To the Ignorant Masses Stop Defending Islam

I am so sick of hearing people defend Islam not just the general population, but the government and the Islamic community. For obvious reasons these people cant come out pubicly and admit the truth behind Islam, its still infurating.


The Quran is the Core of the Islam belief, so I am going to go straight to the source.

Its believed that the quran was revealed with divine revelation to Muhammad in 610.With it being standardized in 653. This is the general belief by Muslims.

I am going to nip the argument of "interpretations" right here and now.


Around this time before and after for many years the world is controlled completly and utterly by religion with religious people killing one another in the name of their "god"

With this in my mind I find it a little far fetched and hard to believe not Only for the Quran but for the Bible and other books alike that the Scriptures, verses, commandments, ect relating to killing, violence, and all sorts of other travestsy are being "mis-interupted" These books wernt written by clever writers with the view of hidden messages in the words. Civilization and man is still very young at this stage. Logic tells you that whats written is in fact whats ment, and that man today with his greater knowledge twists the scriptures and verses to suit his opinion, and his view. The great Number of churches across this world that read from the same book, yet share views that are so outragously different is a testament to my point.

So lets have a quick look at what the Quran has to offer us.

The Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers. Some are quite graphic, with commands to chop off heads and fingers and kill infidels wherever they may be hiding. Muslims who do not join the fight are called 'hypocrites' and warned that Allah will send them to Hell if they do not join the slaughter.

There is no place in the Qur'an where Muhammad commands Muslims to love people of other religions. There is about 500 that speak of their place in Hell. They are from each period in Muhammad's life, scattered across 87 of the Qur'an's 114 chapters.

To put this in perspective, nearly one out of twelve verses in the Qur'an says that Allah hates non-Muslims to the extent that he will torment them for eternity in horrible ways. The Suras that make reference to this comprise about 95% of the Qur'an's total volume. If Allah creates infidels merely to fuel the fires of Hell, then there is little reason for Muslims to believe that such lives are of any worth in this world either.


I could List them all, but whats the point so I will show you some, I have not picked these for any particular reason, merely just examples.


Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help."


Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks.


Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"


Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them."

So According to this verse, the best way of staying safe from Muslim violence is to convert to Islam. Prayer (salat) and the poor tax (zakat) are among the religions Five Pillars.



Quran (33:60-62) - "If the hypocrites, and those in whose hearts is a disease, and the alarmists in the city do not cease, We verily shall urge thee on against them, then they will be your neighbors in it but a little while. Accursed, they will be seized wherever found and slain with a (fierce) slaughter."

This passage sanctions the slaughter (rendered "merciless" and "horrible murder" in other translations) against three groups: Hypocrites (Muslims who don't act like Muslims should), those with "diseased hearts" (which include Jews and Christians 5:51-52), and "alarmists" or "agitators who include those who merely speak out against Islam, according to Muhammad's biographers. It is worth noting that the victims are to be sought out by Muslims, which is what today's terrorists do. If this passage is meant merely to apply to the city of Medina, then it is unclear why it is included in Allah's eternal word to Muslim generations.


So there we have but a few examples of violence, lets have a look at hate another good character trait of religion.


Qur'an (22:19-21) - But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will be cut out for them; boiling fluid will be poured down on their heads; Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be melted; And for them are hooked rods of iron

Qur'an (9:73) - O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites and be unyielding to them; and their abode is hell, and evil is the destination

So because the non-believer is going to hell anyway, you might aswell be ruthless to him.

Qur'an (4:56) - Those who disbelieve Our revelations, We shall expose them to the Fire. As often as their skins are consumed We shall exchange them for fresh skins that they may taste the torment Lo! Allah is ever Mighty, Wise


Far from being mere history or theological construct, the violent verses of the Quran have played a key role in actual massacre and genocide. This includes the brutal slaughter of tens of millions of Hindus for five centuries beginning around 1000 AD with Mahmud of Ghazni's bloody conquest, including the massacre of those who defending their temples from destruction. Buddhism was very nearly wiped off the Indian subcontinent. Judaism and Christianity met the same fate (albeit more slowly) in areas conquered by Muslim armies, including the Middle East, North Africa and parts of Europe, including today's Turkey. Zoroastrianism, the ancient religion of a proud Persian people is despised by Muslims and barely survives in modern Iran.



So ingrained is violence in the religion that Islam has never really stopped being at war, either with other religions or with itself.

Muhammad was a military leader, laying siege to towns, massacring the men, raping their women, enslaving their children, and taking what was once the property of others for his own. On several occasions he rejected offers of surrender from the besieged inhabitants and killed those whom he could take prisoner. He inspired his followers to battle even when they did not feel it was right to fight, promising them slaves and booty if they did and threatening them with Hell if they did not. Muhammad allowed his men to rape traumatized women captured in battle


These are but a few examples, if anyone is interested I have not only the listings, but the entire scriptures here for reference.


Islam is a religion of not only hate and violence but the number one leading cause of the oppression of women world wide. However that is another subject all together.



I wish someone anyone would stand up and say the truth. This world needs to grow up from its dark ages forget this religious rubbish not just Islam, but all other Religions that are dragging us down Remove Religion and the cause for every war going on at the moment is gone. This world can than concentrate on better things, and start moving forward in the right direction.

I wouldn't say the cause for wars would be gone, but one of the excuses for it would be.

reply to post by Sacri


It's no worse than Christianity. I don't defend any religion, but Islam is no different than Christianity.

The horrible truth is that, numerically and statistically speaking, Christian Civilization is the bloodiest and most violent of all civilizations in all of history, and is responsible for hundreds of millions of deaths. Even so, Muslims will never associate this violence and blood bath with the teachings of Jesus (peace be on him).

www.islam101.com...

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by Sacri

 

It's no worse than Christianity. I don't defend any religion, but Islam is no different than Christianity.

The horrible truth is that, numerically and statistically speaking, Christian Civilization is the bloodiest and most violent of all civilizations in all of history, and is responsible for hundreds of millions of deaths. Even so, Muslims will never associate this violence and blood bath with the teachings of Jesus (peace be on him).

www.islam101.com...

I agree with you 100% I am working on a post similar to this regarding christianity as we speak

reply to post by Sacri

Far from being mere history or theological construct, the violent verses of the Quran have played a key role in actual massacre and genocide. This includes the brutal slaughter of tens of millions of Hindus for five centuries beginning around 1000 AD with Mahmud of Ghazni's bloody conquest, including the massacre of those who defending their temples from destruction. Buddhism was very nearly wiped off the Indian subcontinent. Judaism and Christianity met the same fate (albeit more slowly) in areas conquered by Muslim armies, including the Middle East, North Africa and parts of Europe, including today's Turkey. Zoroastrianism, the ancient religion of a proud Persian people is despised by Muslims and barely survives in modern Iran.



So ingrained is violence in the religion that Islam has never really stopped being at war, either with other religions or with itself.

The above has been plagerised from this site. One of serveral sources

And most of your rant is from anti islamic websites.

perhaps your thread title should be:
To the Ignorant Masses, Research Islam, Ask an Imam for the Correct Teachings of Islam

Judaism and Islam both encourage seeking of knowledge. A lot of Christian Religons dont mention this. What you get is from your 'study groups'. Test it out! Ask your minister/priest/padre that you want to read the Qur'an (or the tanach or tulmud) and study the views and beliefs of a different religion, then guage there response.

reply to post by Sacri


Both the Bible and Quran contain a great deal of violence and depict deities who are pretty much evil. The difference is that Christianity has become a modern moderate religion. We don't burn witches here in America anymore. While Islam arrived a bit later than Christianity it too has a moderate side that has adapted itself to Western values. So while I openly condemn radical sects of ANY faith, or radicals of any kind, I do respect and support the rights of moderate Muslims to practice their faith. As long as they aren't taking the entire Quran literally and don't adhere to the primitive aspects of it they aren't all that different from modern Christianity.

reply to post by Sacri


To Sacri and all who agree with his/her OP:

I have already proved the premise of your OP to be inaccurate:
True Islamic Jihad And It's Beauty

Only the OP is necessary, and is very short and straight to the point of answering this thread. Basically I PROVE that both anti-Islamists and Islamic terrorists are dead wrong.

Originally posted by Sahabi
There is a Propagation or Conspiracy going on to paint Muslims as blood-thirsty savages.

There are 2 types of Muslims:

1.) The Wise. Those who know the religion, and follow it as it is meant to be followed.

2.) The Ignorant. Those who take Islamic teachings out of context to fit their own personal ideology.


All of the Qur'anic verses and Islamic teachings about Jihad and killing non-Muslims is absolutely true! However, both the Ignorant Muslims and Anti-Islamic Propagators take these verses and teachings of War and Fighting out of context.

Please allow me to put the verses in their proper perspectives, and illustrate to you the beauty of Jihad.

Islam and the Qur'an strictly prohibits the killing of women, children, and old people. According to Islam, Jihad is actually a Defensive Holy War. Muslims are not allowed to attack other people or countries unless they are attacked first.

WHEN TO FIGHT:

• "To fight against whom war is made, permission is given (to fight), because they are wronged; and verily, Allah is Most Powerful for their aid." Surah 22 Ayah 39
  
  
• "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; For Allah loveth not transgressors." Surah 2 Ayah 190
  

WHEN TO STOP FIGHTING:

• "But if they cease, Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them on until there is no more persecution and the religion becomes Allah's. But if they cease, let there be no hostility except to those who practice oppression." Surah 2 Ayah 192-193
  
  
• "But if the enemy inclines towards peace, you must also incline towards peace, and trust in Allah: for He is the One that hears and knows (All things)." Surah 8 Ayah 61
  
  
• "Allah does not forbid that you do good and make justice for those who do not fight you in the religion or drive you out from your homes. Indeed, Allah loves those who do justice. Allah only forbids your friendship with those who fight you in the religion and drive you out from your homes and back those who drive you out. And befriends them, such are wrongdoers." Surah 60 Ayah 8-9
  

WHO IS PROHIBITTED TO KILL:

• "....whoever kills a single soul unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land, it is though he had killed all of humanity together, and whoever saves the life of a single soul, it is as though he had saved the life of all of humanity together..." Surah 5 Ayah 32
  
  
• [ It is narrated on the authority on Abdullah that a woman was found killed in one of the battles by the Messenger of Allah (s.a.w.s.). He disapproved of the killing of women and children.] Hadith Sahih Muslim Book 19 Number 4319
  
  
• [ It is narrated by ibn Umar that a woman was found killed in one of these battles; so the Messenger of Allah (s.a.w.s.) forbade the killing of women and children. ]
  Hadith Sahih Muslim Book 19 Number 4320
  
  
• "Stop, O people, that I may give you ten rules for your guidance in the battlefield. Do not commit treachery or deviate from the right path. You must not mutilate dead bodies. Neither kill a child, nor a woman, or an aged man. Bring no harm to the trees, nor burn them with fire, especially those which are fruitful. Slay not any of the enemy's flock, save food for yourself. You are likely to pass by people who have devoted their lives to monastic services; leave them alone." Quoted by the first Khalifah Abu Bakr
  

All of the many verses from the Qur'an you have seen that prescribe and ordain Jihad, War, Fighting, Murder, and Violence MUST strictly adhere to these guidelines in order to be considered Righteous Acts of Jihad. Anything straying outside these guidelines will surely gain the Wrath and Punishment of God, not His Blessings and/or Rewards.

I'm very sure people of all faiths, or no faiths can agree and see the Beauty and Justice of these guidelines to Jihad.

[edit on 29-10-2008 by Sahabi]

Originally posted by CitizenNum287119327
reply to post by Sacri

 

Far from being mere history or theological construct, the violent verses of the Quran have played a key role in actual massacre and genocide. This includes the brutal slaughter of tens of millions of Hindus for five centuries beginning around 1000 AD with Mahmud of Ghazni's bloody conquest, including the massacre of those who defending their temples from destruction. Buddhism was very nearly wiped off the Indian subcontinent. Judaism and Christianity met the same fate (albeit more slowly) in areas conquered by Muslim armies, including the Middle East, North Africa and parts of Europe, including today's Turkey. Zoroastrianism, the ancient religion of a proud Persian people is despised by Muslims and barely survives in modern Iran.



So ingrained is violence in the religion that Islam has never really stopped being at war, either with other religions or with itself.

The above has been plagerised from this site. One of serveral sources

And most of your rant is from anti islamic websites.

perhaps your thread title should be:
To the Ignorant Masses, Research Islam, Ask an Imam for the Correct Teachings of Islam

Judaism and Islam both encourage seeking of knowledge. A lot of Christian Religons dont mention this. What you get is from your 'study groups'. Test it out! Ask your minister/priest/padre that you want to read the Qur'an (or the tanach or tulmud) and study the views and beliefs of a different religion, then guage there response.

edit on 11-10-2010 by CitizenNum287119327 because: (no reason given)

Sorry Champ I've never been to that website you provided before.


I spent 22 years as a devout fundamentalist christian years and years of studying not only the bible, but other religious texts, beliefs, and values.

You can seek all you want the truth is there, and its not all love as many will have you believe.

reply to post by Sacri


Anti-Islamists and Islamic Terrorists fail to understand a crucial point about Islam. The way the Qur'an is written is NOT the order the verses were revealed. So to TRULY understand the religion, you must know it as a WHOLE before you can read this verse or that verse to make an understanding about the religion.

Yes, Islam says to kill, maim, and war. But the anti-Islamists, Islamic Terrorists, and Islamic "leaders" speaking of crazy violence are FAILING, because the verses they quote are not being presented in the context of Why, How, and Who to fight. They are skipping those verses and going straight to the killing part.

This is just like trying to build a car, and before even making the car you are reading how to put the vehicle in gear. Understand the entire manual or crash.

So basically Sahabi your taking a miniority of versus, and twisting them, insted of reading them at face value, how thousands have before, and adhered to them, and your trying to twist the meanings.

These radical extremists as they have been labled are actually the true followers of Islam, while these so called friendly Mulims the one condeming the actions of these extremists, are the one that have digressed from the core of their religion. It makes sense and is a typical ploy by religion world wide, to make it look as friendly as possible to drag in as many unwitting people as they can. You cant be preaching extremists views and expect to recruit souls.


I've seen it first hand Spending 8 months deployed in Afghanistan. Kids as young as 12 13 blowing themselves up in the name of allah.

It's a common occurance over there why? because they havent been influenced by western muslims who have digressed. They are merely obeying the quran as they know it to be true, as it is written.

reply to post by Sacri




You did not even respond to my 2 replies. You just once again gave your opinion and feelings.

I will give you a star and flag for this thread if you can refute my 2 replies. Try to stay on topic and leave your feelings and emotions out of it.

Every violent verse you quoted ONLY explains the war part. Hell yeah it's true man, and I agree. But you are no different than the Islamic Terrorists or Islmaic "leaders" preaching hate. You guys are quoting the war part and forgetting the Why, How, and Who.

Prophet Muhammad was a Religious, Political, and Economic leader. Do you really think a military general like him would write a guideline to war without describing the laws to war?



• Sacri
• Anti-Islamists
•Islamic Terrorists
• Radical Islamic Imams (preacher/ community leader)

Quoting war (Jihad) without quoting the rules of engagement. 3 thumbs down :p

reply to post by Sahabi

thanks.

One thing that the Islamic terrorists may be un-aware of is the covenant made by muhammad protecting christians and condemning those who harm him. The originial document is in the Royal Treasury in Constantinople!
The Prophet Muhammad and the Christian priests of Mount Sinai
It's also witnessed and signed by Ali, so even the Shiʻas are included in his promise.
partial quote from Muhammads document:

"As God is great and governeth, from whom all the prophets are come, for there remaineth no record of injustice against God; through the gifts that are given unto men, Mohammed, the son of Abdallah, the Apostle of God, and careful guardian of the whole world, has written the present instrument, to all those that are his national people, and of his religion, as a secure and positive promise to be accomplished to the Christian nation and relations of the Nazareen, whosoever they may be, whether they be the noble or the vulgar, the honourable or otherwise, saying thus:

I. Whosoever of my nation shall presume to break my promise and oath which is contained in this present agreement, destroys the promise of God, acts contrary to the oath and will be a resister of the faith (which God forbid!) for he becometh worthy of the curse, whether he be the king himself or a poor man, or what person soever he may be.

II. That whenever any of the monks in his travels shall happen to settle on any mountain, hill, village, or in any other habitable place, on the sea or in deserts, or in any convent, church, or house of prayer, I shall be in the midst of them, as the preserver and protector of them, their goods and effects, with my soul, aid and protection, jointly with all my national people, because they are a part of my own people, and an honour to me.

III. Moreover, I command all officers not to require any poll tax of them or any other tribute, because they shall not be forced or compelled to anything of this kind.

Originally posted by Sahabi
reply to post by Sacri

 

You did not even respond to my 2 replies. You just once again gave your opinion and feelings.

I will give you a star and flag for this thread if you can refute my 2 replies. Try to stay on topic and leave your feelings and emotions out of it.

Every violent verse you quoted ONLY explains the war part. Hell yeah it's true man, and I agree. But you are no different than the Islamic Terrorists or Islmaic "leaders" preaching hate. You guys are quoting the war part and forgetting the Why, How, and Who.

Prophet Muhammad was a Religious, Political, and Economic leader. Do you really think a military general like him would write a guideline to war without describing the laws to war?



• Sacri
• Anti-Islamists
•Islamic Terrorists
• Radical Islamic Imams (preacher/ community leader)

Quoting war (Jihad) without quoting the rules of engagement. 3 thumbs down :p

I dont understand ?? You want me to reply to your opinion that the versus are taken out of context with what??

All i have is my opinion and what I believe is to be Logic saying that you are wrong. You have your opinion that I am wrong because you cant bring yourself to believe that Islam like all other religions is actually the worst of all evil.


Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"


Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Why How Who you ask??

Why ? because they wage war against allah, because they disbelieve.
Who ? those who wage war and disbelieve.
How ? Casting terror into their hearts by dis embowering them.


By The way I dont give a # about stars or flags. I'm not a child who will be wooed by the promise of receiving such things.

Originally posted by Sahabi
Prophet Muhammad was a Religious, Political, and Economic leader. Do you really think a military general like him would write a guideline to war without describing the laws to war?

Yes I do Muhammad as other religious leaders have been was a delusional,schizophrenic, power hungry moron.


What laws of war did he abide by? He slaughtered Millions raping and pillaging as he went. Is he the only religious leader to do these acts in the name of his religion ?? Of course not.

However considering that Muhammad knew the quran inside and out, we can look at his actions and see he was following it as it is truly written.

reply to post by CitizenNum287119327


Wow, thanks for posting that! I've always heard about it in Islamic History, but I never got to read the actual document!

Similarly, there was a covenant between Prophet Muhammad and the Chiritian King of Abyssinia, modern day Ethiopia. When Muhammad first announced his message, his fellow Arabs of Mecca attacked the new Muslims. Muhammad sent the first ever Islamic political refugees to be safe in that Christian kingdom. Negus Aṣḥama ibn Abjar (King of Abyssinia) made a pact of peace and protection.

In all historical actuality, Christians were the first friends and allies to Muhammad and Muslims.

reply to post by Sacri

All i have is my opinion and what I believe is to be Logic saying that you are wrong. You have your opinion that I am wrong because you cant bring yourself to believe that Islam like all other religions is actually the worst of all evil.

Your facts are flawed, and your condemnation of someone else's religion ('...the worst evil of all'), only highlights you own lack of faith.
The fact you have to run around professing that your religion is the best and everyone else is wrong really shows the subconcious insecurity of your own belief.
You should stop and think quietly: why it is so important to you to get validation from others that your path is the right one.
It appears you cannot accept others unless they believe and agree with your choice of religion. That is a very insecure outlook. No one is trying to change your belief in your religion, why do you take it upon yourself to belittle anothers religious views?

Islamic Terrorist's are not Islamic the moment that they target an 'innocent' as prescribed in the Qur'an when fighting against antagonists/invaders of islamic land.

Originally posted by CitizenNum287119327
reply to post by Sacri

 

All i have is my opinion and what I believe is to be Logic saying that you are wrong. You have your opinion that I am wrong because you cant bring yourself to believe that Islam like all other religions is actually the worst of all evil.

Your facts are flawed, and your condemnation of someone else's religion ('...the worst evil of all'), only highlights you own lack of faith.
The fact you have to run around professing that your religion is the best and everyone else is wrong really shows the subconcious insecurity of your own belief.
You should stop and think quietly: why it is so important to you to get validation from others that your path is the right one.
It appears you cannot accept others unless they believe and agree with your choice of religion. That is a very insecure outlook. No one is trying to change your belief in your religion, why do you take it upon yourself to belittle anothers religious views?

Islamic Terrorist's are not Islamic the moment that they target an 'innocent' as prescribed in the Qur'an when fighting against antagonists/invaders of islamic land.

My facts are flawed in your opinion, not by mine.
I am not seeking any sort of validation I am just merely fed up with the western Muslim blinding the world about the true facts of Islam.

I am not here to change anyone's beliefs champ, I would not waste my my time anyone that is indoctrinated enough to believe that Islam is a religion of love is lost. Only they can save themselves.

Your right I have no faith anymore my faith in Humanity is lost, the world today is well quite simply well and truly #ed.

reply to post by Sahabi


And still you take your verses out of context! No wonder it was so easy for the CIA to create Al-Qaeda, Taliban, and the whole modern "Islamic Fundamentalism." If they [CIA] can can get a fully objectionable non-Muslim to blast hate by quoting out of context, it is so much easier to get a "trusted" Imam to blast hate by quoting out of context to blind-following "believers."

Many Christians have never studied the Bible in it's entirety. So they just believe what dogma and doctrine states, what the preacher said, and what other Christians say about the religion, instead of researching the Bible themselves.

In this same way, a twisted imam quotes out of context to his followers, all the while they just trust him instead of reading. Religious disinfo campaign, if you will.

If you debate a topic, you must gather the entire body of information. You can not just quote out of context. You MUST combine every single verse about jihad and incorporate it together. Don't just get to the violence before getting to the core of the subject! This is the same tactic used by the Islamic propagators of hate.

Originally posted by Sahabi
reply to post by Sahabi

 

And still you take your verses out of context! No wonder it was so easy for the CIA to create Al-Qaeda, Taliban, and the whole modern "Islamic Fundamentalism." If they [CIA] can can get a fully objectionable non-Muslim to blast hate by quoting out of context, it is so much easier to get a "trusted" Imam to blast hate by quoting out of context to blind-following "believers."

Many Christians have never studied the Bible in it's entirety. So they just believe what dogma and doctrine states, what the preacher said, and what other Christians say about the religion, instead of researching the Bible themselves.

In this same way, a twisted imam quotes out of context to his followers, all the while they just trust him instead of reading. Religious disinfo campaign, if you will.

If you debate a topic, you must gather the entire body of information. You can not just quote out of context. You MUST combine every single verse about jihad and incorporate it together. Don't just get to the violence before getting to the core of the subject! This is the same tactic used by the Islamic propagators of hate.

Sorry Buddy I have studied both the bible and quran for many many years.

It is not being taken out of context until a western Muslim decides that whats written in the quran, or a christian decides that whats written in the bible is to full on for todays day age. So they cry mis-interpretation, they say excatly as you are you must study the whole thing.

I don't need to quote the whole quran here. Theres No point because the core of the quran is hate, violence, murder, pain, suffering, and death. To all the Non-believers of Islam.

Not referring to people who attack islam or oppose it, but merely to non believers so for the poor old jack whos sitting on the otherside of the world minding his own business. The quran instructs such travesties upon him simply because he doesn't believe.

YOUR the one who is twisting the scriptures out of context to make your religion a friendly looking one, to blind people to the truth. A radical indoctrination wont work on the western world, but a slow life sucking one will.

You are spewing pure Islamic disinfo and hatred! The message you are spreading to anti-islamists is the same message being spread to Muslims by their twisted imams. Please stop it sir, you are helping to polarize non-Muslims against Muslims. Believe you me, I say the same to Islamic extremists.

The CIA has positioned these Islamic fundamentalists around the world to polarize hate to Muslims against non-believers. Who gots their heads deep up the Saudi's butt's? The CIA! Who helped fund Osama, Wahabism, and the Taliban? The CIA! Wake up dude. I'm telling you man, according to strict Islam, those terrorists are in deep s# when they meet Allah. They are CIA Fundamentalists, not Islamic.

reply to
post by Sacri

Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"


Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Hell yeah that's right! If you don't want to get f# up, don't attack another person! I would give that advice to anyone of any religion or lack thereof! Dude, it says to f# somebody up if they attack you first.

reply to post by Sacri

What laws of war did he abide by? He slaughtered Millions raping and pillaging as he went. Is he the only religious leader to do these acts in the name of his religion ?? Of course not.

However considering that Muhammad knew the quran inside and out, we can look at his actions and see he was following it as it is truly written.

You are a military man, so you understand Rules of Engagement and Military Conduct. Muhammad was a military leader. He indeed had Rules of Engagement and Military Conduct. If you need references, sources, etc., look at my earlier posts or ask the exact quote.




Islamic Military Rules of Engagement:

1. Peace to all of humanity.
2. Never attack a people that have not wronged you.
3. If you are attacked, fight with bravery, fight with tooth and nail, fight to win, and never give up.
4. Do not kill women
5. Do not kill children
6. Do not kill the elderly
7. Do not kill any monk of any religion, that devotes their entire life to the service of their religion in a church, temple, etc.
8. Do not burn people, homes, or trees.
9. Do not kill the animals of the land.
10. Do not burn or mutilate dead bodies.
11. Rape is forbidden at ALL times, even in war. All Muslim men are commanded by Allah to only have sex with their wife. No premarital sex, or sex out of wedlock.
12. Do not kill another Muslim ever! No "friendly fire."
13. Be kind to enemy Prisoners of War. Give them an immediate execution or choose to free them. While in custody, do not torture them or mistreat them. Offer them cold, clean water.
14. If the enemy surrenders, immediately create peace.
15. If the enemy become Muslim, immediately create peace.
16. Do not surrender.
17. The only time you are permitted to lie is at times of open war to save your life. It is more honorable to tell the truth, but if you fear death so much that a lie will save you, you will not be counted as a liar.



Those are the exact Military Rules of Conduct. Any "Muslim" acting outside those laws are disobeying Allah. All the violent verses (the only ones ignorant people chose to solely quote) are elaborations of fighting AFTER an enemy of Islam launches the first transgression!

I will give exact Islamic references to any of those points to any anti-Islamist or Islamic Terrorist that fails to read Islam in full, and out of context. When you study the religion as a whole, and not out of context, you will not be polarized by hate in either direction.