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Originally posted by Maslo
I fully support what France is doing. These people are not in Shengen zone, therefore they are illegal imigrants after 90 days, and they do not own the land which they settle, which is also illegal. By law, they should be deported.
How can you support this act of racial persecution ?
I just hope these deported Roma come back to France in six months time.
Originally posted by Maslo
How is this racial? They are deporting people who broke the law, even twice (illegal immigrants and illegal settlers). Of course that they will firstly prioritize locations where concentrations of those people are the largest.
Originally posted by Maslo
I hope they would settle in the neighbourhoods of those EU byrocrats, so they finally acknowledge that there is a problem with these asocials (regardless of their race), and finally start doing something about it, not just pseudohumanistically closing their eyes and blaming their behaviour on their culture.
It's racial, because the French government were largely reacting to knee-jerk concerns from some of their less intelligent citizens.
They wanted to look tough, by clamping down on these Gypsies ( who are just looking for a better life ), so they acted by deporting them.
Clearly, according to this leaked memo, they are specifically targeting Roma, and the instructions are coming from the highest level:
No, I hope these Romanian and Bulgarian Roma come back to exactly the same camp sites in six months time, and stick their fingers up to the French authorities !
Integration is going to happen, and there are over a couple of million Roma in Romania and Bulgaria that will be coming to a city near you, come 2011.
Originally posted by Maslo
Even if it was true, and majority of concerns wanting to correct this illegal situation came from local fascists (I suppose that is what you mean), how does it matter? If someone who is a fascist (alleged, not convicted!!) reports a crime (lets say a robbery), it should he be ignored? Dont blame the messenger.
Originally posted by Maslo
It does not matter what are they motives to break the law. Bank robbers are also "just looking for a better life". Does it make their crimes legal and justified?
Originally posted by Maslo
Yes, because Roma camps are the largest, therefore they are the priority. I dont see anything wrong with that. If someone steals 1 000 000 euros, and someone steals 100 euros, what crime would you prioritize, given that you have limited resources?
Originally posted by Maslo
They can come to visit. But if they illegaly settle them, they would be deported again
Originally posted by Maslo
Again, they can visit us, I dont have any problem with that. But if they break the settlement laws (or any other local laws), I would personally report them and they will be prosecuted. After March 2011 they could not be legally deported, but breaking property rights is neverthless a punishable crime. If they come earlier, they would be deported
Let's not act coy about this. France has a number of illegal immigrants, estimated to be in the hundreds of thousands, so why act on these few Romany people ?
It is apparent to me, that it was just a show of strength by the French authorities, to placate the prejudiced underbelly of French society, who, no doubt, were trying to blame their own shortcomings on someone else, in the form of Eastern European Gypsies.
LOL. You are using the same erroneous argument as the people justifying the Arizona immigration bill. Clearly, bank robbery is a serious crime, because it affects individual people, rather than just the multi-million pound bank group that they are robbing. Illegal immigration is completely nonsynonymous with genuine law-breaking that harms others.
Can you honestly say, that if you lived in third-world conditions, that you wouldn't go somewhere else to seek a better life ? Come on man, where's your humanity ?
Why do these camps have to be identified by the ethnicity of their inhabitants ? This is the fundamental problem, here.
If the French authorities were indiscriminately rounding up Romanians and Bulgarians from all around the country, then I could understand that, from a practical level.
As for ''personally reporting them'' for breaking settlement laws, then I'd say you're a grass and a NIMBY, if you did that.
Originally posted by Maslo
Considering that the immigrants are abusing their social system and do not provide anything in return (just increased criminality), they are at least partially right.
Originally posted by Maslo
It puts additional strain on social security system and law enforcement, therefore it ultimately afects quality of life of local residents in negative way.
Originally posted by Maslo
I probably would, but maybe not illegally. And if I was really poor, I would probably steal to survive, too. Does this mean we should make stealing legal?
Originally posted by Maslo
Since majority (almost all) of their residents is of one ethnicity, the question is "why not"? Why should they be not reffered to (not exclusively identified) as Roma camps? Because of blind political corectness? They are deporting all of their inhabitants which are there illegaly, regardless of their nationality, and thats important.
Originally posted by Maslo
They are rounding up all illegal immigrants. Its just easier to do with those in camps than those dispersed among the whole population.
Originally posted by Maslo
According to wikipedia, NIMBY means someone who is against some development, which does not suits them, but in all occasions is perfectly legal. If I am against stealing land (thats what illegal settlements are), no matter what development is there or who is doing it, I do not qualify as NIMBY. I am just a lawful citizen.
In what way am I a grass? You mean this ? I am not familiar with this english expression.
Have you got anything to back up the increased criminality claim ?
“delinquency of Romanian origin” in Paris had rocketed by 138 percent in 2009 and by 259 percent in the past eighteen months. “Today, in Paris, the reality is that almost one thief in five is a Romanian” and “one theft in four by minors is committed by a Romanian minor,” Mr Hortefeux said. Mr Hortfeux said that these figures were “not about stigmatising this or that population, but we cannot close our eyes to reality.” As a result, the French government has ordered the dismantling of at least 300 illegal Gypsy camps across France as part of a fight against crime and urban violence. The figures showed that in 2008, some 1,323 Gypsies were charged with criminal offences. This figure leaped to 3,151 in 2009. According to Mr Hortefeux, most of the charges were related to burglary, theft and pick pocketing.
It's pretty obvious to me, they are being targeted to appeal to the lowest common denominator in French society, and make it look like they are being tough on foreigners.
In a very minute way. It's not equatable with criminal activity, such as robbing a bank.
That doesn't make sense. Stealing is a crime with a victim, moving to another country isn't.
Because referring to them by their ethnicity shows the French authorities true colours.
Correction. It's just better publicity for them to have a high-profile crackdown on an ethnic group that many of the French people are prejudiced against.
I could understand you being against it if they were illegally settling on your property, but why would you get involved in something that had nothing to do with you ?
Sorry, I shouldn't have used the term ''grass'', as mos people probably won't know the term; it's a slang for a ''snitch'' or a police informer, or someone who generally tries to get someone else in trouble.