Scythians preceded Sumerians? Also Scythian & Ireland Connection

The Irish annalists claim a descent from the Scythians, who, they say, are descended from Magog, the son of Japhet, the son of Noah. Keating says: "We will set down here the branching off of the race of Magog, according to the Book of Invasions (of Ireland), which was called the Cin of Drom Snechta."[7] It will be remembered how curiously O'Curry verified Keating's statement as to the authorship of this work,[8] so that his testimony may be received with respect. In the Scripture genealogy, the sons of Magog are not enumerated; but an historian, who cannot be suspected of any design of assisting the Celts to build up a pedigree, has happily supplied the deficiency. Josephus writes:[9] "Magog led out a colony, which from him were named Magoges, but by the Greeks called Scythians." But Keating specifies the precise title of Scythians, from which the Irish Celts are descended. He says they had established themselves in remote ages on the borders of the Red Sea, at the town of Chiroth; that they were expelled by the grandson of that Pharaoh who had been drowned in the Red Sea; and that he persecuted them because they had supplied the Israelites with provisions. This statement is singularly and most conclusively confirmed by Rabbi Simon, who wrote two hundred years before the birth of Christ. He says that certain Canaanites near the Red Sea gave provisions to the Israelites; "and because these Canaan ships gave Israel of their provisions, God would not destroy their ships, but with an east wind carried them down the Red Sea."[1] This colony settled in what was subsequently called Phoenicia; and here again our traditions are confirmed ab extra, for Herodotus says: "The Phoenicians anciently dwelt, as they allege, on the borders of the Red Sea."

www.libraryireland.com...

Originally posted by LUXUS
The Irish trace their origins back to Magog the second son of Japheth this is well known. Josephus identified the offspring of Magog as the Scythians. Basically the Scythians are the Irish, and the Irish are the Scythians!

irish priests claimed they did, but it is a well known fact that they did that for every group of people, in an effort to categorize everyone into decedents of the children of noah, it hardly means they were.
also it was common for people to insinuate that a group of people were related to the scythians as a way to smear them. the scythians were thought of as the ultimate barbarian, claiming someone was related to the scythians would be an insult, i guess the scots and the irish hearing it a lot didn't think it was an insult.

of course by the time the irish and scots claimed it, the term was so generic anyone could claim it.
people seem to forget that often times words stop meaning what they used to, so claiming a label doesn't mean anything unless you can produce evidence of it.

i have a question for people, why does anyone take .bibliotecapleyades.as anything more than nonsense? it is nothing but pure horse manure pretending to be authoritative. it has no sources, why does anyone take it seriously?
is it purely because people think historians are out to hide the truth for some reason and so they believe the most outlandish things to rectify it?

I found this on Wiki.Interesting.

Fénius Farsaid (also Phoeniusa, Phenius, Féinius; Farsa, Farsaidh, many variant spellings) is a legendary king of Scythia who shows up in different versions of Irish folklore. He was the son of Bathath who was a son of Magog. According to some traditions, he was the creator of the Ogham alphabet and the Gaelic language.

According to recensions M and A of the Lebor Gabála Érenn, Fénius and his son Nél journeyed to the Tower of Babel (in recension B, it is Rifath Scot son of Gomer instead). Nél, who was trained in many languages, married Scota, daughter of Pharaoh, and their son was Goidel Glas.

In the Lebor Gabála Érenn (11th C), he is said to be one of the 72 chieftains who built Nimrod's Tower of Babel, but travelled to Scythia after the tower collapsed.

According to the Auraicept na n-Éces, Fenius journeyed from Scythia together with Goídel mac Ethéoir, Íar mac Nema and a retinue of 72 scholars. They came to the plain of Shinar to study the confused languages at Nimrod's tower. Finding that they had already been dispersed, Fenius sent his scholars to study them, staying at the tower, coordinating the effort. After ten years, the investigations were complete, and Fenius created in Bérla tóbaide "the selected language", taking the best of each of the confused tongues, which he called Goídelc, Goidelic, after Goídel mac Ethéoir. He also created extensions of Goídelc, called Bérla Féne, after himself, Íarmberla, after Íar mac Nema, and others, and the Beithe-luis-nuin (the Ogham) as a perfected writing system for his languages. The names he gave to the letters were those of his 25 best scholars.

Auraicept claims that Fenius Farsaidh discovered four alphabets, the Hebrew, Greek and Latin ones, and finally the Ogham, and that the Ogham is the most perfected because it was discovered last.

I am glad this thread was brought back up, this is such an interesting story. Reading about the marriage to the Pharaoh's daughter really makes me wonder. Ramses II had red hair... is this a coincidence? Why are there so many red heads in ireland and scotland? 10-13% of the people there have red hair, compared to america with 2%.

Maybe there is something to this.

there is a huge connection between egypt/israel/sumeria with Ireland, and it is Newgrange

en.wikipedia.org...

It was built in 3200 BC. It could be 500 years older than the Great Pyramids and it is older than Stonehenge. Did the builders of Newgrange move south and east towards Egypt? Maybe they came from Sumeria or that area and went west and built newgrange? I don't think people were just hanging around the same place in 3000 BC, i think there was a lot of traveling.

reply to post by BeastMaster2012


I would think that the builders of Newgrange came from or were influenced by the Egyptians as opposed to the other way around.Perhaps Newgrange (and Knowth and Dowth) were "budget" attempts at recreating Egyptian or other edifices, by a group a northward migrating explorers.

If you look at Newgrange,Knowth and dowth in GE, you can see the outline of countless other circular structures, suggesting the three were part of a complex perhaps even a city of sorts.There are some curious contours in the area that suggest massive earth moving in the past.

Actually if you look in GE, Ireland's countryside is peppered with the imprints of circular structures.They are extremely common. Some are better preserved than others, but most are not interfered with.

The Book of Invasions is full of surprises. Apparently it named a couple of pharohs that were not known to modern archaeology until relatively recently. In the christian era Ireland was known to be a repository of knowledge where monks transcribed ancient texts. Having seen the Book of Kells and a few other works, it is tantalising to wonder what else remains to be found on the island or even the islands around it and Scotland.

The following is a citation from a 19th century Assyriologist named Edward Hincks which argues an alternative and far reaching proposal
""Paragraph 5.1, It is possible, too, that the word from which the phonetic value is derived may be one belonging to a different language. I will, in a subsequent section, produce an instance, in which I believe that the ordinary phonetic character, namely pa, the value of PA sign , was adopted from a foreign language. This mode of proceeding may be illustrated by some of the abbreviations used in Irish manuscripts. The Irish letters were at first chiefly used in the copying of Latin texts. In Latin manuscripts, the letter s with a peculiar mark, which may be represented by s', was used to express the word sed. In the course of time the same mark was used in Irish manuscripts to express acht, the Irish equivalent of sed. And by a further progress, it was used to express this sound, when it no longer signified “but”, but was a portion of a word of totally different meaning. Thus, ts' was used for teacht, “to come”. See O’Donovan’s Irish Grammar, p. 430
For more on this proposal see the works of 19th century Assyriologists and historians such as George Rawlinson and François Lenormant, Particularly "The Origins of History According to the Bible and the Traditions of the Oriental Peoples"
Also noted in Genisis of the grail kings by Laurence Gardner is a proposal of George Rawlinson to the Royal Asiatic society in 1853
""Even Scythian writings from 1000 years before the earliest Sumerian script (29) are identical to those of early Akkad. The Scythian warlords of the Sidhe (a transcendent intellect called the Web of the Wise) originated in the Carpathians and Russian steppe-lands to become a migratory race who took their culture far and wide - as far as Ireland to the West and Mongolia to the East. Indeed, the very name of Ur (the capital of Sumer) came from the Scythian word Ur, meaning 'Lord', while the settlement of Anu was not in Sumer where one might expect to find it, but hundreds of miles to the north on the Caspian Sea

Sumerian:Anu/ Irish :Anu/ Sumerian:Abarta /Irish:Abarta /Sumerian :Cara/ Irish:Cara/ Sumerian:inanna/ Irish:Anann Sanskrit: Tara = Mother Goddess Ref: en.wikipedia.org...‎ Irish: Tara = Mother Goddess/ Ref: en.wikipedia.org...‎ Sanskrit: Siddhi= Superpower/ Ref: en.wikipedia.org... Irish: Sidhe = Supernatural race/ Ref: en.wikipedia.org... Sanskrit: Danu = Mother Goddess/ Ref: en.wikipedia.org... Irish: Danu = Mother Goddess/ Ref: en.wikipedia.org...‎ / Sanskrit: Rishi = Sage/ Ref: en.wikipedia.org... Irish: Ri shee = King Fairy/ Ref: www.irish-word.com...

All names for Ireland, Eire, Eirn ,Eiru, Tara, all translate as Noble in ancient mesopotamian languages

The plowman constelation is directly above Ireland, This is The constelation of the seven Rishis,

The name Metatron which is argued to be the name of god can also mean ,Along with the Plow www.thefreedictionary.com... / wordinfo.info...


Im trying to find a link between the official name of Ireland Eiru and the Ancient pre sumerian city of Eirdu,, can anybody help me with this

Originally posted by prestigiouzman

All names for Ireland, Eire, Eirn ,Eiru, Tara, all translate as Noble in ancient mesopotamian languages

Noble in Sumerian is Zal and I found no entries for those words in Akkadian or Babylonian.

What dictionary are you basing this on?

if you look up Tara on wiki relating to buddhism you will see that it translates as Ayra, I cannot find the precise findings of François Lenormant but i am told that he linked Tara,arya,eire,eirn,and eiru as variants of the same term Aryan, can you help me in finding this, i looked up google scholar and i cant find it.

reply to post by Prestigiouzman


Use the Babylonian, Sumerian and Akkadian online dictionaries. In those I could not find the meanings you suggested.

www.ping.de...

Impregnate - ERU

This is what i found,, newgrange in ireland is thought to be structured around worldly gestation and the macro cosmic gestation event

Scythian people actually encompassed a lot of eventually different peoples. As far as linguistics go, the closest is Magyar/Hungarian. Over 2000 similar words and 1000 common root words.

If true the old Hungarian tale of Hunnor and Magor might be true.

Magog-Magor-Magyar

Hunnor-Hun-Hungarian

This might explain the Irish (Celts) and Finns. Brits carry a bit of Finnish extract and the Irish culture is closely tied to it's music and dance and also warring abilities, same as Hungarians. Both countries have heavy affinity for violin and bagpipe.

The story of Hunnor and Magor tells how the people migrated following the mythical white stag, which supposedly led them back to the Carpathian Basin. But in old Celt dig sites the white stag shows up on artifacts, in fact it shows up in a lot of places.

In Scottish Mac denotes boy/descendent, in Irish Mc, in Hungarian it's Mag. In the British Isles you have lake Bala, river Don, and Thames. In Karpatia you have lake Balaton, river Duna, and river Temes.

Also Scotts/Irish and Hungarian are both historically known for getting screwed over and slandered by our neighbors.

More connections can be found here:
Irish and Hungarian connections

reply to post by Prestigiouzman


Or it was tomb...

reply to post by Lucifersjester


I was doing some research last week and saw this

The latest research into Irish DNA has confirmed that the early inhabitants of Ireland were not directly descended from the Keltoi of central Europe. In fact the closest genetic relatives of the Irish in Europe are to be found in the north of Spain in the region known as the Basque Country. These same ancestors are shared to an extent with the people of Britain - especially the Scottish.

link

The article is interesting. It mentions 'the book of invasions' which says the first rulers were the Milesians - the sons of Mil, the soldier from Spain.

The Milesians were the 6th wave, check, en.wikipedia.org...
And yes thats correct, The basque and Bashkir/Permkravites are our closest relatives
check en.wikipedia.org...

There is a way to connect ancient Mesopotamia with ancient Ireland.

You start with sargon ofhorse d. Sargon forms the first true empire, by conquering the neighboring Sumerian cities. He then extends his empire to the northwest, all the way to the med. coast. Akkadian displaces Sumerian as the "lingua franca" of the region, the akkadians assimilate most if not all Sumerian culture within their own.
Trade routes are established that reach from the Persian gulf all the way to Crete and Cyprus.
The people of the agean, the akkadians trade with, have a long history of trade in the agean and med.
When the Akkadian empire fails some 150 years after sargon, members of the royal court and high ranking military leader flee to the farthest land they know of, Crete, where they use their political and martial skills to influence if not dominate cretean society. This is the birth of the minoans as we know them.
At this point in time military buildings, such as walled forts, appear on islands in the med and Aegean. These building have a clear connection to Mesopotamian military structures, through their architecture.
As minoans expand their influence, they they set up outposts all along the northern med coast. At first they are content to trade with the locals for metal raw materials , like ores of tin, gold, silver and copper, which they come to dominate the trade in.
After a couple of centuries they decide they will take full control of the trade and cut out the middle men, for the most part the iberians, and they found a series of fortified cities at mining centers in Iberia.
They then go looking for the source of tin to the west, and find it in Ireland first and then on the west coast of Britain. They set up trade centers on rivers and bring goods to trade. One such trade center was
near stone henge, where Minoan bronze goods have been found.
The way to connect the scythians to the sumerians is through the Gutians, a tribe of nomadic horsemen , that were light skinned and fair haired barbarians from the north. They conquered portions of Mesopotamia before being driven out.

With regard to the Scythians being similar to the Irish? Well they were an Indo-European people what do you expect?

reply to post by BeastMaster2012


So... it wasn't aliens is what you're telling me? Impossible, it's just illogical to think we can create a society on our own without the help of an outside force ... really a nice find, to bad they don't even teach that it's even a possibility that there were earlier cultures to Sumer, since apparently there was evidence since 1853. I wonder where they originated from though, do they offer a theory to a starting point for them in that book?

An ancient Irish manuscript known as Lebor Feada Runda will help you in tracing the source.

books.google.com.kh... sa=X&ei=wbsyUrTfLefUigeauICwBQ&ved=0CDUQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=LEBOR%20FEADA%20RUNDA&f=false