Witch Burning in Africa (Extremely Disturbing Video)

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by Stormdancer777

 

I haven't actually seen any evidence to support that, it's assumed somehow, somewhere. It's not in the video, of that you can be sure, because I watched it. You still don't need to watch it, trust me, and if you do, bring lots of cleanex's and be prepared to WEEP for the sins of the world and the evils that have been committed therein, some of which yes, have been perpetrated in the name of religion, but in this case, you can't be sure if that is the case at all.

NO evidence to support that there is any proof why these people were burned alive, or if Christians were involved, or if they were killed because of witchcraft?

Yet here this thread has turned into a Christian bashing festival, as usual.

reply to post by wayno


You're right, it is what every human should do, but Christ told his followers that they were supposed to raise the bar, to set the example. The world is supposed to know that we are Christians because we love one another. Let's face it, humans are often vile and ruthless. God's followers were supposed to set the example of what real love and compassion looked like.

As far s the power issue goes, that is the result of people abusing and corrupting the church. The Christian faith was not started as a means to attain power. Those who were in authority over the early church often ended up in prison and were executed. So far as we know, most of the disciples and apostles were martyred for their faith. Jesus also taught something called "servant leadership." Those who had power were supposed to serve the people, not rule over them. The requirements for being an elder include not being lovers of money or power. Just as our government leaders are supposed to be servants of the people, Christianity is supposed to be led by servant leaders. Obviously you are right, however, in saying that today many men of corrupt minds desire positions within religious entities simply for the power that comes with that position.

Man may have created religion, but God created man. Many of us simply want to have a relationship with our creator and do what is pleasing to Him. Men created religion in an effort to do just that. Jesus came and rebuked all the religious leaders of his day and simply told the people to love God and love each other. As a Christian, the rest of what we do is simply to try and do just that, show love and devotion to God and to care for His people (not just those of faith but all people).

reply to post by TechUnique


Wow... that guy who was just sitting there seemingly unphased by all that fire... maybe he really was a witch?
Sadly I think this goes down as one of those things that happen in the third world that nobody cares about until they see... You dont think those female circumcisions they do out there is under the close and watchful eye of a doctor do you? How about sanitized and sterile equipment? As opposed to a tree stump and a hand tool. If we are going to imagine for a second that we are a free people, we cant just look at something on the internet and offer some condemnation because a cultural meme is different from ours (although burning witches seems a little dated we havent done that in what 80 years or so?). And what about the placebo effect? You know that odd facet of humans where they commit an action and get a desired result. What if kililng this so called 'witch' by virtue of a desire for an end result actually caused the end result to happen?

Would you still feel as bad if the person in question was Adolph Hitler?

I am not justifying this by any means just playing devils advocate here...

Originally posted by xtcsx
reply to post by TechUnique

 

Wow... that guy who was just sitting there seemingly unphased by all that fire... maybe he really was a witch?

The guy you're speaking of was rocking back and forth. His mind is in shock from the trauma his body is suffering. I imagine much of the pain is subsiding because of the adrenaline that's pulsing through his veins. Also, once the nerves are damaged so much, your brain is no longer receptive to the pain.

I just can't believe the mob of people standing in the background. It's sad. I refuse to believe that the majority of those people support this torture. It's sad that someone wouldn't stop it.

I don't care what it'd take, I'd relocate my family to another village after witnessing an event like this. I'd rather walk 1000 miles and have nothing to my name than to know that my family or I could maybe suffer a death such as this.

Did a little searching on google and found a bit more insight into this event.

I found the following on another forum www.haitixchange.com

Now, those abominable "witchcraft murders" in a Kenyan village named Nyamataro, or Kisii Nyamataro, which really if you haven't understood what is going on, I suppose it is good that this video is disseminated, but other than that it is the most vile series of images I have seen in a while, just shocking, those poor people being burned alive, not even tied, just thrown in a ditch where they are expected to sit passively as they burn, people just clubbing the hell out of them as they crawl... and not a Christian pastor in sight to yell, "No! This is not what Christianity preaches!"

These killings come in the wake of the murders and tortures of children in the Niger Delta, children accused by evangelical Protestant pastors of being "witches". In those cases, children were lashed to trees with barbed wire and left to die. Fathers pounded mails in the heads of thelr living daughers! And in this case again, the victims are traditionalists being murdered by Christians for the most part, although sometimes traditionalist communities will also kill people they suspect of malevolent magic, just like "lougawou" killings in Haiti.

And there is an equally vile little evangelican Protestant "praise center" located there, some of the congregants of which undoubtedly particpated in the killings, if only because the crowd was so big there must have been some of everyone, you know? But NO ONE stepped forward to say, STOP, or at least, kill them before you burn them.

You can see the little Protestant's website at:

www.praisecenter.org...

Write 'em an email and ask them why, instead of "planting Bible colleges", they don't go out into their own community and plant a little respect for human life!

Then the name Nyamataro pops up again, oh God, check THIS out:

www.boston.com... africa/articles/2009/03/05/kenya_activists_slain_following_report_on_killings/

"NAIROBI, Kenya—Kenyan university students clashed with riot police Thursday night over the bodies of a former student leader and a slain activist who documented alleged extrajudicial killings.

It was unclear who shot former student Paul Oulu and lawyer Oscar Kingara as they were stuck in traffic outside the University of Nairobi on Thursday evening. The deaths come a week after a U.N. official accused Kenya's police of running death squads and the day that a government spokesman accused Kingara of being linked to a notorious gang."

From AP Worldstream: "Policemen Francio Nyamataro says the bodies of lawyer Oscar Kingara and Paul Oulo were discovered shot dead near university dormitories..."

And again from the AP news feed, "Mobs of angry students pushed the blood spattered car into a university compound and defended it with bottles and stones, refusing to release the bodies to police because they accused them of complicity in the killings...."

reply to post by balon0


I went to that forum and they were talking about Vodou

So did Christians tell them to burn these people as witches?

Or did they not stop it?

There's a lot of Christian bashing going on here. Truth is, anyone that burns someone else alive is not with Christ and is not a Christian. They may be using the religion as an excuse to perpetuate their evil, but nowhere in the gospel does it say to burn people alive. In fact, if you recall, some of the Prophets of the old Testament were thrown into lion's dens and firepits and survived. When Christ was born, Herod tried to kill the first born male of every child in his kingdom to try and stop the Messiah.

The burning of human beings has been going on long before Christianity existed. (Before Christ was born)

latter-rain.com...

Some of you here, claim to be open minded, yet your anti-christian bigotry proves you are not.

There is a book called "The Book of the Martyrs." It names thousands of Christians that were martyred for their faith. They were burned alive, dismembered, cooked on a metal plate, raped, tortured, etc. Sometimes by people that claimed to be Christian.

The truth is, evil exists, no matter what disguise you wear. When people will learn that a person is evil regardless of religious beliefs, then maybe we can have a great conversation. Until then, lets blame each other for crimes committed against our brethren. I guess I shouldn't point out the millions that were killed under "Secular" rule last century under Stalin, Mao, Lenin and Hitler.

Finally, who knows who burned those people in the video. It is assumed those people were burned because they were witches, but who accused them, what were their religious beliefs? Maybe we should figure that out, before we bash anyone's religion. I would hate for people to think we aren't open minded here at ATS.

reply to post by balon0


Now hold on a second, I can agree that the killings were vile and completely wrong in every sense, but how can you make the jump to claiming the protestant "praise center" that was in the area as being just as vile? Is there any proof that they had anything to do with these murders at all? If there is please tell me and I too will condemn that group and pass judgment on them, but I see no justifiable way to turn them into the guilty party.

Were there some hypocrites there who attended both the church services and the murders? Possibly, but we don't know. Perhaps they tried to stop it some how. Perhaps some of the Christian leaders were the ones being accused of witchcraft.

Please tell me if there is something I missed, but casting blame and judgment on this group seems to be completely unfounded.

reply to post by balon0

www.boston.com... africa/articles/2009/03/05/kenya_activists_slain_following_report_on_killings/

"NAIROBI, Kenya—Kenyan university students clashed with riot police Thursday night over the bodies of a former student leader and a slain activist who documented alleged extrajudicial killings.

It was unclear who shot former student Paul Oulu and lawyer Oscar Kingara as they were stuck in traffic outside the University of Nairobi on Thursday evening.

I don't understand.

Originally posted by Mr Poopra
The Judeo-Christian God, Satan, Lucifer, etc are all misinterpreted characters from Ancient Babylonian mythology. The Bible is mistranslated Hebrew texts plagiarized from much older Sumerian creation myths. Notice how the old testament God doesn't seem like a very benevolent being? He demands worship, sacrifices, complete obedience, murder of insubordinate children and homosexuals etc...kind of different from Jesus' message right? Kinda doesn't seem like they are one and the same hmm?

The point is the Creator is eternal, all loving, all knowing, and we are all a part of "him" regardless of our beliefs or religions. Religions are created by man.

I have to agree with you fully there mate

Religions have done a lot of good , although a lot of bad. Although I cannot see why this thread has been so derailed by what appears to be religious hate.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by TKDRL

 

I agree that that type of narrow, three dimensional thinking, or even more simplistic than that perhaps, has to go. It's like everyone, or a part of them wants SOMEONE to burn..? I've even seen people talk about this and almost grin as they say it, I've seen that, and I'm sure a few of us have as well at some point, or have done that grin ourselves at the prospect of a fully justified BURNING alive, or some such torturous death. At another scale, it's the urge to wage war, of which the likes of George W. Bush and Adolf Hitler are prime examples, but must we all buy into it, this narrow view of human vengeance and of making the other guy the embodiment of evil, so as to have an excuse to burn someone alive?

Just trying to provoke some serious though here that's all please don't get me wrong or take offence, but then again, relative to the worst aspects of our human nature, sometimes the best defence, is a good offense..

Star

The human race really does have to change as a whole. This thread is a small example of the dire need for change. The video in my OP is a major reason why things have to change. If we don't expand our consciences soon we are never going to evolve past this stage of the human race. We need to work together as a whole, like a species SHOULD. There is NO need for killing each other. NO need for flaming, trolling and hating. And NO need for negative energy.

Gusii

western Kenya

www.everyculture.com...

5 • RELIGION

Before Christianity was introduced to the Gusii, they believed in one supreme god who created the world but did not interfere directly in human affairs. Instead, interference was caused by ancestor spirits (ebirecha), witches, and impersonal forces. The Gusii believed that displeased ancestor spirits were responsible for disease, the death of people and livestock, and the destruction of crops.

Today, most Gusii claim to be followers of some form of Christianity. A Roman Catholic mission was first established in 1911 and a Seventh Day Adventist mission in 1913. There are four major denominations in Gusiiland: Roman Catholic, Seventh-Day Adventist, Swedish Lutheran, and the Pentecostal Assemblies of God.

Although churches are very active, some non-Christian beliefs continue to influence the lives of most Gusii. If afflicted by misfortune, many Gusii visit a diviner (abaragori) who may point to displeased spirits of the dead and prescribe sacrifice. In addition to abaragori, who are usually women, various healers also exist. Abanyamoriogi (herbalists) use a variety of plant mixtures for medicines. Indigenous surgeons (ababari) set fractures and treat backaches and headaches through trepanation (needles). Professional sorcerers (abanyamosira) protect against witchcraft and retaliate against witches. Omoriori, the witch smeller, finds witchcraft articles hidden in a house. Witches (omorogi) can be men or women, but are usually women. They are believed to dig up recently buried corpses to eat the inner organs and use body parts for magic. Among the Gusii, witchcraft is believed to be a learned art handed down from parent to child.


Read more: Gusii - Introduction, Location, Language, Folklore, Religion, Major holidays, Rites of passage, Relationships, Living conditions www.everyculture.com...

Contemporary witch-hunting in Gusii, southwestern Kenya.
www.thefreelibrary.com...

Omoriori, the witch smeller

The witch smellers wore extravagant costumes, usually including animal skins and feathered headdresses, and face paint. Their hair was heavily greased, twisted in complicated designs, and frequently dyed bright red. They often carried assegais and shields, and also a quagga-tail switch, the symbol of their profession.

en.wikipedia.org...

Enough of this.

reply to post by TechUnique


The religious hate you are talking about started with you!
The other who really got the ball down the religious hate
field was RR.I came along expressing my opinion about
the video and WHAM! The wolves were indeed biting.
I was just defending my point of view and my faith. If you
want to complain about my part in "derailing" your thread,
talk to my paw!

reply to post by ImAnAlienOnMyOwnPlanet


Ok, here we go. We need the true messiah soon. How about we, adult human beings, understand what's right and what's wrong. When we adults understand that, then things will take care of themselves. I for one don't need a messiah or anyone else for that matter to come in and make up my mind on what to do for right or wrong. It gets to me when people place their choices on someone other than themselves.

Grow up.

Originally posted by Jam240sx

There is a book called "The Book of the Martyrs." It names thousands of Christians that were martyred for their faith. They were burned alive, dismembered, cooked on a metal plate, raped, tortured, etc. Sometimes by people that claimed to be Christian.

Sometimes by people that claimed to be Christians? Way to Cherry pick. The fact is, all the victims in "The Book of the Martyrs" were slain by Christians, namely, the Catholic Christians.

The best example of Christians burning another Christian alive is of course, The story of Joan of Arc.
Your religion is full of hate and persecution. Religion killed the Christ. Religion is the Antichrist. Anti Christ means, instead of the Christ, in the place of Christ, what substitutes him.

Originally posted by snapperski
WHY THE HELL HAS A MOD NOT TAKEN THIS THREAD DOWN...OR AT LEAST REMOVED THE LINK...this is just tottally barbaric,and does not belong on ATS...we all know what goes on in 3rd world countries were there only education is religion,and there plenty of sites that cater for this kind of sick stuff...PLEASE FOR ATS credibilty remove this....

plus why is this getting flagged..????

I never forced anyone to watch it. I never embedded it on the site. Infact I think you'll find that I asked people NOT to watch it. The point of this thread is not watching the video itself, but discussing what happens in the video as it is an IMPORTANT issue. The link to the video is merely to provide evidence for those who don't know this kind of thing still happens.

Although a lot of the thread has been devoted to religious bashing (Unfortunately) , there is still some serious discussion about the real issue at hand. There is no need to delete this thread on the grounds of the content of the video. This is reality. I did not post it with some sick intent in mind or with the hopes of inciting hate or humour. I don't think you understand the purpose of this thread. Although I don't blame you, seeing as it seems to have become somewhat of a flaming ground with people intent on changing other peoples beliefs and ideologies. That is NOT what this thread is for and the thread STILL has the potential to carry on as it started and was intended to be.

Now can everyone PLEASE stop trying to convert each other. I have no problem with religion being discussed, as long as it is relevant to the discussion. Trying to prove who's god is god and who's religion is right is NOT relevant to this discussion.

/Rant over.

Originally posted by mamabeth
reply to post by TechUnique

 

The religious hate you are talking about started with you!
The other who really got the ball down the religious hate
field was RR.I came along expressing my opinion about
the video and WHAM! The wolves were indeed biting.
I was just defending my point of view and my faith. If you
want to complain about my part in "derailing" your thread,
talk to my paw!

I fail to see ANYWHERE in this thread or in my life where I have incited religious hate. Infact, you have deeply offended me by saying this. You may not have understood me correctly, or you are just flaming . I don't know and to be honest If your reply to this still contains the notion that I am not tolerant of other peoples religions and incite religious hate then I simply won't respond. I don't believe in any kind of negative energy. ESPECIALLY Intolerance. Please quote me where I incited religious hate and then explain why it was inciting religious hate. Make sure you do both.

Thanks,

-TechUnique

This is where i think the use of Nuclear weapons would be for the best

reply to post by TechUnique


OK Tech, I am attempting to point out that the persecution of witches has been going on in some from or another since thousands of years before Christianity or Judaism,
The minute someone says witchcraft people immediately assume the Christians had something to do with it, even the Native Americans did away with tribal members they thought were witches, this superstition has been around forever, and no one knows how it started.

That's why I said on another topic, I believe that mans mind has evolved in such a way that religion, rituals and superstitions, including faith, have become a survival mechanism.

If afflicted by misfortune, many Gusii visit a diviner (abaragori) who may point to displeased spirits of the dead and prescribe sacrifice. In addition to abaragori, who are usually women, various healers also exist. Abanyamoriogi (herbalists) use a variety of plant mixtures for medicines. Indigenous surgeons (ababari) set fractures and treat backaches and headaches through trepanation (needles). Professional sorcerers (abanyamosira) protect against witchcraft and retaliate against witches. Omoriori, the witch smeller, finds witchcraft articles hidden in a house. Witches (omorogi) can be men or women, but are usually women. They are believed to dig up recently buried corpses to eat the inner organs and use body parts for magic. Among the Gusii, witchcraft is believed to be a learned art handed down from parent to child.