Palestine - The greatest lie in history

Yes, that's right. Most of You believe one of the greatest lies ever created in human history.
The creation of a people \ nation out of thin air, in order to destroy the recreation of another peoples land.

I urge those who honestly wishes to learn some true historical facts, to read and watch the following:

“The Arab propagandists and apologists almost never mentioned that in 1948, Arab armies launched a war against a one-day-old Israel. Instead he focused on the main consequence of that war: the creation of Arab refugees, stating that Israel "war of genocide" expelled 800,000 of them. This not only disagrees with UN estimates of a bit over 400,000 refugees but also ignores the fact that most of the Arabs/Palestinians were encouraged to leave by the Arab World itself! “

“Israel was responsible for bringing about some of its own problems. The Arabs in the West Bank and Gaza Strip were packed and ready to leave following their 1967 defeat. Suddenly the victorious one-eyed IDF General Moshe Dayan persuaded them to stay. This singular act stunned no one more than the Arab enemy himself who could not believe such an incredible manifestation of Jewish madness!”

www.masada2000.org...


If you are up to it, please read Joan Peters book : 'From Time Immemorial'
Her eye opening research is substantiated with documents and references.
Joan was actually a peace activist news reporter, with an opinion very much favoring the Palestinian side of the story. Joan Peters was stun to learn the true historical facts that were and still are kept in the dark for mere propaganda, hate and scoop seeking journalism that act as any other cheap tabloid.

It came as no surprise that her greatest opponents Norman Finkelsein and Noam Chomsky were among the first to reject it as worthless. Chomsky even went further and said:”
"probably it had been put together by some intelligence agency or something like that".

www.amazon.com...

It's up yo you to decide, but first, open your eyes and minds. Educate yourselves. Defy ignorance.
And before all the Zionists “lovers” jump on the wagon... news flash: Yes there are Israelis and Jews that are evil. Yup, just like every other nation, race and religion has.

Are you trying to say that the Jews appeared from thin air to take Palestinian land? If you are then i agree with you. The Jews are believed to have originated in Southern Arabia. They then migrated to Mesopotamia where the great Semitic dynasty took place in 2350 b.c.

The pre-Mosaic period: the religion of the patriarchs Israelite tradition identified YHWH (by scholarly convention pronounced Yahweh), the God of Israel, with the Creator of the world, who had been known to and worshipped by men from the beginning of time. Abraham (perhaps 19th or 18th-17th centuries BCE) did not discover this God, but entered into a new covenant relation with him, in which he was promised the land of Canaan and a numerous progeny. God fulfilled that promise through the actions of the 13th-century-BCE Hebrew leader Moses: he liberated the people of Israel from Egypt, imposed Covenant obligations on them at Mt. Sinai, and brought them to the promised land.

History of Judaism

Canaan, Kanaʻn; Hebrew: כְּנָעַן Kənáʻan; Arabic: كنعان Kanʻān) is an ancient term for a region encompassing modern-day Israel, Lebanon, the Palestinian territories and adjoining coastal lands, including parts of Jordan, Syria and northeastern Egypt. In the Hebrew Bible, the "Land of Canaan" extends from Lebanon southward across Gaza to the "Brook of Egypt" and eastward to the Jordan River Valley. In far ancient times, the southern area included various ethnic groups. The Amarna Letters found in Ancient Egypt mention Canaan (Akkadian: Kinaḫḫu) in connection with Gaza and other cities along the Phoenician coast and into Upper Galilee. Many earlier Egyptian sources also mention numerous military campaigns conducted in Ka-na-na, just inside Asia.

Canaan

reply to post by gravitational

I love Israel and it's peoples.
However, on the topic, was the creation of Israel peaceful?
I heard it was bombed into existence by Zionist terrosist groups, who killed Palestinians before 1948.
What was the role of Irgun, Hagannah and Stern Gang?
What happened at the King David hotel?
I'm no expert - just wondering about history and its relevance.

Well, Israel is now an international fact and entity, and as a gay person I see it as a leading light of secular humanity.
I sometimes feel Israelis are more critical of the current conundrum than anyone. I do hope the new two-state solution plans works out.
I feel for the displaced Palestinian people too, but the recent Hamas killing of settlers is chilling. Surely they can also do a better public relations act and modernize a bit?

Well, that's my take.

reply to post by gravitational


That land was called Palestine, not Israel, but if you wanna talk about 3000 years ago, don't forget to talk about 4000 years ago..

The European Jews weren't even the aborigine of that land (Jews were sent there by Zionists, they were all European/American), there were already Jews in that land (aborigines), who lived with Palestinian Arabs side by side, even Christians, then the Zionist American + Europeans (who were being killed and tortured in Europe), came in packs to Palestine, and called for the Resurrection of 3000 year old Israel.. That is what started the conflict.. Neither Palestine, nor Israel existed, but the land was called Palestine, it was part of the Ottoman empire..

When the conflict between the Ottoman empire and West started, different Arab regions were promised a nation, including Palestine by the British, if they help the British defeat the Ottoman empire.

British gave in to Zionist terrorists harbored and supported by America, they actually bombed British personal when Britain refused the entry of European Jews to Palestine. After WWII Europe collapsed, including Britain (therefore Britain couldn't stand up against the US, and the US became the Ayatollah of Britain), the US took control, and created Israel because the Zionist Jews helped the US conquer Europe, hence WWII started because of Jews..

History actually helps if you read.

If you examine this picture of Africa, you would see the power of Europe, and you would see why the US needed a civil war amongst Europeans to become the world super power it is today:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4d40a1b86274.gif[/atsimg]

See the power?

[edit on 3-9-2010 by oozyism]

reply to post by gravitational

What is distressing is the spillage of conflicts into other countries and societies.
This might include "rendition" of Muslim people basically kidnapped from the streets, or the very sickening case of 2006 torture and murder of a Jewish man in Paris: www.vosizneias.com...

I think the manipulating potential of this conflict is so great, that the powers that be will never want to resolve it. Divide and rule.

the land was commonly called Palestine in history. There are plenty of maps available that speaks for it's behalf. i know you wont believe it, but as well as the original purpose of this thread was mere zionist propaganda, we may resort to counter-propaganda (sorries for the size of the picture):

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/files/b5f28484c6dccb9a.jpg[/atsimg]

the map is dated back to 1849 afaik. source is university of texas (library) see here.

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Geemor]

Sorry to tell you,
but you have no idea even where the name Palestine originated from and why.

“The name Palestine refers to a region of the eastern Mediterranean coast from the sea to the Jordan valley and from the southern Negev desert to the Galilee lake region in the north. The word itself derives from "Plesheth", a name that appears frequently in the Bible and has come into English as "Philistine". Plesheth, (root palash) was a general term meaning rolling or migratory. This referred to the Philistine's invasion and conquest of the coast from the sea. The Philistines were not Arabs nor even Semites, they were most closely related to the Greeks originating from Asia Minor and Greek localities. They did not speak Arabic. They had no connection, ethnic, linguistic or historical with Arabia or Arabs. “

follow the link to read who named the land. Hint...it wasn't the so called Palestinians.

www.palestinefacts.org...

reply to post by gravitational


Oh... So then that means they are a real people and weren't created out of thin air after all....

So then that would mean prior to 1948 they were there and European Jews did, in fact, displace them.

Looks like you just defeated your OP.

Originally posted by AdAbsurdum
reply to post by gravitational

 

Looks like you just defeated your OP.

exactly what i thought as well. if the region was called palestine, then palestinian must refer to the inhabitants of that region. israelites were only one tribe living in that area. so how come the area is now renamed as israel?

the op is being funny imo

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Geemor]

reply to post by gravitational


If you check your friend's list you will see me there

I will advice you to keep challenging your own self, no matter how much you believe something is true, say it is a lie and challenge yourself to prove it is a lie.

That is the only road to truth, the rest is all BS.

I'm not saying you will reach the truth, but simply saying you will get very close to it ..

*groan

there must be a couple hundred threads on this subject.

So are we to believe that because a group of people living in an area that choose not to be as Nationalistic as the other countries of the world, they do not deserve their land they occupied for thousands of years?

By the same right that Jews created Israel, The Indians of North America could kick us out. If Israel can continue to exist then maybe United States, Canada and Mexico should cease to exist, its peoples rounded up into small areas ontop of each other?

edit to add: Werent the Jews persercuted and kicked out of like 130 countries over the millenia? Why would a peoples be treated this way? Because everyone else was wrong, or they were?

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Le Colonel]

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Le Colonel]

reply to post by gravitational


Every border in the world was created by one of the European powers, inc Russia, by either political or economic conquest or by controlling a neighboring country's border.

Both Israel and Palestine have the same right to exist as any other ME country because all their borders were created by the UK or France as they dissected the Ottoman Empire after ww1.

No country in the ME as constituted now is more than 20 years older than Israel, although all the other peoples have lived there longer than the vast majority of the Israeli Jews, excepting Stalinist population moves in the "baby Stans".

A two state solution is the only one that has any chance to work both countries need to have a valid economy and a chance for socioeconomic cohesion so the 48 borders wont work, some variant of the 67 borders are imho the only option.

Imho Egypt Syria Jordan and Lebanon need to be at the table and with good will a whole variety of borders should be redrawn giving all participants greater security and a chance for peaceful coexistence and a thriving economic zone.

As there is no good will I predict war of varying degrees of heat for the foreseeable future.

As was no doubt planned by us as we set the borders with divide and rule foremost in our minds, as with most of the other borders Europe set up.


[edit on 3-9-2010 by Thepreye]

Oh boy, some of you are really talented in twisting reality.

Did you even bother reading anything I linked to?
The name Palestine has no connection what so ever with the present Muslims who call themselves Palestinians. Jeeezzz, have some decency and read before trying to twist everything to your liking.
Ever heard a palestinian saying he came from the Mediterranean sea and that he is not Arab Muslim? Show me one.
You can't have it both ways. Either they immigrated from The med or Arabia.

If you believe there were once prior to 48 a Palestinian state \ kingdom \ something than answer me this:

when was it created?
what type of government did it have?
Who was the head of this government?
where did the "Palestinians" come from?
what was it's currency
why is there no record of this country not even in Arab newspapers?

More questions to add:

How come both Palestinian leaders and Arab leaders said time and time again “There is no such thing as Palestine” ? Look at the video if you haven't already before answering.

reply to post by gravitational


Hmmm, from where I stand, 10 people are wrong and you are right,

or, YOU ARE WRONG...

I'm democratic..I'll stick with the 10..

Israel was given that land by corrupt poloticians of the day after being booted from many countries for good reason..

My question is why create a state for one particular religion? Israel is the only such state created in modern times.
I haven't heard mention of the Balfour agreement on this thread yet which set the stage for the destruction of Palestine.
Israel was a convenient solution to Jewish refugees as well as making a powerful ally in an oil-rich region. Governments do not act out of kindness or altruism.
This is why the Holocaust was used as an advertising tool to justify it's creation.

Why do people scoff at the idea of Zionists being a powerful cartel when "holocaust denial" is being made illegal nearly everywhere?

Originally posted by Geemor
the land was commonly called Palestine in history. There are plenty of maps available that speaks for it's behalf. i know you wont believe it, but as well as the original purpose of this thread was mere zionist propaganda, we may resort to counter-propaganda (sorries for the size of the picture):

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/files/b5f28484c6dccb9a.jpg[/atsimg]

the map is dated back to 1849 afaik. source is university of texas (library) see here.

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Geemor]

LOL...Strange of you to show that particular map.
That map shows the distribution of the Israelite 12 tribes in the biblical era.
It also bears the authentic name the land was given by the Romans.

Nice try though.

Just wanted to say thanks to the people posting interesting information here. I will admit my ignorance of the middle east issues. I have probably been ignoring them due to the intensity of dispute.

This thread has, in spite of the OP, remained rather reasoned in my opinion and I am learning things from both perspectives. I trust most people in North American barely have even a superficial idea of the issues -- just the soundbites provided by the MSM which does nothing to foster true understanding.

At this point I am not able to make a personal statement of belief supporting either one side or the other. I am leaning towards the notion that 2 states makes no sense. Here in Canada the French and English speaking sectors are learning to make a go of it as one nation. Why not Jews and Palestinians?

Why not redraw borders for everyone in the ME if that makes sense, or eliminate them altogether??

OK now I know I went too far, but thinking about uniting is likely to be more helpful in the long run than thinking about how to further divide. Just my humble, newbie to this issue, opinion.

Originally posted by gravitational
what was it's currency

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by gravitational
The name Palestine has no connection what so ever with the present Muslims who call themselves Palestinians. Jeeezzz, have some decency and read before trying to twist everything to your liking.
Ever heard a palestinian saying he came from the Mediterranean sea and that he is not Arab Muslim? Show me one.
You can't have it both ways. Either they immigrated from The med or Arabia.

If you believe there were once prior to 48 a Palestinian state \ kingdom \ something than answer me this:

when was it created?
what type of government did it have?
Who was the head of this government?
where did the "Palestinians" come from?
what was it's currency
why is there no record of this country not even in Arab newspapers?

More questions to add:

How come both Palestinian leaders and Arab leaders said time and time again “There is no such thing as Palestine” ? Look at the video if you haven't already before answering.

Recent genetic evidence has demonstrated that Palestinians as an ethnic group are closely related to Jews and represent modern "descendants of a core population that lived in the area since prehistoric times,"[15][16] largely predating the Arabian Muslim conquest that resulted in their acculturation, established Arabic as the predominant vernacular, and over time also Islamized many of them from various prior faiths.

en.wikipedia.org...

(yes, I know how people feel about wikipedia, but it is a useful tool nonetheless)

I think you are trying to define Palestine by your own ideas of what makes a nation. Boundaries shift, but my definition of a nation is the zeitgeist of the people. The people of the area lived in relative peace for a long period of time. They lived as many of the Afghani people live now, under local law and custom. Why would they need to establish a national identity as you define it when they already had an identity and a way of life that worked for them?

Suddenly they were told to make way for another group of people. A sense of nationalism arose. I think we would all feel the same way if someone told us we had to move out of an area we had lived in for generations, where our ancestors were buried in the local cemetery, where generations were all born under the same roof.

Just because I defend the Palestinians doesn't mean I'm anti-Israel. It's an extremely complex situation.

edit: mods, forgive me if I didn't quote right.

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Cobra5000]

Originally posted by gravitational

LOL...Strange of you to show that particular map.
That map shows the distribution of the Israelite 12 tribes in the biblical era.
It also bears the authentic name the land was given by the Romans.

Nice try though.

i'm a strange person. here's another map for you.

my sole point is to show that the land was called palestine, and people living in those area were palestinians and amongst them were the tribes mentioned already.

tell me then why romans decided to call the area palestine? because they didn't like israelites? well i think the argument here may be pointless, cuz it doesen't make much difference what we speculate in some internet board? afterall, its the rule of the strongest. i am not sure tho, if it justifies the behaviour israel is currently engaged in.