Die Glocke "The Bell"

reply to post by aiex72


Not sure about a device to travel through space/time but I side with the nulcear device. If you look into the accounts of what happened to the scientists and the living things experimented on, it sounds alot like they are due to radiation. Health problems for the scientists and extremely fast decay for living tissues tested on. I don't know why you are throwing in the Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade movie, he doesn't become goo, the villain who drinks from the false grail has the life taken from him and is reduced to ashes.

reply to post by I B Dazzlin


I thought of this.We know that top nazi scientists were taken into the U.S.after the war.What if they used some of the ideas and concepts of the bell and toned them down slightly to create the aurora plane.

reply to post by UnveilingReality


If the Bell was some type of a nuclear device there are aspects of the technology that could be used in the Aurora but that does not mean that the Bell was a nuclear propulsion device. It could be a uranium breeder or some other device to prepare special isotopes. I wouldn't be suprised though, if there is really an Aurora, that it has some type of fision/fusion type of propulsion engine and used ideas and principles brought over from those in Operation Paperclip but that is still far from the Nazis building a jet or device that can go Mach 6 or defy gravity.

reply to post by I B Dazzlin


This is an awesome thread full of information, thank you for posting it. S&F

In your OP you gave some translations. I would like to add some further translations to those, that may or may not help in understanding the whole picture. First, the word "Tor", as you stated means "gate". It is also the Hebrew noun for "Dove" The Dove is also representative of spirit(Biblical). Second, the word "Chronos" meaning "Time" is also a derivative of "Crononos" which is the name of the Earth god in Druidic(Aryan) beliefs, who is associated with physical life and time. Later he was assimilated by the Catholic Church to represent Lucifer or the Light Bearer("Laternentrager"). To put it all together; Spirit through physical becomes illuminated or Thought through manifestation is understanding. With this flow of transition in the names I think they succeeded.

After reading all of the information in this post it's obvious, that as with the majority of similar subjects, the amount of different theories and explanations is over whelming. I think the only way to decide for your self what the true operation, or purpose, of "The Bell" was, is to conduct your own research and draw your own conclusions.

I think it's a foregone conclusion that the truth about this extraordinary piece of technology will remain a mystery, at least not for many years, which is a shame...

However, as i stated above, it would be enjoyable and curious to conduct one's own research into the topic. Therefore my question is this:

What evidence exists outlining what happened to "The Bell" after it left its final known location at Der Riese (The Giant), or Wenceslaus Mine on the then Poland/Czech border?

I put together some information about Die Glocke, some facts are uncommon

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Honestly what a bunch of drama queens... Some of you people must watch endless re-runs of X-files.

Given a choice between a sound scientific explanation of the Nazi Bell's purpose some people with a fragile grip on reality will always reach for the most bizarre explanations.

The fact is that the Nazis built at least four such devices.

Col Borris Pash of ALSOS captured two:

One at Bisingen which Company B of the US 1269th Engineers Battalion dismantled before the French arrived between 22-28 April 1945.

Then Pash took ALSOS into the Tyrol and east across Austria to Roggendorf where at an underground SS installation also known by the codename Quartz II, he located and retrieved the second Nazi Bell. These were particle accelerators pure and simple. they were however very advanced particle accelerators called spherical tokamaks.

A third one built by a man named Schiebold was evacuated from the fire ravaged ruins of Dresden and taken south west to Burggrub in the direction of Bayreuth. This device was highly modified with beryllium mirriors and beryllium anodes to be a particle beam weapon for shooting down aircraft. Whenever it was operated this device discharged ball lightning which were later termed Foo Fighters, but it was the beam and not the ball lightning which was harmful to aircraft.

The fourth particle accelerator at Wenceslas mine was flown to Norway in April 1945 and found its way to Argentina.

The fact that Die Glocke was part of the nuclear weapons project is the simplest and most rational explanation and it is cross corroborated by several witnesses who knew it's purpose, for example Dr Rolf Wideroe, Professor Manfred von Ardenne, SS Lt Gen Sporrenberg, Railway worker Joachim Ibrom, Nazi then later Nasa scientist Dr Otto Cerny, SS Hauptsturmfuhrer Rudolf Schuster, Dr Karl Wirtz who refers to it in Farm Hall transcripts, Professor Werner Heisenberg (who called it the "super-klystron") Dr Walter Dallenbach who built the Bisingen machine was granted patents for it (as was Wideroe) and lastly Herman Bucher the Chairman of Seimens whose company was involved in manufacture.

Against all this evidence some looney tunes still want to insist it was a UFO ant gravity engine.... Show me the proof?

reply to post by sy.gunson


There is one huge flaw in your theory..

If the Nazi's had the ability to make a nuclear bomb then why didn't they and why didn't they use it?

Antigravity makes much more sense.. because it isn't that big of a game changer initially. It also allowed many of them to escape and regroup. They could have regrouped in remote locations on Earth or even on the moon or Mars.

This would also explain the UFO sightings after WWII such as in the pacific northwest - the Twining document, Roswell and the saucers that flew over Washington DC.

Originally posted by 8311-XHT
reply to post by sy.gunson

 

There is one huge flaw in your theory..

If the Nazi's had the ability to make a nuclear bomb then why didn't they and why didn't they use it?

Not a flaw at all... You are just revealing your ignorance of the historical facts.

The explanation is found in Farm Hall transcripts of secretly recorded conversations amongst captured Nazi scientists. Professor Heisenberg was recorded discussing the reason with Dr Paul Harteck. Many years after the war and before publication of the Farm Hall transcripts Harteck confirmed this in his correspondence with Joseph Borkin. David Irving cites it in the Virus House where he wrote:

During July 1944 Heisenberg was visited in Berlin by Major Bernd von Brauchitisch, Goering’s adjutant, with a report that the German legation in Lisbon had learned of an American threat to drop an Atomic Bomb on Dresden during the next six weeks if Germany did not sue for peace in some way before then.

Earlier in May 1944 the then top secret B-29 bomber was flown to the UK and given massive publicity, citing the advantages of the B-29 that it was a high altitude bomber and signalling an intent to start using the B-29 against Germany. On or about 2/3 July Hitler was so panicked by these threats that he ordered cease to production of bomber aircraft and the Emergency Fighter Program. Specifically the Germans rushed production of the Ta152 high altitude fighter capable of combat at altitudes around 40,000 feet.

However Churchill also let it be known in this same period that he was preparing to use the RAF to drop cattle cakes laced with Anthrax all over the German country side.

Anthrax was the threat which broke Hitler's nerve. Germany had no antibiotics and Anthrax would have starved Germany into surrender in two weeks. Hitler began secret negotiations through Lisbon using an imprisoned former German diplomat Erwin Respondek. In December 1944 General Dornberger flew with Werner von Braun to Lisbon to participate in these secret talks. Hitler went to Roumania and met with Marshall Antonescu to open a dialogue with London in early August 1944. Antonescu had contact with Roumanian opposition circles who had direct contact with London.

The fact is Hitler would not be ready for a nuclear attack until October 1944, when a massed attack with Tabun-b nerve agent was also planned. Nerve gas would be used with V-1 rockets and artillery shells. Dornberger revealed after the war that Hitler would use V-2s with more powerful explosives than just TNT.

Germany was lacking high altitude bombers but had an emergency program running before July 1944 to convert the He-177A-6 bomber into a high altitude He-274 bomber capable of 49,000ft altitudes. Bombing accuracy was no problem with nukes.

Therefore this is the answer... Hitler was intimidated to abandon his nukes project.

After the 20 July bomb plot the SS took over the Nazi nuclear project and used it as a bargaining chip.

Antigravity makes much more sense.. because it isn't that big of a game changer initially. It also allowed many of them to escape and regroup. They could have regrouped in remote locations on Earth or even on the moon or Mars.

This would also explain the UFO sightings after WWII such as in the pacific northwest - the Twining document, Roswell and the saucers that flew over Washington DC.

Anti gravity makes no sense and there is not one shred of evidence that it is real. It only exists in the over fevered imagination of people who watch too much X files

reply to post by sy.gunson


Study the work of T.Twonsend Brown and Viktor Schauberger....

All the work is there and documented. They even completely confirm each others work. Read about the B-2 bomber.. the reports they make match the description of a craft Brown proposed in the 50s. Which is probably why the B-2 is public now. It's antigrav tech is probably old hat in the black world programs all around the world.

Also, Podkletnov who claimed to develop antigrav said his father had papers from Schauberger the Russians acquired at the end of WWII.

Plus, I know someone who I trust completely that saw one up close and personal in the late 60s. And it was the same craft Lazar described as did Billy Meier. His hoaxed models looked exactly like the craft my dad saw. Lazar and Meier were both disinfo agents. You take a real government craft and tie it up with all this phony sounding alien disinfo and legitimate witnesses don't have a leg to stand on.

Also, your theory doesn't account for why so many Nazi's we left alone after the war nor why the US and Russia were so interested in their scientists.

The Nazis had to have some legitimate technology as a bargaining chip.. your claim of the Bell being the chip doesn't make sense because it was no threat... how can you use something they already have as a bargaining chip? This would have also made ex Nazis even more dangerous to let out on the loose as well. But only if it worked.. if they couldn't make a bomb at the end of the war then it obviously didn't work...

Originally posted by 8311-XHT
reply to post by sy.gunson

 

Study the work of T.Twonsend Brown and Viktor Schauberger....

This is a thread about Die Gloke... not about ALLEGED but unproven flying disc craft.

All the work is there and documented. They even completely confirm each others work. Read about the B-2 bomber.. the reports they make match the description of a craft Brown proposed in the 50s. Which is probably why the B-2 is public now. It's antigrav tech is probably old hat in the black world programs all around the world.

In fact flying wings and stealth technology were Nazi inventions. Apart from some dubious claims, drawings and alleged notes you have nothing to back you up.

Also, Podkletnov who claimed to develop antigrav said his father had papers from Schauberger the Russians acquired at the end of WWII.

The let Podkletnov prove himself, meantime there is noting to link your disc craft or Podkletnov to die Glocke.



On the other hand I can tell you that Dr Rolf Wideroe was interviewed and cited in a detailed biography about his development work on the super klystron. Dallenbach and Wideroe were granted patents for it and Professor von Ardenne showed Soviet physicists Georgii Fleryov and Igor Kurchetov to the Wenceslas mine where he installed the Nazi Bell. The chairman of Seimens referred to it as a particle accelerator for the Nazi atomic bomb project.

Plus, I know someone who I trust completely that saw one up close and personal in the late 60s. And it was the same craft Lazar described as did Billy Meier. His hoaxed models looked exactly like the craft my dad saw. Lazar and Meier were both disinfo agents. You take a real government craft and tie it up with all this phony sounding alien disinfo and legitimate witnesses don't have a leg to stand on.

Like this?


I suggest you take stronger medication so we can all get some sleep.

Also, your theory doesn't account for why so many Nazi's we left alone after the war nor why the US and Russia were so interested in their scientists.

You assume every nazi scientist knew or understood about Die Glocke which is not the case. Nazi nuclear scientists were compartmentalised and besides Die Glocke began as a top secret project of German Army Ordnance (HWA) and was later taken over by the even more secretive SS. Not every Nazi scientist was involved with die Glocke and in fact SS Lt General Sporrenberg executed 62 Allied POW technicians who worked on die Glocke which was one of the charges which had him hung by the Poles after WW2.

Many scientists were left alone as you put it because they were of no use, had nothing to offer or were unco-operative.

The Nazis had to have some legitimate technology as a bargaining chip.. your claim of the Bell being the chip doesn't make sense because it was no threat... how can you use something they already have as a bargaining chip? This would have also made ex Nazis even more dangerous to let out on the loose as well. But only if it worked.. if they couldn't make a bomb at the end of the war then it obviously didn't work...

What do you call nuclear weapons if not a bargaining chip?

The Americans were desperate not to let nuclear technology fall into Soviet hands or have you never heard of Operation LUSTY or the ALSOS mission?

The Soviets had no enrichment technology in 1945. Die Glocke was far more advanced as a method for obtaining fissile bomb material than the Oak Ridge gaseous diffusion enrichment plant. Letting that fall into Soviet hands in 1945 would have been a disaster for USA.

And in fact Die Glocke was smuggled to Argentina in May 1945 according to an Argentine Government report declassified in 1993. Dr Ronald Richter re-errected it at Lake Nahuel Huapei for General Peron's nuclear project between 1947 and 1951. It was forced to close under massive pressure and intervention by US and UK governments.

The US Government conducted experiments with Die Glocke after the war in Project Matterhorn

Die Glocke has nothing to do with anti gravity and you cannot disprove the evidence I have cited much less cite your own.

If anti gravity exists, then demonstrate it

Note the presence in these Nazi craft of very conventional engines or rather please show me the anti gravity engines?

The Schumann Trinks bomb went through many minor alterations but taken from a 1942 German patent is this sketch



and an illustration (my own) copied from a diagram issued by Trinks under pseudonym in France after the war:



and the Swann device evolved from but still based upon the work of Schumann and Trinks:



Interestingly the original 1942 bomb specified Uranium 233 as it's fissile material and please can anyone inform me how else except from a particle accelerator could the Germans obtain Uranium 233 in 1942. Heisenberg's speech notes from the Harnack Haus conference of 1942 recently emerged from former KGB files in which Heisenberg specified the need to launch a project to harvest Protactinium 233, which we know degrades after 27 days into .... you guessed Uranium 233

reply to post by sy.gunson



Have you ever considered how electrogravitics would aid in a device used to process nuclear material? Or a nuclear device itself?

Any way.. here is some "proof" for you of electrogravitics being legitimate. - REAL.


www.padrak.com...

"ELECTROGRAVITICS SYSTEMS"
The Declassified Report: Transcribed and Hereby Given to the World.

8. Electrostatic energy sufficient to produce a Mach 3 fighter is possible with megavolt energies and a k of over 10,000.

[Page 20]
9. k figures of 6,000 have been obtained from some ceramic materials and there are prospects of 30,000.

Originally posted by 8311-XHT
reply to post by sy.gunson

 

Have you ever considered how electrogravitics would aid in a device used to process nuclear material? Or a nuclear device itself?

Any way.. here is some "proof" for you of electrogravitics being legitimate. - REAL.

www.padrak.com...

Having read it I had to try very hard to stay awake. Some small laboratory experiments which never resulted in any practical application and apparently are unworkable on the scale needed for a large craft and in either case would irradiate everything around and beneath it and would therefore be detectable from radioactive air samples, none of which you have pointed to proof from.

You atart with a theory unconnected with Die Glocke and try very hard to adapt it to the Nazi device in your theories, but only mange to do that by asserting a flying craft of which you have no evidence and by wholesale sweeping aside and denial of actual corroborating evidence for the Nazi bell as part of a project to harvest fissile material for a nuclear weapon.

Bravo, if there were a way to prove water flows up hill you would be the man to prove it... Theoretically that is

reply to post by sy.gunson


You said eelctrogravitics wasn't real.. I am showing you there is classified documentation showing it was... I didn't say they used the Bell in antigravity craft.. I was saying antigravity could have been used in the Bell..

The Bell may have been a device meant to do several things using the same mechanism in antigravity. The naming of the project indicates this.

I don't understand why you are so set on assuming that it only had one function. Saying it was some secret method of making bomb material doesn't make sense. IF that was all there was to it and if it was so valuable then it should have been able to make a bomb and they would have done it and USED it.

The whole thing seems to indicate much more was going on.. likely something FAR FAR more interesting and valuable than a bomb...

Or is your intent to dissuade anyone form thinking it is possible to achieve antigravity. That is the only reason I cna see for such a dogged agenda to silence the discussion of it.. disinfo as they say.. or maybe you are the one that needs the medication?

www.godlikeproductions.com...

Paul LaViolette: The U.S. Antigravity Squadron.

Electrogravitic (antigravity) technology, under development in U.S. Air Force black R&D programs since late 1954, may now have been put to practical use in the B-2 Advanced Technology Bomber to provide an exotic auxiliary mode of propulsion. This inference is based on the recent disclosure that the B-2 charges both its wing leading edge and jet exhaust stream to a high voltage.

Positive ions emitted from its wing leading edge would produce a positively charged parabolic ion sheath ahead of the craft while negative ions injected into it's exhaust stream would set up a trailing negative space charge with a potential difference in excess of 15 million volts. According to electrogravitic research carried out by physicist T. Townsend Brown, such a differential space charge would set up an artificial gravity field that would induce a reactionless force on the aircraft in the direction of the positive pole. cont.

reply to post by 8311-XHT


Except of course ther is no actual evidence to support the existence of an exotic propulsion system for hte B-2 at all.

There was some speculation back in 1992 - and everything since has been speculation dressed up to look like "fact"

Par for ATS of course, but it would be hoped that more people would start asking for actual evidence instead of unsupported assertion by now!

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


Could you show me the information you are referring too? From what I had heard people were not allowed to seethe engine bays of the B2..

From what I have read the is really no question anymore.. the B2 is the direct result of a aircraft TTBrown proposed in detail the 50s. There really isn't much to the system which is why it was easy to keep as a secret right in plain sight. They said the electrogravitic system was used for radar stealth.. this was just a by product TTbrown said his system would provide..

To see the article from 9 March 1992 Aviation Week & Space technology you have to subscribe.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


i mean the new info you said refutes the earlier reports