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US wants a middle east civil war

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posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:29 PM
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reply to post by MrSpad
 





Iran has tried to spread the revolution through funding rebels/terror groups in other Islamic States, assasination in other Islamic States and coup attempts in other Islamic states. You will find little support for Iran anywhere in the Muslim world as its attempts to spread the revolution has used violence as its primary means.


Actually that is not true at all, if you are talking about Hamas and Hezbullah as attempts to spread the revolution then I don't really know what to say lol.

- Hezbullah was given birth as a resistance group against Israel, hence the Israeli invasion of Lebanon.

- Hamas was also given birth as a resistance group against Israel, hence the second intifada.

Both are resistance groups and have nothing to do with spreading of revolution, go read about it them, and not from MSM please, they kinda trick naive people, that a habit they have.

The rest of your post you have prove..

And just to show the hypocracy, don't forget to mention how the US spreads its own ideology, through terror, assassinations, coups, proxy wars, outright invasions, bombardments, bullyism tactics, economic warfare... I can go on, but you know exaclty where I'm going with this right



edit on 21-9-2010 by oozyism because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by oozyism
reply to post by centurion1211
 


Those tactics are getting boring..

Care to comment in regards to my post rather than just attacking me




I have - more than once.

But it's obvious that you aren't interested in reading anything that differs from your very narrow and dogmatic view of world events.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:37 PM
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Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
reply to post by oozyism
 


Wait what???? European Civil War orchestrated by the Jews and the US? Huh are you talking about WWII? If I recall my History Hitler started the war and in the Process helped kill over 6 Million Jews, not to mention all the other groups he had a hand in killing.




It seems people do not even have the ability to think for themselves anymore, then again why would they? They have been thought the BS winner's side of history for so long, that if told anything different, even different definitions over heats their brains lol..

European civil war wasn't WWII, it was just that, a civil war in Europe. Other nations took sides after it all began, and no, the Jews weren't prosecuted, nor killed before the Zionists terrorists harbored by the US called for an economic warfare against Nazi Germany. So Zionist Jews did play a huge role in orchestrating the civil war, every one wanted a piece of Europe, it played out perfectly, but US took it all, if you don't believe me, ask your leaders in England to do something against the wishes of US, I want to see what happens lol..



You guys are not best buddies, US is the Ayatollah of Europe



edit on 21-9-2010 by oozyism because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:39 PM
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reply to post by centurion1211
 


You just did it again, zzzz..

I just said those tactics are getting boring, and you do it again




doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Albert Einstein

www.quotationspage.com...




edit on 21-9-2010 by oozyism because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by airspoon
reply to post by MrSpad
 


No, you'll find little support for Iran in the countries that are more popular with the US (such as Saudi Arabia), because it is a Shiite country, as opposed to Sunni. In fact, it's not only this divide but also these countries that are part of the American Empire, that do American and Israeli bidding.

You see, Iran has oil and is not part of the American Empire, thus keeping absolute controll of OPEC away from America, her empire and the "petro-dollar". Furthermore, the Iranian Oil-Bourse is threatening the supremecy of the American petro-dollar, thereby threatening the controll structure around that commodity. Saudi strength in the region is entirely dependent upon the USD and the strength of the American Empire.

It really has nothing to do with the reasons you listed, as that it mostly MSM propaganda designed to further the agenda of TPTB, that you seem to be buying hook, line and sinker.

--airspoon


You have limited your view to just the Gulf but, you will find that Iran is very unpopular in the Muslim parts of Africa and South East Asia as well as they have also operated in those areas as well trying to bring down regimes and spread the revolution. How do I know this? I spent many years in those regions. Regions not covered by your "MSM propaganda" excuse. You also seem to have a very black and white view of the US and Irans relashionship. The US and Iran have a mixed track record of hating on each other and working together on occasion. I also do not know how you think the US is just one step way from absolute control of OPEC? Do you know the member countries? And do you know OPEC does whatever the hell in pleases? Oil embargo against the US ring a bell? Oil does play a role in the region as outside powers would have no reason to be there of if did not. However none of that has to do with the general dislike of Iran through out the Muslim world. Irans own actions have shaped that. Of course the Western media only covers Irans actions when it has to with a western power or Israel. Attemting to take out the Governments of Muslims states just never really rated on the nightly news.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:46 PM
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Originally posted by oozyism
And the US supplies the CIA terrorists, that should be good enough of an argument to stop your MSM BS.


Oozy, aren't you on record elsewhere at ATS as claiming that the CIA created the taliban by supporting the mujahideen against the Soviets? If CIA = "terrorists", then by logical extension, the muj = "terrorists" as well.

Aren't you also on record as admitting that your dad and uncle were in the old mujahideen? That means they were "terrorists" as well. What you are doing here is establishing your own links to global terrorism...

It's OK, Oozy, relax. I don't believe a bit of that. The basic premise is flawed, and so then is the rest of the chain of logic leading to your terrorist ties. The CIA are not, nor were they, "terrorists", and neither did they create the taliban. You're safe here, even if you ARE a bit misguided.

I'm just highlighting some of the flaws in your twisted logic is all.



. And the human rights violator lol:
the death sentence of an American woman with borderline mental retardation


You are aware that Teresa Lewis pled guilty to her part in MURDERS, right? The murders of her husband and stepson. How, precisely, does an execution by lethal injection (I think - I believe VA did away with "Old Sparky", but I might be wrong on that point) for murder compare to beating a woman to death with rocks for "adultery" against an already deceased husband?



edit on 2010/9/21 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:51 PM
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Originally posted by oozyism
reply to post by centurion1211
 


You just did it again, zzzz..

I just said those tactics are getting boring, and you do it again


OK, let's try this thread and post of yours on the American woman jailed by iran (for hiking) to back up what I'm saying:

thread




Originally posted by oozyism


Well, this is interesting


When they said bail, I thought they meant bailed out with conditions, meaning she can't leave Iran, but she can live in Iran until her bail conditions are completed, hence "I'm out on bail" 2pac


I thought that would be nice because she would get to know Iran a little better, rather than watching Iran in TV.

Darn..


Pretty twisted view of reality to think that viewing iran from inside an iranian jail cell would be better than watching a documentary about iran on television, or that anyone wrongfully imprisoned with their friend (still being held BTW) would lead anyone to want to stay in that country for a "vacation".

major
's


edit on 9/21/2010 by centurion1211 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:57 PM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


But you miss one important fact out; if there wasn't already the deep religious, tribal and ethnic hatreds and divisions within the region the USA, UK, USSR or anybody else wouldn't have been able to manipulate events.

Iraq had been a part of The Ottoman Empire for centuries and had been the scene of almost constant tribal and poltical infighting.
As The Ottoman Empire was an ally of Germany during WWI the UK invaded and ruled there until granting independance in 1932.
The subsequent regime was constantly plagued with attempted coup d'etat's, eventually one succeeded.
This new regime was pro-German and the UK feared they would cut off oil supplies and re-direct them to Hitler so again the UK invaded.
Iraq was then under military occupation but the pre-coup regime was restored and military occupation ceased in 1947 when Iraq was again a fully independant state, the first time for centuries.
During the next few decades various military and political uprisings and coup's occurred culminating with Saddam's rise to power and his brutal subjugation of it's people.

My point is that the Iraqi people have been complicit themselves in the development of events which has led to the situation they are in now and which they are maintaining with their constant killing of each other.

It is convenient to blame 'The West', though they are not innocent by any stretch of imagination, but not all of their doing's were ill intentioned or ill advised and the Iraqi people have contributed themselves.

Similar events have occurred in most countries throughout the region where religious, tribal and ethnic differences merely help perpetuate the hatred and killing.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by oozyism
reply to post by MrSpad
 





Iran has tried to spread the revolution through funding rebels/terror groups in other Islamic States, assasination in other Islamic States and coup attempts in other Islamic states. You will find little support for Iran anywhere in the Muslim world as its attempts to spread the revolution has used violence as its primary means.


Actually that is not true at all, if you are talking about Hamas and Hezbullah as attempts to spread the revolution then I don't really know what to say lol.

- Hezbullah was given birth as a resistance group against Israel, hence the Israeli invasion of Lebanon.

- Hamas was also given birth as a resistance group against Israel, hence the second intifada.

Both are resistance groups and have nothing to do with spreading of revolution, go read about it them, and not from MSM please, they kinda trick naive people, that a habit they have.

The rest of your post you have prove..

And just to show the hypocracy, don't forget to mention how the US spreads its own ideology, through terror, assassinations, coups, proxy wars, outright invasions, bombardments, bullyism tactics, economic warfare... I can go on, but you know exaclty where I'm going with this right



edit on 21-9-2010 by oozyism because: (no reason given)



No I am not talking about Hezbulla and Hamas. Believe it or not many Muslim states are not in the Mid-east. And I did not forget to mention the US or anyone else and what they may or may not have none because that is not the conversation. The post I responded to had to with why Iran is so unpopular among the rest of the Muslim world. Now that you know the topic feel free to let me know how my years in the those parts of the world getting the opinions of those population is some how related to the MSM.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:02 PM
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reply to post by Freeborn
 


Sorry Freeborn, you act like US doesn't comprise of different religions and ethnicities.

I don't think you will understand until the day comes when US is weak, and the world super powers play their little games in the US over control, then you will see how easy it is to manipulate people.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:15 PM
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This thread has an interesting title and a brazen one at that! When has the Middle East not been in contention by the major world powers, filled with civil unrest, or fraught with hostilities in the history of civilization? If one were to step into a time machine and went back thousands of years they would find the Middle East in a situation akin to what it looks like today except the costumes, dogmas, and military hardware would be different. Middle East has always been in a state of disruption and chaos, and has the US been guilty of some it? Yes, but so has the British, French, and other Western Powers in the modern era.

To go back even further, we can look upon the Greeks under Alexander the Great and his conquests, the Romans and their brutal and repressive thousand year occupation of much of the region, the Mongols as they laid waste to the Middle East during their conquests, and most notably; brutally sacking the cultural and intellectual center at the time in Baghdad, the Ottomans as they gained power in the the 1400s, and even the Crusaders as they massacred Muslims, Eastern Christians, and Jews during their military exploits to ensure safe passage to Jerusalem for Europeans. Then we have a rift that has festered and boiled over on numerous occasions between the two opposing factions in Islam, the Sunni and the Shia, which has lasted over a thousand years.

Perhaps, the reason why the Middle East is so barren is the simple historical fact that it is filled with so much blood? Now, is this US arms deal to Saudia Arabia provocative? Yes, because the House of Saud are no saints, and it could welcome further instability in the region. However, what about the Russians or the Chinese who are actively arming and advising Iran? Do, they get off the hook? Google the relationship Iran has with Russia or China. Apparently, they are using Iran as a proxy to protect their interests in the region? Just as the US has been suspect of using Jordan, Turkey at times, Israel, and potentially Iraq as their proxy. Just as the Russians and Chinese are protecting their interests in and with Iran, is the US not entitled to protect its interest in Saudia Arabia? One thing we all can agree on is the simple fact that the Middle East is a nightmare, and fraught with instability, carnage, and death. There are many actors in this stage play. The military build-up that has been taking place in the Middle East is what concerns me, and it appears a major clash may be in the making if the militarist rhetoric by all sides continues to stoke the fear and anger of people living there and the world over.





edit on 21-9-2010 by Jakes51 because: typos



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:16 PM
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Originally posted by oozyism
reply to post by nenothtu
 


Neno, although I think you deserve to be put under ignore list, I still haven't seen any pedophilia behavior from you therefore I will just allow you to slap your smarta$$ comments around


Thank you. Just so you'll know, you're in good company - my wife always said I was a smartass, too, as well as a couple of other choice descriptors. Her pet name for me involved a vulgarism for the rectal orifice.

I wear the badge proudly.

Now, about this "pedophilia" thing of yours, that's a pretty bizarre statement, even for you. What is this fascination with pedophilia you have? Been dwelling on your prophet too much lately?



Are you suggesting CIA is not a terrorist organization?


"Suggesting"? No, not at all. I'm flat out stating it as fact.





In 2009, 44 predator strikes carried out by the CIA in the tribal areas of Pakistan struck only five of their intended al Qa'eda and Taliban targets, but more than 700 innocent civilians also died, according to Pakistani authorities.

The National


Well, I suppose we could slap each other around all day posting quotes from news stories about war acts and re-labelling them to suit ourselves, but why bother? That's not really debate, it's lazy, letting others carry the weight of debate, and intellectually dishonest, re-labelling various actions to suit our own peculiar world views. The fact remains that I didn't read "terrorist" anywhere in your quote there. Did you perhaps cut it off too soon?



The above is just one example of that terrorism I'm talking about, and the US supplies these terrorists



Again, where is the "terrorism" there?



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:16 PM
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Of course they will so that when the U.S. government wants to strip more of our GOD GIVEN RIGHTS they will blame a nuclear, biological or any kind of attack in the U.S. on the Middle East.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:21 PM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


A blatant attempt at using deflection so as not to answer or reply to the point raised.

Of course the US comprises different religions and ethnicities, and guess what, they don't go around blowing each other up and despite what the PC dominated media may have you believe they practice religious tolerance and equal opportunity.

I assure you, I do not regard the US as the idyllic, perfect society and a paragon of virtue but neither is it the evil home of the devil spawn that some would have you believe.

As for the US's downfall, it is inevitable at some point.
But it is a young country and has quite a bit of life left in it yet.

The USA has made some horrendous mistakes but I for one think the world is a better place for them.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:22 PM
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reply to post by nenothtu
 




Well, I suppose we could slap each other around all day posting quotes from news stories about war acts and re-labelling them to suit ourselves, but why bother? That's not really debate, it's lazy, letting others carry the weight of debate, and intellectually dishonest, re-labelling various actions to suit our own peculiar world views. The fact remains that I didn't read "terrorist" anywhere in your quote there. Did you perhaps cut it off too soon?


If that is all you have to offer as a debate, then you might as well not debate at all


700 innocent people murdered by the CIA, I will just leave it at that lol


In 2009, 44 predator strikes carried out by the CIA in the tribal areas of Pakistan struck only five of their intended al Qa'eda and Taliban targets, but more than 700 innocent civilians also died, according to Pakistani authorities.


You can continue playing the word game, I'll watch and laugh from a distance, don't wanna be close to that guy



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:25 PM
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Originally posted by oozyism
European civil war wasn't WWII, it was just that, a civil war in Europe. Other nations took sides after it all began,


OK, Oozy, I'll play. WHICH European nation was having a civil war that dragged the rest of the world into it?



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:26 PM
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reply to post by Freeborn
 


I'm not deflecting the question, I'm simply saying you won't understand until it comes to your neighborhood.

That is when you see how easy it is to manipulate people, many, many different groups in your country, and they can be easily manipulated, the difference between the US and vulnerable countries are that vulnerability. If someone tries to manipulate the American population in to creating chaos then justifying an invasion, it won't work, because the US has a powerful intelligence agency which will deflect the attempt straight away.

Only time will tell



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:33 PM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


You failed to point out any terrorism, even the second time around - merely reposting the same thing, yet unable to point out "terrorism".

So then, it is as I said, there IS no terrorism there.

Also conveniently skipped all the other questions.

Have a nice day, Oozy, and thanks for playing.



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