9/11 Argument Took Place Yesterday In My Local Inn

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
I say to people, " So you believe 3 towers brought down by 2 planes was conducted from a Cave in the desert by a bond type villan and his group of terrorists?"

I wouldn't pretend to know the full truth of what went on, in regards to these attacks, but what is actually so implausible about that scenario ?

To me, the officially reported method of attack seems far from complex:

Take 19 brainwashed individuals, train some of them up as pilots, and then get them to take advantage of lax airport are airliner security.

reply to post by Titan Uranus


Glad I could help. Im glad to see you have realised that the comic book conspiracy theories just dont hold their weight. They are fun to believe in but thats about it. People feel good about themselves, thinking they know little secrets. Thats what fuels most of the nonsense here on ATS, but if you look at the bigger picture and take the information as it is, most of the conspiracy theories fall apart in seconds.

reply to post by Pryde87


But seriously. You're right it could be many things. The method and mechanism isn't that important, what is important is that people realise that the events of that day are sus and need re-evaluating without the patriotic goggles. You seem like a smart man, do you discount gov't involvement or just thermite and other specifics? Or do you fall in line behind the flag and shout Hooah Ima get me an Arab?

reply to post by Titan Uranus


actually according to Dr. Steven Jones he stated there was thermate because sulfur was found at the site as well. Thermite plus Sulfur equals Thermate basically.Even richard gage states this as well.

reply to post by Titan Uranus


Im personally undecided on the subject. Although I have to say the official story is more convincing. I believe the government could have gone to war with Afghanistan for a number of reasons without having to masacre 3000 of their population to justify it. If they really needed a reason, they could have just assasinated a public figure with a trace leading to the Taliban.

I think the conspiracy theories are fun to follow and are kind of like ghost stories, you just want to believe them. That coupled with peoples general dislike of the government is preventing them from seeing the other side of the story.

That said, I think an event of this magnitude should be looked at thoroughly but I dont see a way of pleasing everyone. If there is an investigation then people will say its another cover up. I am tending to lean away from the conspiracy theories now though, because many of them are so easily discredited. E.g. the explosive plumes coming from windows, the fact that all the jews were told to stay home that day and the continuing debate on whether it would even be possible to hit the towers with a plane.

So in response to your question, I am uncertain but I lean towards an explanation that says the taliban got incredibly lucky and took the united states completely off guard. What are your beliefs?

reply to post by Pryde87


Lol I was being sarcastic. I actually beleive many conspiracy theories hold water. You can give your armchair psychological reasons for the prevelance of conspiracy theories and theorists and I could offer some as to why those individuals who cannot fathom that conspiracies exist deny any evidence to the contrary. I seriously don't understand why you are on this site? Is it to mock those kooks that have deranged beleifs in order to makes yourself feel good about how intelligent you are? Look at the world and its heirachial structure and history. IMHO it is ridiculous to beleive conspiracies don't exist. Just because you cannot comprehend something doesn't mean its not there.

Peace dude, we are not enemies I do not wish to have a back and forth at this time. Perhaps we may meet on a different thread with a less polorised topic.

So now the Taliban are responsible for 911?

This is new information please ellaborate

Originally posted by Pryde87
reply to post by Titan Uranus

 

Glad I could help. Im glad to see you have realised that the comic book conspiracy theories just dont hold their weight. They are fun to believe in but thats about it. People feel good about themselves, thinking they know little secrets. Thats what fuels most of the nonsense here on ATS, but if you look at the bigger picture and take the information as it is, most of the conspiracy theories fall apart in seconds.

IMHO Conspiracies are not fun, especially when they include innocent people. Once upon a time I used to believe everything I was told, I am trusting person. However, as stated on a previous thread some time ago my outlook on life changed dramatically. Sites like this are very useful and very educational, some members spend alot of time and effort on their presentations and I learn many things on a daily basis. From each conspiracy I am interested in I always research, whether that be referencing sources form the internet or going to my local library. Of course there is much more data on the internet mind you.

If you take a look at the bigger picture it is clear that wherever power and money are corruption will always follow. This is where the majority of conspiracies are born from.



[edit on 27-8-2010 by franspeakfree]

reply to post by Pryde87


Its true we need to be cautious with conspiracy theories. Disinformation is everywhere and I will admit that some things I beleive now may be disinfo that was thrown in with truth. I try not to get too hung up on specifics, i enjoy the historical aspects and the lineage of power through the last couple of hundred if not thousand years. (Lots more reading to do). Bottom line is I beleive there is a silver spoon robber baron class that thinks it still holds divine right of sorts and sees us as expendable economic units. As we move into a post industrial era our economic value diminishes and so we become pests to them. I beleive they commit attrocities and revel in them so I tend to lean toward anything that is anti-establishment. Granted it may lead me initially to some dubious sources/conclusions but discernment evens the keel. Bottom line is I beleive there is evil in this world and it has designs on our futures. Its what I beleive and if I am insane then so be it.

Originally posted by woodward
So now the Taliban are responsible for 911?

This is new information please ellaborate

According to the same people in the local inn yesterday Talibans are Al Queada. Even when I tried to explain where the word Al Queada came from, still they did not want to listen.

Is this sufficient evidence can it be substantiated? www.911myths.com...

[edit on 27-8-2010 by franspeakfree]

reply to post by franspeakfree


I'm with you.

I think the reverse is just as, if not more, valid. People deny conspiracy theories to maintain a delusion of control, a sense of control makes you feel good, loss of control makes you feel bad. We are programmed from birth to react in certain ways. The way I see it if you don't realise you are brainwashed then odds are you are brainwashed. I realised a few years back and it was a rude awakening, now when I run into people that remind me of me back then I feel a little bit ashamed.

reply to post by Titan Uranus


I know you were being sarcastic, but I was trying to keep things civilised. I have never said conspiracy theories dont exist. I just dont really believe that 9/11 is one. I really do believe in conspiracy theories but I suppose I just have stricter criteria for something to qualify as one than you do.
I am on this site because I find some of the content interesting, I like debating with people and once in a blue moon you do find a potential conspiracy theory (you just gotta cut through a lot of rubbish to find it). Besides if there werent debunkers on this website, the ATS paranoia would have snowed balled into an unstopable monster and most of the readers would be hiding in their bunkers waiting for the 2012 Niburu event which HAARP created and the government covered up.

Originally posted by MichiganSwampBuck
Let them close their eyes and sleep until the SHTF, then you can say "I told you so" or "I knew this all along. In your face!" not that it will matter much at that point. Prepare for the worst and be happy if you're wrong.

By then its too late! my close friends thought I was mad when I started to stockpile food and provisions a year or so ago. They used to laugh at me and call me a conspiracy nut. But with what I have told them and for what they have researched for themselves, there whole attitude has changed. They too are stockpiling and they too are now taking things very seriously.

Its got nothing to do with believing everything everyone says, IMHO it has everything to do with looking at the state of the world and where we are heading. You don't have to be genius to see that the capitalist bubble will burst eventually causing devaluation of currencies and market crashes causing global meltdowns. Take a good look at Spain at the moment. They seem to be doing a really poor job of wall papering over the cracks. Words are just words unless people get off their arse and start looking for themselves. Sometimes its just so frustrating!

reply to post by Pryde87


Fair enuf,

To me 9/11 is an obvious one not a kooky one. Forget the day, look at the terrorist legislation and the convenience of an external other to project all hatred and fear. This all seems too convenient and contrived. Thats not a good summary but its gettin late here and I am tired. 9/11 makes more sense to me as an act by the robber baron class I mentioned earlier, rather than an isolated attack by radical muslim extremists.

One picture says it all.

Link to picture

"In the kingdom of the blind the one-eyed man is king."

[edit on 27-8-2010 by Grey Magic]

Originally posted by Pryde87
if there werent debunkers on this website, the ATS paranoia would have snowed balled into an unstopable monster and most of the readers would be hiding in their bunkers waiting for the 2012 Niburu event which HAARP created and the government covered up.

This is the type of response I have been reading today:


10.) THE SNEER: This gimmick is an inversion of "Stupid, Crazy
Liars." In "Stupid, Crazy Liars," the skeptic attacks the
character of those advocationg certain ideas or presenting
information in the hope of discrediting the information. In "THE
SNEER," the skeptic attempts to attach a stigma to some idea or
claim and implies that anyone advocating that position must have
something terribly wrong with him. "Anyone who believes we've
been visited by extraterresrial aliens must be a lunatic, a fool,
or a con man. If you believe this, you must a maniac, a simpleton
or a fraud." The object here is to scare others away from a
certain position without having to discuss facts.

5.) THE SANTA CLAUS GAMBIT: This trick consists of lumping
moderate claims or propositions together with extreme ones. If
you suggest, for example, that Sasquatch can't be completely
ruled out from the available evidence,the skeptic will then
facetiously suggest that Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny can't
be "completely" ruled out either.


Just today there is a mention of 2012 in scientific context, Massive solar storm to hit Earth in 2012 with 'force of 100m bombs'

Its all very well to imply that we are all delusional people that believe in wierd and wacky things but even when the evidence begins to mount up the same retorts are sounded. This is what I don't get? why is it that skeptical minded people will not drop their guard and allow themselves room to join the dots?






[edit on 27-8-2010 by franspeakfree]

You cannot convince these people so entering into arguments is pointless.

They DON'T WANT TO KNOW.

Anything other than the OS turns their world upside down.

It would mean that you cannot trust your government.

That we have fought 2 wars for NOTHING.

We have bankrupted our Nation over lies.

Let them keep their comfortable fairy tales. It's how they get through the day. I have lost countless friends and become alienated from family members over this very same debate. IT'S NOT WORTH IT.

Keep working for truth and justice. Maybe one day we will have enough evidence the real perps could be convicted with. Once upon a time, all Europeans thought the world was flat. The truth will become common sense - one day.

reply to post by Titan Uranus


I can tell you right now the disinfo about 9/11 are the planes being holograms. GOD, that is so classic counter measure to make the truthers look bad.

reply to post by franspeakfree


That wasnt a shot at you or anyone on this thread, just a statement (albeit an exagerated one) of the intense level of paranoia on this website. Its partly why this website is so popular, the conspiracy theories feed these peoples paranoia. Some ATS members evacuated their homes during the BP oil spill for gods sake, another member has actually bought a cave system they can hide in when 2012 comes, I kid you not. Now tell me thats not crazy?!

Originally posted by dragnet53
I can tell you right now the disinfo about 9/11 are the planes being holograms. GOD, that is so classic counter measure to make the truthers look bad.

The truthers make themselves look bad, with their hush a boom explosives, nuclear weapons being exploded to destroy the towers, remote controlled missile firing pod carrying planes, beam weapons from space, thermite being used etc etc. These are all claims by truthers themselves, no one else!