Steven Hawking backs Christian Theology, page 1

In his newest book Steven Hawking suggests that God did not create the Universe.He says that "the universe can and will create itself from nothing," That "Spontaneous creation is the reason why there is something rather than nothing, why the universe exists, why we exist,".

Theologians that study the bible concur.I will try to explain it here.
Science is the study of matter.Which Mr Hawking studies.
In Theology spirit is the subject of study.
What is a spirit? The only way one can determine what a spirit is, is by what it is not.
A spirit has no weight, no color, no smell, no size. no shape, You could say that a spirit is, well nothing. However, to us Christians nothing is something. In the Bible, It says
(John 4:24) "God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

Its amazing how one of the most brilliant minds of science has concurred as to what theologians have been saying for thousands of years.Nothing created the universe -which is God!
source-www.cnn.com...

reply to post by oliveoil

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How can God crate the universe and still nothing created the universe? I think you misinterpreted the article. Stephen Hawking said God was not necessary in creating the universe. Also I don't believe a thing Christianity has to offer. Since Christianity contradicts the Torah.

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel

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The Bible clearly states that God is a spirit. Please let me know if the Christian definition of spirit in the NT is different than that of the Torah and or the OT. How can I misinterpret this. Mr Hawking said the universe can and will create itself from nothing.
Does nothing have any material attributes
Does spirit have any material attributes?
Spirit and nothing are the same,However nothing is not nothing.

Originally posted by oliveoil
reply to post by Romantic_Rebel

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The Bible clearly states that God is a spirit. Please let me know if the Christian definition of spirit in the NT is different than that of the Torah and or the OT. How can I misinterpret this. Mr Hawking said the universe can and will create itself from nothing.
Does nothing have any material attributes
Does spirit have any material attributes?
Spirit and nothing are the same,However nothing is not nothing.

Well there are different sects in the Christian religion. I do have a link to share if you wouldn't mind reading it.
Jews reject Christianity because of all the false information in the NT. Not that I'm knocking you down. Don't shoot the messenger.
judaism.about.com...

reply to post by Hitotsumami

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Thats the point. He is not supporting God. Through his revelation he has come to this conclusion.However hes not smart enough to figure out that nothing is what we Christians call spirit. God is a spirit. Infinite spirit.

reply to post by oliveoil

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I would live to give a quick response to this.

What kind of properties does a spirit have? It doesn't have to be a physical property. Does it have any reasoning in it's process of creation, or any purpose to create? Does it have any kind of characteristic?

If it does, then I have to disagree that it is the same thing as nothing.

And if it doesn't have any characteristic at all, then why not just keep calling it nothing? The word 'spirit' for most people, carries baggage.

Kind regards

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Hitotsumami]

reply to post by Hitotsumami

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Perhaps we could put it this way;
In Biblical teaching, God created all things.
But God is no thing. [ie not a "thing"]
(Though, admittedly, not quite what Hawkings meant)

God did not CREATE the universe. The universe is the physical aspect of God-in-manifestation.

It is a pity Hawking - like most people - is still stuck in the unsophisticated, ancient notion that God CREATED the cosmos, like some old man in a white beard making a dolls house.

If you want real, mathematical evidence for God that cannot be refuted and which proves that M-theory is actually part of the divine blueprint, then spend the six months studying the research articles here:

smphillips.8m.com...

Explore the website as preparation for your encounter with the divine paradigm.

Be advised, however, that the articles will challenge your mathematical ability.

Originally posted by DISRAELI
reply to post by Hitotsumami

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Perhaps we could put it this way;
In Biblical teaching, God created all things.
But God is no thing. [ie not a "thing"]
(Though, admittedly, not quite what Hawkings meant)

Thank you for the response.

I also do not think that is what Hakwing meant.

Also, I do not think something that is not part of our physical universe is nothing (God). If it has some kind of reasoning to it and can do a process, then it is more than nothing at all, as far as I know.

kind regards

reply to post by Hitotsumami

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Thanks for the reply. To answer your question, lets get deeper into thought.
Matter does not,can not ,will not, produce matter. Only ones will can produce matter.

Next question logically would be what is ones will.

Originally posted by micpsi
God did not CREATE the universe. The universe is the physical aspect of God-in-manifestation.

It is a pity Hawking - like most people - is still stuck in the unsophisticated, ancient notion that God CREATED the cosmos, like some old man in a white beard making a dolls house.

If you want real, mathematical evidence for God that cannot be refuted and which proves that M-theory is actually part of the divine blueprint, then spend the six months studying the research articles here:

smphillips.8m.com...

Explore the website as preparation for your encounter with the divine paradigm.

Be advised, however, that the articles will challenge your mathematical ability.

I do not know anything about that website, but would like to make a quick point.

This thread is in response to the Christian God, as the title proposes, and for most people in this modern time, it is believed that the God created the universe.

I will follow the link and research it, but I don't think it will help the current subject of the thread.

Kind regards

Originally posted by Hitotsumami

Originally posted by micpsi
God did not CREATE the universe. The universe is the physical aspect of God-in-manifestation.

It is a pity Hawking - like most people - is still stuck in the unsophisticated, ancient notion that God CREATED the cosmos, like some old man in a white beard making a dolls house.

If you want real, mathematical evidence for God that cannot be refuted and which proves that M-theory is actually part of the divine blueprint, then spend the six months studying the research articles here:

smphillips.8m.com...

Explore the website as preparation for your encounter with the divine paradigm.

Be advised, however, that the articles will challenge your mathematical ability.

I do not know anything about that website, but would like to make a quick point.

This thread is in response to the Christian God, as the title proposes, and for most people in this modern time, it is believed that the God created the universe.

I will follow the link and research it, but I don't think it will help the current subject of the thread.

Kind regards

Real quick! What is the Christian God exactly? Christianity is the largest religion with numerous sects. Most worship Jesus as God in human form. Which contradicts Judaism view of God.

Originally posted by Hitotsumami

Originally posted by ben91069

Originally posted by Hitotsumami

On the subject of the article, I also do not see how Hawking was supporting God.

It is simple. God is spirit. The universe is material. God did not exist first without the universe and then create it, but the material is a reflection of God's spiritual qualities and consciousness - from the smallest of particles to the largest. That is why the Hebrew God claims to be none other than the "I am", because that is everything. It is a blessing to be alive, which means that you are eternal but do not know your path yet.

Thank you for the response.

I would like to make sure I understand your point. God did not exist without the universe. That is what you said. Does this mean the universe has always been? If it has always been, why is a God required for the universe to be at all?

Thanks again for the reply

Kind regards

Can you check this out?
www.usbible.com...

This is a classic story from the Bible which talks about a pre existing universe.

From a scientific point of view, Genesis 1:1-2 tells of a preexistent universe prior to creation. 1In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2The earth was without form and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the waters. (Gen 1:1-2)

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
Real quick! What is the Christian God exactly?

For personal reasons, I like this definition.
At least it's quick;

Definition of God

Originally posted by oliveoil
reply to post by Hitotsumami

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Thanks for the reply. To answer your question, lets get deeper into thought.
Matter does not,can not ,will not, produce matter. Only ones will can produce matter.

Next question logically would be what is ones will.

Thank youf or the response.

You say that matter cannot produce matter. As far as I am aware, this is true on larger levels of matter. Matter and energy is constant.

However, I also know that at a below atomic level, the natural forces of our universe start to not apply. I also remember seeing articles of particles coming out of nothingness, and then disappearing again.

But I will assume for the sake of conversation that this below atomic matter that is coming out of nothing is actually coming from God in some kind of way. My original response was basically this:

"Does a spirit have any kind of characteristic?

If it does, then I have to disagree that it is the same thing as nothing.

And if it doesn't have any characteristic at all, then why not just keep calling it nothing? The word 'spirit' for most people, carries baggage."

I do not quite see how your response to me was any kind of answer to my question. I would very much appreciate it if you could better explain for me. I'm very sorry if I didn't get your point.

Kind regards

Originally posted by DISRAELI

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
Real quick! What is the Christian God exactly?

For personal reasons, I like this definition.
At least it's quick;

Definition of God

Thanks for the link. But still I'm skeptical what the Christian religion has to offer in the NT.
www.messiahtruth.com...
What do you think of this link?

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