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Should I throw in the towel?

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posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 08:29 PM
What kind of market do you want to sell this invention to? Are we talking truckers, fleet managers or something else?

There are quite a few ways of marketing things without having to invest a lot to start with.

Is it something that you can produce in small quantities so you can build up the business capital slowly from just a few dozen sales (I am assuming yes as you said you have already installed some), or are we talking about something that is going to need specialized tooling etc to manufacture?

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 08:31 PM
reply to post by Sinter Klaas

LOL, I really like the star trek analogy. The problem here is the borg is not try to assimilate me. They just want to set up a one night stand(no strings attached) with 7 of 9.
Then we all walk away like nothing happened. Would there be regrets? Maybe... but dude have you seen her? Seriously!?

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 08:44 PM
May I suggest one Canadian company called


that has a number of divisions which are
now branching out into green technologies
such as advanced sewage treatment,
green power production and other technologies.

The Ledcor Environmental Group is the one
to call for a demo! You'll have to come up to
Vancouver, Canada to do a real demo with a
decent report on your products abilities,
but if you can walk the talk in advanced power
production then you definitely will have a chance
to talk to the big boys in engineering and finance
and get them interested in your product.

May I also suggest you take a look at this video
which the company I work for just happened to do
for Ledcor Environmental Group.

which can sell your company AND your product!

Take a look at the above video link and SEE HOW
a properly done promo video can really punch a hole
through the sometimes byzantine world of executive-level
interest and venture capital.

U2U me if you need some advice on what might be
an effective print or video marketing campaign for
your type of product.

As another link to a marketing video shows,
YOU CAN MARKET esoteric products if you make
proper videos that EXCITE PEOPLE...

So I suggest you contemplate how and what you can
do to use web video to market YOUR PRODUCTS & SERVICES.
to ma

[edit on 2010/8/23 by StargateSG7]

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 08:51 PM
reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

Hi seeker, um... can we bring the melodrama level down just one order of magnitude. It's a really cool gizmo, however it is not a game changer. I am a very realistic person, and not nearly as endowed with ego as some seem to assume. On the one hand greed would say to hold out for all the money you can get. The little white guy with the wings on the other shoulder says give it away, but he lives out of a dumpster, and doesn't smell so good, and they took his kids away when he couldn't feed them. Oh.. BTW. The world still didn't make use of his product because they figured it was worthless since he just gave it away.(That IS reality for all the give it away crowd.) The pragmatist in the middle says "Get while the getting is good. It's a fair offer for what it is, and where it is at this point." The money will be used to put myself, and others in our group into a position to bring more ideas to fruition more easily. No plans for mansions, and Ferrari's. I'm more of a secluded log cabin, classic car guy anyway.

The money isn't everything statement is central to my line of thinking. I very much liked the fisherman story recently posted here on ATS. We can kick this horse for 20 years, and possibly make a great positive difference, or waste 20 years, and wonder where our lives went, and why the kids never come to see us. The mark I wish to leave on the world is the legacy of unconditional love, and inner strength passed on to my children. Money is just a tool, and I'm trying to figure out how to organize my tools.

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 09:05 PM
This one is easy for me. Sell it off and take the profit and then regroup with your new profits and lack of debt stress to create something that is a bigger game changer and take one step up the ladder.

Think of it like you are an artist, you create a great painting and if you dont sell it you cant make more. What would make a bigger impact, selling and making more and honing your skills or just keeping this one painting to yourself.

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 09:09 PM
reply to post by kiwifoot

I understand, and appreciate where you are coming from. What you are describing though is the holy grail of inventors. It only happens a few times a century, and hindsight is always 20/20. This gadget just isn't THAT big. Don't get me wrong it makes the gadget guys shorts wet, but the average Joe says meh... is there an app. for that?

I can tell you 1000s of anecdotal stories of ruined lives, and families, and millions wasted on ideas that were all great ideas, and every single one had potential. One of my partners is an electronics engineer who built automation systems for Hughes. He invented a crosswind control system that would save a multi-million dollar aircraft from unexpected crosswinds while unmanned on a runway. The device modified the aircraft's on board automation already in place. He was granted a patent quickly, and easily. The patent officer even gushed about how innovative the idea was, and that he was certain to be a millionaire in short order. The FAA loved it. The modification cost less than $10,000 which is about what a tank of fuel costs. This was during the very same year that an aircraft on a runway in Italy was blown off the runway by crosswinds, and over 50 people died. He sited it as a strong case for his device. The airline companies' response "That's why we buy insurance." Great ideas go unheard of, and unused every day because nothing is more powerful than paradigm of thought.

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 09:13 PM
reply to post by whoshotJR

You must be clairevoyant my friend. This is exactly where my line of thinking is at the moment. They can buy the molds, jigs, forms, and schematics, but they can't buy the brains that built them. I will always have the knowledge, and techniques gained from doing this project, and they will invariably affect the next project.

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 09:28 PM
reply to post by davespanners

It is something that can be built on a small scale. We have sold it to a few small to moderate fleets. The thing is when we use those companies as references, they don't talk us up. The reason being is they see our device as a competitive edge, and they don't want another company to have the same edge. They don't trash us they just don't brag either. We know for a fact they are laughing all the way to the bank with the money they are saving. One company paid for all 5 modified vehicles in only 6 weeks of savings. These vehicles run almost 24/7 so they realized savings very rapidly. They also have full time maintenance men that were trained on the system so they keep it in top notch shape. The maintenance guys love the system because it increases performance a bit, and the drivers don't gripe about their trucks being gutless anymore. Our sales to individuals have come from people who work for these companies who wanted the device on their personal cars. The maintenance guys cars run fine, but if you don't do the upkeep it plays havoc with the system. Again the maintenance is very minimal. If you can pour a glass of milk you can do the maintenance. There's even a little light that tells you when you need to do it.

edit to add: Specialized tools would make the process faster, and more cost effective, but not necessary to start. We did it with some nice old 3 in 1 machines, and core machine shop staples. It's slow, but it works for a few units a day.

[edit on 23-8-2010 by Binder]

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 09:34 PM
reply to post by Binder

Oh yeah... I did. * whistle*

Well if that's the case. You know what to do. Drop it and prepare to assimilate...


For the non trekkies. Seven of nine is like the Jennifer Aniston of the show.

However a go for the long term with Miss Janeway...

posted on Aug, 23 2010 @ 09:44 PM
Ok ( I don't know what experience you have of producing media but this it what I would try) so how about

1. Obvious but important, Build a web page, and promote that page, get it as high a google ranking as possible, link to it from as many different relevant forums as you can, put the web sites link into every sig (on forums that allow that)

2. Get some media interest, Find the most relevant magazine that you can think of who's customers would be your target market and phone them, ask them if they would like to test your product as an article, if you can afford to send them a free one and let them use it for a while. In my experience magazines are always desperate for good copy, and it's free

3. Do the same thing but with local news channels, or any radio programs that you think might be interested in your area.

4. To do the two things above it helps if you have a press pack that you can send them, this sounds fancy but it's just a little printed ad about what your product does the benefits etc as well as a little background on yourself etc, anything that they can use to fill up airtime / magazine space.

5. I'm not sure about this one but maybe you could send it to the EPA to test, I think I remember reading that there are only 4 products like this that the EPA endorses and they test hundreds. if yours does what it says it does then an EPA cert can only be an advantage.

6. Pay per click ads. On most site these are a waste of time, but I have found that advertising on face book is quite effective, and not that expensive, It's very targeted and you can choose the type of people who you want to market to.

7. Make a clip for youtube, with your results etc and then post it everywhere you can for people to discuss.

All of these things can be done quite easily by just 1 person, a lot of people are quite nervous about approaching media companies, but they are usually a lot easier to get on with and friendlier then you would expect.

[edit on 23-8-2010 by davespanners]

posted on Aug, 24 2010 @ 04:01 PM
You need to speak to Steven Greer! He is looking for this kinda thing I think and suggested he can see it come to light and protect it from being hiden under the national security act when you try to patent it...

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 03:43 AM
reply to post by BlindingBlizzard

It's already patented, and I seriously doubt it would be considered worthy of "national security" status. As I said it's wicked cool, but still a stop gap measure on the way to better things.

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 03:49 AM
reply to post by Binder

Firstly, I admire you for being an inventor.

Secondly, it is not what you know, it is who you know.

Does anyone in your group have a powerful friend or family member?

Please pursue this - do not throw in the towel.

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 04:12 AM
So you have sold it to a few companies who want to keep it secret to beat thier competition, and a few individuals who forgot to maintain it and now you want to throw in the towel... Hardly what I would call a good market test. I know hundreds of individuals who would maintain it because alternative and free (relatively) energy is their passion.

Your always going to have individuals that don't maintain thier equipment as you said they don't get an oil change when neeeded but what about the millions who do? You have to find a way to reach them.

Sure you can send the kids to colleges but what about thier future and your grand kids future? Do you want them to grow up in polluted dying environment? How many more gulf accidents can we stand?

Maybe for the consumer you could offer them a maintenance contract with the device this would create jobs too. Or how about offering it so it has to be partially assembled so it attracts the kind of people who would be willing to assemble it and more likely to maintain it properly?

You need to get in contact with the owner of this website he has a network of thousands of which I am part of who are developing and searching for that break through he will help you market this product. U2U me if you cannot find his contact information.

Do not give this to China and don't sell out because you will be selling out your grand kids too. Look at Tesla he spent his whole life trying to give humanity a better life and he did even though much of it was suppressed and he ended up not making much off it. But Most of what we have today in the way of electrical energy is due to him.

I don't know if you believe in karma but if you sell out you will reap what you sow if not in this life in a future one. Think this through and don't give up just yet. Better to light a candle rather then curse the darkness!

Hang in there man, I am telling you people want this you just need to get the word out. I would be glad to help you market it as much as I can. Where can we learn more about your product?

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 06:08 PM
Binder, you are in the proverbial "valley of death" problem in technology development.

Suggestions: partner with an appropriate academic research lab. Find some area of communal interest, perhaps they would like to characterize the engineering/physics/chemistry/efficiency more suitably. Make sure that you get some peer-reviewed publications that you can use in your marketing.

If you live in the USA, try to apply for a SBIR (Small Business Innovation Research grant, which may help you develop the next stage of technology.

Try to get a contract with a government or university which will deploy your technology. Make a deal where you will deploy it at cost, and in return the agency/university/government will collect data and verify the performance improvements and be willing to vouch for its success.

Work hard to develop personal contacts among program managers in the appropriate areas in EPA, DOE, DOT (USA) or equivalents in your country. Get Sergei Brin and Google foundation interested in it (this is not a joke).

Go to every "green transportation" conference you can and get publicity.

Hire a "green business development" consultant/employee.

Try to improve your technology so that if maintenance is not performed, it will fall back to a baseline operating mode which is not worse than the performance without the device.

Try to increase the time between maintenance intervals.

[edit on 25-8-2010 by mbkennel]

[edit on 25-8-2010 by mbkennel]

[edit on 25-8-2010 by mbkennel]

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 06:13 PM
reply to post by Binder

The catch, I can tell from the terms in the prospectus that he has every intention of permanently shelving this technology. Not another one will be made of our design if we do this

Research people who have developed alternate energy.

Many have ended up dead.

Yes, they will shelve it and yet another avenue of hope to mankind will be lost.

If you don't sell your idea to them, watch your life getting scary.

We are an oil / fossil fuel based economy and TPTB want to keep it that way.

"They" will go to any lengths to keep us enslaved to fossil fuels - including murder.

Personally, if I were as smart as you and could figure something like you have out, I would secretly go it alone with no outside help.

Make sure you patent your inventions up the wazoo.

Keep in mind, the oil, nuclear and electric companies own Washington. They're some of the biggest lobbyists in this country.

That's an idea, maybe go to Sweden, or ?.

America's "governement" is owned by the large corporations.

Humanity desperately needs good clean, cheap alternative energy.

Good luck, you're going to need it.

[edit on 25-8-2010 by ofhumandescent]

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 06:16 PM

Originally posted by Binder
One company paid for all 5 modified vehicles in only 6 weeks of savings.

Business 101: you're not charging them enough money!!!

Write your contracts appropriately so that you get paid by some fraction of savings (estimated or actual). Recurring revenue is good.

The maintenance guys cars run fine, but if you don't do the upkeep it plays havoc with the system.

Fix that, ASAP. Design it so that it emails you when it's time for maintenance (if you can!)

edit to add: Specialized tools would make the process faster, and more cost effective, but not necessary to start. We did it with some nice old 3 in 1 machines, and core machine shop staples. It's slow, but it works for a few units a day.

Design, sell or lease the tools to make the maintenance very fast & reliable.

Think like a businessman, not just an engineer.

It's not about the technology only, it's building a sustainable business on that technology. At that point, the business will be worth more as an ongoing concern than something which should be shut down.

Make a deal when you sell that if the company stops marketing it, you get the patent & trademark rights back. Or you sell the operational company but you still own the patents which are licensed by the operational company.

[edit on 25-8-2010 by mbkennel]

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 07:30 PM

The Future will unfold with us or without us. The path we are on today, corporately and militarily, cannot be changed by a single person or product because there is an "effect taking place" based on the "cause" of such institutions. They are committed more than ever.

Sell! Sell! Sell!

You take care of you and yours, this is the time to protect. It is only a matter of a Season and we will see more than the weather change, perhaps money does grow on trees because if you own a tree you have more than the next person! Fruit you can eat. Wood you can build. Trees are our symbiotic Souls! When the Almighty Dollar becomes toilet paper we might just save a tree, but in the meantime you do what is best for YOU!

posted on Aug, 25 2010 @ 07:48 PM
reply to post by Binder

Originally posted by Binder
reply to post by whoshotJR

You must be clairevoyant my friend. This is exactly where my line of thinking is at the moment. They can buy the molds, jigs, forms, and schematics, but they can't buy the brains that built them. I will always have the knowledge, and techniques gained from doing this project, and they will invariably affect the next project.

I think this is the best idea and you should go with this.
If your invention isn't going to revolutionise the world then sell it to the bad men and then use their money to create something greater.

[edit on 25/8/10 by The Empty Skies]

posted on Aug, 26 2010 @ 12:00 AM
reply to post by mbkennel

You are exactly right. I believe this "valley of death" is intentionally fabricated also. We do have unbiased 3rd party verification that it works. The problem that comes in is this. Every individual entity you engage with has their own verification process they want done, at your expense, before they want to seriously talk to you. You can easily spend your entire life savings just getting an audience. Then you have nothing left with which to take the project porward. The wheels of academia turn slowly. By the time you have a nationally recognized, and vetted think tank group on your side you are too old, tired, and gray to give a crap anymore. The only people that make any money is the certification groups. It's like death from a thousand tiny cuts. A big reason is because you have so many garage tinkerers that have piddled with some internet plans, and built an odd variant of the same thing everyone else is doing that when something comes along that really is different, and effective it can't be seen for the ocean of copycats trying to cash in on the alternative energy scam. Not all alt. energy is a scam, but let's be honest the vast majority is. Take that with the grain of salt that this is coming from a guy who plays with alt. energy, and can smell a scam as it walks through the door, because I got burned by a few myself, but I didn't let it turn me off to the field. In order to do what you say I would have to fight through a literal torrent of "ME TOO!!"s to be heard. As I said I have other ventures besides this one. I could easily spend all my remaining years, energy, and personal resources on this one thing, and easily never be heard. Tesla died alone, a pauper, because he held on to his convictions of how he wanted his technology developed, and he wasn't a good businessman. Westinghouse became incredibly wealthy because he knew how to play the game. When to call, and when to fold. I don't want to call when I should fold, or vice versa.

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