2 UFO's filmed over water on News (NEW)

The video is really bad. Why does it always seem to be in UFO videos that the camera person can't keep the camera still. To me it looks like two wind surfers messing around. I just don't see these images as being of a shape of a UFO.

Who's to say that they aren't buoys, floating on top of the water? Due to the lighting, it looks like they are closer, floating above the water. Although this video does look interesting, I'm not so convinced that they aren't buoys. Is there video of either when they showed up or when they left?

Sure, the objects did move quite a bit, lending to the notion that they are floating above the water and not buoys, however at low tide, the slack on the buoys would allow them to much greater play in the currents. Can we get a location of where this was, with the exact time and date for purposes of determining the tide?

Anyway, with what I have seen so far, I'm not convinced that these are anything other than buoys (of some type).



--airspoon

reply to post by airspoon


I was thinking the same thing at first. But if it is something floating on top of the water it is moving against the current and against the wind at a very high speed, and it its moving to constant to be dragged by the wind. If its a bouy it would be made out of hard plastic. It would be quite heavy.

The barge is probably doing 5 - 10 knots inside the shipping lane/harbour. There are speed limits in a shipping lane like this one.

The black object is probably doing 15 - 20 knots. And that is very fast even for a kite surfer. And it is to fast for a object of this size to be dragged by the wind on top of the water. A boat wouldn't drift that fast even if there was a full storm.

reply to post by airspoon


Definitely not buoys - that is something I can agree with with spy66, as they are going too fast. Though I do not agree the tidal direction can be determined anyway, unless we get the exact location. The wind direction (coming from the upper right, offshore) will often give an erroneous appearance on the water surface as to the underlying tidal direction.

For istance, you can get an incoming tide, but an offshore wind, with mild, small wind-generated waves heading out to sea, in the opposite direction of the tide.

The direction of the moving object is going in the right direction in relation to wind direction if it was, as I believe it to be, a kiteboarder. The kites, particularly from a distance, will often give the appearance of hovering depending what the rider is doing - then will take off in a particular direction once he has his tack or intended direction set.

Once the original guy who filmed it turns up with exact location, dates etc..it will be easy to determine how regularly kiteboarders sail in that particular bay.

reply to post by cloudbreak


reply to post by cloudbreak


If there is a strong wind. And with a kite of this size. It has to be around 13 square meters +++ large at least. The kite would be quite high and not as low as the video indicate if the wind is strong.

A kite of this size indicate that there is hardly any wind. The other factor is that the object is quite low, indicating that the surfer has to use his kite where the wind is at its peak. You get more wind in the kite if you have it low and in front of you in the direction you want to go.
If the wind is as poor as i would believe, the surfer must work to keep the kite where the force of the wind generates most power. If so, we should see clear movement in the kite.

If you have been a former wind surfer. You should know when you use a large sail and when you use a storm sail. You use a lager sail if there is poor wind, and you use a smaller sail if there is strong wind. It is the same principles we use for choosing a kite. We choose the kite depending on the force of the wind.

There is no way a kite would get this speed in poor wind.

I dont know how experienced some of you are in determining tides. But i have a lot from serving as a Navy diver in Norway. And i know that the tide is coming in on this location. It is coming in from the right at about 2 O'clock.

Since there is no white splashes on the waves i dont think the wind is coming from the shore, but has the same direction as the tide coming in. This is the only thing i am uncertain about.

reply to post by spy66



G,day spy 66 I do like your posts mate , you keep saying that the objects are too low in the water for them to be kite surfers, and even thou I reckon they are kite surfers this also has me a little puzzled. Have you or anyone else thought about the camera angle, This guy ( camera dude) seems to be a lot higher up then water level,

Do you reckon this could be a factor to eliminate them being so low ?

And for the record white caps start at 15knts, so in my view this wind isn't that strong

Wal

reply to post by spy66


Yep I know all about sail-size to wind strength ratio.

I’m not being argumentative, and I’m not sure if maybe it’s because English might be your second language – no offense meant – but you seem to be getting some things 180 degrees back to front, when I don’t think you actually mean to.

You say if there is a strong wind, the kite has to be around 13 sqm at least, but then next para say a kite of this size indicates there is hardly any wind. At 15-18 knot gusts of wind, kite could easily be smaller than this size anyway and he may want a shorter line too, for more control.

I do not believe there is no or very low wind because if you look at the looped video (please look again) it clearly seems the wind is offshore, coming from right to left/upper right to lower left. That means, there is little time for wind waves and whitecaps to be generated as the land structures are also upper right, dead ahead and to the right. Yet you can still see clearly delineated wind wave lines of minor proportions. You can get 40-45 knot offshore winds, and as far as 30 metres off shore the water can still be flat as. I know, as I’ve seen it many times.
If you were to travel 1 or 2 km down to the left/ lower left though (offscreen on the video), and look back towards the kiteboarders, you may see some form of white caps, as the minor surface wave formations begin to get a bit larger.

The wind is ‘offshore’ as it is coming away from the land.

But what confuses me – again – I am just trying to determine what exactly you are saying as it seems to be opposite of what you are intending to say:

Originally posted by spy66
.

Since there is no white splashes on the waves i dont think the wind is coming from the shore, but has the same direction as the tide coming in. This is the only thing i am uncertain about.

This is exactly why there would be no whitecaps though, because the wind is coming from the shore. This is what offshore wind means. What makes you think the tide is moving right to left? To the right/upper right, and ahead, is where the land is.

Are you assuming the land is to the left/lower left, and it is open sea out to the right? That is the only thing I can think of, whereas I am certain it is the other way around looking at the video.

Either way it’s still nigh on impossible to determine tidal direction with 100% conviction just looking at the surface of the water. You should know this, as wind indentations on the sea surface can be, and often will, show a different direction to the underlying current.

The wind could easily be up to 18knots, and given the distance away from the zoomed in camera, of course the sail is going to appear lower to the water.

Anyway, I don’t want to argue about this and maybe there is a lack of communications somewhere involved (on my part, not yours), but would like to get the exact location and date, we can then look at charts get windspeed/direction/tidal movements – and more importantly, get in touch with someone who knows how often kiteboarders sail there.

Excuse my long-winded posts.

Originally posted by Wolfenz
what in the heck is this video Blurry I know degrading quality would be the cause of Youtube
but the Guy that Videoed this is Using a High Definition Cam (HDD) !!!!!
well the one he is using in the interview as i assume it the same one he Used while filming ! Right ?

is this the cam or similar to it ?
www.informationengineer.org...
maybe it just me ...

Close but not quite. You can see the rear view of the camera at 3:14, and the screen has a semicirlce on the outermost edge, as opposed to the flat one you linked to. It is a 3ccd camera, as seen above the screen, and also taking into account the writing seen on the front of the screen, I'm almost certain it is this model. Take a look at the pics if you want to check, or search for more of the same model.JVC Everio GZ-MG505EK 3-CCD Hard Disk Camcorder + 5MP [30GB Hard Disk, 2.7" LCD screen]

# Sensor resolution: 1.33 Megapixels
# Optical zoom: 10x
# Digital zoom: 800x
# Optical sensor: 3CCD
# Optical sensor size: 1/4.5"
# LCD Screen size: 2.7 inch
# Maximum stills resolution: 2560 x 1920
# Shooting modes: Auto, Low Light, Sports

So this model has 10x optical zoom, with 800x digital zoom. By the looks of the video, I would guess that the zoom has gone well into the digital zoom. This means that the zoom merely crops the zoomed out image, without actually picking up any extra detail. This is why I believe the surfer is not easily distinguishable, while any whitewash would be too small to be picked up by the digital zoom. I do believe you can see glimpses of the surfer, such as in the screenshots that AlienCarnage posted.

Originally posted by airspoon
Who's to say that they aren't buoys, floating on top of the water? Due to the lighting, it looks like they are closer, floating above the water. Although this video does look interesting, I'm not so convinced that they aren't buoys. Is there video of either when they showed up or when they left?

I'd be happy to say that I am certain the moving object is not a buoy. My reason for stating this is the movement of the 'object' in the vertical direction. To me it appears just like a kite would, changing it's attitude to the wind, and rising and falling with these motions. I've taken some screenshots to show what I mean.

This first shot is taken at 4:33. The stationary object is to the left, while the moving object is right at the tip of the point.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b007d7681948.jpg[/atsimg]

Here at 4:34, the 'object' has dipped considerably in relation to the point in the background. It almost appears as though it is angled down.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2d84ce2ae96e.jpg[/atsimg]
Now at 4:36, it appears to me the 'object' is now angled upwards towards the right. Notice it's position.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/012ea39f4f90.jpg[/atsimg]
And at 4:38, the 'object' is back at the level of the point behind, although it has moved a considerable distance to the right.[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/112fa01ca518.jpg[/atsimg]

I could post the shot from 4:39, but I don't think it's necessary. But one more screenshot I want to show is from 4:45. It is when the video zooms out compared to it's zoom in during the rest of the video. I have highlighted the two objects in question.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/1297f9a5c9e2.jpg[/atsimg]
Notice how tiny those objects are, especially the moving object. And this may not even by completely zoomed out. Some people seem to expect that a kitesurfer controlling a kite would be easily recognizable from this distance. The majority of zoom on this camera is digital zoom, which is really just cropping the zoomed out images to make the pixels appear larger, often with interpolation adding in pixels to fill in the gaps. This is why I beleive it would be near impossible to see a kitesurfer in the zoomed in footage (although the screenshots AlienCarnage posted could indeed be showing a blurry kitesurfer.

I hopes that helps some people understand why I currently believe that the moving object is a kite, and the stationary object, well anything stationary really, possibly even a rock. Anything darker than the water is going to appear as just a bunch of dark pixels in these light conditions and quality. So assuming they must be the same type of object would not be a very sound judgement, especially when they clearly show different movement characteristics.

reply to post by Curious and Concerned


Curious and Concerned.....

I agree with you.....

As per my earlier post, I think the objects are kites.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned
Since when do people schedule kitesurfing?

The only time I could think of scheduled kitesurfing would be for lessons, but by the looks of it, this guy certainly aint an ameteur. And by the looks of the light (dusk?), I highly doubt there would be anything "scheduled".

On the whole, I don't believe it would be scheduled on the whole, but I can also imagine a scenario, where people in speedboats or waterskis might not be advised by the owners of the lake (be they public or private) to share the lake at the same time as kitesurfers for safety reasons in case of collisions and accidents, and so an agreement is reached, so one night at a certain time it's used by speedboats, next night kitesurfers, in so on.

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned
I agree with Griffo and Regensturm (and Silver Star) regarding the attitude of reporters regarding UFO's. But where do you see them "circling"? If you go to the first video, and slide the 'slider' back and forth from 4:10 to 4:45, you can see one of the objects appear almost stationary the entire time, while the other is moving constantly from left to right, with a few dipping and rising motions. This is why I still believe one is a stationary object, possibly a boat, and the other is a kitesurfer travelling from left to right. I'm just not seeing any suspicious or abnormal movements other than the jittery filming.

It looked to me like there was circling, but perhaps that was an opticial perception created by the shaky camera.

The poor light does not help matters when it comes to identification either.

Originally posted by Silver Star
Yes. Sometimes it seems there is an intellectual conspiracy to laugh these subjects out of the headlines.

Indeed.

Originally posted by Silver Star
I know it shouldn't, but it makes me embarrassed to discuss these topics with people. The MSM have made a good job of ridiculing any train of thought that doesn't fit into the accepted view of things. Thank God for places like ATS, that allow me to air my 'loony' ideas.

I know what you mean. I have experienced strange events and occurances that could be deemed paranormal or witnessing UFO's, and whilst there will be elements who would laugh at this, it is surprising, encouraging, and reassuring to often find the people you converse with who you have never discussed the subject of 'the unknown' before have also encountered what they believe to be the paranormal or at the very least "something odd".

I agree with you about ATS, hear, hear! And thank goodness for people like Yig, who post such interesting threads and videos!

Your ideas are far from 'loony' I'm sure. Be encouraged that discussing the possible paranormal and etc is not strange, but merely someone who is trying to get to the bottom of the truth of things mysterious.

Good luck in your endeavours, and remember that the important thing is to never stop questioning!

By the way, I like your avatar. That I believe is one of the first warning dishes, used in the Cold War in the UK when someone would sit in a room below that dish with a stereoscope connect to a contraption in the dish to listen for any Soviet bombers.

Originally posted by spy66
I dont know how experienced some of you are in determining tides. But i have a lot from serving as a Navy diver in Norway. And i know that the tide is coming in on this location. It is coming in from the right at about 2 O'clock.

I've had my fair share. I've spent hours upon hours, watching the ocean, waiting for the right swell/wind/tide changes to produce favourable surfing conditions, or just because I get a sense of calmness and relaxation staring at the ocean. Since your apparantly in the Navy, I find it quite astounding that you would post this...

To me it seams like there is a lot of unstable wind moving from right to left. Because it does seam like the shadows come and go around the object that is moving to the right.

You claim the wind (or the tide :puz is causing the shadows to move from right to left, yet seem to completely neglect the movement of the ship!? The ship is clearly moving in the same direction as the barge, probably at a faster velocity. See these images to see how you can tell this.

This is at 4:21[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/73963b279f80.jpg[/atsimg]
Notice the position of the light on the hill in relation to the closer point. Now look how far the point has moved compared to the same light 8 seconds later at 4:29.[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/06819dcd04c9.jpg[/atsimg]
If you take the movement of the ship into account, it seems more likely to me that the wind is coming more straight on to the camera, in an offshore direction. This would indicate that the kitesurfer is travelling crosswind, with the kite angled towards the camera. This would also mean that there would be only very small ripples closer to the shoreline where the kitesurfer is, meaning there would be little chop to cause excess white water. But as I've shown, even if he was creating lots of white water, it would be pretty hard to make out from that distance, especially without any sun to reflect the white water.

Originally posted by Regensturm

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned
Since when do people schedule kitesurfing?

The only time I could think of scheduled kitesurfing would be for lessons, but by the looks of it, this guy certainly aint an ameteur. And by the looks of the light (dusk?), I highly doubt there would be anything "scheduled".

On the whole, I don't believe it would be scheduled on the whole, but I can also imagine a scenario, where people in speedboats or waterskis might not be advised by the owners of the lake (be they public or private) to share the lake at the same time as kitesurfers for safety reasons in case of collisions and accidents, and so an agreement is reached, so one night at a certain time it's used by speedboats, next night kitesurfers, in so on.

This footage was filmed from the deck of the Pacific Jewel, a cruise ship around Noumea I believe. This is not on a lake, but the ocean. I've been looking at maps to try and figure out the exact location, but there aren't really many landmarks to investigate. I think you'd have trouble trying to tell some of the kitesurfers I know not to go out because their not scheduled But I suppose it could be a plausible scenario, just not in this case in my opinion.

And I can see how the jittery film could make it look like strange movements, the zoom doesn't help his steadiness at all. But if you watch the longer sections of the clip, it certainly appears that one is stationary and one is travelling towards the right.
Cheers

reply to post by Curious and Concerned


Curious and Concerned.....

I've been looking at maps to try and figure out the exact location, but there aren't really many landmarks to investigate.

Did you notice ArMaP's map, seemingly of the correct location?

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not

reply to post by Maybe...maybe not


Hey, yeah it's been his map I've he linked that I've been looking at, cheers. I know it's meant to be around Noumea, but I'm trying to find an exact location. I'm considering the point, that has some kind of civilisation on, as well as the land in the background with more dispersed lights. Also, the view is probably from some kind of shipping lane or channel. I've noticed a few reefs around the area, so it must be steering clear of those. I've also considered the possibility that the stationary object is a rock in the water in line with the point. But so far, no luck

reply to post by Curious and Concerned


Curious and Concerned.....

Here are 2 links (albeit which I have not reviewed in detail) that might provide some info.....

www.bestcruises.com.au...

www.bestcruises.com.au...

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not

Anyone kind enough to provide me a sitrep?

MMN??

*puppy dog eyes*

Originally posted by Chadwickus
Anyone kind enough to provide me a sitrep?

MMN??

*puppy dog eyes*

Well me ol' mate Chadwickus.....

I reckon the objects are 2 kites being used by 2 kite surfers.

There appear to be a few of us who think the same thing.....& a few who don't.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not

reply to post by Maybe...maybe not


No ones nutted the exact location yet?

I saw a link by Armap but the map was only a zoomed out shot of one of the bays near Noumea.

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned

This footage was filmed from the deck of the Pacific Jewel, a cruise ship around Noumea I believe. This is not on a lake, but the ocean. I've been looking at maps to try and figure out the exact location, but there aren't really many landmarks to investigate. I think you'd have trouble trying to tell some of the kitesurfers I know not to go out because their not scheduled

But I suppose it could be a plausible scenario, just not in this case in my opinion.

An Ocean? Oh. @ me. Schedules might be handy and sometimes needed for lakes, which are of course smaller, but not Oceans I should imagine!

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned

And I can see how the jittery film could make it look like strange movements, the zoom doesn't help his steadiness at all. But if you watch the longer sections of the clip, it certainly appears that one is stationary and one is travelling towards the right.
Cheers

Could you show the video to your kitesurfing friends, and ask their opinion of what they think they are seeing? They would have an experienced eye for seeing fellow kitesurfers (if that is what the shapes are) or shapes on water I should imagine.

Originally posted by yigsstarhouse
uggghhh, sometimes it is so frustrating to try and post something maybe decent. So many that have responded on here I truly respect their opinions, (you know who you are), but dangit, it is so frustrating when you have a clip that clearly divides the opinions. I could understand if the general populace all concured it was a flare or lantern or for something new, kite surfer, but when there is strong argument for both sides, ie., something as simple as, oppose too, but if you look at this or that then you might have this or that........ just uggghhhhh... pardon me just having a moment here. I mean just what is it going to take????

Please don't feel disheartened Yig. People are offering their many opinions and analysis, and some of course who contribute will be naysayers or yaysayers, come what may.

It's good that people are offering different opinions, because we can not be sure what it is, except that is unidentified. Perhaps we can get to the bottom of it, Alien or something mundane. It would be cool to find out!

Don't feel demoralised. Your thread has generated lots of interest! It's got everybody talking about what is in the video. It has reached a wider audience then an Australian morning programme on at 6am in the morning.

That's a good thing, right? Yes.

Now, chin up, and turn that frown, upside down!

Originally posted by yigsstarhouse
Again, not saying this is anything other worldly, but I am not convinced it is a kite surfer. They still remain UFOS to me at this moment.

Me too.