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The Holes of F-911

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posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 01:42 PM
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Please follow the link to the article which lists several of the many holes and lies in Moore's propoganda film.

Some of my favorites....

"Finally, Moore shows prominent members of the Taliban visiting Texas, implying that they were invited by then-Governor Bush. The Taliban delegation, however, was invited to Houston by UNOCAL (search), a California energy company.

Moore also doesn't mention that the visit was made with the permission of the Clinton administration, which twice met with Taliban members in 1997 and 1998."

And "In "Fahrenheit 9/11" (search) Moore also claims that the White House approved plans for planes to pick up relatives of Usama Bin Laden right after the attacks. But according to terrorism czar Richard Clarke (search), he alone approved the Saudi flights."

LINK




posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 01:48 PM
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The only thing about Fox news is that they are a really conservative station. I would expect them to argue the points.



posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 01:49 PM
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Lets trust the judgement and reporting of a network that is slammed in this film before the opening credits roll. riiigghhttt.



[edit on 6-29-2004 by Garon]



posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 02:27 PM
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And would you two expect me to go to Moore's siote to view these "facts"?

Right there at the link, the holes clearly listed.



posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 02:33 PM
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No need to get defensive.

One thing...Camp David is not a place he goes to strictly for work. He can do work there while "resting", but to say vacation time was cut from 42% to 13%? I just don't believe it. Just because he was there does not mean he was working.



posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 03:13 PM
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is that all there is? i thought there would be more than that, but those minor issues certainly do not overshadow the fact that bush's financial connections are shady as all get out



posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 03:18 PM
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Originally posted by JediMaster
Please follow the link to the article which lists several of the many holes and lies in Moore's propoganda film.

Some of my favorites....

"Finally, Moore shows prominent members of the Taliban visiting Texas, implying that they were invited by then-Governor Bush. The Taliban delegation, however, was invited to Houston by UNOCAL (search), a California energy company.

The writer infers that Moore was implying something. You call this exposing a lie?


Moore also doesn't mention that the visit was made with the permission of the Clinton administration, which twice met with Taliban members in 1997 and 1998."

Not mentioning something is a lie?


And "In "Fahrenheit 9/11" (search) Moore also claims that the White House approved plans for planes to pick up relatives of Usama Bin Laden right after the attacks. But according to terrorism czar Richard Clarke (search), he alone approved the Saudi flights."

Richard Clarke was working in the White House when he approved the flights. Again, there is no lie here.

After all the bloviating and ad hominem attacks, you and other Michael Moore critics on ATS have yet to come up with a single lie in Fahrenheit 9/11. At the same time, some of the Moore critics have shamelessly lied and willfully distorted what Moore actually says in the film. You people should be ashamed to participate in a web forum whose slogan is "Deny Ignorance."



posted on Jun, 29 2004 @ 04:55 PM
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I'm not sure about the credibility of this website but this article demonstrates a link between Bush and UNOCAL: www.globalresearch.ca...



According to Afghan, Iranian, and Turkish government sources, Hamid Karzai, the interim Prime Minister of Afghanistan, was a top adviser to the El Segundo, California-based UNOCAL Corporation which was negotiating with the Taliban to construct a Central Asia Gas (CentGas) pipeline from Turkmenistan through western Afghanistan to Pakistan.

Karzai, the leader of the southern Afghan Pashtun Durrani tribe, was a member of the mujaheddin that fought the Soviets during the 1980s. He was a top contact for the CIA and maintained close relations with CIA Director William Casey, Vice President George Bush, and their Pakistani Inter Service Intelligence (ISI) Service interlocutors. Later, Karzai and a number of his brothers moved to the United States under the auspices of the CIA. Karzai continued to serve the agency's interests, as well as those of the Bush Family and their oil friends in negotiating the CentGas deal, according to Middle East and South Asian sources.

When one peers beyond all of the rhetoric of the White House and Pentagon concerning the Taliban, a clear pattern emerges showing that construction of the trans-Afghan pipeline was a top priority of the Bush administration from the outset. Although UNOCAL claims it abandoned the pipeline project in December 1998, the series of meetings held between U.S., Pakistani, and Taliban officials after 1998, indicates the project was never off the table.


-Attero

[edit on 29-6-2004 by Attero Auctorita]



posted on Jun, 30 2004 @ 06:58 AM
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fahrenheit..._fact.blogspot.com/

Here you are ... a FACT sheet about the trash propaganda F911.
What are the truths and what are the facts in the film.
Hint - not much is true.

It's so sad that people are throwning money at Michael Moores
feet for this garbage. I bet he's laughing all the way to the bank.



posted on Jun, 30 2004 @ 07:30 AM
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The link isn't working.


Edit: Now it is

[edit on 30-6-2004 by SupaFly]



posted on Jun, 30 2004 @ 08:11 AM
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Yes, NOT MENTIONING SOMETHING is a lie when it changes the meaning or context of what IS being said. Anything stated with the intent to deceive is a lie. Moore is LIAR. He was busted for numerous lies in Bowling for Columbine and now F911. If you buy this underhanded schlockumentary, fine. But if you truly want to be informed of the FACTS... don't turn to Moore.



posted on Jun, 30 2004 @ 08:56 AM
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You do have to look at this from both angles. Everyone has their opinions. This is a propaganda film that should be taken with a grain of salt. However, some good points were made between the connections of the Bush family, saudis, and bin ladens. Some of it has to make you think.



posted on Jun, 30 2004 @ 08:58 AM
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Originally posted by JediMaster
Moore also doesn't mention that the visit was made with the permission of the Clinton administration, which twice met with Taliban members in 1997 and 1998."


I am interested in what this is supposed to imply, because if it is what I think it is then their lies are no better than his lies.


PB

posted on Jun, 30 2004 @ 10:46 PM
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Originally posted by SupaFly
However, some good points were made between the connections of the Bush family, saudis, and bin ladens. Some of it has to make you think.


I havent seen the movie, so I cant really have an opinion. Can someone briefly outline the links that are talked about? Is it a direct link, ie they come over for dinner twice a week, a business link, or what? At some point could the link be chalked up to 6 degrees of separation?



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 07:49 AM
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Here's another link -

www.dfw.com.../printstory.jsp&1c



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 06:14 PM
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Originally posted by donguillermo
Not mentioning something is a lie?





but not mentioning something when you are trying to present the "whole truth" is decptive. all of this movies are only made to serve moore's liberal agenda



posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 02:52 AM
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Haven't seen the flick yet, but I know he had all of the Clinton + Taliban + Texas link in his last book...just throwing something out there.

(Besides, Moore doesn't even like Clinton...called him the greatest Republican Prez ever...or something to that effect)



posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 04:11 AM
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I saw the movie, and I have to say the horrors presented due to the actual fighting, i.e. our 5,000 wounded and the Iraqi's 10,000 or more wounded, was much more disturbing than any Bush/Clinton/Taliban/Texas/etc. links. Of course they are all linked, they are all rich, and rich people get richer by investing in each other.

Anyways, here's a rebuttal from Mr. Moore's website that helps fill up some of the alleged "holes" in Fahrenheit.

www.michaelmoore.com...



posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 04:41 AM
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Good link RockerDom, short of Bush being caught on camera being handed cash in a brown envelope, I think your defence of Michael Moore is falling on deaf ears or blinkered eyes. It's simple, Moore chooses, carefully, the words he uses.

Quote by Krazy Ivan
"but not mentioning something when you are trying to present the "whole truth" is decptive. all of this movies are only made to serve moore's liberal agenda"

Unlike Bush who's halo is to tight to deceive, double standards yet again from the Facist Bush appreciation Society.



posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 04:54 AM
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I should add that there is, on Moore's site, an entire story about his movie, and the fact-checking that went into it right here:

www.michaelmoore.com...

Some quotes of interest:




[W]ith "Fahrenheit" he has taken on his biggest and best-defended target yet, and his production staff says that on his orders they have taken no chances in checking and double-checking the film, knowing Bush supporters would pounce on factual mistakes.





He has retained Chris Lehane, a Democratic Party strategist known as a master of the black art of "oppo," or opposition research, used to discredit detractors. He also hired outside fact-checkers, led by a former general counsel of The New Yorker and a veteran member of that magazine's legendary fact-checking team, to vet the film. And he is threatening to go one step further, saying he has consulted with lawyers who can bring defamation suits against anyone who maligns the film or damages his reputation.


Forgive the excessive quoting, but I thought it should be here in the thread to help offer an opposing view.

One question: Do you think the Bush Administration would allow the fact-checkers from Fahrenheit unrestricted access to, say, Haliburton records? Or Bush's service's records?

By the way, before you engage in character assassination, allow me to say that Clinton was piece of flea feces, so don't throw any Clinton crap at me. Some of us don't like any of the politicians out there, we just think it's funny that some people feel the need to belong to a larger group that would gladly send their children to war, while effing them in ass financially, burning away their rights with bic lighters in the name of "protection" from an invisible enemy, and patting them on the back for taking like a man.



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