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Whats with people being called anti-semitic for asking questions?

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posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 06:21 PM
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I am just writing this as a reminder that there are boundaries that are crossed now and again on ATS. Either one accused of being an anti-Semite, or accusing a topic being anti-Semitic in its context. Do not get me wrong, I am trying to find out why people are immediately accused of an-Semitism when it comes to questioning Israel’s foreign policy. But why does anti-Semitism constantly pop up on these boards when talking about Israel? Why are some people sensitive to relatively anything regarding this country? Why does anything negative about Israel’s policies wind up being anti-Semitic? I had to think about these questions, and observations.

First, I went over the definition of anti-semitism.
Definition according to Wikipedia:


Anti-Semitism (also spelled anti-Semitism or anti-Semitism) is prejudice against or hostility towards Jews, often rooted in hatred of their ethnic background, culture, and/or religion. In its extreme form, it "attributes to the Jews an exceptional position among all other civilizations, defames them as an inferior group and denies their being part of the nation[s]" in which they reside. A person who practices anti-Semitism is called an "anti-Semite."
en.wikipedia.org...

Web definition:


relating to or characterized by anti-Semitism; hating Jews.
www.google.com...:anti+semitic&sa=X&ei=DN-HTN6LKMH7lweFtKz0Dg&sqi=2&ved=0CBYQkAE

Free dictionary definition


One who discriminates against or who is hostile toward or prejudiced against Jews.
www.thefreedictionary.com...

When I take a step back, and read the basic definition, it becomes apparent that it’s the hatred, and hostility against Jews that make someone an anti-Semite. So, wait a minute, its hatred and hostility that make someone an anti-Semite. So basically all it means is that you hate Jews, period. Constant hatred and hostility towards them. Am I right so far? But this is where I have a few questions.

Why does questioning a countries foreign/domestic policy get you labeled as an anti-Semite when there is no hatred, or hostility towards them?

Why do threads get derailed so easily because of the conspiracy behind Israel when it’s just asking questions and not threatening, or hating the whole Jewish race?

But all aside, these are just questions to help me (and probably others) onto why these clashes happen on the boards and a reminder that questioning one aspect of a conspiracy relating to Israel Does not mean your anti-Semitic.

It means you’re just asking questions… the label should not apply. No one deserves to be treated like a racist, unless their proof to it along the lines of the definition i presented.

On a ha-ha ending note: this thread may be seen as anti-Semitic… *sigh*

If anyone else has more insight into this, please contribute.

Thanks!


edit on 9/8/2010 by ugie1028 because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 06:36 PM
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So overall what i am trying to get from this thread is the reason why its so easy to be an anti-semite for questioning Israel's government?

thats what im asking, i am not asking why we should hate anyone or anything, or the reason why there is hatred, just the reason why it is so easy to be labeled as a racism for questioning one countries political stance.

/discuss... or try too! no one here wants to spread hate. If they do, then well the mods/admins will deal with them. I just want a reasonable debate on why questioning Israel's policy is anti-Semitic.



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 06:48 PM
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Calling someone anti-semetic is their way of avoiding having to come up with a coherant argument to refute their oponent's facts.

It's kinda like taking your ball and storming off the field so nobody else can play the game.


It worked wonders for them in the past but, its starting to lose its potency.



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 06:49 PM
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reply to post by FortAnthem
 


It may have lost its potency due to the membership waking up to the duality of asking questions and pure hatred, but why do some people still do it?

is it an agenda?

Is it pure ignorance?

is it it just pure loyalty to a Point of View of a random poster?



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 06:54 PM
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reply to post by ugie1028
 


Its a reflex action; any time they hear something bad about Isreal, they automatically shout "you're anti-semitic!"

After that they feel they don't have to listen to anything you say because your just a bad person who hates jews.

Its their way of not having to deal with having their pre-set views challenged with real facts.



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 07:00 PM
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reply to post by FortAnthem
 


So basically what your saying is that any form of anti-Israel comments are immediately labeled as anti-Semitic?

Thing is, according to the definition you have to have hatred for Jews, and want to wish bad things to happen to them! but how does questioning an Israeli policy become anti-Semitic? How does a question automatically become words of hate?

If any of you out there who support Israel 100% and know what im looking for, please reply, or U2U me. I would like to know how questioning a countries policy leads to the questioner being labeled as anti-Semitic.

Thanks!



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 07:00 PM
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Double post *odd* please continue below!



edit on 9/8/2010 by ugie1028 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 07:04 PM
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"It may have lost its potency due to the membership waking up to the duality of asking questions and pure hatred, but why do some people still do it?"

Some do it because they do not have the skills, nor the capacity to debate issues in a mature and professional manner. Others do it because they do not want you barking up certain trees, fearing that you may find something that they do not want you to find. And still others do it because they have been brainwashed to truly believe the crap they dish out on a consistent basis.

In any event, there are much worse and tragic things in life than being falsely labeled an anti-semite by some ignorant uneducated lowlife who can't even spell his name correctly. If I were you, I wouldn't lose too much sleep over it.



edit on 8-9-2010 by SphinxMontreal because: (no reason given)




edit on 8-9-2010 by SphinxMontreal because: spelling



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 09:27 PM
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reply to post by SphinxMontreal
 


it isnt that, its either

A.) the person who is replying doesn't fully understand what is being explained...

Or

B.) Purposely derailing the thread because it is Anti Israel.... Which isn't anti-Semitic.... Its just anti-Israel.



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 09:53 PM
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It's the same as when someone questions Obama's policies. People label them as racist even though they may never say anything about Obama himself.

Some people claim that questioning Israel is, in itself, Antisemitic. They may believe that Israel is the "kingdom of god" thus no matter what they do, it is correct. So, in their views, questioning Israel is paramount to questioning the word of god.

Others have been convinced that Muslims are evil, thus Israel has the right to retaliate against them in whatever manner they choose.

For others, it may just be a misunderstanding of what Antisemitism is. They may truly believe that questioning anything that the "Jewish state" does is antisemitic.



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 09:56 PM
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why isnt ATS banning people that are accusing people just to change the thread subject?

thats what I dont understand, why let the discussion continue, I mean, not continue with those accusations?

I reported the posts from that guy, and nobody did anything about it

thats a good conspiracy in my opinion, is ATS helping those trolls?



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 10:13 PM
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Originally posted by FortAnthem
Calling someone anti-semetic is their way of avoiding having to come up with a coherant argument to refute their oponent's facts.


I agree.

I hate to say this but it is like Michael Savage says. When they can not argue with logic or intelect, people will scream "hate speech." It derails everything because the usual response is a defensive one. People become so busy trying to defend their character that they forget the original debate.



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 10:41 PM
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reply to post by MikeNice81
 


When they cry hate speech, Shouldn't they explain why it is hate speech? I have seen some posts here where no one claims why its hate speech. Its policy, not a race or religion! But why use the race card?

Just to escape the truth?

Scapegoating?



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 10:54 PM
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reply to post by FortAnthem
 


This is the most simple and comprehensive answer as to WHY they use the "you are anti-semitic" line over and over.

Thank You!


I posted something similar some hours ago, giving the main reason why some people (Spaniards) call themselfs anti-semitic.

Linky


Cheers
Jechu



posted on Sep, 8 2010 @ 10:59 PM
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It's just a deflection tactic meant to derail the thread and take it off topic.

The best thing to do is not react to it.

The people who do that are counting on you wanting to prove your actions aren't anti-semetic. This gives them the upper hand as you are trying to appeal to their reason, but at the same time, you are basically saying it's alright for them to judge you, as you try to establish the standard by which they can judge you.

Here is the standard that they use. If you disagree with anything Israel does, and or you are supportive of Islam in any way, or Palestinians in anyway you are an anti-Semite.

This is their standard, and they aren't going to change that standard because you want to reasonably display to them you aren't anti-semetic.

All that is going to happen is an ongoing argument that is going to emotionally unballance you, frustrate you, diminish the quality of your own posts as a result and take the thread further and further off topic.

Condemning them for it just invites the same argument as trying to appeal to their reason.

Smile, and shrug it off, ignore them, keep the thread on topic, don't worry if their is a group who are starring each other, trying to make it look like it's reasonable to call you an anti-Semite.

The people who level that accusation usually operate in small packs, they are there to bait you, they are there to support one another, to use peer pressure along with emotional domination to try to keep the topic from developing on topic.

See them for what they are, and your best offense and best defense is just to ignore them.



posted on Sep, 9 2010 @ 10:14 AM
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its just amazing that this thread got forgotten too ...

I think it needs attention, at least the mods need to improve their game and start doing something about it, since, in ALL threads, you find accusations of antisemitism



posted on Sep, 9 2010 @ 10:25 AM
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There probably are some anti-Semitic posters on ATS, who hide their dislike of Jews, behind criticism of Israel.

However, we don't know the true intentions behind a poster's comments, so unless they explicit say ''I hate Jews !'', it is illogical to read any ulterior motive into people's comments, especially as most people who are anti-israel, are probably not Anti-Semitic.

It's a bit like the childish cries of ''racism'', that some use to stifle any criticism of Obama. I have no doubt that some criticism of Obama is down to racism, but I imagine more of it is down to his political party, and just the fact that he's POTUS.

Anybody who plays any card like this, without valid reason, is just ignorant.

I also think there's a general blurring and confusion for some people, between Israel, Zionism, Jews as an ethnicity, and Judaism.

To immediately link anti-israel comments, with hostility towards the largest ethnic and religious group in the country, is nonsensical, and akin to claiming that any anti-USA feeling is down to hostility against white Christians !



posted on Sep, 9 2010 @ 10:56 AM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


Not everyone is aware, or are able to dodge that kind of bullet. Yes, ignoring them would be the best bet, but in all honesty, its never ignored. You or I may ignore those comments, but others dont. How can we start education the membership on what is and isn't antisemitism?

You also mention groups... wouldnt that fall under some sort of trolling that is supposed to get you banner or warned on this site? how come we have not seen any acion in regards to these posters purposely derailing threads using the 'Its racist' Excuse?

reply to post by Faiol
 


It didint get forgotten, there are two or three recent threads that touch what i have brought here in this thread.

reply to post by Sherlock Holmes
 


Yes, they use racism as a way to win an argument, or dodge an important subject. Yea they must be ignorant to an extent. either pushing an agenda, or don't understand the situation.



posted on Sep, 9 2010 @ 01:44 PM
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Yeah I do not get it. It is kind of like if you don't believe 100% in the official 9/11 story then you OMG HATE 'MERICA. That is what got me looking into the Holocaust, which the history of the Holocaust has now been blocked off by political correctness.

If you ever mention or ask.
*There were no gas chambers in Auschwitz.
*The statistics of jewish people killed durring the holocaust is based off census information before and after the war. This does not take into account the millions of people who fled germany before and after the holocaust.
* So far only 3 million jews were proven to have died in the camps
*Depending where you get your information 11-17 million people died in the concentration camps. That would make around 1/2 or significantly less than 1/2 (if you use real statistics instead of estimates) of the people killed jewish, making the holocaust not a strict anti-semetic activity (the nazis were equal opportunity mass murderers).
*Ask why holocaust historians only mention the larger percentage of non-jews killed in the death camps as a side note.

These things will get you branded an anti-semite, even though you are not.



posted on Sep, 9 2010 @ 02:33 PM
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reply to post by ugie1028
 





You also mention groups... wouldnt that fall under some sort of trolling that is supposed to get you banner or warned on this site? how come we have not seen any acion in regards to these posters purposely derailing threads using the 'Its racist' Excuse?


Because it's very hard to prove that they are not just like minded posters, especially if they are coordinating their activities through off site email or other forms of communication.

Also because banning them would result in cries of Anti-Semitism being levelled against the site itself.

It's kind of like when you were a kid, and mom or day made you take along your little brother to play with you, when you went to play with friends your own age. A lot of whinning and complaining and sobbing and crying, that you just have to get use too. Unlike when you were a little kid though you can't put them upside down in a trash barrel and load the lid with a bunch of cinder blocks and throw in a garder snake and make them sing God save the Queen to be let out!

The Internet has some real limitations!



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