It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Is Yahweh/Jehova the God that Jesus referes to as 'My Father'?

page: 4
1
<< 1  2  3   >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 05:54 PM
link   
reply to post by Romantic_Rebel
 


I think you are confused. Jesus is all thorough the OT.
Many Jews worshipped Jesus, Nicodemus and Paul were Pharisees and they worshipped Jesus, Thomas was a Jew and he worshipped Jesus. All the OT saints who worshipped Jehovah worshipped Jesus. Moses and Elijah were on the Mt. of Transfiguration and Jesus showed himself as Jehovah to them. They were not suprised, they had already seen him in glory.
You don't know who God is, but you are sure of who he is not??
God made man in his own image, how can you say is totally unlike us??
It will be Yam Kippur soon, what will offer as an atonement for your sin?? You have nothing and if you are a Jew, you know that sin can only be covered by blood. God had the temple destroyed because he provided himself a lamb and you have rejected it. Cain did that and suffered, Abraham accepted the lamb and he accepted. Which of these men do you wish to follow??




posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 05:58 PM
link   
reply to post by zachi
 


Slow down. In Judaism God does not appear as a person.

As this article says it leads to idolatry.


G-d is Incorporeal Although many places in scripture and Talmud speak of various parts of G-d's body (the Hand of G-d, G-d's wings, etc.) or speak of G-d in anthropomorphic terms (G-d walking in the garden of Eden, G-d laying tefillin, etc.), Judaism firmly maintains that G-d has no body. Any reference to G-d's body is simply a figure of speech, a means of making G-d's actions more comprehensible to beings living in a material world. Much of Rambam's Guide for the Perplexed is devoted to explaining each of these anthropomorphic references and proving that they should be understood figuratively. We are forbidden to represent G-d in a physical form. That is considered idolatry. The sin of the Golden Calf incident was not that the people chose another deity, but that they tried to represent G-d in a physical form.




G-d is One One of the primary expressions of Jewish faith, recited twice daily in prayer, is the Shema, which begins "Hear, Israel: The L-rd is our G-d, The L-rd is one." This simple statement encompasses several different ideas: 1. There is only one G-d. No other being participated in the work of creation. 2. G-d is a unity. He is a single, whole, complete indivisible entity. He cannot be divided into parts or described by attributes. Any attempt to ascribe attributes to G-d is merely man's imperfect attempt to understand the infinite. 3. G-d is the only being to whom we should offer praise. The Shema can also be translated as "The L-rd is our G-d, The L-rd alone," meaning that no other is our G-d, and we should not pray to any other.

Think about it. Where are the other human sacrifices in Judaism?



There are a number of requirements for a sacrifice to be valid or it is completely disqualified and will be an abomination to G-d. These requirements are as follows: 1. The sin offering must be brought forth by the person seeking atonement, and slaughtered either by the sinner or by the priest. 2. Death must be caused by a sharp, perfect blade cutting across the neck, resulting in blood loss and swift death. 3. The offering must be physically unblemished. 4. In the case of mammal offerings (bulls, lambs, etc.) the offering must be less than one year old. 5. In the case of mammal offerings, the mammal must have cloven hooves and chew cud. 6. The sacrifice must be brought at the Temple 7. The sacrifice must have its blood taken by a priest and sprinkled on the altar. 8. The sacrifice must be salted. Since Jesus did not fulfill even one of the eight precepts listed above, it's clear that his death could not be the atoning sacrifice Christians claim it is.

www.messiahtruth.com...

Tell me what are your thoughts of these claims?



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 10:55 PM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 


I hear you, but Daniel prophesied the exact day the "Anointed One" (Messiah) would enter the city. That day came and passed over 2,000 years ago.



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 11:18 PM
link   
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


assuming I understood your post/s I find this one is pretty sharp as far as when exactly He came/spoke-

In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. 3The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.

and as far as anything relating to the future-

Jesus replied. "But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."

so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 08:45 AM
link   

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by adjensen
 


I hear you, but Daniel prophesied the exact day the "Anointed One" (Messiah) would enter the city. That day came and passed over 2,000 years ago.


Again, prophecy is not presence.

The first Jew who could accept Christ and his gift of salvation came after Christ, not before him. Any Jew, then or today, who does not participate in the New Covenant, is bound under the old law, and finds their reconciliation to God there.

For Romantic_Rebel to become a Jew, for example, as he's stated in another thread he's thinking about, he will need to be circumcised, go through the appropriate rituals, then live in accordance to the full law in Torah and Talmud and hope that, in the absence of sacrifice at the Temple, which is now impossible, this is "close enough" for God.

Until Christ was born, had his ministry, suffered, died and was resurrected, this was the only path to reconciliation to God (in the Abrahamic religion "tree".) Many believe that Christ, during the three days that he was buried, was with those who had already died outside of God and offered salvation to them that had not been available in their lives, which is the New Covenant connection to the PEOPLE of the Old Testament, but not the OT itself.

The destruction of the Temple in 70AD kind of sealed the deal, making Christ's existence a lot more pointed, but the Judaic faith has soldiered on in the absence of that component, and as RR has pointed out (to the point of distraction,) the Jews continue to await the Messiah prophesied in the Old Testament, and await the reconstruction of the Temple in Jerusalem when the Messiah comes.


edit on 14-9-2010 by adjensen because: spelling



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 04:27 AM
link   
Human have many races, different languages and beliefs. For me, Father Elohim "The Seventh Generation God of Heaven" the father of Jesus. Father Elohim i called him Heavenly Father/ Almighty Father.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 07:06 AM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 


*sigh*

"You search the Scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is these that bear witness of Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me, that you may have life." ~ John 5:39-40



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 07:24 AM
link   
I also like Psalm 2.

It speaks of the Lord, His "Anointed One", and that He is His Son. (capital S)



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 08:38 AM
link   
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I don't know why you're still arguing this. We both agree that Christ existed in the time of the Old Testament, we both agree that he is prophesied in the Old Testament, but I don't get how you think he is completely and accurately portrayed there.

Again, do you believe that a Jew, in 50BC, could read what we now call the Old Testament and be able to discern the nature of Christ, accept the salvation that had not yet occurred, and be saved? Recall Jesus' aggravation at the Apostles, who were physically with him, and still didn't understand him.

Until it all happened, and the power of the Holy Spirit brought understanding, no Jew could comprehend that Jesus wasn't here to improve our standing in the world (which is what the Jewish Messiah is supposed to do) but was here to improve our standing with God. We can now go back to the OT, read the messianic passages, slap our foreheads and say "of course!" but I think it impossible that the Jew of 50BC could even contemplate the direction that things went.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 10:01 AM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 


Apparently it could be done.

Jesus was admonishing them for NOT doing so.

The entire OT speaks of Jesus, and not reading them all and connecting them to Jesus is a major problem in ones walk with Him.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:44 AM
link   

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
reply to post by Blue_Jay33
 


One way to clear this up is this verse here:
www.simpletoremember.com...
The Catholic idea of Trinity breaks God into three separate beings: The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost (Matthew 28:19).


No, it doesn't. This is specifically addressed by the Doctrine of the Trinity, expressed by Augustine as a seven part statement.

1) The Father is God
2) The Son is God
3) The Holy Spirit is God
4) The Father is not the Son
5) The Son is not the Holy Spirit
6) The Holy Spirit is not the Father
7) There is one God

This is not a simple doctrine to understand, but you can start with the overview at Wikipedia. Doctrine of the Trinity


Sorry but I to me this sounds like a very clever attempt to promote Polytheism under the guise of Monotheism. As I understand things, before Rome hijacked the original Christianity the Romans were a Polytheistic people and to make the new national religion more appealing to the Polytheists alot of the old Pagan traditions and stories were incorporated into the writting of the new bible. Countless Popes have invented new Saints and Ladies and Millipns world wide worship Mother Mary. Does this not go against the 10 commandments where is states - Worship NO GOD but ME.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 12:29 PM
link   

Originally posted by WENEEDAREVOLUTION

Originally posted by adjensen
This is not a simple doctrine to understand, but you can start with the overview at Wikipedia. Doctrine of the Trinity


Sorry but I to me this sounds like a very clever attempt to promote Polytheism under the guise of Monotheism. As I understand things, before Rome hijacked the original Christianity the Romans were a Polytheistic people and to make the new national religion more appealing to the Polytheists alot of the old Pagan traditions and stories were incorporated into the writting of the new bible. Countless Popes have invented new Saints and Ladies and Millipns world wide worship Mother Mary. Does this not go against the 10 commandments where is states - Worship NO GOD but ME.


Call it what you like, but the Doctrine of the Trinity has been a fundamental part of Christian Theology since the earliest times. Christ specifically does and says things in the New Testament that show he wasn't just "some guy", but that he really was God. It's referred to often as the "mystery of the Trinity", because it really is tough to wrap your head around, but you can if you work at it.

And you understand incorrectly, Rome did not "hijack" the original Christianity -- they had a fine system of their own going, they didn't really need to jump on the Jewish sect bandwagon. The Bible existed, in part (the "Old Testament",) for 1500 years or so before Christ, and the rest preceded Constantine's conversion by several hundred years, as well (Dan Brown books not withstanding :-)

Unless you believe that the Romans had discovered time travel and limited its use to going back to rewrite obscure (at the time) religious texts, your belief is wrong.

To finish up the corrections -- the Popes do not "invent" Saints, Saints are recognized as such through a specific process, and no one worships Mary, many Catholics pray to Mary (and to various Saints) through something called "Intercessory Prayer", which is basically asking her to pray for you, because she's currently closer to God than you are (her being in Heaven and all.)

The "Hail Mary" that you're always hearing about (outside of football games, of course) is:

Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee. Blessed art though among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our deaths. Amen.

No worship going on there. (As I am not a Catholic, I might have messed that up, recalling from memory. Apologies if I did.)



posted on Sep, 25 2010 @ 03:07 AM
link   
reply to post by Khaaaaaan!!
 


I think it pains me each time I read responses from people that are really looking for answers, but the material is really hidden from us. I've been pounding this site
www.thechronicleproject.org...
in response to a lot of questions on the blogs, because finally you can ask...
what does Yahweh mean, and find the real answer.
It means ruler of all and Elohim, is plural and means supreme ones. Put the two together and you have the name usually translated Lord God.
Hope that helps



posted on Sep, 25 2010 @ 03:11 AM
link   
reply to post by getreadyalready
 


Jesus taught by his own words that in the end of days, all shall be brought, and those who were kind to God's kids, entered into their rest. Those who were not, were sent away.
How come no one ever quotes this. Note Jesus said nothing about through him only, but by good acts
I quote: I a man gives a prophet a glass of water because he is a prophet, I tell you this, that he shall have a prophets reward.
Read what's there.
Why do you call him Lord and do not follow his commandments?



new topics

top topics



 
1
<< 1  2  3   >>

log in

join