Alien space craft show the lensing effect of our solar system

This is a thought experiment
There is no proof of interstellar alien space craft but for the purpose of this thought experiment we are going to assume that 0.001 per cent of UFOs are from other solar systems
Question 1
Are these craft travelling at the speed of light?
I want to start with another question how do we measure the speed of light?
Well we do experiments on earth in labs and in vacuum tubes and using very sensitive equipment and reliable results that show that light speed is consistently

the speed of light = 299 792 458 m / s

Now there are some things that can effect these measurements and 1 thing that comes to mind is our sun its gravity, the solar wind, plasma ejections and the concentration of the solar medium in which our planet is encased.
The helio sphere is the shock boundary where all of this solar medium is encased and compressed
Imagine the solar wind is constantly coming from the sun and racing to this boundary and slowing down and transitioning to sub sonic speeds

At this point in space there is a change in the density of the medium of space
So does this mean that light would travel faster or slower in this new medium or would it be the same speed?

Well i wonder if light partials are effected by solar wind, gravity or the helio boundary?
Is there an amazingly small change in the speed of light at the helio sphere as the light particle changes from one medium to the other?
Well there is another boundary to consider the helio sheath
Si if there is a very small barely perceivable change in the speed of light at the helio sphere what about the helio sheath?
The change in medium outside the helio sheath is like going from air to water

The area in between the helio sphere and the out side of the helio sheath is a different medium and the charged gas cloud on the outside is alot more dense and energetic than previously thought so

Why cant we see the helio sphere from the inside?
I mean we can measure it with ibex an plot different densities of particals around it but with a telescope when looking through it we do not see a distortion

Is light being modulated at this boundry?
Is light being modulated between the helio sheath and helio sphere?
Is there an optical lensing effect going on between our solar system and other solar systems?
Does this lensing effect make our distance calculations to our nearest star incorrect?

If there is two lenses and two objects one per solar system does this effect increase the perceived distance between them?

Diagram here



A telescope has a series of lenses that are convex that focuses the light onto a giant concave mirror that reflects the light onto a receiver

This enables us to see great distances but these lenses also occur around our solar system and others and instead of magnify they do the opposite
They make things appear further away

If the solar systems are ALOT closer than they seam (think looking backwards through binoculars) then it makes it alot more likely that 0.1 per cent of UFOs are actually not travelling anywhere near the speed of light to travel the distance required to visit earth

Alot of people use the Einstein’s theory of speed of light travel to negate interstellar space travel well i think light optics may be the counter argument

distance is in the eye of the observer

XPLodER

That`s a great theory you`ve got there and sounds plausible.
I dont think many people would have thought of space in that way.

reply to post by lambros56


here are some lensing shapes to consider and remember reading glasses work because they as a medium are a different density than the surrounding air







the surface and shape of each boundry combined with the different densities of the mediums create the lensing effect

xploder

XPLodER, this thread, and your other thread - CLICK HERE , and the theory you are working on, are fascinating and intriguing!

This could explain many "problems" we perceive with space travel and other beings' ability to travel here...

This is the stuff that keeps me coming back to ATS, Thanks!

It will be good to see what our resident experts think of this.

Gravitational lensing is the result of this warping of spacetime and is mainly detected around very massive galaxy clusters. Due to the gravitational effect of both the cluster's observable matter and hidden dark matter, the light is bent around the cluster. This bending of light allows the clusters in certain places to act as natural gravitational telescopes that give the light of faint and faraway objects a boost.

This implies that the galaxy's are actually further away.

Very cool stuff. One question, when light bends (for instance during a solar eclipse) is it speeding up, slowing down or maintaining a constant speed?....

reply to post by Signals


i have been looking at light and optics for a while now and after exausting conversations my friends could not agree that light speed was the physical speed barrer to mass

i like the optic theory because it uses light and doent brake einsteins theory so me and my freinds dont end up in a punch up

optical illutions are more than just fun to do they bend our perception of what we are seeing
enjoy this one




i amagine the optical effect of the boundry lensing effect would only be noticable if we were out side the lense looking inward to our sun

xploder
ps thanks for folowing my threads i put alot of effort into them so i like the praise

reply to post by flyingfish


gravatational lensing is when the medium the light travels through (space) is bent because of gravity bending space in a curve around mass
but this is a good example of optically something looking closer because of the lens effect
it is different but shows the general theory that because we use light to see it can effect how we see things

xploder

here is a fun way to see density changes effecting how we see light from an object




there is a least three density changes and boundrys looking out at our nearest star

xploder

reply to post by XPLodER

I think I see what you are saying, great theory.Thanks for the info.
I found this video, I think it could be explaining the phenomenon your talking about.
Let me know it helps me to get a visual.

reply to post by flyingfish


thank you for the video it explains gravatational lensing and the optical illution of einsteins ring very well
it shows that distortion of light can change the perceived distence either closer or further away from its acual position
the lensing effect can be relitive to the mass density of the gravatational area produced
ie the density of space is increased in the lens area allowing for the curvature of space time to curve the hidden object around the mass and be visable

very good video thank you

XPLodER

it just dawned on me that we use the medium of light to measure distence but the distence can be subjective to light as it curves and can be lensed or refacted, refocused and split into component parts

how can we use the medium of vision (light) to measure distence (perspective) if they are both conserned with the same function eye sight ?

gravatational lensing can be seen because we are out side the optical path of the light as it bends in space time
if we were in the event horizon would we be able to see this effect or would it be hidden by the fact of perspective

can we witness light bending in space time if we were at the point where it is bent?
or would perspective (to us) obscure this effecct?

xploder

Threads like this is exactly why I joined ATS years ago. You present real, thought out questions, that engage the reader to actually use there mind. Furthermore you presented a theory of your own to contemplate and mix in the equation. Excellent job! S&F

Is this the type of effect you are reffering too?

reply to post by highfreq


thank you very much you have just added a valuable component to this thread

Light, which normally travels the 240,000 miles from the Moon to Earth in less than two seconds, has been slowed to the speed of a minivan in rush-hour traffic -- 38 miles an hour.

An entirely new state of matter, first observed four years ago, has made this possible. When atoms become packed super-closely together at super-low temperatures and super-high vacuum, they lose their identity as individual particles and act like a single super- atom with characteristics similar to a laser.

Such an exotic medium can be engineered to slow a light beam 20 million-fold from 186,282 miles a second to a pokey 38 miles an hour.

link to slowing down the speed of light

so in different mediums and under different conditions light can be slowed down giving us incorrect distence calculations this would increase the lensing effect as light speed can be slower than our measurements show making objects even closer to the observer because the distence travelled relitive to the observer of that light would be less distence

you have made my day
thanks and star 4 you

But if stars and other massive objects are a LOT closer to one another than they appear, why doesn't gravity draw them all together? The astronomical distances are essential to maintain the balance of the universe.

Originally posted by FOXMULDER147
But if stars and other massive objects are a LOT closer to one another than they appear, why doesn't gravity draw them all together? The astronomical distances are essential to maintain the balance of the universe.

i like the idea that like solar wind travels outwards from the sun to the helio boundry
the amount of energy being released at this boundry continues outward at a different rate (helio shock) and pushes against anything in its path (hot gass clouds) that are magntically active on a small scale but are cumlitive to the overall
density or mass of the cloud
ie the clouds are attracted to the energy being released but when in closer contact are over powered and repelled individually as gass particals instead of being attracted as a whole

so initially the mass from different helio shocks and helio sheaths would be repellant to the on coming suns helio sphere unless the kenetic energy can overcome the repultion from the individual interactions of the gass particals that make up the suns helio sphere
once this boundry is over come the suns would interact as a cumulitive mass again and they would gravatationally atract each other into an orbit or direct collision

one interesting point to note is the ibex satalite findings that the gas cloud our helio sphere is encounting is compressed and hot and has about 4 to 5 times the magnetic streanght there should be and this is on an idividual atom basis funny thing is there is a stream of neutral atoms traveling straight through the helio boundry
this leads me to beleive that the interaction is on a individual atom scale

picture of neutral atom ribbon computer generated



xploder
ps this is only theory to explain my understanding of this system and is not proven fact

reply to post by FOXMULDER147


helio interaction
the two helio spheres would repell each other up to this point then blam




remeber this is theory only

Voyager data show that the Fluff is much more strongly magnetized than anyone had previously suspected—between 4 and 5 microgauss*," says Opher. "This magnetic field can provide the extra pressure required to resist destruction."

xploder

reply to post by XPLodER

Your posts, although interesting, are a little complicated. Shall we put your idea into simple terms so people can follow the thread a little easier?

Your theory (as I understand it) is that the bubble of material that surrounds a star -- the heliosphere -- can act as a lens, modulating, or slowing down, the speed of light.

The significance of this is that an object (for example) 1 light year away may be perceived by us as being further away than it actually is because the light emanating from the object is being slowed down by our sun's "bubble".

So the light from an object 1 light year away may take, say, 10 light years to reach us. And therefore we perceive that object to be 10 light years away.

And the point you're making with regards to extraterrestrial life is that they may not need to travel anywhere near the distances, or anywhere near the speeds, hitherto assumed in order to "visit" us.

Interesting idea. I've not heard it before. Gonna be hell to prove though!

Originally posted by highfreq
Is this the type of effect you are reffering too?

Nice article.

On a conspiratorial note the reason popular media
only ever talks about Einstein and never Newton's Optics,
is cause only engineers use Optics. There is no theory left to solve.
It is of no interest to academics, and will never have that edgy 'new thing' for the press to cover.

I posit that the amount of darkness there is in America is proportional to the percentage
of its people that know zero about optics.

It's threads like these that cause me to reflect and realize,
no matter _what_ happens, some of these people right here will survive.


David Grouchy

Originally posted by XPLodER
once this boundry is over come the suns would interact as a cumulitive mass again and they would gravatationally atract each other into an orbit or direct collision

It is also worth considering that
the various solar systems which a ray of light may pass through
act as amplifyers relaying the light and strengthing it. In that case
the reason the milky way would look so milky is the vast number of solar systems
in close proximity to each other.


David Grouchy