'Damn right' I personally ordered waterboarding: Bush, page 2

Originally posted by Clisen33
reply to post by antonia

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Water boarding pales in comparison of what goes on in other countries. None of what happens in other countries matters because no one cares if it's not U.S. related.

Here's a very small example. Might be graphic for some people...
How would you all act if this was U.S. forces doing this to Iraqi/Afghan captured militants?

Russian Prison

You're trying to make Bush look good by showing what goes on in a Russian prison? You do realize that there isn't much crime in Russia compared to the US, right? There was barely any crime in the USSR for a damn good reason; called discipline. In other words, if you are a stupid idiot in Russia who feels like you can do whatever to anyone else, then you'll get far worse in the end (US is the exact opposite, it's called "competition" and "capitalism").

Originally posted by antonia
reply to post by Clisen33

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And? I don't want to see it. I don't like to see people being hurt. I don't get off on that sort of thing. Either way, you didn't address the issue. What Russians do does not justify what Bush allowed.

Of course it doesn't justify what Bush ordered! What is there to address? What am I gonna do - deny that Bush ordered water boarding?

You don't want to see that? Maybe if you'd watch it, maybe then it will open up your eyes that there's a whole lot of worse things going on that is not related to U.S.

Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

Originally posted by Clisen33
reply to post by antonia

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Water boarding pales in comparison of what goes on in other countries. None of what happens in other countries matters because no one cares if it's not U.S. related.

Here's a very small example. Might be graphic for some people...
How would you all act if this was U.S. forces doing this to Iraqi/Afghan captured militants?

Russian Prison

You're trying to make Bush look good by showing what goes on in a Russian prison? You do realize that there isn't much crime in Russia compared to the US, right? There was barely any crime in the USSR for a damn good reason; called discipline. In other words, if you are a stupid idiot in Russia who feels like you can do whatever to anyone else, then you'll get far worse in the end (US is the exact opposite, it's called "competition" and "capitalism").

So then what you're saying is that water boarding should be allowed because it can be a form of discipline? Isn't that contradicting the whole water boarding is wrong idea?

reply to post by Clisen33

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I am well aware there is some awful going on outside the U.S, but that's not the subject of this thread.

Originally posted by antonia
reply to post by Clisen33

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I am well aware there is some awful going on outside the U.S, but that's not the subject of this thread.

You're right, Bush admitted that he ordered water boarding. So what is there to say about it?

I was originally saying that there's a crap load of worse things that goes on outside the States, and no one cares because it is not related to the U.S. and quite frankly you make my point.

reply to post by airspoon

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Amazing how everyone gets worked up over a little water being splashed in a terrorist face as being cruel but its perfectly all right for the US President to order the assassination of United States citizen's without a trial or due process.

Why no outrage over this?

reply to post by gandhi

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George W Bush Jr. will never be arrested, tried or convicted............he and his family are above the law and they know it.

reply to post by airspoon

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Well, I've read your OP, applied my flag & 2 stars, & noticed that the thread is now @2 pages. I'm predicting that by the time I get through reading to wherever this post lands, somebody will have attempted to excuse Bush Jnr. by comparing him to Obama or Clinton.
I'll be saddened but not surprised when, if this thread gains much traction, someone attempts to excuse The Shrub by comparing him to Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Kim Jong Il, even Saddam Hussein (which would be so ironic it'd have to go straight to the "Classic Quotes Burial Ground" thread). I add this to the thread in the hope that my disdain for such arguments may deter people from making them. If anyone genuinely is a person who cannot argue from any other standpoint than "if its not this, it must be that" then let me remind you that 2 wrongs dont make a right, or as 1 of my respected foes (I'm not buying "rivals" - I do respect my foes & those I disagree with that dont get on that list are not my rivals, they are my prey) said recently in another thread, reporting the words of an older, wiser man to him, "You dont fight fire with fire, you fight fire with water, young dumbass."

Originally posted by Clisen33
reply to post by antonia

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Water boarding pales in comparison of what goes on in other countries. None of what happens in other countries matters because no one cares if it's not U.S. related.

Here's a very small example. Might be graphic for some people...
How would you all act if this was U.S. forces doing this to Iraqi/Afghan captured militants?

Russian Prison

Here we have the 1st clear example of "its not as bad as this, so if its not wrong, it must be right". No mention of Obama yet, but I'm only 1/2 way through the 1st page.

reply to post by airspoon

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When will people ever learn our leaders are murderers, and desperate ones at that. There is no such thing as karma, and when will people learn that. Do you think leaders would do all these things if they thought there would be consequences, no.

This and billions of other serial killer types that have been on earth prove that serial killer types is what these people are, and they love it.

But heck christians will buy his book, lol

reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

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Sounds like waterboarding to me

en.wikipedia.org...


maybe I misunderstood your comment?

Originally posted by mrsdudara
I wish we lived in a world where everyone was considerate of other people and respected life. Unfortunatly we don't and there are real people out there who want to kill other real people. If waterboarding or torturing one of those people (who would, have, and would again kill someone), would save the lives of innocent people.....

How do you know the people tortured and waterboarded were guilty of being enemy combatants and or killers.
Were they tried and found guilty. Can innocent people be caught up in circumstances beyond their control.
This is Urban warfare and innocents are killed and tortured routinely.

Do you condone the torture of innocents and when found out they knew nothing....oops never mind.

We executed Japanese soldiers for waterboarding as a war crime after WWII.

www.worldwar2database.com...

reply to post by mrsdudara

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If waterboarding or torturing one of those people (who would, have, and would again kill someone), would save the lives of innocent people.....Ok. and Thank you

Thing is, would you & could you do it yourself?
I had a violent upbringing, so had to learn how to take it & dish it. There have been times since where I could see no other way to stop myself or someone else suffering from an immediate attack than to kick someone's arse. I regret it as a failure of intellect on my part, but, despite having literally puked &/or cried for the hurt I'd caused & worse, for the sickness inside me that enjoys violence, I've never backed down from what I felt was the best of bad choices. This has got me some good arse kickings in my time too (I once had to be flown back to the UK to save my kidneys after a proper walloping, but that was just due to me fighting back against robbers).
My point is that I'm no blushing violet. Yet, in all my time, I've never once coldbloodedly hurt someone, nor carried on hurting them beyond what was necessary to make them desist. Its all twisted up in my head, but I know where the boundaries are & I wont cross them.
Be honest with yourself, could you torture someone? B/c if you cant, but are ok for others to do what you would find too disgusting &/or morally repugnant to do, then, by the dictionary definition, you'd be a hypocrite.

reply to post by mrsdudara

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You know this, how? Surely not because he was afforded due process of law and his guilt was assessed after a fair and civilized trial?

The problem is, you have no idea just how guilty or innocent the guy is, as you have to take the word of an administration that tortures. It is basically their "word" that he is guilty and we all know just how much their "word" is worth.

You see, in a civilized and free world, we can can't on justice and the rule of law. It is the tyrants and terrorists who allow themselves to throw the rule of law out of the window. Guess which one Bush was.


--airspoon

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