I'm Going to a Mega-Church this Sunday!

I'm going to a mega-church this Sunday, and I'm going to write a check of $50,000 to God for the Stairway to Heaven.

Please allow me to explain myself...

I'm doing this as a protest to organized religion. I'm by no means an atheist by any sense. I'm completely tolerant of other peoples beliefs and I do not discriminate against anyone for their "religious" or "spiritual" beliefs as long as you choose to believe your theology, morals, and philosophy due to personal experiences and YOUR perspective instead of allowing someone else to do it for you.

I believe in a lot of philosophical view points that comes from the Bible, Torah, Koran, etc. but as religion as a "whole" I'm fundamentally against the concept. Of course the moralities and philosophies of religious texts are great and have done a lot of good, (I'm a student of philosophy so my beliefs of different symbolical, theological, and philosophical aspects of ALL religions have been interpreted from MY OWN perspective built from personal experiences) but RELIGION as a WHOLE has been used by people to manipulate the perspectives and masses either for political or personal gain (which I'm sure most of you are aware of) and this has affected history tremendously, either for better or worse, depending on your perspective you argue either way.

Before I go any further I must explain why I say base your beliefs from interpretations based on your own personal experiences and perspective. ALL religions (besides Scientology) have doctrines, practices, and beliefs that originated from shadowy origins, meaning, the history of the Old and New Testaments and who wrote them are practically unknown, Judaism was founded from tribal religions from one region and eventually through time evolved into one religion encompassing different and similar practices from different tribes. Christianity originated from Judaism but the interpretations of the original gospel have been changing ever since the original ministry of Jesus. Hinduism started from the tribes of the pre-Vedic and Dravidian eras in India then was encompassed into one whole religion (well to some extent). It can also be argued that Buddhism branched off of philosophies of Hinduism. All of these examples and others lead to my point that we don't really know who or what started these religions and thus the validity of their doctrines are subject to question. With this in mind I base my beliefs on what relates to me due to my perspective.

Now, to my main points why organized religion has become a problem...
(I'll start with Christianity since my Grandmother exposed it to me as a little one and it is the religion that I have "witnessed" the most)

Christianity has a lot of beliefs I can relate too and a lot of Christians ARE open minded and very humble people, but also I have found a lot of them to be very narrow minded and judgmental of other peoples beliefs when in reality they can't even explain the history, doctrines, or beliefs that they believe in.

The typical belief is that when you die you either go to heaven or hell depending on whether or not you have been good or bad (kind of like how Karma works, you go to a "lower" life or "higher" life depending on your Karma, but the Abrahamic version of sin and holy is more absolute). Now, there are the 10 commandments which you must not do otherwise you'll sin. Then the church leaders come in and interpret the bible for you and tell you what is sinful or not depending on their own agenda. The masses typically follow and believe without question. The priests use the potential of hell or heaven as a means to lure you into their "spell." (as lack of better terminology)

But with the concepts of going to heaven or hell when you die, the religion is hypocritical in a lot of ways. In the Old Testament it is said that the "soul" of the individual separates from the body and goes to a place called Sheol, where the soul will reside. In the New Testament, Jesus calls this place Hades (the Greek after world) which consists of two sections one for the righteous and one for the unrighteous and the souls wait until resurrection occurs. (kind of sounds like the process of the 7 Bardos in Tibbetan Buddhism with higher and lower reincarnations, both abrahmic and eastern religions say that there is an intermediate state between life and the next, whether from resurrection or reincarnation)

Later in History, Christian Theology further developed on this concept and stated the the soul will directly go to heaven or hell do "get a taste" of what it'll be like after the Final Judgement and will be resurrected with their bodies. This is where a lot of denominations are divided. They either say the soul sleeps until judgement, go to Hades, or go to directly to hell. With these inevitabilities of the afterlives being engraved into our beliefs system, the priests are able to interpret the bible for their own agenda and not have to worry about the masses in their congregation going against their words. How are we suppose to follow these types of people, look at the Catholic church, the Pope goes to Africa and says "Condoms are bad" when AIDS is most wide spread on the continent, while on the other hand, priests (note, note all) in the Catholic Church are constantly committing pedophilia with little boys and the church neglects to mention that.

"War is not Pro-Life"

The point to this is that, the church will say one thing to control while on the other neglects to admit their flaws to the masses that they are preaching too. Knowingly misconstruing the beliefs and psyche of the masses is far worse of an ultimate sin than some little child stealing a piece of candy. The church took the Philosophy of Jesus Christ, interpreted it to their own liking then forced people to follow their religions or be punished in the name of God (look at the Crusades and the converting of the native people of the colonies that the Europeans forced upon people). In western society we look at the Islamic way of life as savage, barbaric, immoral, jihad, and intolerable of other religions and ways of life, while at the same time this type of mentality is just as immoral, savage, and intolerable as they claim the Muslim World to be (in my opinion the Christian doing is much worse than the Muslims because Christianity holds a lot more power in the global chess board than Muslims do, due to the societies that most of these beliefs are concentrated in). These same people say that the Muslims want for governments to be Islamic governments and have a problem with that, while at the same time they are the same ones to say "America is a Christian Nation based on Christian Fundamentals.' So, we can look at this as a war between religions in a way, as one side thinks the other side does the same thing that the other side thinks the other side is doing. Now, I know the politics behind the war is far more than just religion difference, that is not the point for this argument.

I'm not solely saying that the Christian religion is the only ones guilty of this; Judaism, Islam, and even Hinduism are just as guilty of this act. In fact, the Brahim priests of the Vedic ages are just as guilty. As, the high priests of their religions in their time, they were in charge of worship, rituals, and knowledge bestowed upon the lower levels of society. Since they were the unquestionable "link from men to the gods" their power was unchallenged. They interpreted the concepts of reincarnation and karma to create a caste (class) system in which they were the ones at the topic. They said, you are in a lower level of society because of the karma of your past life, if you live your life to the best then you will be reincarnated into a higher caste. So they used the promise of a better next life if you do good to keep other members of society into lower places. They were just as guilty if not more guilty than their western counterparts at interpreting scripture and manipulating the masses.

In conclusion, I'm a very civil person and respectful of peoples beliefs and love to have conversations with others about their philosophical, moral, and theological beliefs, it intrigues me. But, I am against "high priests" manipulating the masses for their own gain. My personal beliefs are a combination of different from all walks of religion and philosophy. Theology, I believe in after life, reincarnation, one god, and unconditional love, which almost all religions teach in some way, but all these religions have their own "little" details on how to achieve Salvation, Enlightenment, etc. and in these little details they become so against each other and start wars and kill each other and they all missed the whole point of religion in the first place.

With almost 7,000,000,000,000 people on Earth and 7,000,000,000,000 different perspectives, problems will naturally and systematically occur if we allow others to do the thinking for us.

So I'm going to a Mega-Church this upcoming Sunday and when communion comes around I'm going to write my check to God for eternal salvation. I'm going to put my phone number on their so that when they try to cash this check they will contact me and I can bring my viewpoint to their attention.

When they ask me why, I'm going to ask them, why are you involved with religion? Is it because your own beliefs led to this? Is it because you want to go to heaven? Are you afraid to die? Were you raised this way? Do subconsciously just want to be a part of something? Do you feel your just an microscopic electron compared to the rest of the infinite universe and you want to have some type of meaning in life? Is it because you agree with the morals? Why do we stories to give us a better sense of morality? Is it because if we associate these stories as divine acts of God that we recognize these beliefs and morals as the proper way of life? Why must we NEED these stories to add importance into our lives?

"Religion has convinced people that there’s an invisible man…living in the sky, who watches everything you do every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a list of ten specific things he doesn’t want you to do. And if you do any of these things, he will send you to a special place, of burning and fire and smoke and torture and anguish for you to live forever, and suffer and burn and scream until the end of time. But he loves you. He loves you and he needs money." -George Carlin

give me $50000 and i will wander the earth preaching to Christians... (:

i could make a web site telling them why they all suck. and then i could die happy knowing, you gave $50000 to me!.

u2u me if you like my idea.i like money!

Love it... too bad the person calling will be from the bank!

while you're at it though, ask 'em about dinosaurs - they love that question!

reply to post by elfulanozutan0





Couldn't you just talk to the preacher/priest/pastor or whatever?
Or even leave just your phone number in there asking them to call you as It's an important matter.

I don't really get the significance of the money.... sounds like a bit of a silly plan to me.

reply to post by elfulanozutan0


I'm doing this as a protest to organized religion. I'm by no means an atheist by any sense. I'm completely tolerant of other peoples beliefs and I do not discriminate against anyone for their "religious" or "spiritual" beliefs as long as you choose to believe your theology, morals, and philosophy due to personal experiences and YOUR perspective instead of allowing someone else to do it for you.





Weak sauce...so, you're tolerant as long as their ideals were formed and created by themselves..?


So, how did you come to your own opinion..? You had no problem throwing a Carlin quote out there, so I can only assume he had an influence on you...and from the un-original thread you produced, I'd say Big Bird and the Cookie Monster had a large impact on you as well.


And your brilliant idea to toss in a check you do not intend to pay up on is no better than the bullsh!t tithe the church asks - it's just coming from a different direction...


Stop throwing rocks from glass houses...

reply to post by elfulanozutan0


In many states, you can be charged three times the amount of the check for writing a bad check. You can get arrested in many states as well, as it is considered a crime.

I doubt they would try to enforce the law in your case, but I think your attempt will fall on deaf ears. Then you will be used as the object lesson in the coming weeks, about a lost soul who didn't have Jesus.

That would be counter-productive to your cause and viewpoint.

reply to post by elfulanozutan0


What a waste.

$50,000 towards world hunger would be better.

What a twat rip off sheep you are..................religion is the bane of mankind.

We were meant to be spiritual not religious beings.

All the major religions were invented to control and manipulate humanity.

God grow the frak up.

Give with your heart and soul.

You sound controlled.

The question is by who or what?

reply to post by elfulanozutan0


As-Salāmu `Alayk(a) —Peace be upon you

I totally agree with you that it is confusing.

We should know that, a book of God should contain a book of signs, and in the signs it should contain science.
It should not have any contradiction.with established science too.

I have studied almost all world religions more or less.
And what i ended up with is that the quran had both religion and science. a guideline, a moral code.
In the end what do we know what is best for mankind and what is not?

I know and believe in Allah(God) that has revealed to all the 124000 messengers to each and every land.

It is mentioned in the quran, about the big bang, the earths shape like an ostrich-egg, the universe is expanding, all living creatures contain water, moon is borrowing light from the sun, all planets are rotating in its own orbit, water cycle, embriology, and much more in detail. In this glorious book koran, it has 6000 verses, and more than 1000 of the verses contains words of science.

I have studied about the bible, and i believe that some parts of the bible may contain words of God. But it does also contains, information from historian, priests, and absurdity. And so much contradictions like the earth is flat, and that we all human can eat all the fruits, even the poison, there is also not an single uneqvocal statement where Jesus(peace be upon him) says "i am god" or worship me"

In the hinduism, they have a concept of gods, which in itself is contradiction, how can the universe hold if there where many gods, for an example look at todays leaders, they are fighting eachother for power.

And some hindus believes in 330million gods, and there would be a big propability that the universe would collapse if each god claimed to be all mighty.

The concept of reincarnation, in hinduism never say something about birth-death-birth-death-birth-death in vedas, which is the top famous book in India. But it was some scholars who came up with the philosofy, same with christianity, it is the churches fault.

In the end you will find out that all have a similarity more or less, and the concept of 1 God, but later on many contradictions in their book..

But the quran today has the same information as since it was revealed.

Remember, years are numbers, and does not proove that the latest is manmade..
Bible was valid once upon a time, the torah was valid once upon a time, but that was only for that period of time, and the last and final messenger of Allah is Muhammad(peace be upon him) that mankind should follow..

I am glad to answer your questions if you just ask me question in the future inshallah(God willing).

reply to post by facelift


Weak sauce...so, you're tolerant as long as their ideals were formed and created by themselves..? So, how did you come to your own opinion..? You had no problem throwing a Carlin quote out there, so I can only assume he had an influence on you...and from the un-original thread you produced, I'd say Big Bird and the Cookie Monster had a large impact on you as well.

I'm tolerant as long as you don't let a t.v. preacher make a monkey out of you. I didn't say just make things up and there you have it. I said make your beliefs based upon your OWN perspective and personal experiences.

On the George Carlin quote, I presented this information to a friend of mine and he sent me that quote and I felt that it was appropriate, I actually never knew who this person was until today when I started making this thread.

To blupblup: I used the significance of money because church's like to tell you how to seek god and salvation while taking your money, so I decided that I'm going to cut to the chase and just "pay" god a large sum of money to buy salvation instead of multiple small donations.

To ofhumandescent: i'm not controlled, and I'm what you could call a "spiritual" person (for lack of a better term). I'm not controlled, and if I was controlled it wold probably be Satan controlling me as my "blasphemy" has made God cry.

Have you had a preacher ask you, "Have you found God?"

Well, I didn't know I was suppose to be looking for him.

Since the change over to the new ATS, I can't access BTS.

Are you having the same problem? Is that why you posted a screed that has nothing to do with conspiracies in the Conspiracies in Religion sub-forum?

I guess that this will become the dumping ground for anything having to do with religion, faith or spirituality if BTS is not available (not too big a loss as it trends that way regardless).


Eric

reply to post by EricD


Say nothing to do with conspiracies, but conspiracies are in history my friend. And if you need to address a conspiracy in my OP then... the conspiracy is that good religious texts have been used to manipulate the masses in a bad way. I used the title of the thread to make the point that we have religions asking for money while selling you salvation and that is what is for debate here, that is a conspiracy in itself.

It is not a theological debate, unless your theology is that you must you must give 10% of your income to your local church in order to reach heaven.

Originally posted by elfulanozutan0
reply to post by EricD

 

Say nothing to do with conspiracies, but conspiracies are in history my friend. And if you need to address a conspiracy in my OP then...

No, I don't have to address anything. You do. It is called the Conspiracy in Religions sub-forum for a reason. If you want to build a weak and tangential link to your OP in order to justify where you post your thread, than that is up to you, but please keep in mind that the stickied rules and guidelines regarding CiR state:

--2. This forum is specifically for conspiracies in religion. Make the conspiracy clear in your opening post. Name the conspiracy theory, talk about the motives, effects, and methods. Don't make the conspiracy merely implicit.--


Eric

reply to post by EricD


I can admit when I'm wrong, and apparently I am, lo siento. However, I would rather prefer your opinion rather than categorizing, that is for the mods. The conspiracy is there, even if I didn't directly address it as so. I try to be civil and unbiased at all times, even when I'm talking to people that my impression is off of their avatar, no problem with that, debate should be anonymous.

Not to be off topic, the information we deal with on this site is crucial and important, we can't address the change that needs to be done in this world without informing people and you can't just go to a group of your standard U.S. citizens and start talking about "alternative" topics. We are addressed as loco, and subject closed minds, so we must address the issues as if we're coming from a "normal" perspective.

You might want to see this info, I think it will shed some light on the problem

www.thechronicleproject.org...