Capitalism=Imperialism

Now Ive been an ATSer for a while now and have refrained from getting political but i just cant hold back anymore.Its been brought to my attention that over 60% of americans still beleive that capitalism is the best economic order form there is and its evident that its wrong.Facing the trillion dollar deficit,disguising forthcoming tax hikes,not to mention our debt to china and the blows we've caused to world banking don't seem to be enough proof that socialism is what this country needs..So what will it take?Another world war,because at our spending rate and poor marketing that will send us straight to an oblivion where the entire u.s will be broke except for people who have invested into overseas markets.The u.s is becoming more and more desperate with the looming money crisis and its only a matter of time before we pay for their mistakes.EMBRACE SOCIALISM!!!Make others earn their money just like YOU!!!!!!!

Capitalism = Imperialism.

That's what your topic title is, no? So please explain how you come to that conclusion. Try to refrain from including corrupt government policies in your argument.

Thank you.

And for the record, Socialism does not force anyone to

"Make others earn their money just like YOU!!!!!!! "

Capitalism however does.

The reason bieng IS political corruption,I mean besides the richer get richer,poorer get poorer aspect of capitalism..The united states credit system(which definately needs to go) is a trap developed by govt fueled by the human desire to buy shiny things(metaphor) a person gets sucked into a credit pit and just like early monarchy if you cant pay your debts to the king you pay with your blood,but in our case you lose your belonging and your credit credibility ..

You can easily cmpare the U.S to the holy roman empire.

How exactly does socialism force everyone to earn there own money? First time I've ever heard that.

reply to post by Mental Maze


Socialism is most definitely NOT what this country needs. A managerial cradle-to-grave welfare state, a gross military industrial complex, Socialism has proven every time it has a position of high authority to express itself as a tyrannical force for oppression, destruction and division.

Liassez-faire Capitalism has not succeeded either, it has created a corrupt, corporatist and morally destructive society which believes that through individual consumption and greed man will advance himself. This has not succeeded and has failed almost as bad as Socialism.

Capitalism itself is the best form of Economic thought but the one that truly protects society, communities, culture and its citizens is Protectionism and Mercantilism. Combine that with localized agrarian communities capitalism succeeds.

Every political question is a moral question, like it or not. When someone chooses socialism they believe that people cannot make decisions for themselves and that trying to make everyone equal should be the goal. Look what happens in the name of Egalitarianism, the king of France was put to the guillotine in its name. In a nation of Liberty there cannot be Socialism because Socialism is about Equality, you cannot have both Liberty and Equality.

Originally posted by rakkasansct
How exactly does socialism force everyone to earn there own money? First time I've ever heard that.

That's my point. Capitalism forces people to earn money to survive. Socialism is something like "...to each according to their need, from each according to their ability...." or something like that. Or at least that was what I learned in economics, government and social studies classes.

Originally posted by Mental Maze
The reason bieng IS political corruption,I mean besides the richer get richer,poorer get poorer aspect of capitalism..The united states credit system(which definately needs to go) is a trap developed by govt fueled by the human desire to buy shiny things(metaphor) a person gets sucked into a credit pit and just like early monarchy if you cant pay your debts to the king you pay with your blood,but in our case you lose your belonging and your credit credibility ..

You made the declaration that "Capitalism = Imperialism".

Deflecting away from that statement by using government policies to support your declaration does not prove your assertation.

Socialism forces you to work because with it comes no other form of income.No welfare,no credit fraud,no social security for drug addicts and people who fear society,tell me do you honestly think that this pipe dream we call capitalism is better than the socialist economy??I mean i understand how you would oppose this if you hold shares in american companies because with socialism most shares would become state owned,but healthcare,schooling and taxes would be paid for with that money.

reply to post by Mental Maze


Would you care to state who you are replying too?

no the rich dont get richer but the poor does become poorer

the rich and im talking idk lets say wealth of 30 million or more can simply pick up and leave at any time of their choosing

the poor cannot they are stuck here with nowhere to go

the governments plan tax from the rich to make them poor and then there comes a time when there are no more rich so you have noone to take from and give to...........whats left is just taking from the massives to feed the government greed............whats killing this country is decades of socialist ideals............and its very embodiment is robbing from peter to pay paul.............borrow or steal from someone else and give to yourself(power)...absolute power..........this isnt about money any more...............its about the governments control over you and me..............

capitalism works.....................what doesnt work is socialism..........in capitalism there is success and failure and the strong survive this is the nature of the animal....................in socialism you become the strongest and take from everyone else making them weaker and more dependent on them............if there really will be a time of imperialism i would say its now with the imperious leader obama and the left..........taking and taking and feeding their own coiffers and letting the average john and jane fight for the scraps...........people just dont get it and there never will the utopian dream where every one is rich and they never have to work and everything they want will always be given to them............its a fantasy it will never be for the simple fact of mans own inate greed and lust for power and control...............with capitalism money and power are not centralized it breeds competition it provides better services cheaper and it has the ability to be self sustaining create wealth and that wealth creates more wealth the only thing that socialism does is destroy it............................think im wrong? take a good look at the redistributive power of the government and look at the wealth destruction...........missing the point of this post still? $13 trillion dollar deficits...jobs leaving the country....people unemployed..people underemployed...........the mass baby boomer getting ready to retire..............this countrys current path is no where close to be self sustaining..............and it infuriates me..........people are blaming the wrong people and not blaming the people who are responsible...........whats more they beg and plead for more and more government...............this country is doomed..............we are in our last days.........take a good look at what we had..............what we have now...............there will come days ahead that you will be absolutely begging for these days.......because the days ahead are going to make today look like a cake walk compared the evilness and outright shame of whats coming.............america you have a choice decide now............capitalism.......or socialism...................i chose capitalism and for good reason.

Originally posted by Mental Maze
Socialism forces you to work because with it comes no other form of income.No welfare,no credit fraud,no social security for drug addicts and people who fear society,tell me do you honestly think that this pipe dream we call capitalism is better than the socialist economy??I mean i understand how you would oppose this if you hold shares in american companies because with socialism most shares would become state owned,but healthcare,schooling and taxes would be paid for with that money.

I prefer capitalism because it implicitly allows me to innovate and create new ideas that can allow me to prosper above others. Socialism would require me to share the fruits of my labor with those who've done little more than what's necessary to get by. As a free man, blue collar worker, that should say a lot of my opinion with regards to socialism and labor unions.

Good day.

I understand your arguments completely,see what youve learned through disinfo is that people dont have to work to get paid which is completely untrue for socialism,not capitalism.With capitalism whatever percentage of your check is going towards supporting jobless people,which leaves you to pay for schooling,healthcare and other expenses that a socialist economy would take care of.

reply to post by abecedarian


NOO no no you've got it all wrong,youve been taught for some reason that you will have to share your hard earned money with others, how so?explain..

Originally posted by Mental Maze
I understand your arguments completely,see what youve learned through disinfo is that people dont have to work to get paid which is completely untrue for socialism,not capitalism.With capitalism whatever percentage of your check is going towards supporting jobless people,which leaves you to pay for schooling,healthcare and other expenses that a socialist economy would take care of.

Wow... you are misinformed, or are a troll....

Show me a capitalist society where people who don't work still get paid? The USA? LOL! It's the socialist policies and programs such as welfare, social security, public education and healthcare that guarantee that those not working get paid something and get benefits to which they've not contributed towards.

Are you seeing the contradiction you're presenting and perpetuating yet?

reply to post by Mental Maze


I've not been taught so. Matter of fact, Capitalism teaches you should not have to share your hard earned income. Socialism requires you to share everything.

reply to post by Misoir


Funny thing is that with capitalism we have nomore liberty nor equality than we would as a socialist country..Im not saying lets abolish markets and and rich people to hell im saying use the shares that govt already owns to create the jobs that they certainly can instead of wallowing in their own greed...The United states can most certainly adopt some socialist ideas.

incentive is whats hes talking about..................this is what is perhaps the best idea out of capitalism.....progress leading the way into the future.....the very foundation that built and sustained this country to the levels of the past and those ideals are not being carried forth in the mondane masses of today..........

a person who has the foresight,the knowledge,the will and desire to simply provide a good or service that he can make a buck on or alot of them..........that is what built this country.......

when the majority of the masses control or own everything............there is no wealth,there is nothing moving them forward their only desires are to live just as good as today tomorrow...........

capitalism..someone trying to get rich and trying his or her damndest to make tomorrow better for him and as a by product when he provided that good or service to other people that increases their level of comfort so to speak.....

this country was founded by people who knew what life was like underneath socialist ideals and values and they ran as far and as fast as they could from it........they came here for a better life and they knew the only people who could give themselves that better life was they themselves..............not the government.............we have learned nothing from history and it is repeating itself and it is a crying shame.

reply to post by Mental Maze


Apparently you did not understand my post. The only thing the government should be doing is managing our trade policies to benefit our nation. Although I support Social Security, I am opposed to every other form of welfare and income redistribution. We should live with the belief that we are our brothers keeper, but this policy should not be forced on us by the government or by anyone else, it should be a moral belief we all hold.

reply to post by Mental Maze


Capitalism is not a form of governance. American is a representative democratic republic, as was Rome. Capitalism is a financial system. And it is the best model for such as produced thus far.

Your OP is rife with contradictory positions and misunderstood or misstated beliefs.

Socialism does not reward work. Socialism merely spreads out the benefits of the work of the collective without regard to who did the work and who didn't.

Capitalism does allow for incentive based rewards.

But neither is a perfect answer. Socialism is patently unfair to the achievers. Capitalism is patently unfair to those who cannot contribute or who are disadvantaged in some way.

Unfortunately our American brand of capitalism has begun rewarding immoral behaviors as of late as well - as was seen in the stock market, housing bubble, and the bail outs.

We most definitely need to tweak the system, but to aim for socialism with that tweak is folly. However it is also folly to consider social programs to be considered as socialism.

~Heff