reply to post by dontreally
Originally posted by dontreally
But what you dont understand is that we are made as microcosm of the world at large. Kabbalah does a very convincing job explaining this.
*Sigh* Okay, maybe you are assuming that I know nothing about the mystical traditions, since my posts may not reflect this very well. So let me
explain, even though I find it to be in vain.
I've read some of Qabalah (for example, Dion Fortune's Mystical Qabalah
), although written Qabalah may not be the same as the traditional
Qabalah, which is said to be a "mouth to ear"-tradition. I know about microcosm/macrocosm -concept pair, which is basically same as alchemical
proverb 'as above, so below'
or the part appearing in Lord's Prayer 'in earth as it is in heaven'.
But I've failed to take these analogies literally. Instead I understand that we, human beings as well as other parts of the great whole, are part of
this by being composed on pretty much same fundamental particles and under same laws of nature (not necessarily our knowledge about the laws of
nature, but the real ones) as everything else. This microcosm/macrocom analogy that is portrayed in mystical texts, is pretty much analogous. It may
not mean that in every being, there's the exact replica of universe.
It is quite impudent to claim that all the enigmas and mysteries of the existence has already been solved by the ancients. Our knowledge about reality
is increasing. As Jung said:
"[T]here is still another form of negative thinking, which at first glance might not be recognized as such, and that is theosophical thinking, which
today is rapidly spreading in all parts of the world, presumably in reaction to the materialism of the recent past. Theosophical thinking has an air
that is not in the least reductive, since it exalts everything to a transcendental and world-embracing idea. A dream, for instance, is no longer just
a dream, but an experience “on another plane.” The hitherto inexplicable fact of telepathy is very simply explained as “vibrations” passing
from one person to another. And ordinary nervous complaint is explained by the fact that something has collided with the “astral body”. Certain
ethnological peculiarities of the dwellers on the Atlantic seaboard are easily accounted for by the submergence of Atlantis, and so on. We have
only to open a theosophical book to be overwhelmed by the realization that everything is already explained, and that “spiritual science” has left
no enigmas unsolved. But, at bottom, this kind of thinking is just as negative as materialistic thinking.
" (CW 6: Psychological types. Page 354,
emphasis by v01i0).
By the way, I've read not just couple of Jung's works, but a few
Anyhow, reading stuff is never enough - in fact it may be harmful. I am proponent of empiricism, and therefore I maintain that is important to
individually emerge on these things head on, experience them first hand. With one's own experiences, we are able to distinguish fact from fiction,
false from true. There are these people (not necessarily implying that you would be such) which have built their ivory towers of theories, yet they
have no clue about practice. These people are just dreamers, fantasising the reality and fooled by their own imaginariums.
Based on experience I still maintain that no spirits whatsoever exists. To me, they are just inconvinient symbols that describe something, but not the
Originally posted by dontreally
For instance, in quantum mechanics, certain numbers which conceptually are akin to certain archetypal processes in the unconscious are connected. This
indicates that the same autonomous process is at work in two different dimensions; one the psyche and the other the physical world.
Of course, the same ultimate rules apply from top to bottom, there's no question about that in my mind. Psyche and physical world are not distinct
even the phenomenas of each may appear somewhat different in our experience. It is as above as below.
Since you recommended more reading for me, I recommend more experimental empiricism for you
I already responded to your challenge, now it is your
turn to run into the field.
Just go summoning spirits and talk to them, ask who they are and so on. Maybe they'll let you know
PS. To embarass myself conveniently, I have to say scio me nihil scire
. We all have our own perceptions, experiences and conceptions of
reality. As Protagoras said, human is the measure of everything. So please do not take this as if I would try to convert you thinking the way I do. I
(think I) know it to be impossible.
[edit on 6-9-2010 by v01i0]