Breaking: Foreclosure and a Government coverup in the IRS? Deeper investagation needed

I stumbled across an interesting article on Zerohedge and I feel they are onto something. Of course it is breaking first here on Alternative news outlets.

I will sum up some of the key points of the article and I am giving full credit to the article so there is no need to cut this down mods as I am not copying the whole article

Experienced circuit court judges with decades of trial court, evidentiary and complex litigation experience have started to ask real questions about the millions of dollars in foreclosure judgments they’re signing every day in their courtrooms to entities that they cannot identify. Federal judges with hundreds of years of experience are really starting to dig into documents filed and representations made by the parties that appear before them… There are real questions being raised in bankruptcy courts and even bigger questions about fraud and collusion and federal crimes at the highest levels of American businesses.
Source

They go in in the article to discuss a readers comments about the above:

The best way to prove this mess all got dissolved is to go to the IRS.gov website and look for the publication # 938 for 2006 through the present. This is where you will see that the gain on sale reporting etc all stopped as the securitization machine was turned off temporarily in late 2007. The trusts were all named and reporting until the end of 07 then 08 is missing?????? They restart the reporting in 09 but it is down to only Ginnie/Freddie/Fannie/JPM/Citi and random trusts that have been created. The government absolutely knows what happened yet seems to help cover this up thinking we are too dumb to catch it.
Source

Now you can see this all on the source, but for now I will add them to this page for easier access.

When you look at the IRS website you can see the p938 reports, which are real estate mortgage investment conduits Internal Real Estate (REMICs) and collateralized debt obligations Revenue (CDOs).

Explanation of REMICS here

Here they are:

2003 IRS p938

2004 IRS p938

2005 IRS p938

2006 IRS p938

2007 IRS p938

2008 IRS p938 Missing! The big question is why?

2009 IRS p938




IRS Prior Years database take a look


Why would the IRS remove this? Time to get our investigative hats on!

Lucky for us the digital age has made backing up databases easier!

www.unclefed.com has a copy of 2008!!

2008 p938


So the big question is why does the IRS not have it listed? Is it because of the investigation taking place? Can anyone find anything in that document that is damning?

I also found this out about REMIC's:

REMICs are subject to federal income taxes at the highest corporate rate for foreclosure income and must file returns through Form 1066. The foreclosure income that is taxable is the same as that for a real estate investment trust (REIT) and may include rents contingent on making a profit, rents paid by a related party, rents from property to which the REMIC offers atypical services, and income from foreclosed property when the REMIC serves as dealer.
Source

This should be fun!

-Kdial1

Christopher Story's web site is still open . He has allot of archive material with analysis . I am not sure but he may have a hint as to where to look or what to look for . worldreports.org... I hope this might be helpful ..peace

No one have any input?


Further along in the article there is quite a smart person explaining what is going on:

The banks' failure to file taxes occurs at every step of making loans. The banks don't lend their money or credit, they access YOUR credit and bring it into the bank. Through fractional banking they leverage up your credit 9x and make more loans. The earnings on the 9x are supposed to be reported on the 1099OID forms to the IRS. They never do report and pay the tax. I doesn't surprise me that during the securitization, they have the IRS 938 forms to submit. They don't file their taxes at any point. They withhold your credit and present you with a promissory note to make you promise to pay back your credit plus interest for the life of the loan. This is the loan we are tricked into believing we received. Since the bank has no consideration in the contract, they have no right to collateralize or demand payment for the loan. The contract was a fraud to begin with. Then, after 3 years they can file the 1099A Abandonment of credit form with your name on it stating that you abandoned your credit with them. The fact is you had no idea you received credit at the time of signing the loan application. The banks succeed in stealing your credit 3 years later. This is well known by all regulators and government. Even the CPAs know what is going on. But my CPA stated that the taxes to be paid were so miniscule in relation to the tax return of the banks that it would not be prosecuted. This is particularly so if only a few people report to the IRS that the taxes on their transactions were not paid. Just a drop in the bucket. So now that the MBS investors found out 938 tax filings were not done, we might get some action. But what about all the 1099OIDs not filed? What about all the credit stolen by the banks at the same time?........
by kayl
on Sat, 10/16/2010 - 11:18
#655143 of Zerohedge.com

He goes on, but I think he has nailed it...

I do not think the Mainstream media will report on this, so it is up to us to spread this. We are more powerful than the MSM anyways so lets get this out there!

Why are these Powerful Banksters not in jail for Tax evasion?

I think we all know the answer to that.... The elite rule, I bet there is going to be some legislation passed that lets everyone of these scumbags go. EX POST FACTO STYLE! (For those that don't know, Ex post facto law is illegal in the United states due to the Bill of Rights and the US constitution.)

That is when I believe Americans will have had enough of this ruling elite running over our system and country ruining the values and pride of the US Constitution and the people of this great nation!

I am getting sick even thinking about them passing something like this through .......

Going to shutup and see what everyone else has to say about the subject.

-Kdial1

reply to post by the2ofusr1


Thank you!! Very good stuff here!

Article from 2008

[Alan Greenspan] ‘The evidence strongly suggests that without the excess demand from securitizers, sub-prime mortgage originations (undeniably the original source of the crisis) would have been far smaller, and defaults accordingly far lower’.

As will be seen, all that Greenspan did here was to describe the situation in general terms, offering no solutions and deflecting attention from his own culpability while at the same time perpetuating the CIA ‘slide’ that the crisis stemmed originally from the ‘sub-prime mortgage meltdown’.

The only element of that last statement that is true concerns the fact that when the ‘taster’ low-interest period of certain mortgages ended, very large increases in monthly payments proved impossible for lower-income householders to finance.

However the real financial scandal buried inside this ‘slide’ is that the mortgage bank prospectively gets paid FOUR TIMES per mortgage:

Payment #1: Down payment and subsequent income stream from the householder granted the mortgage.

Payment #2: A discounted payment from the ‘mortgage collectiviser’ (such as Lehman Brothers or Bear Stearns) which buys the mortgage at a discount from the mortgage bank and then sells it on to Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac, which then places the mortgage in a trust, which then creates Collateralised Debt Obligations (CDOs) after collectivisation with other mortgages (or even with dud paper), and then splits the CDOs into tranches, which are then multiplied creating a ‘basket’ of pools of tranches which are sold off to institutions, especially carousel participating institutions abroad which didn’t originally do their due diligence, with the resulting avalanche of completely worthless assets being propped up alone by the NAMES OF THE INSTITUTIONS marketing them.

Of course, from the earliest stage of this avalanche, the owners of the ‘assets’ beyond the original mortgage bank have sold them ‘without recourse’ to the holder of the original mortgage.

Therefore, if the mortgagee defaults, so that the ORIGINAL asset has become worthless, none of the parties ‘downstream’ is any the wiser. They just keep on marketing successive tranches of these fake ‘assets’ ON THE UNCHECKED ASSUMPTION that the original mortgage is still intact.

• For Greenspan, who was arrested in June 2007 and held under house arrest/in jail for three weeks to bring him to his senses, to tell Congress that he ‘couldn’t have imagined’ this being the case, is TYPICALLY SELF-SERVING and UTTERLY OUTRAGEOUS.

Payment #3:
Since the bank continues to hold the associated Universal Commercial Code 1 document that goes with the original mortgage and does not ‘travel’ with the subsequent hypothecations, the bank is in a position to sell the mortgage a second time, to a third party (which starts the replication process beyond the mortgage bank all over again).

Payment #4:
Finally, the bank of course continues to demand the repayments from the mortgagee. Should the mortgagee default, and foreclosure occurs, the bank hopes to be in a position to repossess the property, whereupon it becomes a realtor and proceeds to sell it or to provide a mortgage against it from scratch (which would open up a further three prospective payments for the mortgage bank in accordance with the above sequence).

In such cases, people facing repossession should, as we pointed out in our report dated 26th December 2007, demand that the TOP COPY of the mortgage document be presented to the Court.

Since the bank has sold the mortgage on, it may not be able to comply with this demand, in which case the repossession should be adjudged to be null and void.

• A related scam associated with this scandal here is that mortgagees may have been asked to sign THREE TOP COPIES of the mortgage documents, which of course greatly facilitates the proliferation of this fraudulent financing scam scenario.


Source 2008 Article on Worldnews.org

I thank you again for contributing the2ofusr1, it is a long messy paper trail but we will get to the bottom of it!

For some reason, I feel that we need a tax lawyer here in this thread. I have a sneaking suspicion that the amount owed by the banks is going to be out of this world! There is no way in hell the American people will bail them out again, absolutely no way.

They may try doing this under the table without letting the public in.... We need to keep a close eye on this!

-Kdial1

Originally posted by kdial1

However the real financial scandal buried inside this ‘slide’ is that the mortgage bank prospectively gets paid FOUR TIMES per mortgage:

I thought it was on 2 times they got paid.. The actual money and the interest which usually equals out to the house or a tad over what the house is worth.,.

EXP: My ex got a house for around 70g, after she is done paying the loan off she will have paid into the house around 150ish grand..

How do they get paid 4x's the amount.. I dont get what they are saying and why they are saying this..

Oh if you wanna take a crash course in fractional reserve you might wanna look at this below..

Google Video Link

I dont agree with the 2nd part of this movie but the 1st part is very interesting.. skip to around 4 minutes..

reply to post by ThichHeaded



Sorry it goes on in the article.

I will edit and add the other 2 payments in the above post.

-Kdial1

reply to post by kdial1


Ok thats cool.. I added Zeitgeist above.. I think its a good way how money works and how the interest rate works...

No one, else think this an important issue?

I believe this is Front Page worthy.

It is being exposed here, the scam is unfolding before your eyes.

-Kdial1

reply to post by kdial1


GREAT FIND... I find this Extremely Important and Thank You for beginning this Thread.

It appears we have a lot of work ahead of us, but you already started with a great sum of data.

F&S and we need to keep this going until we find some resolve and this reaches the ATS Masses.

Best Regards,

t

Ya I am suprised nobody else has commented.. This should be interesting news..

Very good find indeed.
Unfortunately I suffer from Dysfunctional Economics Avoidance Syndrome, a condition in which my eyes glaze over and I go temporarily brain dead from reading about economics.
Go get those bastards!

reply to post by Asktheanimals


Its means we ahve been screwed good and hard and we actually paid for it.. Thats what it all means..

Anyway this is a good topic non the less...

reply to post by EyeHeartBigfoot


This is the stuff investigative journalists drool over.

We need to nail it so Zerohedge and ATS can get the kudos for it.

I am just not good at crunching the numbers and knowing the laws of taxes (percentages and such) I know we have some smart people here that can crunch the numbers, hell I am hoping we have a tax guy that reads this that can explain what the banks owe for tax evasion when they packaged these up.

I am not trying to cause an economic collapse here, I am just pointing out that the banks seriously I think could owe close to a trillion dollars.

I know we will not bail them out again for a Trillion dollars.

Of course that is an estimate but I think it is close. Considering the Housing Market I think was quoted at being 14 trillion dollars. (May be more or less) If they packaged these and taxes were not correct I see it being substantial.

-Kdial1

This may help if a tax guy is watching this thread and debating on whether to add input




IRS Procedure 2010-30


-Kdial1

Thank you kdial1 for posting this, I am still (wading) through what has already been posted. Economics has never really made sense to me but I am learning as I go here ha ha good post

We have a few economic genius types (or a few armchair ones, anyway). I would expect that we will see them, but it will be on Monday.

Regardless, people who actually know the law should be the ones chiming in here. Don't push the average membership too hard just yet. Otherwise you will get people who are even dumber than me trying to proselytize and wax philosophical about things they have no clue about.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


It doesn't matter, people are more interested in UFO's over NYC than the biggest scam ever in history taking place. This does not effect just Americans, this is actually the whole world it is affecting!

There was once a time when this site had great investigative journalism qualities to it.

This thread especially was a great one that ATS investigated that got picked up by the NY Times.

NY Times Article


I think most of those members have left and now we are stuck with people that enjoy debating, guess most here are learning from the best! (American Politics all talk, no walk)

No I am not going to debate if someone tries to derail this thread with endless squabble and pages that go off nowhere and make it difficult for anyone trying to disseminate information have to go through 14 pages just to get past the bickering.

I am going to go to another website and see if I can get some answers and will post back if any relevant information comes of it.

-Kdial1

Great info, thanks for posting.

The unfolding of the story is facinating. We live in interesting times.

Up next, collapse of the banking system. They are the next "house of cards" to go down, imho.

Alright....are you guys just going to sit here and take this!?!

Just saw this thread this morning, seriously!

CNBC predicts Congress will retroactively legalize foreclosure fraud

Congress will pass a bill to "forgive" banks the potentially criminal errors made in foreclosure proceedings, a senior CNBC editor predicts. In a blog column Friday, John Carney argues that lawmakers in DC won't allow the country's largest issuers of mortgages to suffer financial losses following revelations of numerous mishandled foreclosure proceedings, especially when bailing them out this time "won't cost taxpayers a dime."
Source

This is clear example of Amnesty Law being applied to the Banks and Ex Post Facto Law applied to the people! This is outrageous!! Every American that has an ounce of integrity left in them should be so utterly furious over this!

Brief Explanation of Ex Post Facto Law and Amnesty law:

An ex post facto law or retroactive law, is a law that retroactively changes the legal consequences (or status) of actions committed or relationships that existed prior to the enactment of the law. In reference to criminal law, it may criminalize actions that were legal when committed; or it may aggravate a crime by bringing it into a more severe category than it was in at the time it was committed; or it may change or increase the punishment prescribed for a crime, such as by adding new penalties or extending terms; or it may alter the rules of evidence in order to make conviction for a crime more likely than it would have been at the time of the action for which a defendant is prosecuted.

Conversely, a form of ex post facto law commonly known as an amnesty law may decriminalize certain acts or alleviate possible punishments (for example by replacing the death sentence with life-long imprisonment) retroactively.......Generally speaking, ex post facto penal laws are seen as a violation of the rule of law as it applies in a free and democratic society. Most common law jurisdictions do not permit retroactive criminal legislation, though new precedent generally applies to events that occurred prior to the judicial decision. Ex post facto laws are expressly forbidden by the United States Constitution.
Source

If this happens consider the US constitution null and void in the eyes of the federal government, these politicians that took an Oath to defend it will have obviously just wiped their you know what with it.

-Kdial1

18 Flags & 14 Stars For The OP with only 1 page shows we have a lot of interest. Now if we can just interpret the legal mumbo-jumbo.

Before Quickens Software, I was one of those idiots that never balanced their checkbook even though my father is a retired comptroller.

Since we seem to have not reached an ATS Member with the financial and legal background as of yet, I am going over to mom & dad's home for brunch and watch my beloved Cleveland Browns literally and figuratively have their asses handed to them by the Pittsburgh Steeler. I will see if he has any opinion.

Fair warning, he has been retired for 9 years, is in his mid-seventies, still is addicted to Wall Street and plays the market usually come out on top. So, he may just look at it and say it is pretty much standard elitist business practice that you just have to accept and move on because until they reform campaign contributions you just need to use such information like this when creating your investment strategy. Meaning, he would not really see a major problem because TPTB (and yes, he believes in them...) are either skating the law or have had the laws altered to benefit their cause.

He is however, one of the very few people I know with money and still possess a soul. I am not saying that because he is my dad but because it is actually true. The man is generous beyond words as he is someone who gives and gives and gives until it hurts and then he gives more, and not just money, he donates many hours of his time to (in his and my mom's eyes) are very worthy causes. I know my mom has a lot to do with it and yes I may be a bit blinded being he is dad.

I wrote the last two paragraphs so we all understand where I acquired the data in my up coming post and in hopes that I could avoid any personal attacks on my family. I am only bringing my father's opinion in because this thread has not moved on and he is the only person I know with a financial and legal corporate background.

Hope I come back with something.

Thanks again for beginning this thread,

t