Watch Out! Here comes some Climate Change "Denial"

Science Daily

The change in the ice mass covering Antarctica is a critical factor in global climate events. Scientists at the GFZ German Research Centre for Geosciences have now found that the year by year mass variations in the western Antarctic are mainly attributable to fluctuations in precipitation, which are controlled significantly by the climate phenomenon El Niño. They examined the GFZ data of the German-American satellite mission GRACE (Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment). The investigation showed significant regional differences in the western coastal area of the South Pole area.

This article seems to be saying that the Antarctic ice loss is due to a sort of cyclical warming trend called El Niño. And it's opposite La Niña. The Wiki Article below explains it better than I could

Wikipedia

El Niño/La Niña-Southern Oscillation, or ENSO, is a quasi-periodic climate pattern that occurs across the tropical Pacific Ocean on average every five years, but over a period which varies from three to seven years. It is characterised by variations in the temperature of the surface of the tropical eastern Pacific Ocean - warming or cooling known as El Niño and La Niña respectively - and air surface pressure in the tropical western Pacific - the Southern Oscillation. The two variations are coupled: the warm oceanic phase, El Niño, accompanies high air surface pressure in the west Pacific, while the cold phase, La Niña, accompanies low air surface pressure in the west Pacific.[2][3] Mechanisms that cause the oscillation remain under study.

This piece of information kind of infuriates me a little. I've seen a lot of global warming propaganda talking about the Antarctic ice loss being due to our egregious actions against the Earth, and now this.

Reactionary, BS, political douche-baggery has no place in science. And this proves it. Politics doesn't wait for the data to be compiled. It doesn't wait for the real answers. And we wind up with a confused and evermore divided

Example of BS:
Antarctic Losing Ice 'Nearly Twice As Fast As Ten Years Ago'

The ice in the Antarctic isn't just melting. It's melting faster than ever. According to this report, "The rate of annual ice loss in the Antarctic has increased by almost 80 billion tonnes in a decade... Measurements using satellite radar readings revealed that in parts of the continent the rate of loss has speeded up by 140 per cent since 1996. Global warming is thought to be among the most likely factors and the data provides one of the most detailed assessments yet of the changes."

Example 2:


I may not be a climate scientist. But I do know that the climate is a very big complex system with many variables. To think that we can predict how the whole thing functions based on incomplete data, and to then drive public policy around these erroneous set of assumptions, is characteristic of fraud.

Not climate denial and not proof that climate change is false.

But hey, people will cling to anything on here.

reply to post by The Sword


"Climate change" is a known phenomenon. It has many cycles it doesn't work in just one direction and it has been here since before mankind.

What I'm saying is that we shouldn't be making public policy where people's livelihoods are at stake over incomplete and highly politicized 'data'. Like blaming ice loss on an incomplete theory like anthropogenic climate change.

Edit:
Look at the edits BTW. I had some glitches and the post posted before I had the chance to finish the thread.

reply to post by projectvxn


climate change is a fact that most people will not deny but as to its cause's it where the most arguements take place.

i for one know without a doubt that the earth warms and cools as a part of its natural cycle and this has been done hundred of times if not more in the past.

add the fact that it has changed its axis in the past and other factors such as the solar cycles and the interior of the earths core and speed can and changes to the earths magnetic field and does contribute to climate change.

i wonder what the icecaps would have looked like when the super continent existed global warming is a myth trumped up by crony capitalism to make countries buy carbon credits and destroy trillions of wealth all in the pursuit of the new world order and global governance.

I understand that the loss of the Larsen B ice sheet and another were caused by erosion of the oceanic floor.

I also understand Antarctica is trapped within icy sea currents that circle the continent. This causes the continent to be more or less unaffected by any warmer waters.

I also understand that any warming or cooling in in the northern hemisphere has an opposite effect in Antarctic.

I've learned this information during my research for the possibility of an advanced society that once lived on the Antarctic continent. The NOAA from ice core studies.

Here is a link to them. NOAA Paleoclimatology program

the earth has cycles of warm and cold. These are attributed to the orbit of the Earth around the sun. Its either elliptical in which we get the cold period or circular in which we get warm periods. We are in the warm period with a circular orbit around the sun. Now the Earth has a dynamic system to stop run away warming and when nothing interfers with that system climate change is slow and gradual. However if warming is too fast then the Earths dynamic system switches on the freezer and starts to cool it down. Now if you care to take a look at all the warm periods of the last several thousand years everytime theres been a sharp rise in warming theres follows a marked drop in temperature not too soon after. Now Humans have interfered with this dynamic system (pollution killing of species cutting down of forests etc) and injecting more greenhouse gas into the atmosphere by releasing that was once trapped underground (oil). So our future dosent look good if the Earth follows its pattern of reverting to a cold period in what should be a nice warm period.....

Just a little weird little snippet of useless information. When drilling in northern Alaska, they had hit things that showed the area was once lush jungles. I guess the SUV's of the paleolithic era caused all the warming.

Here is the sadistic part of the carbon credits scam. Even if humans ceased to emit one iota of carbon dioxide, even if the WORST models are used. The decrease in the carbon dioxide would not decrease the tempature even an 1/8 of a degree Celsius.

So, if we know that modifying the carbon output is going to do nothing, why is it being implemented.

I mean, this IS NOT rocket science. This is their own words.

reply to post by projectvxn


I so agree with you, and add to that the alleged falsification of some of the significant data in favour of man made global warming and the charge of fraud gets stronger.

It is the very complexity of the whole issue of climate, and changing natural cycles of climate which allows this duplicity to occur. And absolutely, the incredible number of variables, known and unknown make it impossible to substantiate the declarations they have made and acted upon.....noticeably, as always, at the cost of the ordinary person, never the elites.

As I write this they are spraying God knows what toxins in the sky here, on the basis of these unsubstantiated claims.

Like many others, I believe the confusion and misinformation based on incomplete and inaccurate data is deliberate, in the name of control and transfer of wealth to the core few mafia organisations who, inexplicably, are still in positions of power in our governments.

You feel angry - I feel angry, and I believe we should be angry.

I think people should be less worried about the whole climate change thing, and more worried about other environmental issues. Like deforestation, polluting the ocean, nuclear power. I think stuff like that have a way bigger impact, and would be easier to get a handle on as well.

reply to post by TKDRL


I think you are absolutely right.

Whatever the exact cause of our changing climate is, it's a process in motion. My guess is that we can not influence an already taken road very much.

Deforestation, IMO one of the biggest reasons of an excess of carbon in the atmosphere, can be stopped.

The destruction of animal habitats will be a bigger problem to reverse once there are to many species extinct.

Overfishing is a big problem, and a worse case scenario are empty oceans only 40 years from now.
The destruction of the continental sea floor has transformed lush green and fertile ecosystems into barren wastelands, by dragging miles of heavy fish nets for some food. Something we can not reverse anytime soon.

Pollution of the environment is another big concern as the effects could last for years and years to come.

A changing climate is a bummer. The destruction of our habitat and food sources and the ecosystems our food needs to live in, that is much worse IMO.

Originally posted by projectvxn
Science Daily

The change in the ice mass covering Antarctica is a critical factor in global climate events. Scientists at the GFZ German Research Centre for Geosciences have now found that the year by year mass variations in the western Antarctic are mainly attributable to fluctuations in precipitation, which are controlled significantly by the climate phenomenon El Niño. They examined the GFZ data of the German-American satellite mission GRACE (Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment). The investigation showed significant regional differences in the western coastal area of the South Pole area.

This article seems to be saying that the Antarctic ice loss is due to a sort of cyclical warming trend called El Niño. And it's opposite La Niña. The Wiki Article below explains it better than I could

Wikipedia

El Niño/La Niña-Southern Oscillation, or ENSO, is a quasi-periodic climate pattern that occurs across the tropical Pacific Ocean on average every five years, but over a period which varies from three to seven years. It is characterised by variations in the temperature of the surface of the tropical eastern Pacific Ocean - warming or cooling known as El Niño and La Niña respectively - and air surface pressure in the tropical western Pacific - the Southern Oscillation. The two variations are coupled: the warm oceanic phase, El Niño, accompanies high air surface pressure in the west Pacific, while the cold phase, La Niña, accompanies low air surface pressure in the west Pacific.[2][3] Mechanisms that cause the oscillation remain under study.

This piece of information kind of infuriates me a little. I've seen a lot of global warming propaganda talking about the Antarctic ice loss being due to our egregious actions against the Earth, and now this.

Reactionary, BS, political douche-baggery has no place in science. And this proves it. Politics doesn't wait for the data to be compiled. It doesn't wait for the real answers. And we wind up with a confused and evermore divided

Example of BS:
Antarctic Losing Ice 'Nearly Twice As Fast As Ten Years Ago'

The ice in the Antarctic isn't just melting. It's melting faster than ever. According to this report, "The rate of annual ice loss in the Antarctic has increased by almost 80 billion tonnes in a decade... Measurements using satellite radar readings revealed that in parts of the continent the rate of loss has speeded up by 140 per cent since 1996. Global warming is thought to be among the most likely factors and the data provides one of the most detailed assessments yet of the changes."

Example 2:

I may not be a climate scientist. But I do know that the climate is a very big complex system with many variables. To think that we can predict how the whole thing functions based on incomplete data, and to then drive public policy around these erroneous set of assumptions, is characteristic of fraud.

edit on 30-10-2010 by projectvxn because: Sorry...I had a few glitches. Added the rest of my post.

How come you include a vid of the north when you are referring to Antarctica?

tt

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by The Sword

 

"Climate change" is a known phenomenon. It has many cycles it doesn't work in just one direction and it has been here since before mankind.

Exactly, no proof what so ever that cows farting brings on dangerous effects and swings in climate. Global climate change always happens,a nd it works within boundaries, and these boundaries it has always flung between.

Amazing how gore tried to say the sun is not the most important thing in climate, lol.

The fact that phrases such as "climate change denial" and "climate change denialists" even exist is a huge clue that the AGW crowd is a political movement and not a scientific one. The Big Bang Theory has long been a widely accepted theory regarding the origins of our universe, and even so, when this theory was first introduced into the public consciousness there were physicist who didn't buy it, and some who posited their own theories, such as the Steady State Theory, put forth by Fred Hoyle, Thomas Gold and H. Bondi. These physicists weren't branded Big Bang denialists, or dissidents, just because the offered an alternative theory to the origins of our universe. The fact of the matter is that as time goes on new discoveries tend to put a crimp in old theories, and either scientists are willing to expand their views and accept the new data as a part of changing their views in an effort to discover the truth, or trenches get dug and the political movements begin to demonize those who produce any data that contradicts the theories they've chosen to advocate at the expense of the truth.

reply to post by trailertrash


Did you watch the video?

It included the Antarctic as well.