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The "Right" fits the Marxist definition of Fascism.

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posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 02:34 PM
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Waste of breathe. Why should I care about your political stance? Why do I care if you're liberal or conservative.

More importantly, what effect does it have on our country?

None.




posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by dr_strangecraft
More Leftist Class Warfare against the working class

The ugly truth is that the left doesn't genuinely represent the "working class" which they claim to champion. The leadership of the left has always been (in the US) the college-educated East Coast Elite. Try to find an Evangelist of the Left who isn't a trust fund baby, who paid his/her way through college. Good Luck.

Look at their criticism of the Tea Party, in particular the rhetoric with which the tea party is excoriated. They are uneducated people from the south and midwest, who are secretly racists and ... omg... FAT! How is it again that the Tea Party represents the giant corporations? Maybe it is the connection between NASCAR and big oil???? The fact that the Tea Party occasionally rejects the leadership of the GOP elite ought to give the left an opening; but the liberal elite is so busy hating that they cannot even imagine that the Tea Partiers are not wealthy plutocrats. Oh well.

The whole problem is that the "Hard Right" actually represents the attitudes and beliefs of the people that the Left wishes they could represent--working-class people who just want to do their jobs and go home to their families.


Well my criticism of the Tea Party is not based upon what you portray (racism), it is based upon the fact that many TP members are FOX viewers. In being FOX viewers many of these same people provide the basis structure
of popular support that let Bush accomplish terribly unconstitutional, fiscally disastrous things that only
helped enrich The Military Industrial Complex, Big Oil, Energy and the FED n' friends. FOX and Bush intentionally used 9/11 as a platform to garner extreme fear, with the event as the foundation they used the fearful conservative based as a tool to oppose the left in this nation who did not want war, Enron, Gasoline price gouging or the merging of Investment and insurance - self insuring of the parties own investments.

All these thing helped bring us to this position we are in today economically speaking, ALL of these things were
sold and justified to the public by FOX almost exclusively. This simple connection is not hard to make, so maybe the idea that NASCAR fans drink oil could have some merit. All jabbing aside, you cannot have a real
movement if it is shaped by the private media outlet of the government you are allegedly revolting against.

Sure enough, TTPM has FOX (who played the most vital role in creating this horrible situation) and its agents firmly evolved in the movement which is responding to FOX's failure and corruption. This simple and factual connection is mind numbing, very clear to see and DAMNS the TP to once again be a collective of Minions
championing the things which the are allegedly fighting against. IF the TP rejected FOX 'n FRIEND's
I would not feel the way I do... It is actually sad and pathetic to see for me; like a woman taking back
the drunken husband who beat her from an inch of her life just yesterday. TTP should have made this connection and been aware that they were manipulated, unfortunately they built this whole to-do on
a putrid foundation, a propagandistic coalition.

On the next thing -

Your claim; "the "Hard Right" actually represents the attitudes and beliefs of the people that the Left wishes they could represent--working-class people who just want to do their jobs and go home to their families. "

Your diluted, let me give you an example of something where the hard right could have done EXACTLY what you are referring to, where the liberal did try to represent anyone with a car and a budget.

If you recall the "Gasoline price spike"??? you remember that??? Everyday gas inched up and up and up?

THE U.S was in virtual control of the Oil producing region of the world, new sources where already tapped increasing SUPPLY. No reason for those prices to skyrocket my friend... Unless it was manipulation with intent.




Official: A bill to provide energy price relief and hold oil companies and other entities accountable for their actions with regard to high energy prices, and for other purposes. as introduced.
Short: Petroleum Consumer Price Gouging Protection Act as introduced.
Short: NOPEC as introduced.
Short: No Oil Producing and Exporting Cartels Act of 2008 as introduced.
Short: Consumer-First Energy Act of 2008 as introduced.

ZERO AMENDMENTS


This was the first motion to launch an investigation based upon the fact that these U.S prices appeared to
be erroneous and felonious ~ the act of cartel like collusion.

www.senate.gov...

Also; the big five OIL CEO's at the time attended the

Senate Judiciary Cmte. hearing on Rising Crude Oil Prices, which helped warrant an investigation. This PROVES MY POINT that something was afoot

You will be amazed to hear what comes from the mouth of John Hofmeister, president and U.S. country chairman, Shell Oil Co ( the only honest one of the five CEOs present) - paraphrased - he said that if you take out the market speculation and the geo political concerns that oil can be produced, shipped at about 40 - 60 dollars a barrel -

all the other members cited 130 - 170 a barrel !

TALK ABOUT B.S

SO my friend, when it came time to simply investigate why on Earth oil had increased over 100% in a decade
the Republicans decided that there was no reason to even INVESTIGATE.

We got robbed BLIND by OPEC, we foot the bill for this fraudulent, one sided profit race.

All but three republicans voted on behalf of saving OPEC some discomfort -

NAYs ---43
Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burr (R-NC)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Sununu (R-NH)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Wicker (R-MS)

$5.50 gas


I don't think you pay attention much, in almost every case where corporations take advantage and screw those people you refer to, conservatives side with BIG BUSINESS, not the hard working families trying to put food on their families.

You look at this clearly - who was on the side of the ELITES??? There is no other reasonable conclusion to be made.



edit on 21-9-2010 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 04:39 PM
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I think the word you were looking for is "deluded," meaning someone who is mistaken. "Diluted" means to be weakened by having water added, like what some people do to their Scotch by adding ice cubes.

All of your post shows what, that "the Right" is fascist?

Funny how you change horses to your long screed about the price of oil and focus on GOP party votes to show how this is fascism.

Your definition of fascism also seems rubbery enough to stretch any which way you need it to in order to cover "the right."

Again, its funny (the "ha-ha" kind) that the Tea Party, as an indigenous (not-identical-to-GOP) grass-roots force is somehow supposed (by you) to be fascist for daring to oppose the socialism of O'bama Pelosi and Reid.

What is really funny (the weird kind) is that The Right includes anyone you don't like, along with the assumption that almighty YOU has a better idea of what the public needs than they themselves do.

Fascinating, how one-sided (liberal) ATS turns out to be. Probably because techies and unemployed people lurk so much on the internet.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by dr_strangecraft
Again, its funny (the "ha-ha" kind) that the Tea Party, as an indigenous (not-identical-to-GOP) grass-roots force is somehow supposed (by you) to be fascist for daring to oppose the socialism of O'bama Pelosi and Reid.


Again, it's funny (the "ha-ha" kind) that you mention Obama and socialism in one breath, while working people are struggling like they never did in the past decades and the rich get richer.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:15 PM
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Maybe you are too young to remember 1991. or 1981.

But maybe you are suggesting that the Republicans screwed everything up...before being voted out of congress...four years ago.

Maybe if O'bama and company could get another half-trillion TARP, they could create jobs for another 3 million people, thus lowering unemployment by what, another percentage point? Down to 8 percent? wouldn't that be lovely.

I guess corporations that write paychecks are merely killing off jobs faster than O'bama/Biden can create them. Ooh, except that....governments don't create jobs---employers do.

Too bad this lefty regime has declared war on capitalism.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:31 PM
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reply to post by Misoir
 


Excellent thread and it confirms that America is and has always been the 4th Reich.

A factual analysis is your best weapon against ignorance.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:33 PM
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reply to post by dr_strangecraft
 


Responses like this are to be expected.

But if what you say is true, what's stopping these companies from creating new jobs? Why do people elect Republicans who promise to create jobs (like in VT) when politicians/government do not create jobs?



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:37 PM
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Originally posted by dr_strangecraft

I think the word you were looking for is "deluded," meaning someone who is mistaken. "Diluted" means to be weakened by having water added, like what some people do to their Scotch by adding ice cubes.

All of your post shows what, that "the Right" is fascist?

Funny how you change horses to your long screed about the price of oil and focus on GOP party votes to show how this is fascism.

Your definition of fascism also seems rubbery enough to stretch any which way you need it to in order to cover "the right."

Again, its funny (the "ha-ha" kind) that the Tea Party, as an indigenous (not-identical-to-GOP) grass-roots force is somehow supposed (by you) to be fascist for daring to oppose the socialism of O'bama Pelosi and Reid.

What is really funny (the weird kind) is that The Right includes anyone you don't like, along with the assumption that almighty YOU has a better idea of what the public needs than they themselves do.

Fascinating, how one-sided (liberal) ATS turns out to be. Probably because techies and unemployed people lurk so much on the internet.




Sorry that I chose the wrong option with spell check, I suppose this negates my example in response to your previous assertion?


What is really funny (the weird kind) is that The Right includes anyone you don't like, along with the assumption that almighty YOU has a better idea of what the public needs than they themselves do.




My response was to your post, 100% focused on what you stated - Note the third line in the above post.

Why are you criticizing my response and its basis when my "screed" is directed at the foundation you laid
with your own words. Why are you trying to redirect the debate, when it is based upon your argument?

You posted three paragraphs and the final paragraph concluded your argument with this, again your
determination and your words



The whole problem is that the "Hard Right" actually represents the attitudes and beliefs of the people that the Left wishes they could represent--working-class people who just want to do their jobs and go home to their families.


I combated the assertion that your argument presented with a real, tangible action and vote of
the major Left and Right parties in America.

again read your words;



The whole problem is that the "Hard Right" actually represents the attitudes and beliefs of the people that the Left wishes they could represent--working-class people who just want to do their jobs and go home to their families.


Are you saying that "working-class people who just want to do their jobs and go home to their families."
enjoy being gouged by Middle Eastern Oil Cartels? Are you justifying the whole sale looting of anyone with a
car who might happen to need gasoline?

I provided a procedural vote which would have launched an investigation into corrupt practices which lead to the unnatural spike in gasoline prices.

This procedural vote indicated that GOP did not feel the need to determine why this nation and its "working-class people who just want to do their jobs and go home to their families" were being fleeced by Billionaire Middle Easterners. FYI - most oil companies recorded the highest profits in HISTORY during this period,
you paid, I paid, every single American paid to provide this un warranted, historic profit.

This is an actual example that could have given merit to the assertion of your argument. Unfortunately it
shows just the opposite, 60 vote were not reached because the GOP cared very little for the working class people who had to support these felonious costs.

In not even being able to recognize this; after being presented real evidence I understand that logic does not
determine your belief system.

This vote was so clean and straight forward there were no amendments, just an attempt to advocate
for everyone who had their budgets impacted by actual Elites manipulating the markets.

So please help me understand how you justify the GOP's stance on this, when you believe this



The whole problem is that the "Hard Right" actually represents the attitudes and beliefs of the people that the Left wishes they could represent--working-class people who just want to do their jobs and go home to their families.


Finish the argument you started









edit on 21-9-2010 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:39 PM
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Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by dr_strangecraft
 


Responses like this are to be expected.

But if what you say is true, what's stopping these companies from creating new jobs? Why do people elect Republicans who promise to create jobs (like in VT) when politicians/government do not create jobs?


I love Vermont, you are the only state that would proudly elect an Independent Democratic Socialist Senator. But why would you elect a Republican for governor, what gives? I hope you are voting this year for the Progressive Party pick for Governor (Martha Abbott) and Patrick Leahy.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:39 PM
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reply to post by Janky Red
 


Just one word: BURN!!!


I don't come from old money. My family doesn't have any political influence. I come from a family of laborers and custodians. We are blue-collar to the bone. And? We live in the Northeast, the supposed home of the "elite".



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:40 PM
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Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by Misoir
 


Excellent thread and it confirms that America is and has always been the 4th Reich.


Amazing. America is time-traveling fascists. Just. Wow.

For your info, the 2nd Reich didn't die until 1918. But we were already the 4th? You sense of history is ... breath-taking.



A factual analysis is your best weapon against ignorance.


Yeah, well, too bad you won't be finding that here. On an "opinion" page. Look, unless you do a word count and then apply some statistics to this page, you won't get any "factual analysis." It's simply not possible. That's just the inherent nature of editorials and opinion pieces.

Oh, but don't let me get in the way of the tsunami of righteous (or is it left-eous) indignation flowing from the blue estate right about now. I mean, Liberal president, liberal congress, what was missing? I mean, other than the ability to get the country on track with *trillions* of dollars is government pork-barrel, and the perfect target in the person of George Bush.

But yes, everyone not-left oriented (read, anyone in the other 75% of the American demographic) is an ignorant hillbilly fascist for not begging for more government control of what is left of their personal finances.

just wow.

torrents of ignorance.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:43 PM
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reply to post by Misoir
 


Abbott is no longer in the running. I don't understand why a Republican is governor but it might be the media influence upon people that calls for "balance" in state politics, since the House and Legislature are overwhelmingly Democrat. I have no idea if the Democrat running for Governor has a chance. Republican candidate Brian Dubie has a past as a hard-core conservative but the Democrats have not exploited this. Democratic candidate Peter Shumlin is not as well-known as he needs to be and it's been a bad habit of the Dems to field a candidate that lacks the charisma and work ethic needed to defeat the Republicans. Time will only tell. If Anthony Pollina were running again, I'd consider voting for him. He's given up on running for Gov though.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:45 PM
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reply to post by Misoir
 


" I believed that this definition of Fascism can be easily equated with the modern variant of Hard-Core Conservatism. I am not claiming that every Republican is a Fascist nor am I claiming that even the Hard-Core Conservatives fit every definition exactly. "



What Exactly are you " Claiming " then ? Talk about Generalizations ! Moral and Ethical Beliefs are part of Mainstream Conservatism . Sounds like someone Needs a Hug here...............



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:47 PM
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Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by dr_strangecraft
 


Responses like this are to be expected.

But if what you say is true, what's stopping these companies from creating new jobs? Why do people elect Republicans who promise to create jobs (like in VT) when politicians/government do not create jobs?


Republicans don't promise to create jobs. They promise not to take everyone's money away.

Of course, the GOP is full of opportunist RINO hacks who will say anything to get elected--just like their enemies across the aisle.

What is stopping companies from creating new jobs is precisely what is stopping individual consumers from spending:

They are fearful of the future. Fearful that they won't have enough money in coming months.

Offering to "soak the rich" only scares them into hiding their money better. It doesn't make them buy stocks and start new companies. It simply makes them put their money in T bills and money market accounts, (where it won't be taxed, hopefully), thus taking money out of circulation and shrinking the economy even more.

The fear-mongering of the left is precisely what kills people's hope for the future, and their chance of a job.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:49 PM
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reply to post by dr_strangecraft
 


Umm, Germany was the 3rd Reich.

Sheesh. You want to go back to watching Fox and Friends and let the adults talk about politics?



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:57 PM
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Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by dr_strangecraft
 


Umm, Germany was the 3rd Reich.

Sheesh. You want to go back to watching Fox and Friends and let the adults talk about politics?


When the adults chime in, I'll wake you up. (It's always dangerous to try an educate a stranger on a subject upon which you are woefully ignorant.)


The first Reich was the Holy Roman Empire (Germany), that was ended by Napoleon's invasion 1806.

The Second Reich was Prussia's declaration of empire (Germany) in 1871. It lasted until Wilhelm abdicated at the end of World War One.

The Nazi state claimed to be the (German) successor to the first two (German) reichs, or empires.

The German concept of Reich is older than America. So his post, and now your post, are both ridiculous.


It seems like you learnt your geography and history by watching beauty pageants.


edit on 21-9-2010 by dr_strangecraft because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by dr_strangecraft
 


Umm, Germany was the 3rd Reich.

Sheesh. You want to go back to watching Fox and Friends and let the adults talk about politics?


You did post this though:

Excellent thread and it confirms that America is and has always been the 4th Reich.
.

Which sounds like you were saying that America, founded in 1789, was the Fourth Reich when Nazi Germany, founded in 1933, was the Third Reich. If you meant something different I understand, I'm just saying by the way it sounds the math definitely wouldn't add up.



edit on 9/21/2010 by Misoir because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 06:03 PM
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Wondering...How does calling for smaller government equal Fascist?

fas·cism
n.

1. often Fascism
1. A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.
2. A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.
2. Oppressive, dictatorial control.

[Italian fascismo, from fascio, group, from Late Latin fascium, from Latin fascis, bundle.]
fascistic fas·cis'tic (fə-shĭs'tĭk) adj.

WORD HISTORY It is fitting that the name of an authoritarian political movement like Fascism, founded in 1919 by Benito Mussolini, should come from the name of a symbol of authority. The Italian name of the movement, fascismo, is derived from fascio, "bundle, (political) group," but also refers to the movement's emblem, the fasces, a bundle of rods bound around a projecting axe-head that was carried before an ancient Roman magistrate by an attendant as a symbol of authority and power. The name of Mussolini's group of revolutionaries was soon used for similar nationalistic movements in other countries that sought to gain power through violence and ruthlessness, such as National Socialism.

Here is the definition from Answers.com

Here is an interesting article about it,
www.thenewamerican.com...


edit on 21-9-2010 by Punisher75 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 06:04 PM
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reply to post by dr_strangecraft
 


"Chime, Chime"

Can you finish your debate with me when you have the time?

Or are going to pretend you never made the assertions you did and then walk away from your platform?

I am looking forward to it, thanks





edit on 21-9-2010 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 06:11 PM
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Originally posted by Punisher75
Wondering...How does calling for smaller government equal Fascist?


If it actually manifested as you present, it would not be.

Why don't you give me 1 President in the last 100 years, who embodies the proposed conservatism in action?

Just 1






edit on 21-9-2010 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)



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