2012 and the Great Confiscation of Your Wealth and Why You Should Worry.

I was going to offer a retort to your original post, but something tells me that you wouldn't accept the facts that I present. Neither would some of your followers.

They're not shiny and mysterious enough for you. In closing I'd like to point out that the premises presented in the entire original post are false.

reply to post by prepared4truth


As to the physical reality and depth of what will occur, there simply isn't enough complete information available. What we do know is that all ancient civilizations warned us of this period, of a returning planetary body, and that the government is reacting as if they certainly have grave concerns about their continuity. Consider it another harbinger. I would say this to you. Obtain the things you need to survive in your location. Beyond that, don't worry. Death is not the worst thing that can happen to you. This world is just one phase of life. Don't worry over things that you can't control.

reply to post by links234


I'd love to see what you are willing to "retort", all opinions are valuable, all points of view mean something, what the point of saying "I was gonna but now I wont", it brings nothing forward to the conversation, so please explain why its all false? why do you think everything will say the way it is?
please explain....

reply to post by TheOneEyedProphet


Alright, there's a lot to go through here so let's start with the first that bothered me:

There are two leading theories about the events that may unfold around 2012. One concerns the fact that the earth will cross the galactic plane, encountering gravitational disturbances...

Supposedly we're outside of the 'galactic plane' right now. That our location within the Milky Way galaxy is somehow askew to the 'eqautor' of the galaxy. I believe this is patently false, there's absolutely no evidence, whatsoever, that proposes the gravitational effects of nearby stars affects our planet or the life on our planet.

Even the belief that the gravitational effects of our galactic black hole in the center of the galaxy are in question at this distance. As is offered in the topic of our galaxy's roation curve.

other around Nibiru, or Planet X. Planet X, despite NASA's denials, was named by.......NASA.

The only Planet X that was discovered is Pluto. This discovery was long before the formation of the National Aeronautics and Space Administration.

The reason such a term exists is due to the over estimation of Neptune's mass, which was corrected in the early 1980's with a more accurate idea of mass (close to that of Mars) after the Voyager spacecraft passed by the planet. Further reading here.

Without beating a dead horse, it was detected in the late 70's (orbital perterbences of the outer planets)...

Which I addressed in my previous paragraph

...and NASA sent the IRAS satellites to investigate, then announced to the world in '83 they had found a body perhaps several times the size of Jupiter.

IRAS (Infrared Astronomical Satellite) was launched in January 1983 and stopped working in November of 1983. This is where the conspiracy comes in, and why I didn't want to bother posting anything more than my original post; This is the original story of the mystery object. I want you to take note of the possible explanations given:

a planet, a giant comet, a nearby "protostar" that never got hot enough to become a star, a distant galaxy so young that it is still in the process of forming its first stars or a galaxy so shrouded in dust that none of the light cast by its stars ever gets through.

I said take note because the article then goes on for the following two paragraphs highlighting the planetary theory (which would be absolutely groundbreaking) without addressing the other possibilities (which are much less exciting). This is the birth of the conspiracy.

Further observations (which should always, always, always be done) revealed no solar system object...only distant galaxies and some galactic dust. No Tenth Planet Yet From IRAS

Now...this is just the beginning to the very long original post. I pay special attention to posts that make mention of astronomy in some way, which is the only reason I felt compelled to issue some sort of reply. The OP goes into various assumptions and beliefs which go all over the place and...are honestly, too much for me to want to delve into right now.

Supposedly we're outside of the 'galactic plane' right now. That our location within the Milky Way galaxy is somehow askew to the 'eqautor' of the galaxy. I believe this is patently false, there's absolutely no evidence, whatsoever, that proposes the gravitational effects of nearby stars affects our planet or the life on our planet.

Even the belief that the gravitational effects of our galactic black hole in the center of the galaxy are in question at this distance.

You say that the Galactic Center isn't capable of causing effect on the Solar System - Space.com disagrees:

Our results show in great detail that supermassive black holes have a surprisingly good control over the evolution of the galaxies in which they live," said Norbert Werner of the SLAC National Accelerator Laboratory in Melo Park, Calif., who led one of two studies of M87's black hole and its effects. "The black hole's reach extends ever farther into the entire cluster, similar to how one small volcano can affect practically an entire hemisphere on Earth."

Source: www.space.com...

Even sunspots from our tiny Sol have effect:

Sunspots squeeze and stretch the day

Source: www.newscientist.com...

As far as Planet X, this could be a sister Sun that we haven't discovered as of yet (Or at least revealed to the public). Most star systems observed are binary or more - ours would be in the minority if we have a single star in our Solar System. There are videos online that show gravitational effects outside our Solar System that cannot currently be explained, and nothing we can see with our telescopes account for this effect.

However, when scientists plug into the equation another star, the graphs and charts suddenly make sense. They also say it's entirely possible that a dwarf star wouldn't be visible to us unless it was right on top of us because of it's small size and the speed at which it moves.

I believe one of the videos you can watch on YouTube is called "The Great Year." The Zodiac is a 26,000 year calendar - why would the ancients create a 26, 000 year calendar unless there was something very significant about these cycles? No one lives that long; who cares? The one we are entering now is the 5th and final one according to the Mayans - the most rare - there is something to all of this, and there are too many theories to discuss here and now, but you can't discount this as another Y2K.

Y2K was a bunch of morons shaking their Bibles and rednecks thinking planes would fall out of the sky and banks would not work and power grids would shut down simply because they didn't have enough numbers written into programming code.

2012 has absolute facts that are a bit too strange to be coincidence. We will have an alignment with the Galactic Center, the solar cycle peaks in 2012 (And is estimated to be stronger than any previously observed), and it does mark the precession of the equinoxes. Not to mention we've only known about Sagittarius A for less than a decade and the Mayan calendar has depicted it for thousands of years.

But I digest...

Originally posted by Cataka

You say that the Galactic Center isn't capable of causing effect on the Solar System - Space.com disagrees:

I don't think the folks over at space.com necessarilly disagree with my assessment, that article is in regards to the M87 galaxy, 50 million light years away. M87 appears to have an active galactic nucleus, a blackhole that is in the process of eating up nearby matter, when this occurs then yes, it can have profound effects on its galaxy.

The Milky Way, however, has an 'inactive' supermassive black hole in Sagittarius A, which was only detectable by radio astronomers and discovered in the 1970's, not the past decade as you believe.

Even sunspots from our tiny Sol have effect:

I never doubted that our star has some effect on our planet, it has profound effects on our planet. That's not the question here. The question is whether or not some yet to be discovered proto-star has an effect on our planet.

As far as Planet X, this could be a sister Sun that we haven't discovered as of yet (Or at least revealed to the public). Most star systems observed are binary or more - ours would be in the minority if we have a single star in our Solar System.

Space.com will disagree with you here: Astronomers Had it Wrong: Most Stars are Single

There are videos online that show gravitational effects outside our Solar System that cannot currently be explained, and nothing we can see with our telescopes account for this effect.

I would love to see one of these videos.

I believe one of the videos you can watch on YouTube is called "The Great Year." The Zodiac is a 26,000 year calendar - why would the ancients create a 26, 000 year calendar unless there was something very significant about these cycles? No one lives that long; who cares? The one we are entering now is the 5th and final one according to the Mayans - the most rare - there is something to all of this, and there are too many theories to discuss here and now, but you can't discount this as another Y2K.

The zodiac, in terms of astrology, is 13 signs coinciding 13 named constellations.

2012 has absolute facts that are a bit too strange to be coincidence.

Which ones are strange? Which ones are facts?

We will have an alignment with the Galactic Center,

What alignment? I could say we're aligned right now. I could say we're aligned with the Sun for that matter. I was under the impression that an alignment required more than two objects.

the solar cycle peaks in 2012 (And is estimated to be stronger than any previously observed),

That is a fact, yes. However, what effect it will have may be minimal on us.

and it does mark the precession of the equinoxes. Not to mention we've only known about Sagittarius A for less than a decade and the Mayan calendar has depicted it for thousands of years.

Assuming we're talking about the same precession, it's elliptical, who's to say where on that circle is the beginning and where is the end? It's true it does take 26,000 years to complete that circle, in 12,000 years Vega will be the north star. 14,000 years after that it will be back to Polaris.

Mayans were great astronomers, I don't think anyone's arguing that. I would disagree they were aware of the existence of Sagittarius A. We can see the bulge of our galaxy, but that doesn't mean anyone prior to 1900 was aware of the existence of a single point being responsible for that.

reply to post by links234


Actually, your refutal is wrong on all counts. Look up the right hand rule. Centrifugal force moves outward, and with equal force disects the plane at 90 degrees. This is how a gyroscope works. As you say you have an interest in astronomy, you perhaps should notice that each galaxy exists as a flat spiral, unless it's encountered another galaxy, or hasn't completely formed.

Regarding you refutal that the only tenth planet discovered was Pluto, that's a reflection that you really don't know what you're talking about. You see, Our astronomers discovered Pluto, the NINTH planet, in 1930. The IRAS sattelite which discovered Planet X (X being the roman numeral for 10....assuming based on your retort that you don't understand this) was said to be 50 billion miles out and up to "five times the size of JUPITER".
As you obviously don't realize this, Reference Thomas O'Toole's article in the Washington Post. Pluto is quite small.

Just a suggestion, but when I make a post, I list facts. If I have a question about a fact, I research it before I make a statement of fact. If you wish to refute something, please make the effort to know what the hell you're talking about. I get the impression you tend to create your own facts with your invisible friend.

Thats just what I wanted to see, It makes a world of difference when one backs up statements with facts, even if the outlook of said facts can be interpreted in many ways according to who we are.

You wont find any conclusive evidence on any reality altering event, main media just wants things to stay the way they are, panic and mass hysteria has to be avoided at any cost, the illusion of calmness must be maintained at all costs.

We can argue all we can, but we cannot take official statements as truth, and we do not believe in private research that is not backed up by official sources, its a rhetoric semiotic circle, it wont get us anywhere.

We have to trust our gut and our intuition, and any formal training we have to connect the dots, I would just love that things where changing for the better, but that is not the case, it will take all we've got as human beings to adapt to change, to loose the fear of the unknown, we must be flexible we must adapt, I don't think anyone can debate that being prepared to any eventuality is the wisest choice, if survival is the main objective.

I can read between the lines, the universe will make us change one way or the other!
thanks to everyone for sharing your thoughtspace!

Originally posted by astrogolf
Actually, your refutal is wrong on all counts.

How so?

Look up the right hand rule. Centrifugal force moves outward, and with equal force disects the plane at 90 degrees. This is how a gyroscope works. As you say you have an interest in astronomy, you perhaps should notice that each galaxy exists as a flat spiral, unless it's encountered another galaxy, or hasn't completely formed.

So you're saying our galaxy isn't flat at all? OK, I could buy that, we're colliding with two or three smaller galaxies/clusters as we speak, which may or may not have an effect on the 'flatness' of our galaxy.

I still don't see the impact of crossing the plane will have on us.

Regarding you refutal that the only tenth planet discovered was Pluto,

This is an absolute misunderstanding, when you refer to 'Planet X' are you referring to the planet theorized to exist after Neptune was discovered or a tenth planet? I was under the assumption that planet EX and not planet TEN was what we were talking about.

that's a reflection that you really don't know what you're talking about. You see, Our astronomers discovered Pluto, the NINTH planet, in 1930. The IRAS sattelite which discovered Planet X (X being the roman numeral for 10....assuming based on your retort that you don't understand this) was said to be 50 billion miles out and up to "five times the size of JUPITER".
As you obviously don't realize this, Reference Thomas O'Toole's article in the Washington Post. Pluto is quite small.

Pluto was discovered in 1930 by Clyde Tombaugh because he was looking for planet X (ex), because at that time calculations of the mass of Neptune showed that planet to have an unusual orbit and, logically, there must've been a large ninth planet (Planet ex) causing this disturbance. So Tombaugh went scouring the sky's using Lowell's observatory and subsequently discovered Pluto. Source

It wasn't until the 1990's after we sent the Voyager spacecraft to fly by Neptune that we calculated a more accurate mass for the planet and realized there were no unusual orbital patterns when the accurate mass was used.. This discovery effectively ended any search for Planet Ex.
Source

I did read the article, in fact, I linked it and referenced it in this very thread. I also listed the subsequent press release stating that no tenth planet was found. To reiterate, IRAS never discovered a tenth planet.

Just a suggestion, but when I make a post, I list facts. If I have a question about a fact, I research it before I make a statement of fact. If you wish to refute something, please make the effort to know what the hell you're talking about. I get the impression you tend to create your own facts with your invisible friend.

Then in the future, may I request you also post the source of your 'facts'?

reply to post by links234


Wrong again. I did not say our galaxy was flat, I said it is a spiral. Loosely termed it is somewhat flat, and exists on a flat plain, as a frisbee sitting on a table.
Nasa deemed the discovery of a planetary body discovered in 1983 to be planet x, as mentioned in the Washington Post, New York Times and four other newspapers, adding that it was up to five times the size of Jupiter. They added that it was possibly 50 billion miles from the sun.

RE: all the hype of underground bases and government fleeing to their 'safe' places...
thumbs up to them
because the World's most recognized source of what will transpire in all our futures
instructs the people to, "flee-to-the-mountains"

+++++++++++++++++++++

3.Matthew 24:16
then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

4.Mark 13:14
"When you see 'the abomination that causes desolation'
standing where it does not belong—let the reader understand—
then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

5.Luke 21:21
Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains,
let those in the city get out, and let those in the country
not enter the city.

So, it will serve these people right...as they deserve their fate
in building their own elaborate graves



myself and lots of others that read & take heed of the 'future roadmap'
passed down to the 2012 era through Biblical writings...will not dig holes
in the ground or occupy the reinforced bunkers...


We will head for the mountains to hide among the rocks...

because the incremental changes in the energies in our biosphere
and environment will be manageable for all those outside in the air
and sunshine...

We, of the outside world will all acclimate to the sunlight changes,
and the blue wavelength daylight caused by the higher energy gamma-ray
bombardment that will subside in a short time.


But those trapped in the bowels of the Earth, will perish from any number
of calamities which will beset the neuvo-troglodites in their underground fortresses.


including the neutrino bombardment that gets focused because of the dense matter
of their concret & steel cages...the rebar will become resonant and generate heat
which will eventually cook the occupants of these safe, underground facilities/bunkers/military posts


what a way to go, huh ?

Originally posted by astrogolf
Wrong again.

Originally posted by astrogolf
Actually, your refutal is wrong on all counts.

Originally posted by links234
...something tells me that you wouldn't accept the facts that I present.

I tried.