Is Yahweh really the prime creator?

page: 5
11
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join

posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 01:52 AM
link   
There is something that doesn't sound right about this version of creation.

When i read this part:


On a lower level, Sophia (Wisdom) appeared as an Emanation of Barbelo. She wanted to create a male entity to appear out of herself, but without approval of the Spirit and without letting her consort know it (consorts are mentioned in connection with entities; hence they are actually androgynous, but either the female or male part comes in appearance). It was her own idea. She actually had just a thought, but on that level thoughts are creative: you think it, and then it is there. Therefore this entity came to be in ignorance and was imperfect. Sophia realized this and regretted it, cast the entity away from her and surrounded it with a luminous cloud, so that no one might see it but the Holy Spirit. She called it Yaldabaoth.


There are a few things that dont make sense here.

1. If she thinks it it appears?

-The only thing that can appear is the idea. It can only be hidden with her. She can not cast out a idea to a different dimension and hide it even if the idea is physical.


2. How can a creation know of its creator if it is cast out and sealed?

How can anyone write such a detailed description of all the Gods, and how they are able to create separate things?


Nibiru:

The story goes that Nibiru orbits our sun every 3600 years. When Nibiru is out of reach from the energy of our sun, Nibiru is as cold as ice. At that point the beings on Nibiru change dimension from 3d to 4th dimension.

My question is: how can they evolve to become technologically inferior to us humans on earth? Especially within the 3d dimension if they spend most of their time within a 4th dimension.




posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 02:04 AM
link   
I agree, water is more dense than energy. It's been an interesting discussion. I believe James of Wingmakers did give an interview for Project Camelot concerning the Anunnaki, if you're interested.



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 02:18 AM
link   
reply to post by rusethorcain
 


Specifically, followers of Rabbinical Judaism and a rare few Christians will choose not to use the "name of god" Yaweh יהוה. These are the exception to common use. Ironically, most Christians are unfamiliar with the name itself.

Use of the word, Elohim אלוהים is more of a function title, rather than the proper name, יהוה. In use in English, some choose to use "G-d" rather than Yaweh, despite that "god" is a function/role/title.

There are other gods named within the Tanach / Bible, and the use of "El" (a singular form of god versus Elohim- the plural) is common in many names and okay for common use (daniEL, nathiEL).

Use of the Proper Name of the central deity in this mythos is restricted. It gets shortened to just "Ya". Ex: YAnatan (Johnathan)

In my humble opinions, the monotheism theme is uncommon in history. Discussions here about a single Universal Authority / Creator is evidence of the great influence this mythos has had upon Western society.

Strangely, this mythos of monotheism and the very question, "Is יהוה the prime creator" has been wrestling with pantheistic challenges and influences for millennium. To specify use of the Proper Name יהוה could cause a rift with those holding strongly to the name ישוע (Yeshua/Jesus)... and again opens the trinity pantheon discussion.

After learning to speak, read and write Hebrew for purpose of discovering the answer to the question herein posed, I must say that in my humble opinion, the deity יהוה introduced in the Tanach cannot be the prime creator (perhaps I should say instead: I dearly hope it isn't the creator).

Nor does the deity יהוה maintain a constant identity throughout the various books after its introduction in Genesis. The nature and character of this character changes depending upon the author and events written. From my studies, its identity is not singular nor constant, and therefore cannot be a "prime" (due to its multi-facets / multiple personalities) creator.

Evidence of creation relating to it comes solely from the book of Genesis. Therein exists far too many questions, quandaries and challenges to have consistent logical progression. Sourcing the Torah as evidence of creation by Yaweh is inconclusive, debatable, and if true- terrifying.



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 02:29 AM
link   
To this discussion I wish to add a very abbreviated description in my words of the Gnostic world concept, based on Origen and other sources, as well as more than 30 years of regression experiences with many thousands of clients. This could hopefully widen the scope a little bit.

First there was only God’s “light world” and we were there with him, existing as entities from the beginning.
Some of us wanted to go out from the light world to have experiences we couldn’t have there.
God let us do that, since we have our free will, but THEN had to create material worlds, where we could be after we went out from the light.
First he created nine (3x3 according to Dionysios Areopagita) angelic levels and then as a tenth level the material worlds, and those of us who fell to that level became souls who were put in bodies.
Actually, that level would be the darker region of Yaldabaoth (see post above) and the world of humans a region within that level. The archons of Yaldabaoth could be compared to the Anunnaki.
Humans reincarnate in their world until they can return to the light world to stay there. Between incarnations they usually go to the periphery of the light world, since they are not yet there to stay.
They can stay only after at least two conditions are fulfilled (and there may be more): That we finally understand and LIVE LOVE, indiscriminately for all beings, and that we have reconciled with all souls who once were our victims or perpetrators.

Now the trouble official science has with reincarnation is that it fails to conceive of a soul that survives the death of the body. And the trouble with reincarnation for the Church is that it threatens its power…



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 02:41 AM
link   
reply to post by spy66
 


“If she thinks it, it appears?”
So say various creation stories: An idea “materializes” and takes form. On the spiritual level.
“How can a creation know of its creator if it is cast out and sealed?”
That is our problem! If we listen inside to our Epinoia (see post above) and allow for its inspiration, we can slowly begin to understand a bit more than our rational mind ever can…
“How can anyone write such a detailed description of all the Gods, and how they are able to create separate things?”
Out of inspiration (Epinoia) and information in ancient traditions from civilizations that still knew a bit of things we have to day lost knowledge of. They seem to have had certain information from the “gods” themselves that we don’t have.
“… how can they [the Nibiruans] evolve to become technologically inferior to us humans on earth? Especially within the 3d dimension if they spend most of their time within a 4th dimension.”
Who said that they are technologically inferior? They appear to be multidimensional beings (maybe, e.g., 5-dimensional) and, therefore, can do things we cannot imagine. However, it seems that their moral is not highly developed…



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 02:50 AM
link   
reply to post by sakokrap
 


As has been discussed above, Elohim is plural and literally means “gods”. Taking it that way makes us better understand many things… “The First One created the gods and the cosmic worlds, and with them the Earth” (Gen 1:1 more properly translated).

I agree with much that you wrote. However, we are here not considering only the Genesis, but also the Sumerian tradition that obviously precedes it as well as Christian Gnosticism that apparently had much knowledge that later became suppressed by the Church (for political reasons).


[edit on 2-9-2010 by memyself]

[edit on 2-9-2010 by memyself]



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 02:53 AM
link   
reply to post by Onboard2
 


Thanks. Can you give us a link?



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 03:35 AM
link   
Your post on Yahweh rocked I very much enjoyed the read. Keep up the good work my belief is that it doesn't matter what you believe as long as you stay in touch with your spiritual side that is what the father wants to keep you from being materialistic



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 05:46 AM
link   
reply to post by memyself
 


I made a post about this some time ago. There is a reason why your theory is wrong.

I will try and explain it again.

If we start with the infinite dimension. There are a few things we can say about it.

1. We can illustrate it with a image. Like the one bellow.





2. We can give the infinite dimension information by giving it lines of measurements. That way we can imagine the volume of it.



3. Since this dimension is infinite, it always was and always is. That also makes this infinite dimension a constant. That means it will never change. But since we have the existence of finite. it proves that it has changed.

Since it has changed it proves one more thing. That it has a awareness. The dimension knows what it is.



4. For this dimension of awareness to create other independent and separate dimensions of awareness's it must make changes to its self. The other dimensions can not be like it "infinite".

The infinite dimension can only do that by a compression. Because everything that the infinite create must exist within it self.

When Thee God did this. God already knew what everything would become. Because when God compressed himself, He also laid out the foundation of how his creation was to evolve/expand.
The other Gods we imagine we know about, have no authority to make independent changes to Gods original creation in mind. They have to fallow his grand design.

Where would they get the energy and tools from to alter his creation?

There is no way "She" would be able to create a male and female dimension without Gods help.








[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 07:34 AM
link   
reply to post by spy66
 


You are beginning to explain sacred geometry.

www.christcollege.co.nz...

In other words, we are not here to earn God's love, we are here to spend it.
...a snippet from an interesting link on the topic of sacred geometry.


[edit on 2-9-2010 by rusethorcain]



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 08:17 AM
link   
reply to post by spy66
 


First: The contraction is known as tzim-tzum in the Kabbalah (mentioned in one of my posts), taught by the great rabbi Isaac Luria.

I here miss the free will that God gave to all of us. If created gods have a free will, they will also be able to change certain things at their will, or they don't have any.

If the will is absolutely free, things will be possible that even God cannot predict. Since he is almighty, he CAN make it possible that created entities will do things he has not foreseen, so that the free will is absolute.

The Gnostics taught that we, all of us, once were in what you call the infinite dimension - I call it God's light world - at a time when that world was all there was. However, some of us wanted to go out of the light world to have experiences we could not have there - such as acting according to our free will even if that would hurt another entity. The latter is not possible in the light world, since there we were so connected that if I would there hurt another, I would in the same moment feel his pain myself. We, therefore, didn't do such things there and experienced this as a limitation of our free will.

So we wanted to go out from that world. God said something like: "That is not a good idea, but since you have your free will, I will let you have it, if you really want that." And we wanted it. He then contracted (tzim-tzum) so that a kind of free and first empty space arose. In that space he created worlds for them to live in, who wanted to go out - like we did – we, who, therefore, became humans.

In these worlds he changed time for a special purpose. We would still feel the pain we cause others – if that is what we choose to do – but later, mostly in a later incarnation. That is called karma and it is not punishment but a lesson. Then we know what we did and understand that it is wrong and that we will not do it again. Once we fully understand all of it and LIVE indiscriminate LOVE, we can finish our incarnations and return into the light world to stay there.

If everything was predictable and predetermined: what meaning would existence have? How could I then ever develop? It would be useless to take any effort or plan something, since I could not change things anyway and it would have to become as predicted.

“She”, I suppose that you mean Sophia, created Yaldabaoth. As I have written in one of my posts, this will have been planned by the prime creator God for the purpose of having him make a world of relative darkness for those who were to “fall” into that world, to play out there free will and experience their karma and hence learn their lessons.

I miss this aspect in your geometry…

Now please don't claim that we couldn't learn from karma if we don't know why we have it. We DO know - in our souls, just not in our little rational mind. When the soul has left the body, it knows very well what the body's brain couldn't know and understand.




[edit on 2-9-2010 by memyself]



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 09:09 AM
link   
Greetings Brothers and Sisters,

Forgive me for not reading every post in this thread. I want to reply to the original post without my thoughts tainted by others replies. I therefore apologise for any unintended repetition.

Yahweh the name of God? To borrow a bit from Shakespeare, would God by any other name be just as Magnificent?

Before we understand his name, we must first understand what it is we are naming.

Who amongst us who believes in God, does not think his idea of God is undefinable? If one believes his God is definable, he has limited his God and therefore made it inferior to himself, and therefore not a God at all. To understand that God is undefinable, all one has to do is look at creation, or for the Atheist, existence. It is infinite! Every time we think we have found the limits of creation/existence, we later discover through technology and exploration that our limits were nothing but self imposed. The electron microscope gave us the world of atoms, and we now know that the world of atoms is but a beginning in the journey of quantum science. The Hubble telescope revealed an infinite universe that we cannot even comprehend the breadth of. Creation/Existence is far beyond what one mind can define, yet is arranged in a very precise order which we can calculate. The calculations reveal that everything is connected from the smallest to the largest pieces of creation/existence. These connections defy any chance at mere randomness. Without randomness, something had to do the arranging! This being is God. Omniscient and Omnipresent, all things come from him and so too do all things return.

How can something so beyond our comprehension have something so minuscule in the scheme of things as a name? All we can do is label the idea of God, and we have done so since the dawn of man, as best we could according to our cultural understanding. Are we not beyond our cultural limitations now? God needs not a name to exist. God needs not a belief in him to exist. We however, must have God to exist. Even the Atheist among us, exists but by God. Don't we need the Atheist to progress? If it were not for the questioning of the existence of God, we would still be worshipping the Sun, assuming that it is the greatest things in Creation/Existence. Now we know that God has much more in store for us. He created a wondrous universe for us to explore both outside us, and within. We can get there if we just put aside our differences and work together to explore it. The only thing that seperates us is culture and upbringing. United despite these differences, we could do so much more. We create our own limitations. We are the divine spark of God, destined to explore his greatness.

There is but one Law of God, do unto others that which you would have them do unto you. Every great religion has this as its foundation. Every human heart wants this at its core. Who here does not want to be loved for who you are? Give it to your Brothers, and you will receive it in return.

With love,

Your Brother



[edit on 2-9-2010 by IAMIAM]



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 09:12 AM
link   

Originally posted by rusethorcain
reply to post by spy66
 


You are beginning to explain sacred geometry.

www.christcollege.co.nz...

In other words, we are not here to earn God's love, we are here to spend it.
...a snippet from an interesting link on the topic of sacred geometry.


[edit on 2-9-2010 by rusethorcain]


Not really. What i am explaining is the law God created for existence.

God created existence in a specific order when he compressed. Because a compression of energies will do specific things. A compression will cause a packing of energies, and at the same time as the proses of compression is taking place, you will get emitted energies "light and heat" among many.

By studying our own dimension we can perfectly explain how it works, and must work. Because we are at the core of creation. We are among the solids that feed the expansion of energies into the universe "heaven".

We have to keep in mind that all energies expand out wards from its source.


Look at the light, it is expanding from the compressed source.



If this image represents Gods only creation. We know that everything that God had planed will evolve from the expansion of this dimension. That means the other Gods cant exist, and dont have authority over Gods creation. They dont even have authority to argue with him.



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 09:23 AM
link   
reply to post by IAMIAM
 


Dear Brother,
I agree - talking about The First One, the primordial creator. But we are here discussing if someone put himself in between, shielded us off from The First One and wanted us to believe that he would be the prime creator and that we shouldn't know of things above him.

The reason for questioning this is the enormous amount of suffering in this world and that the one who put himself in between even has ordered us humans to commit horrible atrocities, as extensively described in the OT.

And we discuss why The First One let this happen.

As concerns the geometry, I would like to add that it to me is very static and it seems that something dynamic - flexible and adapting - is missing. I think these are words that I would like to use.



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 09:37 AM
link   

Originally posted by memyself
reply to post by IAMIAM
 


Dear Brother,
I agree - talking about The First One, the primordial creator. But we are here discussing if someone put himself in between, shielded us off from The First One and wanted us to believe that he would be the prime creator and that we shouldn't know of things above him.

The reason for questioning this is the enormous amount of suffering in this world and that the one who put himself in between even has ordered us humans to commit horrible atrocities, as extensively described in the OT.

And we discuss why The First One let this happen.

As concerns the geometry, I would like to add that it to me is very static and it seems that something dynamic - flexible and adapting - is missing. I think these are words that I would like to use.


There is one put between Us and God, it is created by us, and is allowed by God. It is our own limitations to love each other. We have the choice of whether this divider exists. I choose to not allow it to exist. If you need it, then have it. Suffering exists in this world because we as a species allow it. None of us are born murderers, rapists, torturers, or anything else "evil". We learn these things through life. They are reactions to the life we have lead. They are the results of our choices, and the choices of others. If we open our hearts to love the murderers, the rapists, the "evils" of the world, we would find what pain has brought them to their choices, and with love be able to heal them. It is our choice. Shall we destroy ourselves, or grow?



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 10:18 AM
link   
reply to post by IAMIAM
 


I must agree with you. There is a force that separates us from God, and its non other then our selves. But there is a reason for that to.

I have created two images, One that explains the religious view and one that explains the order of expanding energy. They are exactly the same, but viewed differently by scientists and religious people.



1. The religious view:





2. A scientists view:



As you can see there is a lot of energy that separates us from God.

What we humans have done is created Gods out of the emitted energies.



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 10:33 AM
link   

Originally posted by spy66
reply to post by IAMIAM
 


But there is a reason for that to.


We create the reason as well...

Thank you for the images Brother. They show symbolically the truth. My only difference of opinion is that the image shows God away from the center. In fact God is the entire picture, your words, the laptop I am viewing from, my eyes that I perceive it with, and my mind that Comprehends it. As well as the air that I am breathing, the sun which warms me, the porch I sit on, etc. God is All.

Thank you for your additions to this conversation Brother.

With Love,

Your Brother



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 11:12 AM
link   
reply to post by spy66
 

You can't trust other religions, all religions are corupted.
They are made up by the snake, the snake turned everything upside down, the snake rules the earth. The snake states everything is an illusion. We will see how the snake laughs covered in ice. Reallity is a beauty, a gift.
So special to walk around and do what you want, control is an illusion, the only one who can control if it desires is god. God did not create robots, created the human to be a human, not a damn robot. The snake can't be human, so it acts like a robot, kabalah ? it has no power, if people wake up they would kick but. They teach to be a robot, they have no souls


The true spiritual human is amazing, it's why they took the blue out of the water, poluted everything, so people don't get it.



[edit on 2-9-2010 by pepsi78]



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 11:36 AM
link   

Originally posted by pepsi78
reply to post by spy66
 

You can't trust other religions, all religions are corupted.
They are made up by the snake, the snake turned everything upside down, the snake rules the earth. The snake states everything is an illusion. We will see how the snake laughs covered in ice. Reallity is a beauty, a gift.
So special to walk around and do what you want, control is an illusion, the only one who can control if it desires is god. God did not create robots, created the human to be a human, not a damn robot. The snake can't be human, so it acts like a robot, kabalah ? it has no power, if people wake up they would kick but. They teach to be a robot, they have no souls


The true spiritual human is amazing, it's why they took the blue out of the water, poluted everything, so people don't get it.



[edit on 2-9-2010 by pepsi78]


My Brother, you profess to have ultimate control over yourself, yet you choose to use that control to mock others for not having the same control as you? Truly you have not control if you can judge others simply because they are where you once were?

Do you think you can open minds with mockery? Try loving instead of hating. Then all will be with you.

Just some thoughts with love,

Your Brother

[edit on 2-9-2010 by IAMIAM]



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 12:17 PM
link   

Originally posted by pepsi78
reply to post by spy66
 

You can't trust other religions, all religions are corupted.
They are made up by the snake, the snake turned everything upside down, the snake rules the earth. The snake states everything is an illusion. We will see how the snake laughs covered in ice. Reallity is a beauty, a gift.
So special to walk around and do what you want, control is an illusion, the only one who can control if it desires is god. God did not create robots, created the human to be a human, not a damn robot. The snake can't be human, so it acts like a robot, kabalah ? it has no power, if people wake up they would kick but. They teach to be a robot, they have no souls


The true spiritual human is amazing, it's why they took the blue out of the water, poluted everything, so people don't get it.



[edit on 2-9-2010 by pepsi78]



You learn nothing by faith alone. Unless you search for the facts you have faith in.

If you keep on reading human facts you will most likely miss out on all the facts. The facts are within your own awareness. All you have to do is trust it to figure it out. Don't trust someone else's awareness because they can tell you a fictional lie.





new topics
top topics
 
11
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join