Many will abandon faith in the end times.

Originally posted by kallisti36 You haven't provided ANY information.

Now, let me see if I have this right: I haven't "provided ANY information". Right?

Yet, on the basis of not providing "ANY information", you accused me by saying "This man is a liar."

So, the obvious question is "How did you 'conclude' that I am "a liar", if, as you say, I have not "provided ANY information"?

In other words, what EVIDENCE do you have that I am " a liar" if I have not "provided ANY information"?

And, if I have not "provided ANY information", what is it, precisely, that you are responding to?

Oh, never mind. You wouldn't understand.

However, you have offered no evidence...

Well, the problem here is really much worse than I anticipated.

But you wouldn't understand.

Have you ever read the Bible? Have you ever read the poem If, by Rudyard Kipling; or, for that matter, any other poetry? Have you ever been touched by the lyrics of a love song? Have you ever read the Sermon on the Mount by Jesus (Chapters 5-7 of the Gospel of Matthew); which ends with the following verses: "...and his Teaching made a deep impression on the people, because he taught them with authority, and not like their own scribes"?

All of these examples consist of nothing more than a series of naked assertions. There is not one single logical argument in the Revelations; Jesus does not make one single logical argument in the Sermon on the Mount; neither do poetry or the lyrics of love songs consist of logical arguments. In other words, logical argumentation is merely ONE aspect of truth; specifically, the truth as conceived by the consciousness of the 'thinker'. There are also truths of the heart (or "self"), which have no logic; but which are, neverthess, the truth--or no one would ever be able to sell love songs.

Listen, for example, to the logic in the following song:

www.youtube.com...

And then, there are also Revealed Truths, which, similar to poetry, are nothing more than naked assertions. They are beyond the categories of truth demanded by the consciousness of the 'thinker'.

Now, pick up a science book, or a book on theology; and what do you read?

You read logical arguments arranged to support a particular conclusion. You read of the experiments and the observations and other evidence that has been accumulated in support of one scientific theory or another. Or you read long and intricate quotations of numerous Revelations strung together in an attempt to prove that this or that interpretation of the Revelations is the TRUE interpretation; a process of logical argumentation which, for SOME reason (you wouldn't understand) is NOT included in the Revelations themselves.

So, back to Jesus.

Despite the fact that he did not use ONE logical argument in the Sermon on the Mount, he was considered as having taught the people "with authority", and "unlike their own scribes"--who, no doubt, used the same kind of logical argumentation as do the Christian theologians who try to PROVE that their interpretations of the Revelations are the only TRUE interpretations.

So, by insisting that the rules of evidence and logical argumentation are the final and absolute arbiters of the Truth; what you are doing is categorically denying not only all of the Revelations in the Bible; but, also, that poetry and the lyrics of love songs convey any truth whatsoever.

And, by doing that, you are asserting that the "beast of the earth"-consciousness of the 'thinker' is, for all practical purposes, God.

But you wouldn't understand that.

What Revelation have you recieved?

You wouldn't understand.

A revelation can be explained even to the "uninformed".

Then you don't understand the meaning of the word "uninformed".

Your doctrine of reincarnation is not supported in the Bible, it just seems like a hodgepodge of Eastern and Western philosophy.

Well, I could explain this, but you wouldn't understand.

Still, I am open to any explanation you have to offer,

But you wouldn't understand the explanation.

I just won't accept this "You wouldn't understand.

Well, good.

Because you wouldn't understand.

As for as "I wouldn't understand"; I have experienced multiple lives at once, but I was very very high. I consider that to have been an immsensely powerful spiritual experience

Thanks for sharing. There is the evidence that you wouldn't understand.

If you can't explain, I will simply write you off as an arrogant gnostic and a disinformation agent.

Well, I guess you really don't have any other option, do you?

Especially because you don't understand.

What good is a revelation if you can't find some way to explain it?

Well, not surprisingly, you wouldn't understand.

Revelations are for people who understand Revelations.

They are NOT for people who do not understand Revelations.

But you wouldn't understand.

I hope I have made myself clear.

Michael

reply to post by Michael Cecil


Not at all. I perfectly understand what you're getting at with theologians who over rationalize everything. The only way to truly understand the Bible is to have read it and interpret it yourself. I also understand the feeling and overall spirit behind words, lyrics, poetry, and what-have-you. However, all of these mediums have a way of expressing themselves so others can understand, something you seem incapable of. You appear to be an intelligent person,but you refuse to offer anything to back up your claims. You state that the ressurection meant reincarnation, but you won't even offer an explanation from the Bible, some obscure scripture, or personal anecdote which leads to either two conclusions. The first possible conclusion being that you are lying, which would explain why you can't express this personal experience having never had it. The second is that you are arrogant and don't think anyone is intelligent, insightful, cool, or speshul enough to understand you. Your tone indicates the latter, though the former may be proved later. You see, the thing about the Bible and the Holy Spirit is that ANYONE can understand them in some way. A complete idiot could know the Holy Spirit, because God loves everyone. With that in mind, does yours? In this lies my disgust of gnosticism. While I am guessing by your posts that you aren't truly a gnostic, atleast not your run of the mill gnostic, you exhibit the same characteristics in how you treat people. I am offering you a chance to explain. I'm not going to pick it apart or anything. I am very curious about this illusive belief system of yours that you will only hint at. You haven't even considered the possibility that I might understand. I'm also a tad offended you wrote me off for having experimented in the past, as if that makes me an idiot. You spent the beginning of this thread railing against the ressurection and several posters have defended that belief admirably, yet when pressed for a defence for your belief you won't offer anything, instead you insult the intelligence of everyone else. This poison the well tactic is very lame. You use this belief as an argument but you won't explain it, so no one has any idea if it is a valid argumant or not. Seriously, I'm curious, I'm all ears, please explain!

reply to post by Michael Cecil


Also, I apologize for stating you were a liar off the bat. I also apologize to the OP for contributing in de-railing the thread.

Michael you have overcome!

Originally posted by kallisti36

The only way to truly understand the Bible is to have read it and interpret it yourself.

The only way that you can interpret the Revelations is through the "beast of the sea"-consciousness of the "self" or the "beast of the earth"-consciousness of the 'thinker'. Both of these dimensions of consciousness are of the 'fallen' consciousness which originate in the 'movement' of self-reflection, which is referred to as the "great dragon, the primeval serpent, the devil, or Satan". Thus, all interpretations of the Revelations are in error. Knowledge of the Revelations is conveyed by means of the 2-dimensional 'flat' space consciousness, as is explained on my website; an explanation that you do not understand.

I also understand the feeling and overall spirit behind words, lyrics, poetry, and what-have-you.

.

No you don't. The principal phonetic tone of the song that I linked to is the Long A phonetic tone. Unbeknownst to you, the Long A phonetic tone pertains to the Revelation of the "resurrection" received in the heart; something that you would not understand.

However, all of these mediums have a way of expressing themselves so others can understand, something you seem incapable of.

You act almost as if I do not even have a website. My explanation is conveyed on my website. You just don't undertand it. But that does not mean that it is not an explanation.

You appear to be an intelligent person,but you refuse to offer anything to back up your claims.

Listen to the phonetic tones conveyed on the link to the "Star gate sequence" from 2001--A Space Odyssey.

You do not understand the meaning of those phonetic tones; neither do you understand the meaning of the words I use on my website in the explanation of the Unsealing of the Seven Seals.

You state that the ressurection meant reincarnation, but you won't even offer an explanation from the Bible, some obscure scripture, or personal anecdote which leads to either two conclusions.

I have already written several dozens if not hundreds of notes on ATS. My explanation of this is contained in those notes. I do not have the time to give you a personal explanation. Read my notes.

You see,

There are ten principal phonetic tones in the English language; there are also intermediate phonetic tones. Each tone conveys a particular emotion and has a particular significance with regards to the structure of both the 'fallen' consciousness and the consciousness Created by God.

In addition, there is something called expropriated phonetic tones which are typically chosen to convey lies.

The two words you just used consist of expropriated phonetic tones.

You would not understand the explantion of expropriated phonetic tones.

Neither would you understand that the War in Heaven first occurred at the level of the phonetic tones of consciousness prior to any words at all.

When I read the words you use and there is a deviation between the conceptual meaning and the phonetic tones you are using, I understand the dimension of consciousness from which your words originate.

But you wouldn't understand.

the thing about the Bible and the Holy Spirit is that ANYONE

The words that peope chUz to capitalize are instructive. This particular capitalized word demonstrates another aspect of Revelational phonetics; something referred to as the visual masking of phonetic tones. For example, the word "ONE" is written as if it should be pronounced with a Long O tone; when, in fact, it is pronounced with a short u tone. It is pronounced "wun" rather than "On". This indicates the origin of that word in consciousness by the way that you use it.

can understand them in some way.

Another expropriated phonetic tone referring to the Revelation of the "resurrection"; coupled with a perverse phonetic tone. You convey a duality here of phonetic tones; thus, you are trying to convey the impression of telling the Truth, when, in fact, you are not telling the Truth

You are trying to make amends for calling me a liar. But it is not genuine; merely temporary and tactical.

It's tU lAt fOr that (too late for that).

A complete idiot could know the Holy Spirit, because God loves everyone.

The "beast of the earth"-consciousness of the 'thinker' "speaks with the vOEs of the dragon"; meaning that the "beast of the earth"-consciousness of the 'thinker' speaks with the phonetic tOnz of the dragun.

This means that there is no point in me contradicting your assertion.

Because you would never understand.

With that in mind, does yours?

DON'T expropriate phonetic tones with me.

Do you actually 'think' that I am incapable of seeing that you have no Knowledge, that your words are not chosen for the purpose of conveying the Truth?

Not sorry, but I simply don't have the time to deal with the remainder of your phonetic tones.

I'm curious, I'm all ears, please explain!

This is why this is so sad. The last two words that you use here do not use expropriated phonetic tones; they are, in fact, a very clear expression of your desire for Truth, for reasons which you would not understand.

But there are consequences to calling me a liar: I am forbidden to give you an explanation that you will understand.

Mi cha el

Originally posted by kallisti36
reply to post by Michael Cecil

 

Also, I apologize for stating you were a liar off the bat.

This is quite unfortunate.

It does not make any difference that you have apologized.

You might want to Google "accused our brothers" and "dragon".

I also apologize to the OP for contributing in de-railing the thread.

Let me suggest that many will abandon faith for Knowledge.

But not precisely yet. That is yet to come.

But I very seriously doubt that you will abandon faith for Knowledge.

Faith in the lies you have been told by the religious 'authorities' is much more pleasurable to you.

The word "faith" consisting of not only an expropriated phonetic tone, but an expropriated vowel--the unnecessary letter "i"--for the purpose of deception.

In other words, the word "faith" should be written as "fAth"--with no letter "i".

The phonetic tone of the letter "i", of course, is a dualistic, violent, phonetic tone as opposed to the pure, unitary phonetic tones.

But you reject the significance of all dualities.

So there is no need for me to explain such things...

Since you would not understand.

Mi ch ael (the phonetic tones in Hebrew are much more accurate than the phonetic tones in English)

Originally posted by etherical waterwave
Michael you have overcome!

Because of the expropriated phonetic tones that you use, I resent the implication.

This is not about me.

This is about the Knowledge Revealed through both the Vision of the "Son of man" and the Revelation of John which is EXPLAINED on my website; even if it is not recognized as an explanation.

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Michael Cecil

Listen to the phonetic tones conveyed on the link to the "Star gate sequence" from 2001--A Space Odyssey.

Link to the Star gate sequence:

www.youtube.com...

Mi cha el

getting to the kernel of the matter:

"Many will abandon faith in the end times. "


i see two logical reasons for this future 'falling away'

#1. major organized religion becomes that millstone around one's neck we were warned of:

a: because a religious war breaks out between Islam and 'western' Catholicts & Protestants
b. because of the hedonism of the Priests, Clergy, Preachers, Evangelists


#2. Science & Physics have made "Religion" passee', the mysteries have been uncloaked

a. the very act of survival & sustinence is of more importance than any futile 'beliefs'
b. religion's 'tax free' status is turned around, because a tax-free status is the act
.....of the State giving preference to a Religion..which is counter to the seperation of Church-&-State


all in all= the Age of religion (piscean) is in its waning years, science & knowledge will increase
to heap faith on the pile of pseudo truths we know as folklore and superstition...
the resource scarce global community cannot afford or entertain themselves with
trivial pursuits such as faith/belief/organized religion
especially after the 29 years of conflict, turmoil, terror, which sprang from religious zealots on
both sides of the Muslim-Christian divide.
the new order of the age has banned organized religious fundamentalism-zionism-zealotry-
by both former groups...those with a religion history are tracked & hounded, making MSOR
(main-stream-organized-religion) a underground subculture ~ adding to the #s of the falling away

Originally posted by St Udio
getting to the kernel of the matter:

"Many will abandon faith in the end times. "

The term "end times" or "time of the End" has more than one meaning.

There is no faith whatsoever immediately prior to the receiving of the Vision of the "Son of man" and the Revelation of the "resurrection". Faith consists of thought. Thought and belief must be annihilated for the receiving of Knowledge through Revelation.

#1. major organized religion becomes that millstone around one's neck we were warned of

Rather, the religious 'authorities' will be universally recognized as having no Knowledge whatsoever of the Revelations. All they have is the constructions of the consciousness of the 'thinker'--which, like Maleficent in Disney's Sleeping Beauty and the "beast of the earth" in the Revelation of John and the Quran, has two horns.

a: because a religious war breaks out between Islam and 'western' Catholicts & Protestants

And there is NO 'Rapture'.

b. because of the hedonism of the Priests, Clergy, Preachers, Evangelists

Hedonism is selling lies for money. Hedonism is paying money for nothing more than pleasurable lies and delusions.

Jesus warned against such nonsense; telling the apostles that Truth is given for FREE.

Just another requirement of the Teaching which the Christian religious 'authorities' completely DISREGARD.

#2. Science & Physics have made "Religion" passee', the mysteries have been uncloaked

Neither the physicists nor the "scientists of consciousness" will be able to explain the three dimensions of consciousness or the origin of human consciousness; something that can be explained only through Revelation.

b. religion's 'tax free' status is turned around, because a tax-free status is the act
.....of the State giving preference to a Religion..which is counter to the seperation of Church-&-State

The Judaeo-Christian religious system in the United States is PAID to teach LIES about the Doctrine of "resurrection" because those lies do not threaten the plans of the government to wage genocidal war against Muslims for the purpose of taking over the Middle East.

Mi cha el

Man this is one very hard to follow thread.

I'll just add something: There are no athiests in foxholes

Originally posted by usmc858
Man this is one very hard to follow thread.

I'll just add something: There are no athiests in foxholes

So, how many Buddhists are there in fox holes?

Similar to the Buddha, Jesus taught a Doctrine of 'Rebirth', but it was termed the Doctrine of "resurrection".

How many Christians--who widely and with absolute certainty believe that they are followers of Jesus; when, in fact, they are followers of the Pharisee, Paul--would be in fox holes if the media were to publish this fact?

Mi cha el

reply to post by Michael Cecil


?

My point was - during hard times everyone turns to their idea of God.

Basically saying I don't think religion will be abandoned in end times.

Originally posted by usmc858
My point was - during hard times everyone turns to their idea of God.Basically saying I don't think religion will be abandoned in end times.

But what happens if it is finally realized that it was the religions who produced and were responsible for those "hard times" in the first place?

What happens if all of the theories of the religions are finally realized to be nothing more than the desire of the religious 'authorities' to make money?

Of course, people will turn to their ideas of God.

But what happens if what they have always thought about God is nothing more than the lies that they have been told relentlessly by the religious 'authorities' motivated primarily by greed and the lust for power, and they find out that those ideas are all mistaken?

That is what I am concerned with: What happens then?

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Michael Cecil

Originally posted by usmc858
My point was - during hard times everyone turns to their idea of God.Basically saying I don't think religion will be abandoned in end times.

But what happens if it is finally realized that it was the religions who produced and were responsible for those "hard times" in the first place?

What happens if all of the theories of the religions are finally realized to be nothing more than the desire of the religious 'authorities' to make money?

Of course, people will turn to their ideas of God.

But what happens if what they have always thought about God is nothing more than the lies that they have been told relentlessly by the religious 'authorities' motivated primarily by greed and the lust for power, and they find out that those ideas are all mistaken?

That is what I am concerned with: What happens then?

Mi cha el

edit on 29-10-2010 by Michael Cecil because: (no reason given)

Interesting question. I believe there are various plausible scenarios depending on how open one's mind is to accepting the possibility that the extensive religious, spiritual, and scientific doctrines may in effect be integrated to form an all encompassing belief system that can be accepted by all of humanity. It is the extremist point of view within any belief system that ultimately leads to segregation and conflict within humanity.

For example, I was raised in Toronto, Canada in a traditional jewish home. I attended a private hebrew academy throughout elementary and post secondary school. The emphasis of the chosen curriculum was based on Judaic studies. After I graduated I chose to attend University as opposed to Yeshiva in order to expose myself to the multicultural diversity that is prevalent in Toronto and "expand my horizons". Along the way, I educated myself regarding the bare essence of all cultural and religious faiths and I found that the premise of all the world's major religions are actually analagous if you study the original scriptures and belief systems as opposed to the countless interpretations thereafter that invariably resulted in the segregation that is apparent within society today, even within the organized religions themselves!

Moreover, I believe that the creationist theory and the evolutionist theory regarding the origins of life are actually synonymous with one another if analyzed in a broader context than conventional wisdom would suggest. This approach to studying ancient scripture would actually endorse modern scientific theory within the realm of creation.

In other words, upon the formal disclosure of extraterrestrial life or the revelation of end times, I believe it is those that are open minded to the cohesive, undistorted, validity of all religious, cultural, and scientific beliefs that will be best equipped to accept such a realization with a sense of enlightenment as opposed to devastation...

Originally posted by Humanity4EverIn other words, upon the formal disclosure of extraterrestrial life, I believe it is those that are open minded to the validity of all religious, cultural, and scientific beliefs that will be best equipped to accept such a realization with a sense of enlightenment as opposed to devastation...

Well, maybe so.

But I really wasn't talking about extraterrestrial life.

What I was talking about is that there are easily several hundreds of thousands if not a few millions of people whose paychecks are very directly, or at least indirectly, derived from the lies of the religious 'authorities'.

What happens to those people when the larger population finds out that they have been paying for lies?

Who is going to want to pay them anymore?

Look at how many employees the Christian Broadcasting Network has.

How will CBN pay its utility bills if their contributors find out that they have been lied to?

Then, just multiply those problems by several hundreds, thousands or tens of thousands.

And not only that; one official of CBN has directly involved in the censorship of the Prophecies I informed him of back in August, 1976. What happens if/when that information is made public--especially with regards to the family members of those who lose their lives? Can CBN be sued for multiple tens of billions of dollars for "criminal negligence resulting in genocide"?

Not today they can't.

But what about THEN?

Mi cha el

reply to post by Michael Cecil


Your description of the power of phonetic tones is very fascinating, similar to the concept of the power of a name, which is why I use Yahweh (though Elohim or Adonai probably should be used out of respect) and Yah'shuah instead of God and Jesus, which are Anglo corruptions of the name and have no power in them. This is why so many exorcisms fail. Latin is not a holy language; the name of Yahweh is not in that language. English is not sacred either. This is also why those who summon demons traditionally use Hebrew as well, more power in phonetics. It is a shame that so few exorcists know of this. Thank you for finally getting into the crux of the matter, even if you do continue to repeat that arrogant mantra: "you wouldn't understand". You realize, I hope, that you may be wrong. I myself have pondered on the power of words, but in the end you may be over rationalizing things with metaphysics. Perhaps Adam and Eve truly did exist in the Garden of Eden and there isn't some occulted metaphysical meaning behind the story. None of us shall know until we die. However, in here lies where I disagree with you whole heartedly. There is no doctrine of reincarnation in the Bible, the ressurection is the gift of new life that the followers of Yah'shuah recieve. Reincarnation, as a previous poster put it (Alliteration: fun with phonetics), means being trapped in the earthly realm forever. The Bible refutes this time and again when Heaven is the promise made to the faithful. You also seem to forget one of the main teachings of Yah'shuah: forgiveness. I have forgiven your arrogance and snide remarks yet you seem to think because I have doubted you that I am beyond forgiveness. Did Peter not deny Yah'shuah thrice? The only sin that is unforgivable is to wholeheartedly deny the holy spirit, which is a lifelong choice that may be rectified before death.

This reincarnation philosophy is popular among new-agers, who often believe that the Buddha was Yah'shuah reincarnated. I understand the allure of Buddhism; Buddha was a good teacher. In the end, though, Buddhism is a fatalistic athiest religion and more of a philosophy than anything else. The main connection between Buddhism and Atheism is the belief in a final oblivion in death, Nirvana (for to lose the ego in a sea of everything is the same as becoming one with nothing). After discovering this, I found the philosophy of Buddhism to have some rather frightening themes, especially the Matreiya whose description matches the Biblical anti-christ so well.

I do plan on reading your thoughts on your website, whose link I have until now overlooked. I know you are onto something regarding phonetics, but I reject your philosophy of reincarnation, you have no support for it.

Originally posted by Humanity4Ever

Originally posted by Michael Cecil

Originally posted by usmc858
My point was - during hard times everyone turns to their idea of God.Basically saying I don't think religion will be abandoned in end times.

But what happens if it is finally realized that it was the religions who produced and were responsible for those "hard times" in the first place?

What happens if all of the theories of the religions are finally realized to be nothing more than the desire of the religious 'authorities' to make money?

Of course, people will turn to their ideas of God.

But what happens if what they have always thought about God is nothing more than the lies that they have been told relentlessly by the religious 'authorities' motivated primarily by greed and the lust for power, and they find out that those ideas are all mistaken?

That is what I am concerned with: What happens then?

Mi cha el

edit on 29-10-2010 by Michael Cecil because: (no reason given)

Interesting question. I believe there are various plausible scenarios depending on how open one's mind is to accepting the possibility that the extensive religious, spiritual, and scientific doctrines may in effect be integrated to form an all encompassing belief system that can be accepted by all of humanity. It is the extremist point of view within any belief system that ultimately leads to segregation and conflict within humanity.

For example, I was raised in Toronto, Canada in a traditional jewish home. I attended a private hebrew academy throughout elementary and post secondary school. The emphasis of the chosen curriculum was based on Judaic studies. After I graduated I chose to attend University as opposed to Yeshiva in order to expose myself to the multicultural diversity that is prevalent in Toronto and "expand my horizons". Along the way, I educated myself regarding the bare essence of all cultural and religious faiths and I found that the premise of all the world's major religions are actually analagous if you study the original scriptures and belief systems as opposed to the countless interpretations thereafter that invariably resulted in the segregation that is apparent within society today, even within the organized religions themselves!

Moreover, I believe that the creationist theory and the evolutionist theory regarding the origins of life are actually synonymous with one another if analyzed in a broader context than conventional wisdom would suggest. This approach to studying ancient scripture would actually endorse modern scientific theory within the realm of creation.

In other words, upon the formal disclosure of extraterrestrial life or the revelation of end times, I believe it is those that are open minded to the cohesive, undistorted, validity of all religious, cultural, and scientific beliefs that will be best equipped to accept such a realization with a sense of enlightenment as opposed to devastation...

edit on 29-10-2010 by Humanity4Ever because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-10-2010 by Humanity4Ever because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-10-2010 by Humanity4Ever because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-10-2010 by Humanity4Ever because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-10-2010 by Humanity4Ever because: (no reason given)

Ok, this all encompassing belief system, from a Christian view is one of the signs of the end times. If Christianity is true as I believe it to be, to form this hodgepodge of beliefs, as you suggested, would weaken Yahweh's truth. This is warned about in Revelations as well as the warning that many will scoff at the word of Yahweh in the end times. What Michael was getting at is the idea that if people found out that religious authorities had injected false doctrines into the word, they may reject it as a whole. This has already happened. It has been shown that the Nicean council gutted the Bible and made horrendous changes to suit themselves. This has lead many people to reject the Bible as a whole, in effect, throwing the baby out with the bath water.

I do agree with your idea that evolution and creationism are compatable. I remember thinking evolution was proof that Yahweh had a hand in things when it was first explained to me. I was shocked to learn that many people think this disproves the existence of a god.