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Am I losing my Religion?

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posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 12:06 AM
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Originally posted by AidanK
I've been a lifelong member of the Roman Catholic church. I always believed in God and have prayed daily just like I was taught in my youth. Lately, the economy has tanked, my mother's health has taken a turn for the worse and things just generally stink - very badly.

I watch the nightly news and see nothing but bad news and disasters befalling humanity around the globe. I really can't believe it but for the first time I'm starting to question how this can be. How can my loving God allow these things to happen?

I have almost stopped praying for anything. I no longer believe that anyone is listening. I have always been taught that God answers ALL prayers, even if we might not like the answer but I must say that why MUST the answer ALWAYS be NO?? I don't constantly ask for things, just a little help with life.

I guess I'm about at my breaking point and floundering for help. Can anyone provide any advice here? Many thanks to you all.


Everything happens for a reason. We are to learn through the catalysts, how to cope, accept, and remember, we are in control of how we react to them.

Its not so much about God intervening and making things all better.

Trust that the design of the world has purpose, purpose in teaching humanity. Sometimes us as individuals and us as a whole unit, must walk many paths that are not (trial and error) to learn the paths that are.

If we are the one's to move the mountains and go on to better things....why should God intervene? Why should Thee 'fix' the things that we are to learn to fix ourselves?

The world is going through alot, just be a light to others through these times....instead of wishing God would be the fix, let Thee's love and light shine through you.

Just sharing thoughts...I dont think God intervenes. I think we have purpose in duality and hard times...they are to teach us things. Sometimes this path of learning takes thousands and thousands of years.

Hold onto hope...find hope in the warm sun, smiles of children, the life of nature which provides us with our life.

Just suggestions and things to think about...I lost my religion....but am now a stronger Spirit then what I have ever been. Im OK with admitting to God....I do not know the 'truth'...for all Thee needs to see is my heart, my true intent, my humbleness as I come before Thee.

I dont think this world is a mistake or error...I think its perfect with Divine intentions that awaits US to sift and measure things of Spirit and of flesh.

I used to pray for God to intervene in alot of things. Now I only pray with showing thanks for the things I do have and not ask for the things I dont have.

I dont think we are to wait on God...I think God is waiting on us, to fulfill our purpose as a unit here, as the children of God that we are.

Try to hold hope, try to forgive those that do not know what they do. Each persons path is personal, each person has personal paths that are offering them what they are in need of. Obviously, many paths are being offered many catalysts right now. As well, us as a world/species...are also being offered many catalysts right now. We learn the most, through the hardest of times. It is the hard times, that offer us opportunities of leaps...not steps. Few will take the leaps...some will even take steps backwards...but still, they will learn.

Loosing religion is one thing...loosing faith that there is hope and purpose for all that is, is another. Trust that all is a part of the Divine plan.

LV




posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 12:06 AM
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Originally posted by facelift
reply to post by OldThinker
 


Prayers for insight, wisdom and perseverance...

This helped me when doubts arose many yrs ago...



What's up my Lean Sigma Six amigo..?


Now, you don't really see the 'conflict' between those 2 sentences, do you OT..?



I'm great-thx!

Do I "see" a conflict....more than that I "am" a conflict...but I'm in good company...Romans 7:15

Good point, too, no quick fix...lotta meat in the audio I posted...maybe I'll do a DMAIC



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 12:11 AM
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Originally posted by AidanK
I have almost stopped praying for anything. I no longer believe that anyone is listening. I have always been taught that God answers ALL prayers, even if we might not like the answer but I must say that why MUST the answer ALWAYS be NO?? I don't constantly ask for things, just a little help with life.


One of the constants that I read about prayer, and I have come to believe myself, is that God helps us on his terms, not ours. We may see the "perfect solution" to our problems, pray for it, and not have it happen, but perhaps this was not the perfect solution.

My wife died in March. I was, and still remain, devastated, and my prayers in the past five months have been focused on myself and my family. The best thing, for me, would be for God to give me my wife back, and don't think I haven't prayed that. However, I accept that, while I might think that this is best, it apparently is not, as it has not happened.

When I look at what has happened to me, to my daughter, to my wife's family and many others, since her passing, I do see a lot of good that has happened. While it doesn't seem to me to outweigh the bad, most of the bad has been focused on me, and I'm okay with that.

We don't understand God. We can't understand God. That is a basic truth of faith, and once you get beyond that, you can start to reconcile your wants with your needs, and your state with your potential. To fault God for our current condition diminishes both him and us, but once we buck up, accept our state, and ask God to help us to our potential, we will find a way out of our state.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 12:29 AM
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reply to post by jheated5
 


wow! you are completely retarded I guess! If you fit into the "form" then please fill it! as for your redundant post< i highly doubt you will have any significant imput other than to agree with the"follow your heart" rhetoric that has already led this person to his dilemma! Two thumbs up for you!!

OP, please keep in mind that YOU are the only person who can change anything in your life!

Peace and Hope to you



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 12:44 AM
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I can certainly understand your frustration. However, there is a price of free will. I too am a Christian and I often struggle to understand how/why God lets bad things happen.

The best answer I can come up with, is we can't have it both ways; we can't have free will and yet never have anything bad happen. If that were the case, if bad things never happened, what would be the point of life? If we knew everything would always have a positive outcome, what would be the incentive in life? Where would wisdom come from?

Remember, Abraham was asked to sacrifice his son, Issac, to prove his faith in God.

In a period of about a year I lost a business, filed for bankruptcy, had open heart surgery and started a new job. The stress caught up with me and I developed panic and anxiety attacks. Those were the worst things I have ever been through. The sheer terror and fear of panic attacks and continuous depersonalizaton and feelings of unreality were horrific. I turned to God and the bible in combination with audio therapy and overcame it.

In hindsight, I believe that God did what he had to do to get my attention and I wouldn't change a thing. I am thankful that He took the time to set me on the right course. I am now involved with my church, I play in the worship team and am going to start Stephen Ministry training. In short, I am thankful for what I have gone through.

As far as what the world is going through right now, one only has to read the bible. Free will has brought us here, not God. God may be all powerful but that is not to say he causes all things. He may LET them happen but he doesn't cause them. Until we have seen the final outcome, we can't judge what is happening now. Our freewill has caused sin and our sin has been the cause of our downfall. But fear not, the earth will be cleansed of all sin and Christ will rule for a thousand years. I don't know about you, but I am looking forward to that day.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 12:57 AM
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"I knew I was God during my prayers, when I suddenly realised I spoke to myself". A changed quote with a forgotten source.

Life's changed for the better since I left behind religion and the fallacies of a deity. You only need to open your eyes. Think with a clear head for yourself, without guidance from anything, too see the world around you for what it is and the world of theism for what it truly is.

That's my advice.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 01:11 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


Originally posted by AidanK
How can my loving God allow these things to happen?

A loving God does not allow these things to happen, they happen because of mans fall from grace and the entry of sin and death into our world. The world we live in is subject to the ruler of this world, satan. If you want to blame someone for the human condition, put the blame in the correct place. Not God, but man, sin, and satan.

Often the devil uses events like what you are listing to try and temp/test Christians away from God. Look at the book of Job for example. This is called Spiritual Warfare.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 01:30 AM
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reply to post by AidanK
 

REM- Losing My Religion
www.youtube.com...

I'm not trying to make light of your situation but you sound like you need a laugh. Anywho, I don't know what to tell you. Losing faith is hard but it can also be freeing somehow.

[edit on 28-8-2010 by Skid Mark]



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 02:29 AM
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reply to post by defcon5
 

It's a bit simplistic to blame all the world's problems on "mans fall from grace" and fall on satan's lap, don't you think? Besides didn't god create everything? Does that mean god created satan? If so, then WHY? If not then where the hell did he come from? Do you really believe this nonsense?

I think OP's main issue is that something inside doesn't feel right and these simplistic explanations are not cutting it anymore. For that the OP should be applauded
not told to go read a book and be told what to think AGAIN.

AidanK,

I believe that you are a very intelligent and courageous person to be able to fight off years of conditioning and to critically think for yourself. After all, if there is a god, why would he/she/it not want us to be critical thinkers, who believe in him by choice rather than being brainwashed to believe in him from childhood. Never stop questioning things. Life and this world are more complex than man, sin and satan. Knowledge is power.

My other advice to you would be to try meditation. You be surprised how much it can help you at times like this. Meditation can definitely provide you with more helpful answers than others ever could. It's also helps with stress and provides mental clarity.

Best of luck



[edit on 28-8-2010 by endlessknowledge]



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 02:32 AM
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"Losing my religion" is an old US Southern expression, made famous mostly by the R.E.M. song.

It's not about not going to church anymore.

It's basically the equivalent of "at the end of my rope" but specifically, it describes a situation where you are basically doing a lot of angry swearing and about to choke the s*** out of somebody, or something like that, which is clearly not so much in keeping with the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Well, except for John 69: 25-624

"and Jesus said unto them, 'Ya'll are driving me bonkers, stop trippin''

but woe, they would not stop trippin.

And then, somebody got up in Jesus' face, and he turned the other cheek while they rambled on and on with the same typical whiny BS that Jesus had just made very clear that he had had enough of. And yet his patience was indeed godly.

But then, a little fleck of unchewed corn and spit flew from the mouth of the damn fool who was up in Jesus' grill. And it flew in an arc into the eye of Jesus, and low, he was $*@( pi**ed off. I mean, seriously.

"Mother f**ker my eye!!!" roared Jesus, and he back handed the fool, who did sail through the air about 30 feet backward, and then he shat himself with fear, which we could both hear and smell. And Jesus said "I told you!" Motherf**ker I told you!!! BOOOYAHHH!!!! THAT'S WHAT YOU GET!!!!" And he did the backhand motion again, like a gladiator reenacting his victory move, when he said "booyah."

And then Jesus let fly such a stream of obscenity as none but the Son of God could. It was really impressive actually. And I tried to write it down, but he saw me writing, and said "John, what the f***, put the quill down. Put it the f*** down." And so I put it the f*** down.

I mean, I've never seen him like that, but yay, we had at last the answer to the question 'could Jesus throw down?' And the answer was 'you bet your a** he can throw down.'

And then somebody mocked Jesus for slapping the fool, citing Jesus's own teachings, and I gasped because I knew something bad was about to happen, and Jesus raised his index finger and pointed at the man and turned him into an onion, but kind of like a muppet onion, with a face and a mouth and it could talk, which we knew because it then said "well sh**, now what."

And verily, the crowd fell silent, and quaked with fear. And the Apostles were definitely included in that group, I mean, I peed myself a little.

And then, big Andrew, Peter's brother, simple as he was, started to giggle. And it was not a manly giggle, it was like the giggle of a little girl.

And Jesus was still angry, and he looked at Andrew like he was about to really freak out. And Andrew said "I'm sorry, I can't help it. You slapped the sh** out of that guy. I mean literally, and he's up on that roof over there."

And Jesus said nothing and tried to keep his mean face on, but I think I saw him smirk a little, and everyone else was still motionless and quaking with fear, but Andrew could not stop his giggling from becoming a laugh, and the laugh became so strong he had trouble breathing and started to cry a bit.

And it was hard to understand him, but he said "An onion! You turned him into a cute little onion thing! [unintelligible sentences]. I don't know how you hold back man, I'd do that sh** every day! I mean, EVERY day."

And Jesus dropped his mean face with a great sigh, and the crowd relaxed a bit, but was still wary...

And Jesus said "I'm sorry, I'm just f***in' tired of the same whiny BS day after day after day..."

And Andrew, who had begun to get a hold of himself finally, said "well hey, you're human after all then. Let's go get a beer, homes. I mean, that's what we do."

And Jesus said "You right dog, you right."

And everyone could see that it was ok to relax a bit more.

And Mark, who was thoughtful, said "umm, I guess you should turn that guy back into a human...uh, right?"

And Jesus said "remind me tomorrow."

But actually, we forgot.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 02:50 AM
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I'm pretty sure the actual 'doctrine' explanation is more like...

Bad sh*t can happen here because this world is just not the most important one.

Your time here vs your time in the next world is like comparing the time it takes you to sneeze to the history of the universe times infinity.

Thus, it's just an illusion, and not all that important an illusion.

You love somebody, they die when it's their time, and you die when it's your time, and you see them in the next world if you were good, and if they were bad, you can bring them cookies in purgatory not Hell, because they aren't in Hell, because the first thing Jesus did when he died the human way was whip the mother loving sh** out of the devil.

I mean hey, I didn't write it. But it's nice, eh?

And as for serious Bible references, I've always liked and tried to trust the one from John where Jesus breaks down the whole 'how to get to Heaven' thing using the 'good shepherd' metaphor. Specifically, the promise that his flock would recognize his voice, and that you'd always be in ear shot, more or less.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 03:02 AM
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I believe in a God, you asked why he allows these things to happen. We have free will, we can chose to worship him or not. We can live life as we please with temptation on our left side and a conscience on our right. I believe it is us allowing these things to happen, we believe the lies we are given, we know exactly where our TAX money is going yet we do not complain, we support the very people that are destroying our world, we purchase their products, rarely give to the needy, purchase items of luxury when millions of homeless children are starving, live life like Kings until we hit rock bottom, until we lose something that we cannot replace....then we end up running back to God.....and at the end of the day we still seem to ask why God lets this happen. We let this happen!!!!



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 03:07 AM
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I'm sorry to hear about all of the troubles you have had to experience lately in your life. I truly hope things turn around for the better soon.

My feeling is that we have a limited view of God, something that we as mere humans have no power over--we don't have the capacity to imagine God as anything other than a supernatural person up in the sky who either grants or doesn't grant wishes based solely on their whim. We tend to turn God into a super-being that matches our image (as opposed to the traditional Judeo-Christian idea of the other way around).

God is not an adult Santa Claus. I prefer to think of God in non-theistic terms, such as Paul Tillich and John Shelby Spong's idea of God as the "ground of all being". If this sort of unknowable abstract idea of God as a "non-person" is embraced, than one can conceivably accept that God is not in the business of stopping/changing/preventing/granting. More simply, maybe God "is", but not God "does".

Hope this helps.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 03:19 AM
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reply to post by 11andrew34
 


... and ALL the Angels in Heaven did verily

roll about on the floor

(which was as a sea of glass ... etc . etc. )


at your post !




posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 03:24 AM
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I'm sorry to here about your troubles, life can be a bit Sh*t, look at all those in Pakistan, millions have lost their homes, family members and livelihoods.

Why would God answer your prayers and not theirs? Maybe, just maybe there is no God, maybe religion is a tool for one group of humans to control another? Maybe the world wasn't created in 7 days and maybe men and women evolved and are not made in gods image?

I think there are many questions you could ask about your religion? You are a human being blessed with a brain for questioning things, use it.

[edit on 28-8-2010 by woodwardjnr]



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 05:37 AM
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As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.


Originally posted by endlessknowledge
It's a bit simplistic to blame all the world's problems on "mans fall from grace" and fall on satan's lap, don't you think?

No, its stated straight out in the Bible starting right off with the fall from the garden:


But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. - Genesis 2:17

In that day, Adam and Eve did die. According to the Bible no one has lived over 1000 years old, 1000 years being a day to God. Adam died in his 900’s.



And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel." To the woman he said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you." To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,' "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat of it all the days of your life. It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field. By the sweat of your brow you will eat your food until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken; for dust you are and to dust you will return." Genesis 3: 15-19

Before the “Fall” man did not know evil, pain, death, work, conflict, or any of the bad things that we now toil under.


Originally posted by endlessknowledge
Besides didn't god create everything? Does that mean god created satan?

Yes, God created Satan, but he did not cause Satan to sin, nor did God create sin. Sin has existed since the beginning, the same way that God has existed from the beginning. Sin exists simply because God exists. Its hard to explain, but think of it sort of like Yin and Yang. Things are either of God, and are good, or they are sin. Anything created has the ability to fall out of grace with God through disobeying Gods laws and sinning.

You ever notice that the Angles fell from grace as well, yet they were not granted a chance at salvation like man was? There is a reason for this, but it goes beyond what I have time to write about now.


Originally posted by endlessknowledge
I think OP's main issue is that something inside doesn't feel right and these simplistic explanations are not cutting it anymore.

There are no such simplistic explanations in the Bible, if you really want to understand it, it takes many years of study. People devote their entire lives to learning and understanding what is written in it. Now many Churches realize that most of their membership do not have the drive or the understanding to spend that amount of time learning the subject, so they simplify it for them.

Catholicism is one of the worst at doing this, and they do not even recommend that their members even try to read and interpret the bible. There are multiple reasons why the Roman Catholic Church does this, and it goes well beyond what we are discussing here. However, it brings up a good point that maybe the OP should talk to some pastors that are of other denominations beyond the RCC.


Originally posted by endlessknowledge
For that the OP should be applauded
not told to go read a book and be told what to think AGAIN.

I am going to bet, that being a Roman Catholic, that the OP most likely did not even realize what I had written above was in the Bible. Its one of the issues that they never seem t discuss or explain to their parishioners.

I know a person who makes vestments for the Roman Catholic Church, right up to the Pope himself. They have won awards from the RCC some of which have been given to only a handful of members throughout history. One day we got into a discussion about the fact that Satan rules this world, and she actually argued with me that there was no such thing in the Bible. I pulled out her bible, and showed it to her. She was utterly in shock that she had never even heard such a thing before.


Originally posted by endlessknowledge
After all, if there is a god, why would he/she/it not want us to be critical thinkers, who believe in him by choice rather than being brainwashed to believe in him from childhood.

Actually thinking for ourselves was what got us into trouble to begin with. God created the universe and the laws that govern it. If God had told Adam not to go jump off a cliff because of the law of gravity, and Adam did it anyway because he both doubted and disobeyed God, he would have become subject to the laws he broke. This is no different. When we did not trust God, disobeyed, and broke the rules, sin entered our world and we became subject to that sin. Because God cannot allow sin to be in his presence we had to be cast out of the garden and out of communion with God. However God gave us an out to get back into his graces when we die, simply through accepting God’s Grace.


As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 05:49 AM
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Seek and ye will find.

That is all the advise that I can give you.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 05:59 AM
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reply to post by AidanK
 


Watch The Invention of Lying.

www.youtube.com...

There is no man in the sky.

ALL major religions, every single one of them was constructed to manipulate and control man.

The question you should be asking, is by whom.

We together all of us - are "god".

You have achieved the first step towards enlightenment.

You grasp within your hand, what in the movie, "The Matrix" was termed, "the red pill".

Will you swallow it and see how deep the rabbit hole goes?

The choice is yours.

I suggest research. Read, read and read.

The Gods of Eden by William Bramley
Tales From The Time Loop by David Icke (Page 41)
High Strangeness by Laura Knight Jadczyk
Infinite love is the only Truth Everything Else is illusion by David Icke
Physics of the impossible by Michio Kaku.

It's sort of like the day you learned there wasn't a Santa Claus - you have crossed a threshold from a child's perspective over to an adult (soul) perspective.

Not everyone has the guts to completely cross over it.

We are immortal, spiritual beings trapped in a 3d shell.

The longing each of us feels is our need to return to "the source" from whence we came.

Like drops of the water, each of us - and god is the ocean.

Be warned, once you swallow that red pill, there is probably no going back. You will never quite be the same as you were before.

Freedom is a &itch. With freedom comes responsiblity vs being blindly led in bondage and servitude.

[edit on 28-8-2010 by ofhumandescent]



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 07:16 AM
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Hi. It sounds like you are having a bad time of it. My sympathies. I had my own share of concentrated misfortune over the last 3 years. It can feel like the universe is out to get you sometimes. Everything you touch turns to crud...I've been there.

Heres the best advice I can give. I was raised a protestant christian but i rejected all the 'god/heaven' aspects early on, so my advice is of a more grounded nature.

The good news is, if you remain calm it smoothes out. The universe is not out to get you. Your life is important to you and your loved ones but thats it. Wider humanity doesn't care and neither does the wider universe (or god if you prefer). Life throws random things at you, its up to you how you deal with them. Its unlikely any problem you have is truly unique. Somebody somewhere has already been through it and lived to tell the tale.

The danger is to focus on the negatives. Things can snowball if you let them. Its easy to think, my life is bad so its all bad, if you look for evidence the world is bad you will find it in spades. That can bog you down. Instead of carrying your own problems (real but limited in scope), you start worrying about the world. That can lead to apathy, stopping looking after yourself, ill health, more un-happiness...and on down in a spiral. I went down a ways myself.

Heres what I advise:

Routine. The most underrated tool for coping with life's troubles. Focus down into the essentials. Plan your day and stick to the plan when possible. Anchor yourself in a daily pattern of repetition. Wear it like armour. Leave the bigger questions till your through the fire.

Sleep. Worry and stress robs you of sleep. Which in turn impairs your ability to deal with stress. Incorporate enough sleep into your routine (8 hours). Allow an hour wind down between going to bed and being asleep. If you have trouble try an ipod guided meditation track (yeah, i know, laugh it up, but it worked for me). Also no food after 7pm and no stimulants (alcohol, coffee, tea).

Exercise. If you do a physical job already this doesn't apply..If you spent 10 years working in a cubicle it does. Make enough time in your day for 45 mins exercise. It helps with the stress and with sleeping, amazingly so.

Dont watch the news. Don't read the papers. Get a DVR and record any TV shows you like to catch up on at the weekend. Otherwise the goggle box will steal your sleep/exercise time during the week. Leave this site alone for a while. The world will take care of itself while you sort yourself out. Its not going anywhere.


On the other side, when all is settled you'll find your faith is where you left it. Or you'll find you don't need it anymore. Whatever works for you.

Hope this helps some.



posted on Aug, 28 2010 @ 07:30 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


Originally posted by ofhumandescent
ALL major religions, every single one of them was constructed to manipulate and control man.

Since my religion teaches salvation through grace, not works, how does this allow anyone to control my actions/works? Additionally, a true Christian believes that they are to only follow the rules of man until they conflict with the rules of God, if such a conflict exists, then we are obligated to not follow mans rules.

Again how does that give control?

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



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