If these incredible aircraft exist, why aren't they used around the world to serve US interests? 700 lives could have been saved in Iraq (and thousands of Iraqis). The answer is simple: they don't exist.

Cyberpilot. I can do no more than assure you that it is genuine but as you do not know me I can understand your scepticism. However look out for a TV doc called The Real Flying Saucers, here it was shown on Channel 5 but was co produced by the History Channel. This programme has amazing footage of not just the Avro but also other types actually flying. I could also point you in the direction of the Putnam Aeronautical series of hardback books which are known as the 'Aviation Bible' with individual volumes of hundreds of pages each dedicated to the output of a single company. In this case the volume 'Avro Aircraft Since 1908' by A J Jackson, in the section 'Appendix B - Aircraft designed by A V Roe Canada Ltd' which features the Avrocar prominently.

Incidentally I recommend these books to followers of British aviation history as I have every volume excpt 'Miles Aircraft since 1925' and for you Americans there are also volumes on Boeing, Lockheed and McDonnell Douglas, they incude EVERYTHING each company designed or built (up to publication date in the case of companies still extant).

Incidentally the red line denotes the centre of balance in forward motion for the purposes of film records of the test flights, it made it easier to judge exactly how unstable the thing was from analysing footage of it flying over a line marked on the ground and measuring the variance (in rotation rather than direction). Maybe the red lines do indicate what you said on other aircraft but not in this case.




[edit on 26-7-2004 by waynos]

Originally posted by ghost


I don't mean to sound insaulting, but, you're thinking of a frisbee, not a Flying Disk (Saucer). The physics is slightly different! Flying Disks are aircraft, unlike a frisbee they have a propultion system. Flying Disk have control systems that either use moving control surfaces like most planes, or thrust vectoring, or in some cases a combination of the two. If an aircraft goes into a flat spin(spinning without pitching up or down), It is out of control and about to crash.

Tim
ATS Director of Counter-Ignorance

no to reach high speeds a disc shaped object needs to spin to maintain stability.
the laws are the same with a frisbee since both are similar. thats what caused the avro car to fail. it needed to spin but you cant fly a thing well spinning can you. your thinking about a normal aircraft where its linear motion not circular motion like in a disc shaped craft.
also yes that is an avro car but wheres the cockpit by the way? all the avro cars had cockpits so umm wheres the one on that?

[edit on 19/07/04 by devilwasp]

If these incredible aircraft exist, why aren't they used around the world to serve US interests? 700 lives could have been saved in Iraq (and thousands of Iraqis). The answer is simple: they don't exist.

Of course they would not use this in Iraq these things are the most secret projects in US military you think they would risk one in a war that would be won in 3 weeks hell no. These things are reserved for the Chinese or the Russians. Plus all those report of triangle UFO flying over other countries with no sound and incredible speeds you think there are little gray men aboard them hell no there are USAF pilots testing if other countries can touch or threaten these things IMHO and by all reports they cant.

dude the USAF isnt responsible for EVERY UFO sighting in the world most likely its that countries secret projects not the USAF u gota get off your american propaganda stuff man. it really is quite a load of BS,hte US is a good country by the way but frankly saying the US is superior in everything to everyone in everyway in every post u right is kinda propaganda.

Lockheed does hold the patents on disc-shaped passenger aicraft

Patents are public documents - do you happen to have the registration no. for any of them? I'd love to take a peek!


[edit on 26/7/04 by AlexofSkye]

[edit on 26/7/04 by AlexofSkye]

Mod edit to fix quote tags. and separate author's text from original quote.

[edit on 26-7-2004 by UM_Gazz]

Originally posted by waynos

Incidentally the red line denotes the centre of balance in forward motion for the purposes of film records of the test flights, it made it easier to judge exactly how unstable the thing was from analysing footage of it flying over a line marked on the ground and measuring the variance (in rotation rather than direction). Maybe the red lines do indicate what you said on other aircraft but not in this case.


[edit on 26-7-2004 by waynos]

You have got to be kidding me, EVERY aircraft I have ever flown or seen, or more properly ALL modern aircraft have instruments that would easily document that information right on the panel....And as to "maybe the lines do indicate what I said on other aircraft...blah blah blah"...

try google.

umm one thing that aint a plane.
thats a kinda ground veihicle.

dude the USAF isnt responsible for EVERY UFO sighting in the world most likely its that countries secret projects not the USAF u gota get off your american propaganda stuff man.

When did I say all UFO sightings all I said was the triangle ones, the discs those are beyond me im just talking about aurora and the triangle aircraft. Also some of these triangle sightings are reported over 3rd world countries and I can tell you 3rd world countries don't have flying triangles that make no sound.


[edit on 27-7-2004 by WestPoint23]

Originally posted by WestPoint23
3rd world countries don't have flying triangles that make no sound.

they dont have them

but their neighbors do

Really can you name me some countries that have flying triangles Titus and you have proof or at least some reason Or speculate that these countries have them right?

Originally posted by WestPoint23

When did I say all UFO sightings all I said was the triangle ones, the discs those are beyond me im just talking about aurora and the triangle aircraft. Also some of these triangle sightings are reported over 3rd world countries and I can tell you 3rd world countries don't have flying triangles that make no sound.


[edit on 27-7-2004 by WestPoint23]

Yeah west point the USAF is flying missions over britain to test our radar in case we go to war with each other ........FOR CRYING OUT LOUD GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF UR A$$ and think. the RAF has its own projects you or i dont know about and probably never know about. so dont go claiming your USA rules all bulls**** (sorry to all amerians i know u have a good country and military but i had to make a point.)also how do u you know that the USAF is the only one with triangle planes huh? PROOF SHOW ME PROOF!

See devil there you go putting words in my mouth again! I'm sure Britain has its own programs they don't have to be about flying triangles plus where are you getting this USA rules things? Also i asked if Titus had any proof or any REASON to speculate about this im not asking people to go out and bring me back the top secret plane I said a reason that can vary from pics of the object flying over other countries bases or around their bases that's all.

Originally posted by devilwasp

Originally posted by ghost


I don't mean to sound insaulting, but, you're thinking of a frisbee, not a Flying Disk (Saucer). The physics is slightly different! Flying Disks are aircraft, unlike a frisbee they have a propultion system. Flying Disk have control systems that either use moving control surfaces like most planes, or thrust vectoring, or in some cases a combination of the two. If an aircraft goes into a flat spin(spinning without pitching up or down), It is out of control and about to crash.

Tim
ATS Director of Counter-Ignorance

no to reach high speeds a disc shaped object needs to spin to maintain stability.
the laws are the same with a frisbee since both are similar. thats what caused the avro car to fail. it needed to spin but you cant fly a thing well spinning can you. your thinking about a normal aircraft where its linear motion not circular motion like in a disc shaped craft.
also yes that is an avro car but wheres the cockpit by the way? all the avro cars had cockpits so umm wheres the one on that?

[edit on 19/07/04 by devilwasp]

Hey thanks! I've just learned something new. If a flying saucer spins, then the control laws that it uses must be very different from what I thought they were. How do the controls work then? Also, how can a pilot function inside a spinning craft without getting dizzy and disoriented? Is the X-22A even a manned aircraft?

I no expert on flying Disks, I thought they worked like a flying wing. I based my Ideas on how the B-2 works. Since they are different, I'm back to square one. Tell me some more, I'd love to learn.

Tim
ATS Director of Counter-Ignorance

Originally posted by ghost


Hey thanks! I've just learned something new. If a flying saucer spins, then the control laws that it uses must be very different from what I thought they were. How do the controls work then? Also, how can a pilot function inside a spinning craft without getting dizzy and disoriented? Is the X-22A even a manned aircraft?

I no expert on flying Disks, I thought they worked like a flying wing. I based my Ideas on how the B-2 works. Since they are different, I'm back to square one. Tell me some more, I'd love to learn.

Tim
ATS Director of Counter-Ignorance

yeah that was the problem with the avro program cause well how u gona control a spinning disc?
im no exspert my self but from what iv found out you need the disc to spin to reach high speeds.
seriolsy try throwing a frisbie and it will go further and faster when spinning.
dont ask me how i have no idea how or why but i think it has something to do with the shape of it.

Originally posted by WestPoint23
See devil there you go putting words in my mouth again! I'm sure Britain has its own programs they don't have to be about flying triangles plus where are you getting this USA rules things? Also i asked if Titus had any proof or any REASON to speculate about this im not asking people to go out and bring me back the top secret plane I said a reason that can vary from pics of the object flying over other countries bases or around their bases that's all.

no im not putting words in your mouth im interpreting what u said.
u said that most alien sighting are USAF pilots so you meant most UFO sightings are USAF and since UFO sightings are across the globe id have to interpret that you meant the USAF is testing other countries radar and defenses systems.

and the last bit of ur post made no sense at all

Originally posted by devilwasp

Originally posted by WestPoint23

When did I say all UFO sightings all I said was the triangle ones, the discs those are beyond me im just talking about aurora and the triangle aircraft. Also some of these triangle sightings are reported over 3rd world countries and I can tell you 3rd world countries don't have flying triangles that make no sound.


[edit on 27-7-2004 by WestPoint23]

Yeah west point the USAF is flying missions over britain to test our radar in case we go to war with each other ........FOR CRYING OUT LOUD GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF UR A$$ and think. the RAF has its own projects you or i dont know about and probably never know about. so dont go claiming your USA rules all bulls**** (sorry to all amerians i know u have a good country and military but i had to make a point.)also how do u you know that the USAF is the only one with triangle planes huh? PROOF SHOW ME PROOF!

There is NO PROOF that the USAF is the only one with that technology, Because They Are NOT the Only Ones! The USA and the UK have been sharing and codeveloping technology since WW2. The RAF has been in on the USAF development of secret technologies for a long time. If you do you own research you will even find that some RAF pilots were involved with the F-117 Night Hawk already in the mid 1980's. In Fact some of the F-117 missions flown in the 1991 Gulf War, were flown by RAF Pilots. The US shared research and technology with the UK, in exchange for support in other areas. The UK has stealth thechnology of their own. In fact, they are working with us on the F-35 JSF right now!

Tim
ATS Director of Counter-Ignorance

Originally posted by ghost
If you do you own research you will even find that some RAF pilots were involved with the F-117 Night Hawk already in the mid 1980's. In Fact some of the F-117 missions flown in the 1991 Gulf War, were flown by RAF Pilots.
Tim
ATS Director of Counter-Ignorance

First I have ever heard of that. Do you have any proof to back up that claim?


As I understood it no foregin pilots were allowed to fly the stealth until after the Gulf War, let alone to fly it into combat.

There is some information about UK involvement with the F-117 and other black projects on the link in my 'what crashed at Boscombe down' thread.

Originally posted by cyberpilot

Originally posted by waynos

Incidentally the red line denotes the centre of balance in forward motion for the purposes of film records of the test flights, it made it easier to judge exactly how unstable the thing was from analysing footage of it flying over a line marked on the ground and measuring the variance (in rotation rather than direction). Maybe the red lines do indicate what you said on other aircraft but not in this case.


[edit on 26-7-2004 by waynos]

You have got to be kidding me, EVERY aircraft I have ever flown or seen, or more properly ALL modern aircraft have instruments that would easily document that information right on the panel....And as to "maybe the lines do indicate what I said on other aircraft...blah blah blah"...

try google.

You are forgetting that this Avrocar dates from the fiifties and it was built to explore the properties of flying disc shaped craft, a totally unknown area apart from theory and some nazi research, analysing film footage of the tests was a vital part of this research and the red line is a visual marker to aid in this, ie counter rotational drift in the hover for example, why do you have a problem with that? As it turned out the craft was virtually unflyable anyway but that was the intention. Also, yes of course the red lines on jet aircraft indicate the turbine axis point, not maybe. I should have put it better. There isn't a universal law you know that says 'you must not paint a red line line unless you use it for this one purpose'