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"Ten things I know about the mosque"

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posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 08:44 PM
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From Roger Ebert's Journal:


Ten things I know about the mosque
By Roger Ebert

1. America missed a golden opportunity to showcase its Constitutional freedoms. The instinctive response of Americans should have been the same as President Obama's: Muslims have every right to build there. Where one religion can build a church, so can all religions.


2. The First Amendment comes down to this: "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." It does not come down to: "The First Amendment gives me the right to repeat the N-word 11 times on the radio to an inoffensive black woman, and when you attack me for saying it, you are in violation of my First Amendment rights."



Ebertsunblog

No Mosque even three to six blocks away from the Trade complex but lets build a Mall on the very ashes.

Yeah.

Roger Ebert being the shinning beacon of sanity in uncertain and ignorant times.

- Lee

 

Mod Edit: External Source Tags Instructions – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 22-8-2010 by GAOTU789]




posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 08:48 PM
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Every single one of his points, if true, are dead on.

What a great article.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 08:58 PM
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I don't like the fact that; Fox News turned Obama's statement into a "Full Backing Endorsement"

I argued with my Dad for 15 minutes and it ended with "You need to see what he said, and not what you think he said."

It drive me insane. He backed only the right to build it. And Fox News slammed him for SUPPORTING THE CONSTITUTION.



I like how republicans get all teary eyed over this issue, froth at the mouth. But hey, bombed children in Iraq? GOD BLESS THE USA.

I sometimes wonder what this country is worth; with all its freedoms if people cannot respect it's freedoms.

It only takes a matter of public opinion and people can denied freedoms, usually based off the opinions of morons that have the IQ of a carrot and jump to their first reaction rather than think beyond their first images of hatred.

This is too heavily a politicized issue.

There would be no issue if it were christians responsible for 9/11. They would probably build a church on the WTC grounds, and people would cheer for it.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 09:08 PM
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They should probably just build a Taj Mahal and create a masoleum with influences from every religion on the planet and turn it into an enourmous public works project ensuring it is a true wonder of the modern age and make sure all those employed on the project are people who been recently been made redundant.

But then your not going to see much of a financial return on it, not compared to a shopping mall anyway and thats what matters, oh well.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 09:59 PM
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Originally posted by Johnze
They should probably just build a Taj Mahal and create a masoleum with influences from every religion on the planet and turn it into an enourmous public works project ensuring it is a true wonder of the modern age and make sure all those employed on the project are people who been recently been made redundant.

But then your not going to see much of a financial return on it, not compared to a shopping mall anyway and thats what matters, oh well.

If you're referring to the fact of the size of the building, that it's eleven stories tall, ONLY ONE FLOOR IS A MOSQUE.

One floor is being used as a mosque, the rest of the building is being used for different purposes.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by lee anoma

No Mosque even three to six blocks away from the Trade complex but lets build a Mall on the very ashes.

- Lee

Exactly. That hole in the ground for over 8 years while they bickered and played politics over the businesses that were going to pay top $$$ and a memorial pissed me off a whole lot more than any community center ever could. Shows us what's really "sacred."

Great article. Thanks for posting it, Lee.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 11:03 PM
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On point #4 I think they just polled city dwellers.

The number of ppl that think he has Muslim leanings in rural
areas is MUCH higher.

Mr. O saying it on the TV interview as a slip or not ?!?

Michelle saying he is really from Kenya might be a slip ?!?

The Kenyan newspaper from 2004 saying he is Kenyan a slip ?!?

The deepest bow so far to the king of Saudi Arabia ?!?

It really had some ppl saying what the hell ??

Thinking he is Islamic is not too far of a stretch with having
THREE Islamic names.

I hope I am wrong, but there are a lot of rural folk that have
seen a lot of lies out of DC and elsewhere.

Their level of trust on ANY issue has gotten hair thin.

And they are a "new kind of upset" about it too.

www.ammoland.com...


USA Gun Owners Buy 14 Million Plus Guns In 2009 – More Than 21 of the Worlds Standing Armies Combined That is 14,033,824,000 billion+ rounds of Ammo..you think that is why we have an Ammo shortage?


When the shooting starts I am heading for the middle of no where.

[edit on 21-8-2010 by Ex_MislTech]



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 11:13 PM
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Firstly these things you know, just illustrates to me how one man’s “knowledge” can be another man’s garbage!

Originally posted by lee anoma
1. America missed a golden opportunity to showcase its Constitutional freedoms.

Your “golden opportunity” would have been a PC plastic one! Merely another media footnote in American history claiming: Islam, multiculturalism, or even mass immigration (during recession) is somehow popular. It would all be well & good, if the majority of Americans thought this way (or should think this way). But America is still a European based culture, and people are getting angry at the politically correct, even angry at white men being denied jobs because they’re the wrong colour, and wrong gender.

People have always been angry about these issues, before the recession. They’re views were being ignored by whichever of the Demo-Rep parties they voted for.
Now people have more worry & unemployed time on their hands, interest in previous political issues picks up. This effect happened to Germany in the 1930’s, and has happened to almost every country (in recession) since.

So I 100% disagree. I instead think that we in "the right-wing" ceased a “golden opportunity” to demonstrate that we the people, are getting increasingly irritated by the political elite. And therefore give two fingers, to the types of view expressed by lee anoma The idea of building a Mosque above the death site, of a Muslim terrorists attack, is the perfect poster boy for American people being ignored. It rallies many free minded thinkers, against many PC people; and so makes great debate!!

At least that’s why I oppose the Mosque: Not because I live near the towers, or even plan to visit New York, even once every few decades. The reason why I oppose it, is because I oppose the so called “messages of tolerance” supported by the political camps, who tend to advocate it.

I think privately, both sides know this. Otherwise it's just another religious building, that needed to obtain planning permission, in some city, a few more hundred meters away, from its sponsors proposed, location.

I believe in tolerance for all sorts of things. But I believe multiculturalism, and the brand of politics declaring itself as “tolerance” does in fact walk over too many peoples opinions, and therefore is actually taking the mick (out of any concept of government, being based apon consent). We already know the wider system isn't working.

Originally posted by Mira

It only takes a matter of public opinion and people can denied freedoms, usually based off the opinions of morons that have the IQ of a carrot and jump to their first reaction rather than think beyond their first images of hatred.


Your contempt (for all those you disagree with, over this issue) is pure insult, and no substance. It’s really immature to say one ideology (or one perspective) is full of idiots, because any experience of politics will always teach you those in opposing camps, are often equally intelligent-stupid (and therefore equally as entitled to their view; whatever that is).

[edit on 090705 by Liberal1984]



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 11:25 PM
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reply to post by Liberal1984
 

I like your point on the message of tolerance.

If we try to build a casino and strip club in Saudi Arabia I think
we will be met with some severe lack of tolerance, LOL.

Unless you been to the Land O' Sand you have no idea what
they will stone a person over.

Sharia law allows honor killings.



Dhimmitude is how all non-Muslims are treated.

en.wikipedia.org...

I am not a fan of any religion, but Islam makes current
Christians look like a walk in the park.

The 3 strikes law in Saudi is finger, hand, and then head.

Ppl in the US "Disney bubble" have no idea what Islam is like.

www.thereligionofpeace.com...

I assure you it is not what you think.

[edit on 21-8-2010 by Ex_MislTech]



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 05:32 AM
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Originally posted by hotbakedtater
Every single one of his points, if true, are dead on.

What a great article.


Ebert is as sharp as ever.
He makes so much sense it hurts.

- Lee



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 06:24 AM
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Originally posted by Mak Manto

If you're referring to the fact of the size of the building, that it's eleven stories tall, ONLY ONE FLOOR IS A MOSQUE.

One floor is being used as a mosque, the rest of the building is being used for different purposes.


Either a lot of people don't know this due to misinformation from the far-Right media, or they don't want to accept it.

Everything about this controversy stinks.

From dubbing it the "ground zero Mosque", the Mosque inside a convention center being six blocks away from the North Towers former location and three from the edge of the whole complex, to making it seem as if Obama was 10 seconds away from running down to New York to build the Mosque himself while praising Allah.

Still, people loaded to the brim with inaccurate information from watching FOX think they are the ones that are awake in the world.

They now even seem to be the majority here at ATS.



Just wait till another article claiming that the Mosque violates sacred ground gets created and watch how much attention it gets.

No one whats facts just colorful fiction.


- Lee



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 06:39 AM
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Originally posted by Liberal1984
Firstly these things you know, just illustrates to me how one man’s “knowledge” can be another man’s garbage!


True.
It's all subjective when it comes to opinion, but the Bill of Rights is the Bill of Rights.


Your “golden opportunity” would have been a PC plastic one! Merely another media footnote in American history claiming: Islam, multiculturalism, or even mass immigration (during recession) is somehow popular.


How so?
Freedom of Religion is just that.

If you start saying that we have the right to Freedom of Religion, but only when it doesn't piss me off you jeopardize all of our basic rights.

PC has nothing to do with how those rights are applied.

They are for EVERYONE.



even angry at white men being denied jobs because they’re the wrong colour, and wrong gender.


This has nothing to do with the building of a Mosque on a floor in a community center.


People have always been angry about these issues, before the recession.


Angry and guilble.

This controversy has been manufactured and people are being mislead into creating a process by which they too will be denied Freedom of Religion.


The idea of building a Mosque above the death site, of a Muslim terrorists attack, is the perfect poster boy for American people being ignored. It rallies many free minded thinkers, against many PC people; and so makes great debate!!


45-51 Park Place is the location.

Maybe you've never been to New York so please Google it and then tell me how this is "above a death site".

If the grounds are so sacred, why build a Mall on top of it?
I mean literally not six blocks away like the community center Mosque.


The reason why I oppose it, is because I oppose the so called “messages of tolerance” supported by the political camps, who tend to advocate it.


It's not a message of tolerance it is a message of basic American rights that you actually are opposing. You act as if you are patriotic yet smash the basic rights of certain Americans because you fear a message of tolerance??

To hell with our views on "tolerance" they have a basic American "right" to build the Mosque in the community center.

Period.

You want people telling you what you can and can't build on YOUR property because they don't like it's religious associations?

This goes back to Eberts point here:


7. Many Americans and a great many politicians have either never taken a civics class or disagree with what they should have learned there. The major opinion sources in America that seem to devote the most attention to the Bill of Rights are Fox News, Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, all distorting it as an everyday practice.


- Lee



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 06:43 AM
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Originally posted by Ex_MislTech
reply to post by Liberal1984
 

I like your point on the message of tolerance.

If we try to build a casino and strip club in Saudi Arabia I think
we will be met with some severe lack of tolerance, LOL.


Thank God we are the United States of America and respect the freedoms of it's citizens and not Saudi Arabia.

Or do you think we should foolishly mimic their practices?

- Lee



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 10:29 AM
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It's amazing how a great thread like this filled with truthful, factual information goes mostly unnoticed. Nice find lee anoma.



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by lee anoma

Originally posted by Mak Manto

If you're referring to the fact of the size of the building, that it's eleven stories tall, ONLY ONE FLOOR IS A MOSQUE.

One floor is being used as a mosque, the rest of the building is being used for different purposes.


Either a lot of people don't know this due to misinformation from the far-Right media, or they don't want to accept it.

Everything about this controversy stinks.

From dubbing it the "ground zero Mosque", the Mosque inside a convention center being six blocks away from the North Towers former location and three from the edge of the whole complex, to making it seem as if Obama was 10 seconds away from running down to New York to build the Mosque himself while praising Allah.

Still, people loaded to the brim with inaccurate information from watching FOX think they are the ones that are awake in the world.

They now even seem to be the majority here at ATS.



Just wait till another article claiming that the Mosque violates sacred ground gets created and watch how much attention it gets.

No one whats facts just colorful fiction.


- Lee

Amen, brother...

Second line.



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 12:58 PM
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reply to post by Ex_MislTech
 





If we try to build a casino and strip club in Saudi Arabia I think
we will be met with some severe lack of tolerance, LOL.



I've never understood this attitude... Using someone else’s intolerance as an excuse for one’s own...

One minute people are trying to say how their society is better than someone else’s... and then, in the same breath, pointing out the flaws in someone else’s and copying them flaws to get back at them for having flaws...



Madness!!



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 01:22 PM
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Honestly, I wasnt aware that a mall was being built on the land either. I'm trying to find a recent article on the building of??? Help please finding one....


Kim



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 01:29 PM
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Originally posted by Demetre
Honestly, I wasnt aware that a mall was being built on the land either. I'm trying to find a recent article on the building of??? Help please finding one....


Kim

Here you go: Mosque: Ground Zero




Where is the outcry over the proposed ground zero mall, a 55,000-square-foot underground shopping complex directly under the exact spot where 3,000 people fell to their death? How many anti-mosque yokels know this?



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by Mak Manto
 


Thank u, thank u and thank u!!



posted on Aug, 22 2010 @ 02:58 PM
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reply to post by Mak Manto
 


I think you completley misunderstand what i mean. What i meant was do not build anything other than what i descriped.

You might think, regardles of the horrors that existed during the twin towers attack with regard to the amount of life lost, perhaps America could contribute something to the world, perhaps create a spectacle unseen in the modern world since the immense public works such as the Hoover Dam or the Panama Canal. Why is it so hard to maybe understand that a civilization may want to forgoe the material politics that exist surrounding any issue and simply create a wonder that is a testimant to all ages showing not only there enlightenment beyond petty materialism but there capability to produce such wonders of art?



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