Originally posted by SevenThunders
Since I need to get a cat scan every 6 months for kidney stones, and I average one kidney stone procedure a year I will expect to declare bankruptcy or perhaps simply choose to die an agonizing death.

No wonder your insurance cost so much. AND ours because they use a expensive test on you
A CT scan for kidney stones?????
The standard test for kidney stones is a ultrasound.

Why are they doing a $2000+ test when a simple $50 test will do the same thing.

social security IS SOLVENT.....
the gov't has traded treasury bonds for the cash, those treasury bonds draw interest, and that interest is more than enough to pay for the program!! some would rather just default on those treasury bonds though....
the people should be blasting the gov't for their stupid and very expensive policies and the social security system!!
heck it probably paid for a few of you younger folks to have homes, heat, healthcare, and food...ya know, all those good things in life, some of which those who will be entering retirement soon have gone without most of of their lives!

and well....I am sure that obamacare has everything to do with the current increase in the cost of healthcare and the crappy economy, high unemployment rate, falling value of the dollar, well, that has nothing whatsoever to do with it at all..........
the fact of the matter is that the cost of healthcare has made it so that we the people can't afford it, our state and local gov'ts can't afford it, and the federal gov't can't afford it!!! that "best in the world" healthcare system with it's $400 pills, $3000 insurance deductables, and $200,000 operations is just an all out joke! and the taxpayer is providing over 50% of the revenue going into the healthcare industry in my area!!!
why is it so high?? I mean, most of the developed world is providing adequate care to ALL of their citizens at a fraction of the cost! most of use aren't paying for those $200,000 operations, the insurance companies aren't paying that much, it isn't getting paid!! it's just there on the books, it's there our credit records, it's there on the bill collector's records for them to reference when they call use a half a dozen times a month! heck there's a predatory lending business that's grown big and strong feeding off of peoples medical debt! and that debt is probably being recreated into the little poker chips on wall street much like the subprime was and being being pawned around the world as AAA, when anyone with half a brain could figure out that a person holding a ten dollar an hour job just isn't gonna pay off a $250,000 medical debt for a simple proceedure that if he went to any other country he could have gotten taken care of for $5,000!

obamacare's biggest fault is that it didn't do squat to reign in this insanity! it just says that ya, it will make us all pay for it, don't worry, the customers will be there! only there is no way that we can!!
our biggest fault is that we will continue to use this system, rack up the bills feeling that "we have to", after all life is so precious, right...our health is most important....even if we end up dealing with a massive debt that we could sink every penny that comes our way in for the rest of our lives and still not have it paid off!!!

instead of worrying about obamacare, and how it is affecting your health insurance, one should be worrying about just who wants the american people so far into debt.....AND WHY!!!

Originally posted by OmiOra
Healthcare overall would be more managable to afford for all americans if it wasn't for hospitals and doctors.

Say you go to the ER....ever notice the doctor sees you two times the whole time if you are lucky and it's for 2 minutes....than he may visit the other people...but out of the 3-4 hours you wait he/she spends 3+ hours sitting at the desk. You are charged by how long you are there...there is Fraud but the Insurance companies are forced to hike prices to keep up with paying for your bills so doctors can do nothing. I was in the ER with my girlfriend one night...there were 2 other patients....I walked out of her room to get a drink and sitting in the little desk in the unit were the nurses and doctors playing cards...The government really needs to press on the medical business to stop frauding people....bc it's not just the insurance companies.

AMEN !! My wife is an R.N., she was telling me about something the other night that was a perfect example of waste in the medical field. When a patient is given several injections a night she has to use a new vial every time. Even though they are multiple dose vials, she HAS to throw it away and get a fresh one. We're not talking about giving different patients the same medicine out of the same vial, THAT I could understand. Same person, same med. A lot of these meds are expensive, several hundred per dose and the bill goes up FAST with that kind of waste.

Originally posted by SevenThunders
side effects already appearing]

I like how that was worded! Side effects.

Parts of Obamacare are good. Most of it is bad and some is even unconstitutional.
Mostly it's UNSUSTAINABLE. I'll say it again .... UNSUSTAINABLE.
Listen to people who survived Nazi Germany.
They'll tell ya' that they had great health care BEFORE Hitler nationalized it.
Then it was a conveyor belt kind of health care .. and what care you got was pretty bad.

Saw an interview with a woman who went through that.
She moved to America when she was young .. after the war.
She says Obamacare comes too close to what she saw happening in Germany.

(Nationalized the car industry there ... and banks ... and health care .... sound familiar??)

Originally posted by ANNED
A CT scan for kidney stones????? The standard test for kidney stones is a ultrasound. Why are they doing a $2000+ test when a simple $50 test will do the same thing.

WRONG. I have kidney stones and have had one (4 mm ... YIKES!!) pass.
Ultrasounds can't find everythng and see the tubes well when the stones are moving.
XRAY is what has to be used. It's also quicker when there are severe pain issues involved.

Originally posted by Styki
This bill isn't forcing the insurance companies to cover 25 million "deadbeats", it's forcing the "deadbeats" to go out and buy insurance. I am going to go ahead and switch the term "deadbeats" with the uninsured. Forcing the uninsured to buy health insurance isn't going to raise premiums.

It'll raise TAXES when the 'deadbeats' can't afford the insurance that the government forces them to buy. Then all us taypayers will have to foot the bill through higher taxes in order to cover those who can't afford to buy it. It's the law ... it must be bought ... right?

See where this is going? Redistribution of wealth ... etc etc

You know, upon reading this thread I wasn't going to say anything, but after a few comments, I have too.
Guess what folks. IM FROM SOCIALIST CANADA.
Sometimes, I believe Americans really don't look into history when it comes to current events.
It also seems like they "close door" syndrome, meaning as soon as they got into good health care, they disregarded everyone elses health, and would rather have no one else receive any attention, yet if they didn't have healthcare I am sure there perceptions might change.
Put simply, you guys are stupid, sorry. But the fact you guys have not forced your government to pay for it for you, and have an equality standard for everyone, means you are greedy and relative to a Nazi.
YOU PEOPLE SPEND TRILLIONS KILLING PEOPLE, SOMETIMES EVEN YOUR OWN PEOPLE.
YOU SPEND BILLIONS! ARRESTING YOUR OWN CITIZENS! GOD FORBID, YOU SPEND SOME MONEY HEALING PEOPLE AND HELPING YOUR OWN FELLOW MAN, LEGAL OR NON LEGAL.
Yeah sure I have to wait a few hours at the emergency, but I have only ever had minor ailments, and the reason you wait is because of the people with serious injuries being taken care, which I will gladly wait and PAY FOR.
You people make me sick. Go kill some more arab babies and flaunt your rifles in your dumb founded pride.

Originally posted by The Sword
I will never understand the conservative mindset, which supports rape by health insurance companies in the name of a "free market".

The problem is that either way you work it you'll be raped by the health insurance companies. This is not the same form of government health care that is available in other countries. This system will not work because it gives the insurance companies all the power.

This should no longer be an issue of liberal vs. conservative. It is an issue of big business and corporate greed vs. the people.

By the way, I am a liberal. I voted for Obama. I think his health care would be a joke but I can't laugh at it.

Originally posted by tribaltrip
YOU PEOPLE SPEND TRILLIONS KILLING PEOPLE, SOMETIMES EVEN YOUR OWN PEOPLE.
YOU SPEND BILLIONS! ARRESTING YOUR OWN CITIZENS! GOD FORBID, YOU SPEND SOME MONEY HEALING PEOPLE AND HELPING YOUR OWN FELLOW MAN, LEGAL OR NON LEGAL.
Yeah sure I have to wait a few hours at the emergency, but I have only ever had minor ailments, and the reason you wait is because of the people with serious injuries being taken care, which I will gladly wait and PAY FOR.
You people make me sick. Go kill some more arab babies and flaunt your rifles in your dumb founded pride.

I'm getting off topic here but I just want to point out that your government also has troops in Afghanistan.

Notice how I didn't say "you?" It's because I know that you are not complicit with your government.

I am not complicit with my government either. It does what it wants regardless of the people.

We're all human beings here no matter what our nationality. Does any group of people deserve that kind of abuse? How about a constructive argument, one that doesn't bash the people of an entire nation.

Government owes today 13.5 Trillion.
Government is on the hook for 200 Trillion.

Do you actually understand this folks? Where are they going to be able to tax enough to keep the ponzei scheme known as the Federal gubmint going? If you took every dime that is created in the US for the next 25 years, you would still not have enough to pay off the debt.

Does ANYONE understand this yet?

Look in the near future for the nationalization of resources to "supposedly" pay off the debt.

THAT is what you should be watching for.

There is no way the US is even going to last another 2 years to get to the ACTUAL implementation of this travesty.

Keep bickering, history repeats itself once again.

SOMEONE mentioned that we should wonder why the gubmint is systematically bankrupting this country.

BUT NOOOOOOOO. I want my free healthcare. I want my free welfare. I want........I want.........I want.

Now, I did not know that we had a 2 year olds discussion forum here.

Why don't we just pay doctors less so that insurance companies are unnecessary, and we can pay for medical expenses entirely out of pocket? After all, doctors should be in that profession for the good of mankind, not solely for the wealth. If a doctor messes up, no malpractice insurance either. If he was found negligent by a court, then he'll be sued into bankruptcy. Would put a lot more accountability where it belongs.

That's just my two cents.