Being Gay isnt natural

reply to post by joechip


What you think you know and what you actually do know are two very different things altogether. My friendly suggestion to you would be to gain an understanding that text is a form of communication which requires a certain amount of clarity, when writing, and patience, when reading.

And as we agree to cease interacting, I feel very compelled to, once again, state that I do not appreciate, at all, your continued insistence upon attacking my intellect. Such behavior is uncalled for and highly inappropriate. Seeking to justify it by implying that you somehow "know" my intentions doesn't at all excuse it.

Originally posted by Haydn_17


Being Gay is against Humanity and Nature, our core objective as a species is to reproduce, to keep our species alive, there is no such thing as an immortal organism. They all die, and to continue the survival of the species they must all reproduce before they die. To keep the species stable.

It doesn't matter that Earth is overpopulated, if everyone suddenly woke up Gay Humanity would be extinct within 50 years.

People forget, we are surrounded by technology, social trends, but deep down, really we are animals, animals with basic instincts, to survive, to reproduce, for some reason our society is losing its instinct to reproduce, 1% of the UK see themselves as being Gay or Lesbian, not much, but what will the figure be like in 100 years time? 10%?

I know i have probaly offended a lot of people with this thread, i don't intend to, i just want to understand where has the instinct to reproduce with the opposite sex gone?

I am entitled to my opinions, again i mean no disrespect to Gay, Lesbian, Transexual people.

I just want to understand

Thanks

edit on 23-9-2010 by Haydn_17 because: (no reason given)

edit on 23-9-2010 by Haydn_17 because: (no reason given)

First I have to say that my thoughts on this may have been brought up already, but as this thread is pretty large I haven't read all the replies. Anyway this is what I pose to you.

Of course homosexuality is natural as it occurs in nature. Second I used to think the same way as you, our natural instinct is to procreate and spread our genes/DNA whatever as much as we possibly can. This however is incorrect because we are higher thinking beings. If this were true we would be having children left and right with women, yet we control that. Also what if our minds on an unconscious level have grown aware of our need for some control over our population and since have caused a change so that homosexuality has become more prevalent? It could simply be our evolution, and solution to our own problem. This would mean not only is it natural, but important, and shows growth.

For those of you against homosexuality I ask. Why do YOU hate them (don't base it off of religion, actually think about it)? Did they do anything to you? Did they attack you or cause misery in your life? Why cant you just let them be?

Sorry for the broken syntax. I am trying to work this out in my head.
...You feel homosexuality is a abomination to nature, right? and you feel you must aggressively convince them of this, right?... From this point of view...would you then tell a mentally handicapped person that they are them selves a abomination to nature? Where do you draw the line of aggressive bigotry?

I gather this from the many many comments that those who try to rationalize being against homosexuality as a mental abnormality...well so is autism. So I expect every gay basher here to tell the next autistic person they see that they are an abomination to nature.

You cannot selectively choose who you call an abomination if you do not wish to be labeled a bigot.

I call every gay basher here a bigot. Prove me wrong.

Everyone here seems to have a different definition of natural.

One is The way nature intended things to be and the other It's natural because it's nature's own mistake.

Originally posted by DGFenrir
Everyone here seems to have a different definition of natural.

One is The way nature intended things to be and the other It's natural because it's nature's own mistake.

I would say because there are instances of homosexuality in almost every animal on the Earth it is natural. It is sexual attraction. It happens. So be it.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow

Originally posted by DGFenrir
Everyone here seems to have a different definition of natural.

One is The way nature intended things to be and the other It's natural because it's nature's own mistake.

I would say because there are instances of homosexuality in almost every animal on the Earth it is natural. It is sexual attraction. It happens. So be it.

I agree with you. It is caused by nature itself. From social point of view there's nothing wrong with it.
But..
It's unnatural for a man to stick his penis into another man's rectum.
Naturally the penis is meant to go into a female's vagina.

Different understandings of the same word cause a lot of confusion.

You feel homosexuality is a abomination to nature, right? and you feel you must aggressively convince them of this, right?... From this point of view...would you then tell a mentally handicapped person that they are them selves a abomination to nature?

reply to post by TheKnave


The thing is mate, a mentally handicapped person usually cannot think for himself. Or make his own decisions. He needs to be helped. A homosexual person has got nothing wrong with him/her. They can make their own decisions, and choices. Think for themselves.

So to say that the "gay bashers" as you so elequontly put it, is comparing gays to mentally handicapped persons are a bit naiive. I still maintain that homosexuals make the choice, themselves, to be gay or not.

I for one, has never called a gay person an abomination of nature. So your sweeping generalation is also a bit off putting. All the gay people I know are rather laid back about their sexuality. Even though they know my stance on the matter, there is no beef between me or my gay friends.

VVV

Originally posted by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep

You feel homosexuality is a abomination to nature, right? and you feel you must aggressively convince them of this, right?... From this point of view...would you then tell a mentally handicapped person that they are them selves a abomination to nature?

reply to post by TheKnave

 

The thing is mate, a mentally handicapped person usually cannot think for himself. Or make his own decisions. He needs to be helped. A homosexual person has got nothing wrong with him/her. They can make their own decisions, and choices. Think for themselves.

So to say that the "gay bashers" as you so elequontly put it, is comparing gays to mentally handicapped persons are a bit naiive. I still maintain that homosexuals make the choice, themselves, to be gay or not.

I for one, has never called a gay person an abomination of nature. So your sweeping generalation is also a bit off putting. All the gay people I know are rather laid back about their sexuality. Even though they know my stance on the matter, there is no beef between me or my gay friends.

VVV

One of my best friends turned out to be gay when we were in high school. There was no change in him from earlier years what were his eccentricities in our youth just had an explanation. I don't think it was a choice though. I mean, ok, his acting on homosexual thoughts and drives are a choice so if THAT is what makes you a homosexual than yes it's a choice. But if the drives and thoughts alone make you a homosexual then I believe it's natural. Denying them would prohibit him from living the life his body told him to. So I think it's natural. How can you choose what you are attracted to? Do you think you chose to be attracted to the people you are attracted to?

Do you think you chose to be attracted to the people you are attracted to?

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow



It is good to have a civil conversation for a change. Without unnessasary flaming or baiting.

Yes, I believe i do chose who I am attracted to. I am not attracted to blondes, I chose to like redheads and brunnettes. I choice to go up to them and talk to them. I chose my wife, because she was everything I liked.

If i want to, I can probably chose to turn gay today. So I believe it is my choice.

VVV

And as we agree to cease interacting, I feel very compelled to, once again, state that I do not appreciate, at all, your continued insistence upon attacking my intellect. Such behavior is uncalled for and highly inappropriate. Seeking to justify it by implying that you somehow "know" my intentions doesn't at all excuse it.

You feel "very compelled" to get in the last dig. Really, you should stop now. You started this garbage by claiming that you didn't understand my clear words, (but never stating WHAT you didn't understand) implying that I meant something different than what I said. When I denied that, you refused to accept it, and basically called me both a homophobe and a misogynist. I don't appreciate that. You replied to me first. I will reply to you last. Unless your last reply is an apology. Or you could just let it go, since you started it for no good reason.

I for one, has never called a gay person an abomination of nature. So your sweeping generalation is also a bit off putting. All the gay people I know are rather laid back about their sexuality. Even though they know my stance on the matter, there is no beef between me or my gay friends.

I am only referring to those who have actually called homosexuality a sin or an affront to nature in their posts. I can see that you do not hate homosexuality but there are many other people here who have given me this impression. I feel I am on a christian forum right now. I refuse to let bigotry run rampant and here of all places. This kind of thinking in society breeds hate crimes and cannot be tolerated.

Originally posted by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep

Do you think you chose to be attracted to the people you are attracted to?

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow

 

It is good to have a civil conversation for a change. Without unnessasary flaming or baiting.

Yes, I believe i do chose who I am attracted to. I am not attracted to blondes, I chose to like redheads and brunnettes. I choice to go up to them and talk to them. I chose my wife, because she was everything I liked.

If i want to, I can probably chose to turn gay today. So I believe it is my choice.

VVV

Agreed civil is better.
I don't know though. See those are your preferences in the sex you are attracted to. I'm not saying you are wrong, I'm not you. I also agree, we have the same tastes I guess, I've never so much as dated a blond. All my girlfriends have been brunette. I could go for a blond If I chose. I think that's different though. Same sex you know. I don't think I could be attracted to a man. I'm just not. I don't think my friend could be attracted to a girl. He's just how he is. He is actually only attracted to chubby guys, which has kept me in the clear haha.

Edit: Oh but a blond I could go for that you are probably very familiar with as a South African. Yolandi Vi$$er. Haha she is a blond I could get behind, pun definitely intended.

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow


I agree with you. You can't choose to find men sexually attractive if you simply don't. My best friend is gay and I love the guy, but couldn't choose to find him sexually appealing. It may be possible for some people with tendencies toward bi-sexuality, but certainly not everyone. Nor could he find women sexually appealing either. It is what it is, you like what you like.

edit to add: I think sexual response in general lies beyond the realm of choice, it's kind of a reaction-type thing.

Originally posted by joechip
reply to post by GogoVicMorrow

 

I agree with you. You can't choose to find men sexually attractive if you simply don't. My best friend is gay and I love the guy, but couldn't choose to find him sexually appealing. It may be possible for some people with tendencies toward bi-sexuality, but certainly not everyone. Nor could he find women sexually appealing either. It is what it is, you like what you like.

edit to add: I think sexual response in general lies beyond the realm of choice, it's kind of a reaction-type thing.

edit on 27-9-2010 by joechip because: (no reason given)

So you also think it's natural? Sorry It's a big thread I haven't read everyone's origins on this topic. I only really started commenting because the guy who started it really annoyed me with his first comments. Pretty hateful when he began, I don't know if he's edited it down to sound a little more sensitive. I think there are some people who, like you said, could choose. I think straight men can determine whether or not another man is handsome, though if their straight it's probably their minds picking out more feminine qualities in that man. All in all though, I think it's natural.

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow


Well, I am straight, and married. Yet I actually do find some men attractive. And I am not even ashamed to mention it, for fear of being rediculed. Does that make me strange? I don't think so. It was a personal choice.


VVV

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep

If i want to, I can probably chose to turn gay today. So I believe it is my choice.

I dont believe you. You can choose to follow your desire or not, but you cannot choose to be attracted to someone. You either are, or you are not, but you cannot change it consciously.

Originally posted by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep
reply to post by GogoVicMorrow

 

Well, I am straight, and married. Yet I actually do find some men attractive. And I am not even ashamed to mention it, for fear of being rediculed. Does that make me strange? I don't think so. It was a personal choice.


VVV

No, it doesn't make you strange. If you think it is your choice to find some men attractive I can't argue that again because you are the only one that knows. Maybe that's how things really are. Maybe some people do decide out of choice, but if I'm inclined to believe that I'm also inclined to believe the ones that say they are just born that way. Neither have reason to lie. Maybe it's 50/50, maybe some choose and some don't. If even just one person is born and didn't decide their attraction (as I know is true for myself of women) than that makes it natural, and possibly natural for all though? Right? If you know you chose and aren't just naturally bi (not saying you are). Then that means both are possibilities. Also off topic but.. I tossed in Yolandi because I was curious if you know of her being South African.

Edit: Have you considered (and not trying to step on any toes) that you may be bi, and it is natural. If you have always had the propensity to be attracted to men. Which I haven't. Although I will say I have seen men made up as women on for example the Maury show that I was attracted to BUT it was the feminine aspects. As a man they would do nothing for me. If they exposed themselves to me, I would be turned off.

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep

Well, I am straight, and married. Yet I actually do find some men attractive. And I am not even ashamed to mention it, for fear of being rediculed. Does that make me strange? I don't think so. It was a personal choice.

Then you are bisexual. It does not matter that you lead a heterosexual life, if you are attracted to some men, you are bisexual.

I suppose you are sexually attracted to your wife. Can you choose to be sexualy repulsed by her? I dont think so.

reply to post by Maslo


Actually no, I am not bisexual. Maybe I stated it wrong. I find some men beautiful, like I find some sculptures or paitings beautiful.

But you know, you guys are actually starting to sway me over. Maybe there is a primal force deep inside one that forces you to choose certain things. I have an open mind. I also value the opinions of others, and I am starting to give your thoughts some serious consideration.

VVV

Originally posted by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep
reply to post by Maslo

 

Actually no, I am not bisexual. Maybe I stated it wrong. I find some men beautiful, like I find some sculptures or paitings beautiful.

But you know, you guys are actually starting to sway me over. Maybe there is a primal force deep inside one that forces you to choose certain things. I have an open mind. I also value the opinions of others, and I am starting to give your thoughts some serious consideration.

VVV

That's what I was saying earlier. Straight men can recognize what is attractive in other men. I know what handsome is. Maybe it's instinct we pick up so we can say.. keep our girlfriends the h*ll away from those dudes. What I mean by who you are attracted to is who you could have sex with, be intimate with. I have male friends I could live with happily, just living with my friends, but I wouldn't want to drag them to bed or have that loving connection with them. I couldn't choose to be attracted to men. It would happen naturally. It could probably even happen naturally later in life, but I know in most cases it's from birth or puberty.