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An open letter to Conservatives

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posted on Aug, 31 2010 @ 01:20 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 



I don't think we are going to see a group of citizens willing to serve the country unless there is money to be made. Our entire culture is based off of monetary and material compensation. I believe we will not see a change in politics until we change the way we live.

Needless to say, I am not very optimistic about that.




posted on Aug, 31 2010 @ 01:28 PM
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Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by getreadyalready
 



I don't think we are going to see a group of citizens willing to serve the country unless there is money to be made. Our entire culture is based off of monetary and material compensation. I believe we will not see a change in politics until we change the way we live.

Needless to say, I am not very optimistic about that.


I am afraid you are correct, but if you are correct then the country is doomed!

As long as people are serving the country with the motivation of fattening their own pocket books or gaining favor with some large corporation for a cushy position after their term, then nobody is looking out for the welfare of the Republic.

There are a great many papers I could recommend that show how people felt about government from 1776 to 1950. It was an honorable endeavour by people that were doing a public service. They served out of duty and patriotism. That all started changing about 50-60 years ago, and it was extremely accelerated after Watergate, Korea, Vietnam, MonicaGate, Whitewater, Iran-Contra, Bush-Kerry, 9/11, and now Obamanation.

People have no respect for government, and government has no respect for people. This is why I often say, Tea Parties, love them or hate them, but if they are not successful this fall, then things are going to start looking very, very grim for the entrenched government!



posted on Aug, 31 2010 @ 01:43 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


I think the tea party has already failed. The minute the Republicans noticed the tea party gaining momentum, they called in the big name, big money people to pull it back to the Right. Beck and Hannity, etc. So I have no faith in that movement. And as a conservative, I disagree with some of the tea party's positions.

This will sound bad, but I think that the system has to fail. The old saying: 'it has to get worse, before it gets better' will probably hold true in regards to our economy and government. Maybe we need to start over. The constitution has been molested by people who strive for power. We need to start anew.



posted on Aug, 31 2010 @ 02:10 PM
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reply to post by sheepslayer247
 


The Tea Party hasn't failed, until after the November elections, but it is certainly shackled to a giant parasitic Republican ball and chain!

I hope you are wrong about the "get worse before it gets better." If this November is just more of the same, even if the Republicans win, and it is the mainstream career politicians that take all the spots, it will still be a failure, and it will start to become clear that the government will have to be changed by force, rather than by politics. I am not endorsing a revolution. I am simply stating the obvious. We are running out of options, the country is quickly failing, and if we can't fix it by political means, then our patriots are going to start looking for other methods.



posted on Aug, 31 2010 @ 03:06 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 



If you look at the candidates, even the tea party candidates, it is more of the same. Most non-incumbent candidates have been approved and funded by one of the major parties. I do not see a change in the forecast. I see more of the same, but I hope I am wrong.

Lets not forget thought that the polls can be manipulated. So who knows what will happen.



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 04:20 PM
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bush didn't help our cause,,,,, he was far from conservative,,, in fact he trampled all over everything in the playbook

i think he has tarnished the conservative brand beyond repair,,,, of course his congress had to back his agenda as well
hell,,, he even had democratic support



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 05:49 PM
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Originally posted by shortywarn
bush didn't help our cause,,,,, he was far from conservative,,, in fact he trampled all over everything in the playbook

i think he has tarnished the conservative brand beyond repair,,,, of course his congress had to back his agenda as well
hell,,, he even had democratic support



I think this De-Bushing of conservatives at large is a symptom of what is wrong - I think it is rather factual that
a HUGE portion of Conservative America voted for the man twice... What is to stop this from happening from here until the end of time???

You guys have to figure this out -

Who do you have now???

A whole line of Bush like contenders

If you are serious you HAVE TO examine this disfunction, because what America gets in return are overt CORPORATISTS.



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 06:13 PM
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Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by getreadyalready
 


I think the tea party has already failed. The minute the Republicans noticed the tea party gaining momentum, they called in the big name, big money people to pull it back to the Right. Beck and Hannity, etc. So I have no faith in that movement. And as a conservative, I disagree with some of the tea party's positions.

This will sound bad, but I think that the system has to fail. The old saying: 'it has to get worse, before it gets better' will probably hold true in regards to our economy and government. Maybe we need to start over. The constitution has been molested by people who strive for power. We need to start anew.



I wouldn't give up on "the movement" right yet. I think the "Tea Party" is just the visible part of the movement with many other folks of all persuasions quietly waiting until the elections in November to cast their ballots of displeasure.

TPTB and the MSM will do its best to contain and shape the "revolt of the voters" but they are as out of touch with the voters as are our representatives. So before you write off the discontented voters of all parties across the country, let's wait out the next 6 weeks and see what happens in November.

"And as a conservative, I disagree with some of the tea party's positions." Would you care to elaborate???



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 06:24 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by sheepslayer247
 


The Tea Party hasn't failed, until after the November elections, but it is certainly shackled to a giant parasitic Republican ball and chain!

I hope you are wrong about the "get worse before it gets better." If this November is just more of the same, even if the Republicans win, and it is the mainstream career politicians that take all the spots, it will still be a failure, and it will start to become clear that the government will have to be changed by force, rather than by politics. I am not endorsing a revolution. I am simply stating the obvious. We are running out of options, the country is quickly failing, and if we can't fix it by political means, then our patriots are going to start looking for other methods.


I agree wholeheartedly. We've got the November and 2012 elections to effect peaceful change before other options may be necessary.

I will be moving to the country if it gets to that point.



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 06:30 PM
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reply to post by sheepslayer247
 


I am in agreement on the vast majority of what you wrote about what is wrong with conservatives. Especially the lodestone of strictly Christian ideology. Change is not good nor bad per se, just different. However I will disagree on one example you used.



The same argument can be made regarding Islam and the ground zero mosque. The constitution allows for any religion to thrive in America without the intervention of others. Do we really want to set the precedent that allows a political party or faith to dictate what people of another faith can do with their personal property, and where they can do it?


I disagree only because I thought it was going to be a community center. As it is not being built as just a Mosque I find your argument to be misguided, however in principle you are totally correct about the ramifications. I'd say that for conservatives to flourish they need to be open to new ideas by other religious beliefs and learn to seperate their beliefs from government.



posted on Sep, 13 2010 @ 08:45 PM
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reply to post by Oldnslo
 





"And as a conservative, I disagree with some of the tea party's positions." Would you care to elaborate???


Well, for one I disagree with their extreme pro-life view. I am pro-life, but I see some gray areas, so we have to be careful with it. I also disagree with the recent "selling-out" and acceptance of the parasites like Palin and Beck. I also think it is INSANE to endorse Christine O'Donnell!

My hope is that there is a quiet undercurrent to the Tea Party that is less vocal and a little more mainstream conservative with a common sense approach. I hope the local Tea Parties haven't sold out as much as the Tea Party Express has.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 06:17 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by Oldnslo
 





"And as a conservative, I disagree with some of the tea party's positions." Would you care to elaborate???


Well, for one I disagree with their extreme pro-life view. I am pro-life, but I see some gray areas, so we have to be careful with it. I also disagree with the recent "selling-out" and acceptance of the parasites like Palin and Beck. I also think it is INSANE to endorse Christine O'Donnell!


Thanks for the reply. I'm pro-life for myself but whatever goes for others is fine with me. But I am positively against partial-birth abortions, except when the mother is at risk. I'm holding out on the motives of Beck and Palin. But if Beck is correct in what he is talking about on a daily basis regarding BO's associates, then " We the people" are in deep trouble. As far as I am concerned, if their message wakes up the folks, that's ok with me. Too much is at stake to not listen to all options.

We have primaries tonight so we'll get a better look at how the Tea Party candidates do against established Republicans. It should give us a better insight as to how they will do in November. It should get quite interesting if they promote a balanced budget, reduction in spending, cutting out earmarks, extend Bush's tax cuts, repeal the Healthcare Bill, and put forth a plan of business incentives to jump start small businesses that employ the majority of Americans. We need to return to a manufacturing based economy and stop shipping our jobs overseas. Kind of what Marco Rubio is talking about.

I travel all over the country, and if what I hear from most "regular" folks, they have had it with any establishment candidate, Democrat or Republican. I think tonight will be a night where the status quo Republicans get what they deserve and realize they are also targets of the disenchanted voters. Republicans, just as much as Democrats, need to be thrown out of office for their betrayal of the American people and the destruction of our currency.


My hope is that there is a quiet undercurrent to the Tea Party that is less vocal and a little more mainstream conservative with a common sense approach. I hope the local Tea Parties haven't sold out as much as the Tea Party Express has.


I believe you will find this to be a true statement. The Tea Party is only the visible part of movement, middle Americans have yet to show the total depth of the movement and may not become evident until November. I do believe it will be a blowout of epic proportions.


edit on 14-9-2010 by Oldnslo because: Correct spelling errors



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 09:06 PM
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reply to post by Oldnslo
 


Thanks for reading!

I believe that the position of unbridled corporatism, that many hold dear in the Republican and many Tea Party members, is one of our greatest downfalls. We cannot let "big business" have as much pull in DC as we have as individuals. In fact, our government is designed to uphold individuality and business unless the business does not serve the best interests of the public.

I think it's easy to see that many corporate entities do not exist to serve the public good.




edit on 14-9-2010 by sheepslayer247 because: spelling




edit on 14-9-2010 by sheepslayer247 because: rephrase



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 09:14 PM
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reply to post by hangedman13
 


I said mosque, but many of us know that it is designed to be a community center. You are correct! I would equate it to a local Christian centers that flourish across the U.S.(YMCA) But what is the difference? Not a thing, if you ask me. Both look to provide a service to their community that is not offered on any other level.



posted on Sep, 14 2010 @ 09:43 PM
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Don't have much to say really - just...

I have a lot of conservative values, but the party just turns me off.

It seems to decorate itself with subtle (and sometimes not so subtle) racism, and there's a huge push to return America to "CHRISTIAN VALUES" I don't have a problem with Christian values. I'm a pagan with traditional values that are more Christian than most Christians somehow. Still not sure how that happened, must be the 'an harm none thing..." but anyway, so many of the Republicans I know want to force THEIR religion down everyone's throat, and they look SO down on anyone that isn't Christian, and usually evangelical.

I have a friend who is Catholic, and the good conservative Christian homeschoolers won't let their kids play with hers! So the Catholic children are only welcomed by the pagans and atheists around here. That's real nice, isn't it? It reminds me of that Dr. Seuss show....



Republicans just don't seem to play well with others, or want to.

I hear Republicans saying the same sorts of things about liberals! We are REALLY divided.

I'm not completely either one, so I see it from both sides. It needs to stop b/c we are headed for civil war if it does not, and I'm not sure which side I'll end up on- probably the side that acts the most Christian. Crazy as THAT sounds...to me right now it is the liberals. They seem to have their hearts in the right places even if their decisions suck.

Liberals think they are smarter but they aren't. Conservatives think they are always right but they aren't.
Neither side is really even completely divided. Left and right don't even really WORK to describe most people.



posted on Sep, 15 2010 @ 09:54 AM
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reply to post by hadriana
 

I can't help but laugh at that clip! It is just a childrens cartoon, but it also points out how iggnorant some people can be. I actually know people who act that way towards other people, for whatever reason and it's comedy to say the least.




posted on Sep, 20 2010 @ 09:03 PM
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reply to post by sheepslayer247
 


I just experienced something very disheartening. It was an exchange between myself and a "conservative republican" blogger. I expressed some viewpoints that where outlined in the op, and all hell has broken loose. As soon as the dust settles, I will post links to that exchange.

Even if this is not read, considering the thread is all but dead, thanks to the members of ATS for showing me that there are other like-minded conservatives out there. It's getting hard for many of us.



posted on Sep, 20 2010 @ 10:21 PM
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OP and others, conservatism as you define it is dead. You should reconcile yourself to the fact that if you call yourself conservative, you will be ridiculed by intelligent people because they will assume you are a "dittohead."

In a sense, the new definition of conservative is more appropriate than the one before. Conservatives today are really are about turning back the clock to darker times, not realizing great new achievements.

The purpose of the GOP is to lower the costs of production. Period. Understand that, and the motives behind everything they do will be obvious to you. The GOP uses "conservatism" as a tool to convince exploited workers to vote for them while privately laughing about the fact that the exploited are voting for the exploiters. That's all modern conservatism is, really -- a fear-based sales pitch made by corporatists to gain the political help of the ignorant and bigoted.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 07:23 AM
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reply to post by Grumble
 


I think the term Conservative is being spun very effectively by the far left. Too many people now think it means racist, anti-environment, anti-immigration, anti-social programs, etc.

Conservatives like me and sheepslayer need a PR campaign! The Tea Party had it right at first, but now they are being demonized because of the few most extreme public members. We need a big PR campaign.



posted on Sep, 21 2010 @ 07:35 AM
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reply to post by sheepslayer247
 




Liberals, Democrats, homosexuals and Muslims are not our enemies, we are our own enemy. Conservatives must redefine themselves. Conservatives must be willing to part from the status quo. The tea party was an attempt to do just that but was pulled right back into the Republican Party by its leaders and MSM pawns such as Sean Hannity and Beck. Conservatives must define their ideology and stick to it. Do they believe in the supremacy of the constitution, or the need to change the constitution to mirror the Judeo/Christian faith? We must choose. The freedom of others and our own is at stake in this fight. We must realize that freedom for all is more important than faith, because without freedom, you have no right to faith. Without freedom, we have nothing.


Liberal, conservative, progressive, neocon... no difference. You are all captives of political agendas that mimic life-ideals. But once these partisan agendas are fully installed, replacing the genuine human life, vision becomes skewed, neighbors become foes and every shadow is a threat to life and limb.

To address such an open letter to one division of the political arena and not all, is just another symptom of the invasive. Your presumed motive is in conflict with the non-native politikal rider, thus calling into question sincerity.

Save yourself. Just say no to the red and the blue.



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