Capitalism=Imperialism

Originally posted by justadood

Originally posted by abecedarian


Okay....

I'm one of many people that are capable of doing my job. I get called to do the job because I can do it, but that's not the only reason: I can do the job more efficiently than many others who are generally as well qualified as I. However I can do the job quicker than most others because of tools and techniques I use. I've built the better mouse-trap, so to speak. Mind you though that I'm not willing to share it with anyone thus no patents or such. Should someone else come up with it, they're free to run with it. Mind you though, I'm prepared to present and cite previous art should I ever be challenged.

I get paid more than many because I'm more efficient and accurate at what I do.
Such is the nature of Capitalism, no?

I'm not questioning your work ethic or skills. I'm sure your as able as you claim. Even more so, if you're truly humble.

What I've pointed out already is that if you live in the US, then you aren't experiencing this 'capitalism' you claim you are experiencing. The United States is not a capitalist economy. Sure, you experience aspects of capitalism, but you really aren't there.

Can I be any clearer?

I'm not talking about socialism.

My industry is actually very capitalistic, though it may not operate in a truly capitalistic economy. Businesses and individuals vie continually for the opportunity to work for corporations such as AT&T, Verizon, and such. We provide services to those based almost entirely on productivity and cost. Can't get much more capitalistic than that. Ironic, no... I earn more than most doing what I do, but I do so because quality and productivity are guaranteed or I fix my problems for free. I have very strong work ethics, and that is something few else do. They prefer providing an average product hoping to get by whereas I stand by what I do, win or lose.

But we digress....


I'm still trying to figure out how the OP can state:
"Capitalism = Imperialism"

Originally posted by Mental Maze
lol just a joke,im sure you wouldnt die for something so simple would you?

Would you die if it meant your family could maintain its way of life?
I would.

reply to post by Mental Maze


I would most definitely die if they decided to finally take my Liberty away in favor of Equality. I would like you to read something about Liberty because apparently you just don't understand.

"It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace — but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" ~ Patrick Henry

We take our Liberty very seriously here in America. We were even kind enough to provide you with the Fourteenth Amendment so you aren't forced back to the nation your parents left. And you want to repay us by talking down to Liberty which has given you the country you are so welcomed in? What other country could your parents have illegally entered had a child and the child not be deported? NONE. That is Liberty.

reply to post by abecedarian


Its a vivid comparison i compare the economic classes of our society to the society classes of the holy roman empire.In our case we are commanded by our government,not by presidents or free elections and votes.The government ultimately does what it wants with complete disgregard for other countries as well as our own..

Originally posted by Misoir
reply to post by Mental Maze

 

I would most definitely die if they decided to finally take my Liberty away in favor of Equality. I would like you to read something about Liberty because apparently you just don't understand.

"It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace — but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" ~ Patrick Henry

We take our Liberty very seriously here in America. We were even kind enough to provide you with the Fourteenth Amendment so you aren't forced back to the nation your parents left. And you want to repay us by talking down to Liberty which has given you the country you are so welcomed in? What other country could your parents have illegally entered had a child and the child not be deported? NONE. That is Liberty.

edit on 10/17/2010 by Misoir because: (no reason given)

Again, umm... "I would most definitely die if they decided to finally take my Liberty away in favor of Equality."
Yet you espouse equality over liberty... everyone get's something over providing for one's own self.

I'll ask again: have you realized the contradiction you are professing?

reply to post by abecedarian


I'm not understanding how I am being contradictory. The OP wants Socialism which is Equality, I want Capitalism which is Liberty. Liberty is not compatable with Equality, that is all I am trying to say. I don't get how that is contradictory.

Originally posted by Misoir
reply to post by abecedarian

 

I'm not understanding how I am being contradictory. The OP wants Socialism which is Equality, I want Capitalism which is Liberty. Liberty is not compatable with Equality, that is all I am trying to say. I don't get how that is contradictory.

My apologies. I didn't notice whom I was quoting.
I'll pay more attention next time.

Im an american born and raised so your racial judgement is irrelevant,we'll soon lose our freedom and theres nothing you nor I can do to stop it.You cant beleive everything you hear,ignorance is whats put america in this position,im just tired of my friends and family dying over the situations that our govt has put us all in,i joined the military at 17 because i beleived i was fighting for what was right,and i was lied to..

reply to post by abecedarian


Hahaha okay no problem. I was just like 'What is he talking about!?'.

reply to post by abecedarian


why are you framing it to me in opposition to 'socialism'? I get that is what the OP is referring to, but I'm not.I have said nothing about socialism. I am merely pointing out that the US isn't really 'capitalist'.

reply to post by Mental Maze


Join the club. We have all been lied to continuously, but if you think Socialism is going to solve the problem then you are quite misinformed. I understand your frustrations with how the poor are treated so badly and they are not getting any help while the government and corporations are making huge sums of money and stealing from everyone yet people want to keep the system which allows this to occur. Am I relatively correct?

If so then you are thinking the exact same way I did, the EXACT same way. But when I came to realize that as long as government stays out of it the corporations cannot steal from us and as long as we enforce culture we will always provide for the needy without people being forced to help. Capitalism only works in a moral society based upon the belief that 'I am my brother’s keeper' and you are always willing to help your neighbor. Capitalism works, but not the distorted Corporatism it has become by forcing Liberalism, Modernity, Social Progress and Individualism on us all. This has led to consumerism, corruption, self-centered behavior, war, destruction of culture and loss of our spirits.

That must be understood and once it is you can understand why things are the way they are and how Socialism will only make it worse.

Originally posted by Mental Maze
reply to post by abecedarian

 

Its a vivid comparison i compare the economic classes of our society to the society classes of the holy roman empire.In our case we are commanded by our government,not by presidents or free elections and votes.The government ultimately does what it wants with complete disgregard for other countries as well as our own..

Okay... the president and congress are our system of governance. The failure is due to the ineptitude of the populace to vote in representatives, congress-persons, and a president able to represent the congregate will of the people, not a failure of the system itself. A rather sad outcome given the ubiquity of the Internet and its ability to distribute information to the populace.

That does not however warrant a change in the system but rather a change in how the system relates to the people.

And still... am waiting for you to prove "Capitalism=Imperialism".

Originally posted by justadood
reply to post by abecedarian

 

why are you framing it to me in opposition to 'socialism'? I get that is what the OP is referring to, but I'm not.I have said nothing about socialism. I am merely pointing out that the US isn't really 'capitalist'.

You tell me that I don't work in a 'capitalist' economy, yet everything I do is 'capitalist'... and when I explain that to you... you wonder....
I give up.

After reading this thread, I do believe i've had an epiphany. It does not matter what socio/political system we have.
Not
One
Bit.

What we need is not a change of system, rather a change of mentality. Regardless of which system you happen to think will be "so much better than what we are doing now"' it wont. It is all the same, as we all desire the same things. I can say this confidently, because while calling for pure socialism, the OP has defined capitalism, as well as anarchism, in a way.....pretty much everything except tyranny and/or/of a monarchy.

What people everywhere need to do, is learn to identify corruption and not tolerate it. I think for professional politicians, it would be suitable if it were common practice (should they be corrupt or have tyrannical aspirations) for them to be fired on the spot, followed by being laughed at everywhere they go for say....three years minimum.

*eta* You know what? Even if we cannot fire them all at once, at least we can start laughing at them, right now! You see a politician, point and laugh at 'em!

reply to post by Misoir


i do understand that,but nobody is understanding that im merely suggesting the U.S adopt SOME socialist values,a liiiittllee bit of equality wouldnt destroy society..

Originally posted by Mental Maze
reply to post by Misoir

 

i do understand that,but nobody is understanding that im merely suggesting the U.S adopt SOME socialist values,a liiiittllee bit of equality wouldnt destroy society..

And that proves "Capitalism=Imperialism"?

reply to post by Mental Maze


A little bit equality means a little less liberty. That is a fundamental moral question that I will always stick to the side of Liberty. Let's just take an example of Equality okay?

In the Reflections, Burke argued that the French Revolution would end disastrously, because its abstract foundations, purportedly rational, ignored the complexities of human nature and society. Further, he focused on the practicality of solutions instead of the metaphysics, writing 'What is the use of discussing a man's abstract right to food or to medicine? The question is upon the method of procuring and administering them. In this deliberation I shall always advise to call in the aid of the farmer and the physician, rather than the professor."

AND

He predicted that the Revolution's concomitant disorder would make the army "mutinous and full of faction," and then a "popular general," commanding the soldiery's allegiance, would become "master of your assembly, the master of your whole republic." Though he may have been thinking of Lafayette, Napoleon fulfilled this prophecy on the 18th Brumaire, two years after Burke's death.

Edmund Burke believed that the Revolution in France would fail because it was based on the belief in Egality which is Equality. They wanted drastic changes to society which was pushed during the Age of Reason and the Age of Enlightenment. He predicted it would fail with the rise of a Military Dictatorship which occured when Napoleon took control.

The point he was raising was that Equality when enforced does not work, all people must have their liberty which is their right to 'sink or swim'.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by abecedarian


ok if your not understanding my comparison of how capitalist economy is ruled by an imperialistic tyranny,maybe you should think capitalism on steroids,where companies(mostly foreign) are given far too much power but can't be stopped,because of course with money comes power..the big businesses keep economic class in check just as old monarchy and imperialism kept social classes in check.

in reference to "my brothers keeper"

you people er well some of you are still missing the point............

each and every one of us should have his or her own power to have their own lives in their own two hands......


and the comment of being your brothers keeper does nothing but breed dependency......

this is real life folks the only person you should be counting is is yourself.......there is no one else

there is one person in the world who you can truly count on........who will always be there through thick and thin...bad times and the good times.............and will never absolutely let you down...............YOU!!

self reliance
self responsibillty

and yes there are times that some people will need some help but throwing money at them isnt the way to help them................the best way yo help anyone else to help themselves....self empower........least thats the way i see it...........im sure there are those of you who disagree.............................................and you people really need to stop gauging wealth and success by the value of your bank accounts..........know whats truly important in life.