Feminism: Destroying the Male and Female Relationship

reply to post by DavidLV


I agree that men and women generally have a certain selection of traits that can be defined along gender lines ( in fact, I think I've got into hot water from some of ATS' resident feminazis for pointing out this fact ! ).

However, the idea that women should behave in a feminine way and that men should behave in a masculine way, is still, for the most part, a philosophical view.

While I believe in this idea, I don't think that society should force men and women to behave in a certain way.

If a man likes to dress up in women's clothes or work as a beautician, or if a woman wants to fight on the frontline in the army, then society shouldn't negatively judge these people or their choices, because of outdated gender stereotypes and societal roles.

We should have full social equality across the board.


Equality doesn't have stipulations or conditions; and that's where the problem lies nowadays...

Women, cheered on by the feminist harpies ( or should that be ''shrieked on'' LOL ), are now legally receiving preferential and biased treatment in many aspects of society. This is a complete contradiction of the ''equality'' that the feminazis claim to support.


For example, some fire services alter their physical tests according to the gender of the applicant, so a female firefighter has to carry a weight that is less than a male firefighter has to.

This is clear discrimination, and it flies in the face of equality and meritocracy ( not to mention public safety ).
You'll never hear any complaints from the obnoxious feminists about physical tests such as these, which are weighted ( no pun intended ) in favour of women.


There are also incessant cries for equal pay for sportswomen. Women's sport is a fourth-rate version of men's sport, and they don't deserve to earn as much as the men, because they aren't nearly as good.

The women's 100m Gold Medalist at the 2008 Olympics won in 10.78 seconds; she wouldn't have got anywhere near qualifying from the heats of the men's event, yet alone got near the medals.
In fact, I have ran the 100 metres not too much slower than that, and I'm not nearly good enough to progress beyond the realms of amateur track and field athletics !


Imagine organising a version of the NBA, but only for men who are 5' 10'', and then demanding that the players in this league should earn as much as the top NBA stars ! Or holding a high-jump competition for Congolese pygmies, and awarding them the same prize money as the winner of the top high-jump competitions.

The above scenarios may sound absurd, but they are equally as justifiable as paying women equal prize money in sport.

After all, a good sub 5 foot 10 basketball player, a good pygmy high-jumper, and a good female tennis player ( they do actually exist ! ) are all equally disadvantaged by their genetics to reach the top of their sport...
So, why should women get preferential treatment in this regard, in terms of prize money ?

Originally posted by maria_stardust
On the contrary, Intrepid.

Without this movement do you think domestic violence shelters for women and their children would exist? Or that court systems would demand that men support the children they father? Or that women would be able to earn a livable wage to help support their families?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. Unless things are that much different in the States.

Originally posted by intrepid
reply to post by Serenity08

 

I'm sorry Serenity but that made sense 2-3 decades ago. We've come a long way in that time. Now it looks whiny. Men DID have to make moves for women's equality and we did. That may sound harsh to someone that went through those times but it's time to get past the past.

Edit: See Flighty's post to see how far we have come.

edit on 2-1-2011 by intrepid because: (no reason given)

Intrepid,

I'm sorry that you cannot see that I was dealing with how we have gotten here. How feminism came about, and the course it took. I did not call men selfish and greedy, I called people selfish and greedy. As for making moves to correct it, I would say in many cases yes, but unless you have really experienced professional bias just because of your sex, I doubt you can understand why many women today would never want to go back to where we were before in regards to being a stay at home mother and wife. I seriously doubt men are going to agree to pay for a woman's maintenance for the rest of her life should he want a divorce.

Many of the issues were economic ones, even birth control. Not every man makes a lot of money, so even if he does pay her alimony for wanting out of the marriage for the next newest better Mrs. X, it won't help her much. Women work and are out of the home for survival reasons. Who is going to guarantee her a retirement? Who is going to promise her life maintenance if she stays home during her most productive years to raise the family? Too many women have taken that sacrifice only to find she is able to get low wage jobs when she has to enter the work force to survive and often take care of her children when her successful husband decides he wants out.

Think what you want, but there are a lot of reasons why women are afraid. There are no guarantees in life, and too many have seen the negative side of putting family first and not having a career. The sad truth is, our society places no value on the cost of that child growing up with two working parents who both want careers. Is there a solution? There must be, but just telling women to stay home, raise the children, and take care of your husband with no security will not work. Who is going to pay for that? We are in a pickle.

reply to post by intrepid


Sorry to break this to you, but without the feminist movement the very things I mentioned would be a very watered down version of what's in place today.

The ills of that face relationships in this day and age cannot be placed at the feet of movement designed to help women navigate what is essentially a male-dominated world. Could it be that men fear what they cannot fully control?

Originally posted by maria_stardust
Could it be that men fear what they cannot fully control?

I'm sorry Maria, I totally disagree. Do women still get discriminated against? Sure, there's morons in the world but as has been pointed out by you and others, we have ALL made the right moves. It's time to reel it in.

reply to post by intrepid


What would you like to see women do differently Intrepid? What changes should women make, and how do you perceive that change being attractive to women? Remember, a lot of the issues are economic. How do you propose to make changes that would be great for the family, women, and men while at the same time offering some kind of security for all?

I look forward to your and others ideas.

Originally posted by intrepid
I'm sorry Maria, I totally disagree. Do women still get discriminated against? Sure, there's morons in the world but as has been pointed out by you and others, we have ALL made the right moves. It's time to reel it in.

Why is there a need to "reel it in" as you eloquently put it? Exactly what purpose would that serve?

Bringing an end to the feminist movement won't magically make relationships work out in the end. The premise of this thread is severely flawed with feminism serving as an all to handy scapegoat.

reply to post by Serenity08


Well put. Let us get rid of the glass ceiling let their be true equal opportunity regarding women joining the upper eschelons of public and private sector management. Let us also have full and non- discriminatory equality in terms of pay. We seem to have made great strides in dealing with domestic violence. I believe the economic issues are the most important.

reply to post by maria_stardust


All of your claims are invalid, and have no truth to them whatsoever.

I really hate to tell you this, but there are no woman's shelters, anymore then there are men's shelters. Another words, the problem that you believe existed didn't really exist at all, it was simply the brainwashing by the media of the masses, to bring about the change they wanted to bring about.

Women aren't being beat up by men, this is similar to terrorism, there are no terrorists, there are no women being beat up by men, there is no Iraq war, there is no voting taking place, there is no president running the country, can you take a step out of the Matrix for a minute and try to wake up from the dream of reality you're having?

The media tells people what to think, how to think, what to focus on, what issue will be discussed, you are being manipulated on a grand scale......

The time has come to wake up from this nightmare of reality, and realize what the real truth is.....

Men used to love woman, and buy them roses, and court them, and make them laugh, and try their best to romance them, and give them what they want so that they could win the girls heart, and have themselves a wife to cherish and protect, and take care of.......

Just the exact opposite of what the enemy has filled your mind with......

And you believed the enemy because you didn't realize it was possible for the people on TV to lie to you, and for the newspaper to lie, and for the radio to lie, you didn't realize things were being controlled on a level which you can not see, or touch, or smell, a level outside of your own awareness, who were and are pulling all the strings, and have you brainwashed in the process to believe everything as the exact opposite of the truth....

David

reply to post by DavidLV


So I guess the many, many times I've worked the lines of domestic abuse hotlines, or helped secure a physically battered woman and her children safe shelter, or screened calls from abusive men searching for their wives and girlfriends have all been figments of my imagination.

How quaint.

Originally posted by maria_stardust
Why is there a need to "reel it in" as you eloquently put it? Exactly what purpose would that serve?

Well that in itself would be acknowledgment that men(as a sex) aren't the problem anymore. Why change further what's already working? If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

The premise of this thread is severely flawed with feminism serving as an all to handy scapegoat.

Agreed, that's my point in a shell. That "battle" was fought and won. Great. Works for me. NOW, relax.

Originally posted by intrepid
Well that in itself would be acknowledgment that men(as a sex) aren't the problem anymore. Why change further what's already working? If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

The problem is it's still broken.

Agreed, that's my point in a shell. That "battle" was fought and won. Great. Works for me. NOW, relax.

The battle is still ongoing.

reply to post by Sherlock Holmes


If the enemy didn't first make women out to be helpless victims that screamed at everything, and were treated like objects by men, and if they then didn't change their tactic and then do the reverse and make woman the hero's and men the idiots, then we wouldn't be here.

But we are here, and the enemy is the one causing all of this, he first pitted woman against men, now he's is pitting men against women, with women ending up as the perceived winners, when in reality woman are miserable and so are the men.....

If you let little girls decide which toy they want it's going to be the dolly, and if you let which toy's the boys want to play with it's going to be the race car, girls and boys are different, always have been, what you wouldn't want to happen is for the enemy to portray them in the exact opposite way of the truth. Which is what has been happening since the 60's.........

David

Originally posted by intrepid

Agreed, that's my point in a shell. That "battle" was fought and won. Great. Works for me. NOW, relax.

Wouldn't it be fair to say, that if this and many other threads like it are anything to go by, that 'battle' isn't over?

reply to post by maria_stardust


What they have been is a direct result from the Feminist agenda, and these woman then went out and got a divorce and then shagged up with some other guy and went from guy to guy living a life in the dump, doing drugs, raising messed up kids, all so they could be free from the bad men.....

Listen I've been all over this country, seen a lot of things, and it's the woman who are the ones starting the fights in the first place....

Why must the feminist agenda be the scapegoat for all of the relations ills? Is it because a certain kind of man cannot accept that males contribute to relationship problems? How can any gender be absolutely wrong?

Originally posted by maria_stardust
The battle is still ongoing.

That's the problem. No, it isn't but the situation can be inflamed with that attitude. Why alienate those that are on your side?

Wow. For the love of Christ.

I get called an Elitist for working in the Sciences? When I am the grunt who makes your crap? Yeah, I'm elite all right. And do you not recognize any levity? I was going to direct this to Intrepid but I'll direct it to all considering the further posts -

LIGHTEN UP! People.

And we do need to relax, not only to recognize some humor, but also so that our minds might be able to consider other points of view.

FFS

Does anyone actually realise that feminism is only say fifty years old? So tell me this - prior to the onset of feminism were male/female relationships idyllic as women swanned around and cooked and cleaned in their Playtex 18 hour girdles?

Originally posted by tiger5
Does anyone actually realise that feminism is only say fifty years old? So tell me this - prior to the onset of feminism were male/female relationships idyllic as women swanned around and cooked and cleaned in their Playtex 18 hour girdles?

OR should those under 50 that saw that crap and disagreed with it, supported womens rights, be hammered for the sins of the past?