Purgatory

reply to post by escapevelocity


escapevelocity,

Hi, I recall a few accounts of Protestants who experienced an NDE, they
saw Purgatory. Two names you could search, Howard Storm, a preacher
and Angie Fenimore.

There are many references in Scripture to a place of purgation. A few
in the Old Testament too. Purgatory is like the word Trinity. Neither are in the Bible but they are both described.

Here's one Protestant who saw Purgatory. Blessings to you....

The man who died, his wife meant to say, I think, Purgatory instead
of Limbo. Makes sense.

colbe

+ + +

July 9, 2011

Evangelist and Firm Foundation Fellowship Church Pastor Lois Hoshor wrote "Spirit of the Soul," a book about her husband, Bob, and his heavenly experience. When surgeons were forced to stop the circulation in his heart for 21 mnutes in 2010, he remembers the beauty he experienced as if it happened yesterday.

Written by
Michelle George


When Bob Hoshor thinks of heaven, he thinks of a beautiful setting he can't describe in words, with a meadow filled with loved ones and angels larger than life.

"It's paradise -- the beauty here pales in comparison to what is there," Bob said. "Green is not green like we see it here -- it's almost like it's alive."

Most people only can imagine what awaits them after they die, but Bob said he doesn't have to wonder -- he already knows. That's because the Thornville resident said he had the opportunity to observe Heaven in 2010 when he was clinically dead for 21 minutes during open heart surgery at Fairfield Medical Center.

It's a story his wife, evangelist and Firm Foundation Fellowship Church Pastor Lois Hoshor, has helped him tell in her newly-released book, "The Spirit of the Soul," which is available at Praises bookstore in Lancaster.

"I want people to get an understanding that there is life after death," Lois said in regard to why she wrote the book. "There's only one way to heaven and His name is Jesus."

While Bob's experience took place more than a year ago, he said he still remembers every detail as if it just happened.

He said he still can't reveal some of what he saw on that day in March 2010 when doctors were forced to stop the circulation to his heart for 21 minutes.

"There are things I know I'm not supposed to speak about at this time," he said of the experience.

What Bob already has shared with others is a story that begins with him standing directly behind his surgeon in the operating room.

"I was behind (the surgeon) and I knew Jesus was behind me," Bob said. "I asked, 'Lord, what is he doing?' and He said, "He's massaging your heart.'"

Bob said Jesus then put His hands right through the doctor's arms and hands.

Bob said he eventually found himself in a "paradise" where he saw his and Lois' family members approaching him through a meadow. He said he did not speak to anyone, just observed his surroundings.

When Bob "returned" to the hospital, he said he saw a type of purgatory with hundreds of souls all around him. Purgatory is believed to be a place or state after death in which penitent souls are purified and thereby made ready for heaven.

"There were an awful lot of them -- when you looked out the window, they were just wandering," he said.

Lois said she was surprised at the description her husband gave her of purgatory. As a Protestant, she said she always was taught that there is no such thing as being "caught in limbo."

"I was taught that your spirit goes to God and your body to dust, so this went against everything we've been taught," she said. "But I knew he was seeing what he was seeing."

Lois, who has written three other books, said "Spirit of the Soul" came out just a few weeks ago, but she's already heard feedback from several people who have read it, including an old friend from high school.

Bob said he even met another man who told him he'd had a similar experience.

"We had close to a lot of the same things happen," he said.

Bob said the experience has taken away any uncertainty or fear he's had about death.

He and Lois hope his story will have that same affect on others.

"We're hoping it draws people to the Lord," Lois said. "If you know Christ, you don't have to fear death."

The interesting thing about purgatory, as mentioned in the post above is that people claim to have seen it.

I don't know how many people have heard of Medjugorje, Garabandal and Fatima (these places could be a whole new thread on their own) But, the visionaries there have all been shown and can (could if they have passed) describe in detail heaven, hell and purgatory.

I have heard from Ivan from Medjugorje in person his account of all three places. It was fascinating, terrifying and faith affirming all in one experience.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter if you believe in it or not. Purgatory and it's existence or lack there of is far beyond the realms of human interference.

reply to post by Faisca


Purgatory isn't even remotely biblical. Pick up an old King james and you won't find anything about it anywhere in the bible. Once you die you don't get another chance for forgiveness. The only chance you get for salvation is while youre still breathing air. Youre appointed once to die and then the judgement.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


False

There is evidence in scripture for it but because you reject sacred tradition you cannot interpret it properly.

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

False

There is evidence in scripture for it but because you reject sacred tradition you cannot interpret it properly.

LOL. This coming from a pagan? You didn't even bother to quote scripture. Like i am going to believe anything that comes from a church that grants you 90 days of absolution for kissing idols so that you can go and sin as much as you want .

Don't pull the tradition card man, I'll tear you apart with your crimes against the Messiah. In fact, i already have, youre just too blind to see the forest through the trees. You've fallen to the great delusion and even someone like me who points out the things you do wrong you still refuse to change. There is no repentence in you because there can be none had for you have the mark of the beast.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

False

There is evidence in scripture for it but because you reject sacred tradition you cannot interpret it properly.

LOL. This coming from a pagan? You didn't even bother to quote scripture. Like i am going to believe anything that comes from a church that grants you 90 days of absolution for kissing idols so that you can go and sin as much as you want

.

Don't pull the tradition card man, I'll tear you apart with your crimes against the Messiah. In fact, i already have, youre just too blind to see the forest through the trees. You've fallen to the great delusion and even someone like me who points out the things you do wrong you still refuse to change. There is no repentence in you because there can be none had for you have the mark of the beast.

edit on 31-1-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

Catholics take the time to explain the faith and you do not listen
lonewolf. It's like you don't read the explanation. People looking at this
thread and others have to ask, is it better to listen to a Roman Catholic or believe an anti-Catholic telling everyone what Church teaches?

You hit it on the "head" by your statement. It's so scary, I guess why
I keep posting. The "delusion" is that you and anti-Catholics reject
the true faith. What are you going to do?!!

You are fixed in your anti-Catholicism. Seee... how God in His mercy is
going to show the entire world the true faith.


prayers,

colbe

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


Do you bother to read the links I give you or do you presume to be omniscient and therefore never wrong? There is scriptural verses giving evidence and even quotes from the church fathers even before the bible was compiled. If you reject true knowledge how will you interpret scripture properly? You can keep talking about how it's all wrong because it is not in the protestant bible, but if Mary truly was assumed into heaven, for example, then you miss certain things like how Revelation talks about a woman in heaven who gave birth to the ruler of all nations, Jesus. You would keep insisting it's a symbol because you reject what the Church teaches.

How did early Christians learn when there was no bible? And why would God say "bible alone" if most people were illiterate for thousands of years?

Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

False

There is evidence in scripture for it but because you reject sacred tradition you cannot interpret it properly.

LOL. This coming from a pagan? You didn't even bother to quote scripture. Like i am going to believe anything that comes from a church that grants you 90 days of absolution for kissing idols so that you can go and sin as much as you want

.

Don't pull the tradition card man, I'll tear you apart with your crimes against the Messiah. In fact, i already have, youre just too blind to see the forest through the trees. You've fallen to the great delusion and even someone like me who points out the things you do wrong you still refuse to change. There is no repentence in you because there can be none had for you have the mark of the beast.

edit on 31-1-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

Catholics take the time to explain the faith and you do not listen
lonewolf. It's like you don't read the explanation. People looking at this
thread and others have to ask, is it better to listen to a Roman Catholic or believe an anti-Catholic telling everyone what Church teaches?

You hit it on the "head" by your statement. It's so scary, I guess why
I keep posting. The "delusion" is that you and anti-Catholics reject
the true faith. What are you going to do?!!

You are fixed in your anti-Catholicism. Seee... how God in His mercy is
going to show the entire world the true faith.


prayers,

colbe

Right, we're the ones suffering from the delusion. Hey, you can go on believing that kissing statues can give you 90 days of absolution so you can sin as much as you want, and that hailing a dead woman does you some good and that magical waters have healing properties and that Mary is "co-redemptrix" if you want, you have been told the truth and it's on your head now.

There is only one God and Mary is not a part of him. I for one will not be bowing down to Astarte or anything less than Yahshua himself.

reply to post by 547000


Why should i bother to read anything you post when you ignore what i post?

Do some research on your own. Look up the story of Astarte or Ashtoreth, it's the same goddess. Pay attention to her clothes and particular attention to her story and her title "Queen of Heaven".

Originally posted by 547000
How did early Christians learn when there was no bible? And why would God say "bible alone" if most people were illiterate for thousands of years?

Exactly 547000, finally someone who makes sense

The bible as important as it is, is not the only way for God to communicate to us. If you think otherwise, then you have to accept that God stopped talking to us 2000 odd years ago after the last word was penned in the book of revelations........

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by 547000

 

Why should i bother to read anything you post when you ignore what i post?

Do some research on your own. Look up the story of Astarte or Ashtoreth, it's the same goddess. Pay attention to her clothes and particular attention to her story and her title "Queen of Heaven".

I guess Jesus is Horus too by your logic. If you do not believe that why do you apply a different standard to Mary? Throughout history she has also nourished the Church and Jesus has guided it too. Would you call the Jesus apparitions demonic? I hope not because you would be blaspheming the Holy Spirit by calling its miracles demonic. Why do you suppose it is okay to blaspheme the Mother of God? You do so out of ignorance because you do not ask yourself where your bible comes from, why it is authentic, or even try to understand why the Catholic Church has the beliefs it does. Instead you are content to follow modern churches without researching the fullness of Christianity.

I had to jump into the fray because it's turning into a quarrel between heretic Abrahamists, who are, after all, the same kettle of fish. They all claim that there is only one true religion, everything else being an evil conspiracy. Oddly, the parent faith, Judaism, for which its two sister faiths are heresies, has mellowed due to the persecution amd the homelessness, and it now says that everyone who lives a good life, whatever his or her faith might be, will be "saved", whatever that means.

True, Purgatory is not mentioned in the Bible, but Catholics are devilishly (sorry) clever when it comes to pointing out passages that imply its existence, and they'd convince me if I weren't so far removed from the parochial, theologically elementary Abrahamic faiths. Will I have to cite those passages? My files are bottomless and I'd have to spend hours looking for the matter. It's a case of "reference mislaid".

The gods have placed a veil before thine eyes. The sacred Scriptures of all religions have been shown to have been tampered with by scribes following orders from the rulers, in order to exercise "social control". Bible scholars, who must have a knowledge of Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek and Latin, can notice in the manuscripts exactly where the text is "corrupt", as they say, because from one epoch to another the use of language changes. For example, in the case of the Greek language, scribes belonging to a certain historical period would indicate in a particular way that a letter was to be understood as a number (the ancient Greeks had no numbers but used certain letters as numbers), as by underlining it. So, over the centuries, scribes have been cheerfully inserting and deleting passages.

This means that all such books are actually a chaotic mixture of revelations and distortions. For instance, "lonewolf19792000" says that "you're appointed once to die and then the judgement". He's quoting from (Letter to the) Hebrews 9:27, which Christians point out as final proof that reincarnation is a false belief. It's one of the obvious examples of a later insertion. In Biblical times reincarnation was a common belief throughout the Middle East, as attested by 1) the fact that Origen, one of the Fathers of the Church, taught that doctrine, and 2) the passage where Jesus says that the prophet Elijah or Elias has returned and is now John the Baptist but no one has recognized him. Modern-day Christians try to explain away the contradiction in very contrived ways. Eventually the fact of reincarnation was considered to be an inadequate thing to teach because it was seen as supplying an excuse for procrastinating endlessly instead of putting one's act together NOW if one didn't want to burn in Hell for all eternity, which is a monstrous notion.

Another huge mistake is to think that personal visions are also incontrovertible evidence of whatever one sees during them, like souls in Hell, Purgatory or whatever, squirming as the worms eat through them. As I said, one's beliefs will determine one's experiences in the Beyond.

There is a dim, lowly realm next to ours where we wander about following death if we remain attached to earthly concerns. Our sojourn there is as long or as short as our tendencies make it. The ancient Greeks called it the World of Shadows. This is an objective, unadorned reality. It's the source of the notions of Hell and Purgatory.

An example of social control is the insistence in the N.T. on submission to all authorities: women must obey their husband, slaves must obey their masters and citizens must obey the ruler, whoever he happens to be. Give unto the Caesar what is for him to have. This was very probably not part of the original Message.

All the above is not to delegitimize anybody's convictions. In a world where free will prevails confusion must also prevail because, if everything were perfectly clear, we wouldn't have any chance of choosing for ourselves. That's why religions contradict each other, yet those who guide us communicate with us according to our beliefs. They respect our mistaken beliefs because after all they help us to handle life. You all are free agents, free to suspect that I'm psychotic, or that I'm purposefully misleading you. Things are designed in such a way that my words will be either inspiring and recognized as being close to the truth or they will be experienced as a threat and feared. All one can do is throw out one's words and let the maw of the Universe swallow them or spit them out.