An odd trend occurring in the A&U forum

I've been seeing a few "trends" in the last 6-12 months here in the A&U forum, most are quite obvious and have been touched on before, the trend I am seeing is a little more subtle but relates back to the other issues (See the stickied threads for those issues).

To me this says a lot about where this forum is heading, but I will admit I may be reading too much into this as well so that's why I want to put it out there.


What I am seeing is an increase in posters, usually newish starting their reply with a disclaimer of sorts, along the lines of "I'm a believer, but...".

You'll often see this in some crappy youtube video thread where the object is obviously something quite mundane, so what's the psychology behind this disclaimer?

To me, I think it has to do with the fact that there is a new "breed" of UFO believer here on ATS, one that carries on like a pork chop when their video mystery gets solved, the disclaimer is borne out of fear of upsetting these types by basically saying, "look I'm on your side and I don't want to hurt your feelings but..."

Is this where ATS is heading? Where the bad news has to be broken gently and that people are becoming afraid to upset someone by becoming an "evil debunker"?

I wouldnt say you need to break the news "gently" to someone that their video is likely not a UFO.
However, theres a big difference between breaking the news gently and being a complete jerk about it.

Im all for the truth coming out and getting to the bottom of whatever is in a video.

Also, I hope people dont take it personally when a video they post gets debunked or other possibilites of what it could be are suggested.

Cheers

This isn't a trend it's the norm.

I started reading ATS in 2005, in 2006 I left until 3 months ago, slowly at first.

The things talked about now are pretty much the same as back then, just more BS in between.

reply to post by FoxMulder91


It seems people do take it personally when their video is debunked.

Hence the pandering that seems to go on.

reply to post by Chadwickus


A good point and I think its prevalant on other forums as well. There might be a bit about not wanting to get into conflict because they are newer members. Ive also noted the opposite with new members being generally nasty not only to the op but also to others that have posted in the thread.

Im sure not everyone is sure in dealing with a poster who posts things like this eg, " A bunch of garbage. who is flaging this? Friends of friends and so on. Children please stop.". That post will get the response the poster wants, conflict. I feel courtesy is at an all time low just now. Yea, we know how to take it on the chin and learn from a genuine debunking of our evidence. But as I said, Im sure newbies are wary of aggression coming their way even if they are right.

respects

reply to post by Chadwickus

Perhaps if you check the previous posts by these ppl, you may see that they have been flamed for their previous comments in other threads.

The psycology behind it may simply be that they add the diclaimer in an attempt to reduce the flames from their debunking theory.

There have also been the subtle 'rants' by other's in various forums about the personal attacks towards posters (i think the site owner' recently made the point). The disclaimer could be: "I believe, but I don't believe this video, please analyse my comment on what i theorise, but dont comment about me".

shows they are making the effort to get the thread flowing in the correct direction?

Thats what I believe you are alluding to, but ....

reply to post by Chadwickus


CHad, my aussie friend,I think the majority of the problem comes from the simple fact that a lot of the newer members do indeed take it personal or as a personal attack instead of objectively; after all, we are seeking facts and new information, not playing king of the hill.

Although it is disturbing to see just how many of these same posters are very quick to toss off on any poster's mental state or make allegations as to the amount of adult beverages or mother nature that is involved in their paradigm.

As for myself, I will continue to attempt to be courteous and friendly in all discourses, and just not allow myself to be baited or perturbed by any baiting or barbs.

Mod Edit: Big Quote – Please Review This Link.



Take care, friend.

seeker

reply to post by Chadwickus

What I am seeing is an increase in posters, usually newish starting their reply with a disclaimer of sorts, along the lines of "I'm a believer, but...".

that gives me an idea - i might start prefacing my replies with :

" i am a skeptic, and............. "

before launching my rebutal

if people are so thin skinned and insecure - fook them

reply to post by Chadwickus


It is a trend. The trend is... it is now a bad thing to question UFO videos. Even after all the hoaxers, all the misidentifications, all the CGI videos... if you believe for one second that it is not real, you are the bad guy.

If you use logic and reason to try to identify something which is seemingly unidentified, then you are the bad guy.

If you find flaws, contradictions, and inconsistencies in any UFO video, then you are the bad guy.

If you don't believe everything that is spoon fed to you in the UFO forum, then you are the bad guy.

Denying ignorance is not welcomed in the A & U forum.... you will get called a "skeptic", a "debunker", a "disinfo agent", a "government plant", a "debunker troll", "close minded", etc.....

People know that if you question any UFO video in the A & U forum, or use any type of critical thinking to explain away a UFO video or image, you will be attacked by gangs of people. That is why people are putting disclaimers, they do it in hopes of not being attacked by gangs of people who can't accept what they are about to say.

I am actually amazed by the topic Springer posted the other day regarding "skeptics and debunkers" not being civil. The "debunkers and skeptics" have been the minority on ATS' A & U forum and are constantly attacked to the point where people are now afraid to disagree and state their opinion without posting a disclaimer first so they wont be attacked.

I am one of those people who believe aliens can exist, and I have seen objects flying which I could not identify. However, when I post an opinion about a UFO video which I feel is not a UFO, I am labeled "closed minded" as if I some how don't believe in aliens or UFO. It's an insult. I am surprised there is any skeptics on ATS still because of these types of attacks.

It's very frustrating.

To debunk a thing is good for the science,
If it is truly debunked. Sometimes though, I've noticed that it
can become like a school yard.The mentality
of the bullies is of "self-importance and arrogance".
How dare you post such an unbelievable piece
of unsubstantiated filth and foul as this. Why you're
a disgrace to the entire field of ufology.
This is tounge and cheek right ?
Look, my point is; That everyone here is at a different
place on this learning experience(curve)if you will,
and we're "all" in this together, right ?
Are we not going to help the straglers onto
the life raft ? patience and kindness are free
but, Its the best kind of gift in the world to
someone that is still learning. Peace, from The BrainGarden.

I think it may have come to a point where even some of the hardcore believers are seeing how ridiculous and damaging some of the "awesome real video of an alien!!!11one" posts have become of late.
So they feel the need to explain that they are believers but also that the "evidence" provided is just stupid and misinformed. The need to qualify their beliefs based against their basic common sense.

imho.

double post, sry

It's cultural as well, we Brits are far more robust in our language without the slightest hint of it becoming personal. That i have to remember myself at times.. I remember many moons ago when i use to chat in a certain room. I use to greet a fellow Brit with.... Alright you complete and utter bar steward? he'd reply... How ya doin' ya smeg encrusted turnip.?

One day an American friend pmed me and asked... "Why do you two hate each other, what's the problem"? I had to laugh and had to explain how the deeper the insult on greeting the greater mutual respect. You want to see two Brits that don;t like each other, the politer the greeting the less they like each other

Now this is exacerbated by having a good number of those who do not speak English as their first language or simply not understanding that the idioms of speech in the USA and Britain are often interpreted wildly different.

It's worth keeping that in mind, this is the world wide web..not the world wide English speaking web.

That's why I've taken a break from these boards for a couple months. Everything is proof of ET. If you deny it, you're a skeptical government disinfo agent of doom and misleadingness.

Its annoying.

People favor blind belief instead of intellectual discussion.

Originally posted by SaosinEngaged
That's why I've taken a break from these boards for a couple months. Everything is proof of ET. If you deny it, you're a skeptical government disinfo agent of doom and misleadingness.

Its annoying.

People favor blind belief instead of intellectual discussion.

That's what people see on TV in the press everyday. News is sold to you like it's soap powder. It's simply infecting people by their constant exposure to it all. The news deals in * complete breakdowns, irretrievable differences, the earth shattering conclusions, possibly monumental knock on effects... and thats just the chuffin sports results and the weather forecast.

Originally posted by Chadwickus
Is this where ATS is heading? Where the bad news has to be broken gently and that people are becoming afraid to upset someone by becoming an "evil debunker"?

Face it your just an evil debunker Hey I was even called a skeptic in the missile threads

Seriously though I see the problem becoming more an issue because its not the posters that are at fault but the source material.

Before we had better stories to relate in the UFO area, but even those were mostly old cases and they have been done to death by the regulars. I can see this is the case because of the flags I get when I do bring up an oldie but goody

But today there hasn't been a good solid case of an abduction, or a hard to debunk UFO sighting for some time. All we get are endless youtube fuzzy critters and hoaxes, media networks mistaking planes for missiles and tossing the country into a week long turmoil as bad as the last Blossom Goodchild fiasco.

So newer members who spend more time on youtube tend to want to hit us with the latest hot UFO video, and are used to youtube type commenting...

And I see that reflecting here

Solution?

More super mods... herds of em... Gestapo style rule... iron fist punishments...

errr well okay maybe not workable

Also we have lost a lot of the big heavy weight thread producers that were favorites in this forum... Mike Singh, Internos, Jkrog08 and others. That has left a hole in quality posts

Good debate. Sometimes it's worth more to read it than to write it. As I'm about to find out...

Active banter is still good, crap threads burn...I've only been here a couple of years and nothing's changed.

It's down to how you filter what you read on a forum using yer brain. I mean, if you try and read every piece of information you're bound to read far more rubbish. Just pick the threads that interest you. All the other stuff you might think is poop will still be there. Fact of life. Fact of the never ending database which is the interweb.

That includes the never ending example of someone uploading the same video 300 times with the tag "UFO" on YouTube, which makes it tedious to get involved. Fakes are half fun to debunk, in the nicest possible way. And it's not too difficult to be polite even with the crudest of hoaxes.

The things talked about now are pretty much the same as back then, just more BS in between.

By that, you surely mean with "more people joining" in between. You're never asked to have to side with everyone else in the world's opinions but as I said previously, it's not beyond human nature to tolerate

I'm sure a lot of us have used forums for 10 years minimum now and I suspect those people have a much better grasp on what to take in, what to ignore etc. A lot of "new" people don't have that experience. But it's been evident ever since it was possible to mass communicate. Hyperactivity over the ability to post "stuff" is always going to increase. Creativity unleashed, in whatever form, is what the world wants you to be able to do these days. More people will push chatting #e on forums, posting new hoaxes and dodgy threads as their new devices allow them to be with you in 3D up your bum (for $9.99 a month).

I think, overall, we're getting a goddamn good balance at the moment - granted, I'm only referring to the last two months of activity - but there's a lot of interesting new "cases" dare I use the paranormal investigator term - at the moment, compared to the hoaxes. Maybe I'm choosing selectively what I read/follow up and have missed a lot of naff stuff, in which case, heeellllls yeah!

Now next week we're going to enjoy Skyline. Wait, now we're going to enjoy Skyline, there's going to be a massive UFO influx. Seriously, are you ready? Is your selective nature prepared? Is Roland Emmerich going to pick you off in an overly epic CGI scene of devastation? What has NASA found? Phage's penis?

Find out, only on ATS

reply to post by zorgon


I do miss those guys you mention.

Fair comments too, the older cases definitely do carry a lot more credibility than the myriad of knee jerk youtube threads.

Well CHEER UP

We have a NEW Chinese Moon Mission to play with and they are starting off with old Clementine anomalies and playing coy. Seems there is some hope

reply to post by zorgon


lol, yeah I see that.

It had to happen I guess.