New Chemtrail Pictures!! (or is this just a Natural Phenomenon?)

reply to post by 5 oClock


But, not a thing in that article has any connection to the observations of normal contrails, ICE CRYSTALS, that form behind commercial jets.

People who use articles like that, and then attempt to connect it with normal, everyday air traffic, are either intentionally deluding you, or they are so far disconnected from science, and reality, that their paranoid rantings get attention, without a critical look at the veracity of their claims.

"Cloud-seeding" is a very real science...and has NOTHING to do with contrails at 30,000 feet....because, ONE, you don't "seed" cirri-form clouds, because they NEVER produce precipitation and TWO, at those altitudes it's TOO COLD for liquid water to persist in the atmosphere.

And, "cloud seeding" isn't the creation of clouds, where none were previously. It is inducing existing clouds, in the lower troposphere to (hopefully, for this is its intent) produce precipitation.

The other possible scheme they mention, the "sea water" idea, does NOT involve airplanes AT ALL!!! Ships. On. The. Ocean. Ships specifically designed to pump great quantities of ocean water into the sky, and make clouds that way, to alter the Earth's albedo. It is a "pie-in-the-sky" scheme, to me....and also seems completely unwarranted, and a foolish waste of money. Our naturally-occurring cloud formation, and the Earth's natural climate, is mostly self-correcting...and any temporary anomalous occurrences are often a result of physical forces BEYOND human control....."El Nino/ElNina", for instance. Periodical changes in ocean currents, in the Pacific, result in affecting climate patterns. Nothing we humans can do, about ocean currents!!!

Finally, the "barium and aluminum" claims of "spraying" is utter rubbish!!! Completely a result of those idiotic "chemtrail" sites using pseudoscience, and jumping to incredibly stupid conclusions, with absolutely NO merit, nor any sort of evidence, at all!!

Furthermore, as has been pointed out, IF there were to exist an extensive collections of tiny particles of barium, or aluminum, then they would show up on RADAR!!! Barium is a metal, too...just as aluminum is.

Weather radar works by measuring the reflectivity of the WATER in the atmosphere. There have been instances when large flocks of birds will show up, too. I believe, rarely, extreme dust storms, in desert locations too.

For cripes sake! Airplanes are made out of various metals, most of majority aluminum! They show up on radar too. Yes, because they're dense....but, an airplane fuselage that's a mere few dozen feet long, with a wingspan of about he same (like a small general aviation airplane)....they show up just fine. A LARGE cloud of "aluminum dust"? What these idiot "chemtrail" websites lack is the science, knowledge and critical thinking skills that most educated people have. The "chemtrailers" running those sites are either paranoid fools, or are intentionally spreading this nonsense, in order attract web traffic (and advertisers) or, to sell books, ball caps, trinkets, etc, to OTHER paranoid gullible science illiterates.......

Is it natural.
Yeah sure.
We live in nature.
Even chemicals are natural to some people and form trails in nature.
What looks wild is so many trails.
There must have been a fleet of invisible aircraft going by.
We got any of those around.

reply to post by TeslaandLyne

There must have been a fleet of invisible aircraft going by.

How did you know???

They're "invisible", which is the point! However, I have access to a photo of one, to share:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f1d6f5cf6ca1.jpg[/atsimg]

We got any of those around.

I hear tell that "Wonder Woman" has a huge fleet of them!! At least, some place on the Internet says so, so it must be "true", eh?


Oh, and PS: Pay no attention to the similarity to "Wonder Woman's" initials, and mine! No connection, nope....move along now, please!

I hope I don't have to bring out "Hypno-Toad".......

reply to post by weedwhacker


You are incredibly gullible yourself to trust the government won't lie to you or suppress any information regarding this matter Weedwhacker, and unless you work for them (a personal conviction I've had about you for quite some time, I will add), I have to question the validity of your claims against chemtrails existing alongside contrails. Moreso, I also observe that you astutely stick-to-the-facts regarding this subject in the realms covering the physics and chemistry of the matter, but you never ever venture into the political or economical factors that surround the matter. You may claim to be a master of the science involved here, but you are a pilot, not a chemist or geophysicist, and you rely on the same access to sources that most of us do. Yet, you show up on pretty much every chemtrail-contrail thread and argue the issue until you are conceivably blue in the face, verbally attempting to slice apart every counter-claim as "utter nonsense", "moronic", "pseudo-science", ongoing ad nauseam until the thread is over.

Prove me wrong about the government disinfo agent part. Do us a favour, and show us your heart is in the right place. Let us -the rest of us looking into this that is - investigate a valid conspiracy as the conspiracy it is, and let that run until it's conclusion to establish some Conspiracy Facts. Don't try to short-circuit the process or you'll just piss us off! We're going to look into this very suspicious matter on a board dedicated to uncovering the truth. We don't need reckless and insensitive attitudes trampling what we feel to be very valid concerns : for ourselves, for our families, for the society we live in, and for the sake of the future. If there is something to be learned, we don't need You telling us we are wrong, out of the gate, and trying to shut us down before we even discuss the matter. The truth is the truth. Anyone afraid of others seeing the truth would behave as you have been behaving; you're a zealot for the cause, and inquiring minds already think they know why.

The evidence is mounted against you in fact : oh yes, it's from those other, "circumstantial" sources that you refuse to address by deflecting it back to all your "it couldn't possibly be ..." arguments. Weedwhacker, there are purportedly 28 layers to "top secret" in our world governments, and who knows how many secret societies. Don't try to tell us you know Anything.

I'll bring up a very intriguing take on this, that broadens the topic quite a bit to include Electomagnetic Warfare.
(Yes, this remains on-topic).

My targeting involves the use of an ionized, gas plasma entrained within an
electromagnetic beam — possibly some kind of negative/neutral particle-ion beam.
There are photos on my site showcasing my torture and other victims torture.
The plasma is quite evident, and the beams are quite evident. Plasma can be
used to transmit holographic movies, holograms, sounds, smells, and pain to the victims.
Plasma is a great transmission medium with highly, refractive optical qualities and
the ability to transmit digital or analog sounds. It is used in plasma television screens
and in computer screens. Barium powders which are in the chemtrail spray have
optical qualities,. also. Barium is more refractive than glass. Aluminum when hit by
a laser will produce an aluminum-plasma. There are metal cations in the spray.
Many metals can be hit by a laser and produce plasma.

The military chemtrail spray operations were admitted to me off- of- the- record by
the air traffic controllers here in Texas in 2000. The chemtrail spray is loaded with
ultra-fine grain aluminum particulates. This has been proven by scientific analysis.
There is an associated system that apparently works in conjunction with the
chemtrails. It is the old Ground Weather Emergency Network (GWEN). Old radars
can be converted to gyrotron, impulse radar emitters. There appears to be a system
of these oscillating, magnetic, microwave emitters right on the top of the locations
for the old system. There is a mention made of a Ground Warfare Emergency Network
(GWEN-2?) in the Air Force policy study, “Air Force 2025.” I believe this new system
was setup on the sites of the old weather radars. You can see the oscillating, magnetic
fields on many of the base-reflexivity, radar weather sites on the internet. Europe
seems to have the same kind of network along with the chemtrails. Most NATO
countries have EM victims, chemtrails, and GWEN.

Qualifications of said victim.

Past Vice-President of the United States Psychotronics Association and Founder and Past President of Integrity Research Corporation, Lynn is well known for her work in bioelectromagnetics and psychophysics and for her activism in Green issues and Electromagnetic-Resonance Weapons Disarmament. She has lectured and published extensively on the topics of Bioelectromagnetic Medicine, Alternative Energy Technologies, Electromagnetic Pollution, and the horrors of Electromagnetic Warfare & Weapons proliferation as well as on Yogic Hygiene, Vegetarianism and Holistic Healing Techniques.

She is well known for her ability to make abstruse scientific concepts clear and accessible to non-scientists. For the past two years, she has served as a Delegate to the huge Global Activism meetings (the WORLD SOCIAL FORUM), last year in INDIA and this year in BRAZIL, where 155,000 delegates from around the World met to plan a safe, sane sustainable Future and strategies to counter the lethal assault on the Earth which is being waged by the Multinational Crime Organizations. This year, she officially made presentations to the International Community on behalf of the United States Green Party, the Electromagnetic-Resonance Weapons Disarmament Movement and the 911TRUTH Movement.

www.rinf.com...

There's a small sub-conspiracy I came across here too, which probably deserves a thread of its own. (Feel free if you are so ambitious as to present any or all of this btw). She claims this:

I am a victim of electromagnetic torture. My situation is documented on my
website at: www.noexoticwarfarezone.com.

Look at that site now : it's a World of Warcraft site!

Weedwhacker, let us discuss this topic. Butt out.

reply to post by weedwhacker

I thought of that my self.
How about the truth lasso to put on some posts on ATS.
The fact that agents know of the invisibility of such a craft doesn't surprise me as anyone
might have such a photo much like having hordes of photos of identifiable planes
making trails.

Ignore the Tesla craft, as its the result of all the Illuminati CIA control since 1943.
ED: Still a lot of trails so close together.

By the way, I never put you on ignore, even when the option was available.

reply to post by Northwarden


Speaking of gullible.....

Hijacking this thread with that junk from "RINF", and a crackpot like Lynn Surgalla??

Past Vice-President of the United States "Psychotronic" Associaiton??

Look up what THEY think "psychotronic" means...and the entire raft of "claims" and "complaints" made by her. Especially, that somehow "she" is being "singled out"! Hilarious, and a little sad to see the creeping insanity as it is blossoming in a person.

Really, have a long, hard look at her stuff. And, HER! Oh and there's nothing wrong with her website....your other "source" had the wrong URL:

www.exoticwarfare.com...

LYNN SURGALLA is a biophysicist, healer, holistic teacher, interdisciplinary scientist and non-violence (Vegan) activist. She hold degrees in Physics, Biophysics, Interdisciplinary Social Sciences, English Literature and University Administration.

Seems impressive, except for he crackpottery after "biophycisist"....I have tried and tried to see her actual academic standings, from verifiable sources --- no luck, yet.


NOW...upon a review of the VAST number of off-the-wall claims made by here (and others like her).....the tiniest shred involve the possibility of "chemtrails"...and barium and aluminum particles. As noted, any type of "spraying" that consisted of those types of material would LIGHT UP a radar screen!! THINK about it!

Radar uses EM radiation (the WX radar on our airplanes, for instance, emit in same frequency as your microwave oven). It is inadvisable to stand directly in front of an airliner's radome, at close range, IF the radar is turned on. IN FACT, as a precaution, many of us not only double-check as a standard cockpit set-up check that the radar is OFF when on the ground, we also, out of habit, adjust the antenna "Tilt" to full "Up"...which angles the beam up at about a 15-degree angle, as a "just-in-case".

IN any case, back to the EM radiation --- if you look at those nutty "claims", they also involve EM fields, and radiation....and the "barium" and "aluminum dust" that they think is "sprayed" is supposed to be there, to REFLECT that radiation!! Therefore, it would ALSO reflect RADAR!!!

Yet, the contrails (as a part of this thread's OP) are NOT shown to be visible on weather radar. They ARE visible in the spectrum of light that WE can see, and are therefore able to be photographed from the ground, the air and from satellites. Because, they are clouds of ice crystals. Ice crystals don't reflect radar energy. LIQUID water does, though. Even hail will sometimes not appear on radar, unless accompanied by a liquid water (hail, as it forms, is often surrounded by a layer of liquid water that hasn't yet frozen).

IF people want to believe in the "woo-hoo" that she, and her "colleagues" spout, by all means, that is their right....and deserving of its OWN thread, since it really (contrary to your feelings) doesn't belong here, when examining the facts of the OP's photos, and the circumstances surrounding their formation.

You see, it is NOT about me (or anyone else, regarding the hoax of "chemtrails") being 'disinfo agents'....because, ANYONE who bothers to learn the science can see it for the idiocy and least plausible of any of the various "conspiracy theories" out there.



Oh...and, what nerve to tell me to "butt out"!!! :shk: (BTW-feel free to ask any of the Administrators who own/manage THIS site....or even a few selected Mods.... They know my real-life identity, history, and experience. AND that I have never been employed by any government agency, at any time in my life....not that that matters in the least. Such accusations are usually the refuge of the desperately paranoid).

Start your own thread, on the topic, why don't you, as outlined above, and in your post above. I won't bother wasting my time replying THERE, if you do....because I expect there will be a variety of other ATS members who don't fall for JUNK science, who understand reality, who will be along to comment....so, be prepared.

reply to post by Northwarden


Hard to believe in

electromagnetic torture.

unless its over normal air waves
because any other types of waves were from Tesla and he stayed healthy for many years
until he mentioned he could make force at a distance.
Some claims appear to stem from the research of Tesla without naming his name and
can not be identified as his equipment although we must speculate on the operations
of equipment under wraps since 1943.

reply to post by weedwhacker

Hijacking this thread with that junk from "RINF", and a crackpot like Lynn Surgalla??
Past Vice-President of the United States "Psychotronic" Associaiton??

It may not be to your liking, but it is on topic. It was also ten times better than listening to you ramble on about the impossibility of chemtrails ever existing - a definition you have, in past threads, ruled down to nothing more than a speculative label which must match your highly defined definitions, otherwise leaving you free to discredit just about everything in your "immediate disqualification" category. It doesn't really work that way.


Thank you for finding the site : www.exoticwarfare.com. I had already spent about an hour researching her actually, enough to figure out that she continues to be active in the five years since that letter. The site itself includes links to information on Smart Dust, Vaccinne Concerns, Morgellons, Microchipping, and Chemtrails : it's already of more interest to me than your bland arguments that "nothing's wrong in the skies"!

I notice (on her site) they've started class-action lawsuits :

Contamination with Biological Implants, Heavy Metals, and Germs Emerging Class Action Lawsuit.
Permanent Injunction to Stop Directed Energy Experiments on Americans Emerging Class Action Lawsuit
Permanent Injunction to Stop Aerial Releases of Nanotechnology, Microsensors, Heavy Metals, Germs, Chemicals, and Other Harmful Substances Emerging Class Action Lawsuit

I'd say they're putting things together in the face of the dangers at hand, although I admit, things look a little chinzy with the legal site they use. Still, where you will probably insult, scoff at, and dismiss this point out-of-hand, I prefer to look at it with a sense of open-eyed consideration, and am content to wait and see where that direction will lead. It's a Big Difference from what you have been displaying, and I hope shows a lot more maturity.

LYNN SURGALLA is a biophysicist, healer, holistic teacher, interdisciplinary scientist and non-violence (Vegan) activist. She hold degrees in Physics, Biophysics, Interdisciplinary Social Sciences, English Literature and University Administration.

Seems impressive, except for he crackpottery after "biophycisist"....I have tried and tried to see her actual academic standings, from verifiable sources --- no luck, yet.

You're going to put someone in the crackpot list for being a Holistic Teacher or a Non-violence Activist?? Come on Weedwhacker, be a little more human. Or should we take a look at your top five characteristics, laugh at four, and forever scorn you for commenting on anything in the future?

I'm still looking into things.

Are we being sprayed? It's not only very plausible, it's happening. The questions are, what scope and amount of chemicals.

CHEMTRAILS OR CONTRAILS? Are we really being sprayed?

www.wiseupjournal.com...

Isn't aluminum spray also called "chaff"? When's the military ever sprayed that?? I thought it blocked radar, and was sprayed for that purpose...

Shhh, What if it was reported that they are spraying aluminum?

Could a Ban of Transparent Reporting at the Asilomar Conference be an Attempt to Cover-Up World-Wide Contamination From Stratospheric Aerosol Geo-Engineering Programs?

www.infowars.com...

Saturation through normal barium to counter radioactive barium contamination...

Chemtrails - Barium - Poisoning or mop up?

mikephilbin.blogspot.com...

Pre-HAARP, barium cloud seeding was used to bound electronic signals off the base of clouds and as part of HAARP's patent: It has also been proposed to release large clouds of Barium in the magnetosphere so that photo-ionization will increase the cold plasma density, thereby producing electron precipitation through enhanced whistler-mode interaction.

What Geoengineering, The Royal Society, and Suphur Dioxide have in common ...

Geo-engineering: climate solution or dangerous distraction?

www.theecologist.org...

Haarp, the art of cloud-shaping Video

www.pakistan.tv...

There is an excellent video demonstrating the whys and hows of this from the History Channel documentary.
(This is ten minutes and worth seeing)!

History Channel Documentary airs July 25- HAARP used as Weather as a Weapon

vodpod.com...

Twelve things you should know about Scalar Weapons

www.angelfire.com...

Geo-engineering is in full motion, you can look at the UN to see the public source. Spraying has also been documented in at least five military operations, that we know of.

Operation Deep Shield seems to be a prominent one, and is under mainstream denial.

______beforeitsnews/story/73/166/The_Chemtrail_Smoking_Gun.html

And although dated, these are older news.

Military Said Behind Up To Four Different Chemtrail Programs

www.rense.com...

To wrap up this post, a huge spraying concern for the future. IBM is reverse engineering human brains to create a "world brain", and the world is slated to be coated with smart dust to act as the "skin", which will relay information back to the source for processing through DARPA. I'm happy to bring this up again, I don't think many got to see the thread.

DARPA & IBM building a “global brain” “cognitive computer” for “monitoring people”
IgnoranceIsntBliss

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Isn't aluminum spray also called "chaff"?

Yeah that just came to light as TV weather reporters might say rain that is not falling to
the ground one said there was chaff being delivered at times and showing up on weather
radar.
Many youtubers video UFOs and then the trail makers show up.
We might assume stranded ships that might show up on radar are being protected but
they do drift down below radar instead of crashing perhaps as long as the ship can stay
afloat a rescue can come and lift it up or stabilize it from a heigher altitude that needs
the chaff protection.
So if in range of any radars at least the higher rescue ship is protected as well as both
when back in operation.

reply to post by Northwarden


No, aluminum spray is not called chaff. Chaff are small particles dropped, not sprayed that reflect radar to mask other targets. It's been used since radar was first used for planes.
As to the other parts of your "claims", you are so far off the facts that are provable and have been studied for decades, by real scientists, in experiments that are published and critiqued by other real scientists it's actually amusing. Unlike "chemtrail" sites, which conduct their own tests, make their own assumptions, and have bad science behind them, real science requires thinking and knowledge.

You are so far out in the fringe, claiming so much crap from such nonsensical sources I thought originally that you were joking. You really believe all that stuff? Why? Did you sleep through all 19 years of school?
I, too, am also called a disinfo agent, here and in other sites. I'm not a pilot or meteorologist, or even a "research scientist" as claimed by Carnicom, but I love science and understand most of it. Unlike Weed, I have been paid by the government, in forestry camp for two summers about 30 years ago. ( Ooooo, scary huh? You really can be paranoid about me!) I love clouds and am a storm watcher.
And I'd bet money you think "atmospheric aerosol" means spraying chemicals, right?
And that entire clouds are sometimes made by spraying?
And that the persistence of trails behind planes is a sign of "chemtrail" or real contrail?
And that there are tests that prove toxic amounts of barium has been found in the atmosphere?
Chemtrail planes are featureless, even invisible?
Do you believe rainbows should not be seen in sprinklers? I bet you do.

See, I know there are disinformationalists out there and that there is a "chemtrail" conspiracy.
Just look at all the ads on Rense.com, or Alex Jones. Buy a book from Will Thomas or a video from Carnicom. They are the shills, spreading pseudoscience to gullible people who use the internet for all of their information and never ask questions, expect answers or use critical thinking.
That is the conspiracy I want people to know about. The one that tells people to stop thinking.

The so called 'conspiracy people' are reflecting the concerns of the people.
In law terms 'act of God' or 'act of nature' are for events that can not be controlled.
Well people think there are event that are under human control and Jones and
others make a living pointing out numerable events in history of misguided or
intentional human events.
So far the determination of some event appear beyond any human answering
to human concerns and will just have to wait for ultimate 'act of God' for
final justice.
If trails in the sky were so natural who would care.
No one sees the planes but we have tones of photos.
Where are all the airliners making trails.
Obama should have chase planes going after every airliner and aircraft
in the sky till the real trail plains are found and dealt with.
ED: The so called long lasting haze is most likely a Nitrogen compound
from the high voltage and abundance of Nitrogen in the atmosphere and
Tesla always said he could burn Nitrogen in high voltage.
Every one else shuts their trap or they would be trapped but not
Tesla as he knew his science would conquer the skies but that
darn pollution his invention makes is a big doodoo on us from
the skies above.

reply to post by defcon5


You can see line clouds coming off Lake Michigan going east in winter.
Never saw them over dry land without a nearby lake.
Of course there is a theory that the ground to air lifting forces of the
Tesla ship might bring up any moisture below into the upper atmosphere.
Sort of the reverse of William Reich's rain maker.

reply to post by TeslaandLyne


He says that he is near Selfridge AFB, that is right on lake St Clair.
I'm not sure what this airship your talking about is though.

Originally posted by defcon5
reply to post by TeslaandLyne

 

He says that he is near Selfridge AFB, that is right on lake St Clair.
I'm not sure what this airship your talking about is though.

So fact you know of water nearby.
Some people, perhaps one a Mr. Lyne, think the Tesla ship is a fact but
not dictated to us from authorities that instruct us on how atomic energy
is used for electrical power.
We are not told by any one of anything Tesla since 1943 so people connecting
strange air disturbances such as trails that annoy them to a ship from Tesla
is no surprise to anyone.

reply to post by TeslaandLyne


But there are no real spray planes. They are standard jets, with standard engines using standard jet fuel.

People care now because the internet has brought the pseudoscience crap to this medium. Now people are paying attention to something that has been there since planes first flew. "Tones" of pictures mean that people are finally looking at the sky and can use a camera. It does not make the content of what they are seeing any different than what was there all along. And a even the best picture or video cannot distingush chemical content. As the photo posted by Defcon 5 shows, you can't even claim that every line in the sky seen is somehow related to any jet activity. Nature makes clouds form into long, multiple lines sometimes. It's not something new, it's something shown in pictures, even art from the Masters.
In order to even suggest that there are "chemtrails" for any reason, there must be testing done to find the "chem" or there must be formations that nature cannot do all by itself. I've been debunking for just about 2 years and have looked and been told, countless times, that there is proof of both. None has ever surfaced.

But there is 90 years (the first published paper on contrails was from the 1920's, based on observation in WW1) of many branches of study, by many different experts, for many different reasons. That knowledge is a base that all similar studies have confirmed and supported. The knowledge hasn't changed, though our understanding has, like any science in a similar length of time.
It's not until the internet that people looked up and noticed that white lines form behind some jets. And they forgot all the science they have ever learned and listened to a few people, none of which are scientists in any related field, who made spectacular claims about things they didn't understand or know about. Had they asked a pilot, meteorologist, or similar expert they would not have started the myth But they didn't. It's like they stumbled into a science lab and asked the janitor what was going on.
Ask the experts. Look at the scope of the studies, the depth of the studies, and how the results are repeatable.
Then ask Carnicom what dihydrogen mono-oxide is. He was spoofed by a lab on that. And he says there are "chemtrails"?

reply to post by stars15k


You are right, it is the internet causing all the problems.
People think there are unknown planes due to youtube.
So now there are unknown trails in photos and on youtube.
Unknown planes and unknown trails a perfect fit.
The unknown sparking events are very bright and might be burning up the atmosphere.
No one follows these things to see what they leave behind in the atmosphere.
We only see youtube videos.