Arizona Now Has 'Whopping 30' National Guard Troops and 15 Billboard Signs Warning Citizens About Dr

reply to post by Wildmanimal


Nothing short of military action in Mexico will change the situation.

These are not Drug Cartels anymore, they are organized crime. They engage in kidnapping, extortion, drug trade, and whatever else they can make big money on that isn't legal. This isn't just about drugs anymore. That's just cutting off one facet of this multi-billion dollar industry.

If you don't believe this has turned from the millions into the billions, then you don't realize how many different facets of crime they are into. Human trafficking, sex slavery, money laundering, fraud, you name it.

reply to post by Annee


true, very true. Not implying everyone, but I keep hearing about these border hot spots, that seem to be more dangerous and cartel-ridden than the rest of the state. If a small department with little call-outs has 3 or 4 5-man response/sharpshooter teams, see if a troubled area (near or not near the border) could use the extra men.

Short of us operating in Mexico, we are going to have to rely on the Mexican government to truly put a cap on this. As sad as that sounds, it is indeed possible, more-so with assistance of the U.S.

I just thought of a funny analogy: Think of Mexico as the oil reservoir under the Gulf. The cartel members are leaking out into the U.S. ocean. Taking care of business on our side is equivalent to using a dispersant. To truly stop the flow of toxic waste into our "ocean", we need to cap the source...preferably with 7.62

(Just to make myself clear: this is my stance on the cartel members, NOT immigrants (legal or illegal). Viva los hispanicos mis hermanos!)
[edit on 2-9-2010 by Shark VA84]

[edit on 2-9-2010 by Shark VA84]

These are not Drug Cartels anymore, they are organized crime. They engage in kidnapping, extortion, drug trade, and whatever else they can make big money on that isn't legal. This isn't just about drugs anymore. That's just cutting off one facet of this multi-billion dollar industry.

Absolutely, and nothing short of joint military strikes in Mexico will rid the world of these cartels. But I don't see that happening until more troops are brought home from the wars in Iraq/Afghanistan - or even from the 178 overseas military bases we currently man.

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer

I don't know where you get this term "federalized" - they're not cowpokes on the trail being deputized for a posse - Guard units are part of the army, and can be called out at any time by the Governor if needed.

Where did I get the term? History ... Going back to the civil rights riots in the 60's.

You could also do the same thing I did here - Google "national guard federalized" to see and understand the use of the word ...

search

Originally posted by centurion1211
The National Guard can and has often been "federalized". How do you think all those National Guard soldiers ended up serving in iraq and afghanistan? You do know that thousands have served there, right?

source

A little-noticed change in federal law packs an important change in who is in charge the next time a state is devastated by a disaster such as Hurricane Katrina.

To the dismay of the nation’s governors, the White House now will be empowered to go over a governor’s head and call up National Guard troops to aid a state in time of natural disasters or other public emergencies. Up to now, governors were the sole commanders in chief of citizen soldiers in local Guard units during emergencies within the state.

All that says is that the Fed CAN call them out (I assume the logic being that if the Governor is dragging their feet, the Feds can just say "do it".) It doesn't say that the Governor can't respond, because they can. The Governor of Arizona has opted not to send more than 30 troops to do this, for reasons that I do not know.

As for the available troop count, I suspect that taking National Guard troops from other states to patrol the border in Arizona would open up a whole other can of worms that no one wants to, similar to the disinterest in having regular Army troops do it.

There will never be any real action against it until fighting crime stops being so profitable. The lawyers, the cops, the penitentiary, the special task forces, etc. They all owe their large budgets and big spending to crime. Crime is too profitable to reasonably crack down on.


Also, whoever made the decision to send 30 troops to the border should be arrested for endangering these troops. All you do, by sending those 30 troops, is put their lives in unreasonable danger. They don't have nearly enough support to deal with this problem.

Border issues, they send 30 troops, it's almost a symbol of how politicians treat the issue. They don't really care.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
reply to post by Wildmanimal

 

Nothing short of military action in Mexico will change the situation.

These are not Drug Cartels anymore, they are organized crime. They engage in kidnapping, extortion, drug trade, and whatever else they can make big money on that isn't legal. This isn't just about drugs anymore. That's just cutting off one facet of this multi-billion dollar industry.

If you don't believe this has turned from the millions into the billions, then you don't realize how many different facets of crime they are into. Human trafficking, sex slavery, money laundering, fraud, you name it.

This is absolutely true.

The only way to clean up Mexico is invade them like we did Iraq. Hopefully along with the support of the Mexican army (if anyone can be found that is not corrupted).

Unfortunately - they don't have anything we want. I think our government weighs the benefits. If they lose the amount of control they want to have (like Saddam switching from gold to the Euro) - - then I think they might do something.

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer

These are not Drug Cartels anymore, they are organized crime. They engage in kidnapping, extortion, drug trade, and whatever else they can make big money on that isn't legal. This isn't just about drugs anymore. That's just cutting off one facet of this multi-billion dollar industry.

Absolutely, and nothing short of joint military strikes in Mexico will rid the world of these cartels. But I don't see that happening until more troops are brought home from the wars in Iraq/Afghanistan - or even from the 178 overseas military bases we currently man.

you wont get rid of these cartels...ever. but you can take away their funding.

legalize drugs. all of them

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by grimreaper797
reply to post by Wildmanimal

 

Nothing short of military action in Mexico will change the situation.

These are not Drug Cartels anymore, they are organized crime. They engage in kidnapping, extortion, drug trade, and whatever else they can make big money on that isn't legal. This isn't just about drugs anymore. That's just cutting off one facet of this multi-billion dollar industry.

If you don't believe this has turned from the millions into the billions, then you don't realize how many different facets of crime they are into. Human trafficking, sex slavery, money laundering, fraud, you name it.

This is absolutely true.

The only way to clean up Mexico is invade them like we did Iraq. Hopefully along with the support of the Mexican army (if anyone can be found that is not corrupted).

Unfortunately - they don't have anything we want. I think our government weighs the benefits. If they lose the amount of control they want to have (like Saddam switching from gold to the Euro) - - then I think they might do something.

i have freinds who are in iraq. not cleaned up at all. a cousin of mine has been there since the begining. its gone to hell. well more than before



[edit on 2-9-2010 by X9ballX]

reply to post by X9ballX


Drugs is just one way they fund themselves. They wouldn't be any less of a threat without the drug trade. They control the very governments in many of these countries. The only way to get rid of them is to be so harsh and indiscriminate with these cartel members, that anyone thinking of joining would think twice.

As barbaric as that may sound, the solution to breaking down criminal cartels is fear and constant pressure. You have to approach these cartels with overly discriminate force. I don't mean the poor immigrants at the bottom being force to be mules. I mean the higher ups organizing such. Find them out, and slaughter them. No trials, no prisoners. Slaughter the organizers of these human rights butchering cartels.

They are ruthless, we must be at the very least, equally as ruthless toward them.

Originally posted by Texcin
It's an in your face insult to Arizona. At least they have Gov. Brewer standing up for Arizona.

But....Brewer has the authority to deploy Arizona National Guard. National Guard is under the authority of the governor.

Originally posted by yellowcard

Originally posted by Texcin
It's an in your face insult to Arizona. At least they have Gov. Brewer standing up for Arizona.

But....Brewer has the authority to deploy Arizona National Guard. National Guard is under the authority of the governor.

Shhh that ruins the old politcal tactic of blaming other people. Besides we all know putting people on the border is a waste of time. It has never helped before and will not now. The only way to stop it is to go after the people who reward them for coming with jobs. That will not happen as most of the rich Republicans and Dems who fund campaings also are the same ones they are working for. Its all a political game designed to rally people dumb enough to think the very people who hire the illegals are going to be the ones to stop them form coming in.

Originally posted by X9ballX

i have freinds who are in iraq. not cleaned up at all. a cousin of mine has been there since the begining. its gone to hell. well more than before

I understand that - - but that's a different discussion.

Ya kind of have to pick a side to determine What is better and What is worse.

Originally posted by grimreaper797

As barbaric as that may sound, the solution to breaking down criminal cartels is fear and constant pressure. You have to approach these cartels with overly discriminate force. I don't mean the poor immigrants at the bottom being force to be mules. I mean the higher ups organizing such. Find them out, and slaughter them. No trials, no prisoners. Slaughter the organizers of these human rights butchering cartels.

They are ruthless, we must be at the very least, equally as ruthless toward them.

Mafia Wars in Spanish. Where's Eliot Ness? (just kidding - I have read the real biography)

But definitely similar.

Originally posted by yellowcard

Originally posted by Texcin
It's an in your face insult to Arizona. At least they have Gov. Brewer standing up for Arizona.

But....Brewer has the authority to deploy Arizona National Guard. National Guard is under the authority of the governor.

Not anymore.

Bush changed that.

It seems people are ignoring what IMO is the most important issue in the OP. The signs saying, in effect, that our federal government - now under obama - has effectively ceded control of parts of AZ to the mexican drug cartels.

It's actually now not safe to drive along stretches of a U.S. interstate highway (I-8)!!!

Doing NOTHING about that right here right now, to me, is treason and definitely qualifies as a "high crime and misdemeanor".



[edit on 9/2/2010 by centurion1211]

How does the FED really know how many illegals are and arnt here? how about the ones hiding and not registered in some form or manner? if a corporate business, usually retial, can hide them and employ them..then i thinks the FEDS estimates are wrong*

reply to post by centurion1211


Centurion, seriously, I dislike Obama on just about every issue, but you need to stop your hate obsession. Really. It's not healthy. Sure, Obama has bad policies, and many of the things he is doing are not helping the situation.


I'll be the first to say that liberal policies are not the answer to immigration. Also, there has yet to be an answer to the immigration issue. Stop putting ALL the blame on Obama though, many of this problems have been happening for years, or decades. Obama plays, at best, a moderate role. Many other people in government, INCLUDING REPUBLICANS and democrats alike, have both had the opportunity to solve the problems we face.

Both parties have failed. Obama is no better or worse. He's just another name in the White House perpetuating the cycle.

You made your point, Obama hasn't helped and has done more damage, now do yourself a favor and MOVE ON. This obsession you have isn't healthy at all.

[edit on 2-9-2010 by grimreaper797]

Doing NOTHING about that right here right now, to me, is treason and definitely qualifies as a "high crime and misdemeanor".

Then I guess Brewer and McCain should be the first to be charged? They have the power to put more troops on the border and they haven't. They're too busy milking this for all the political points.

People need to start to realize these issues don't revolve around the president. They don't get solved overnight by a president. They get solve over a prolonged period of time from a vigilant public body pushing to have POLICY tightened up, NOT their political party in office.

This problem is more than just immigration, it's a fundamental flaw in of national security, our economy, and our ability to guarantee the safety of the people who live and deal with this problem. People should start to care MORE about how to solve these issues, and LESS about which party or individuals fault it is that it is happening.

It's getting worse? Okay, "how do we stop that?" should be your very next thought. Not who's fault it is, or back when so and so was in office, but what needs to get done.

Let me put it in other words: The problems our society faces are problems, not ammunition for you against individuals or parties you dislike. These problems are real, they matter, and they are not some sort of game. When we realize that, and stop the attacks, we will start being more productive, getting things done.

I hope that people can realize that soon, because innocent people are dying out there. People are living in oppression and environments that allow physical scare tactics to bully the weak. I'm talking about Mexico here. Our failure is not our failure alone, people on both sides of the border are suffering.