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Are religions watering down the praying process?

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posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 12:10 AM
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When we hear of how people used to pray in the olden days, it would be a much more solemn, intricate process than it is today.

I don't know, but something tells me that the rhyming prayer conventions of today are a far cry from the prayers sent up by our ancestors in ancient times.

When I hear the priests sing the prayers at mass, and I think of how monks always have tonal resonance to their prayers, I always wonder....are prayers supposed to be sung? Does singing a prayer make it more powerful?

As much as we learn about the world today from a scientific standpoint, it seems as if we've lost just as much information from the spiritual standpoint.

I can't help but feel there is so much TPTB are hiding from us. They want to keep the secrets for themselves and leave us ignorant to information even our ancestors were privy to.

I guess they fail to realize that an ignoramus can't be blamed for their sins. After all, how can one sin if one doesn't even know what is wrong and what is right?

They are trying to corrupt us on a daily basis, but by withholding our God-given right to this knowledge, all they are doing is really reverting us back to our true selves.

Ignorant.

Happy will come later.









[edit on 21-8-2010 by Privy_Princess]




posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 12:42 AM
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I pray all the time. I believe prayers can be sung. In our sacred sweat ceremonies we sing songs to the Creator. I know that according to the Bible, one is not supposed to say repetitive prayers, like say Hail Mary's. I know when I'm dying I'll sing a death song, that's a kind of prayer. I warn my relatives that I'm coming to the skyworld to meet them, and thank the Creator for the life I've had on earth. I think one could sing their prayers, just try not to repeat too much.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 12:44 AM
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reply to post by Privy_Princess
 


Please, everyone, don't ask me to provide links. I really don't feel like searching through a Bible tonight. But I recall Jesus mentioned that prayers were not to be made into public spectacles. Nor were they to be chants and repetitions that had no meaning any longer. They were supposed to be heartfelt prayers and not for show.

You know? Communication between the individual and the Creator.

As far as prayer is concerned in other faiths, meh. I got burned once, don't need to be burned again.

I'll just stick with what is in my heart and the Creator.

I might have my own personal rituals that work for me. Alone.

Group prayers and rituals? Not interested.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 12:48 AM
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reply to post by alonzo730
 


That.....I can appreciate.
I have a death song, too. It isn't comepleted beforehand, that's for sure. Because my song will change as the situation dictates.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 12:53 AM
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I have often felt that prayer is simply a form of meditation. More than that, however, I have wondered if prayer can be something like what some people do when they use meditation and energy to affect other things. For example, imagine someone is sick and laying in a hospital bed. Four or five other people are there, around the bed, praying for the sick person. They are directing their thoughts and energy to the person who is in need of aide. There have been many cases where people are cured of illnesses or injuries and medical experts have no explanation for how the patient improved so dramatically. Could it be that there is indeed power in this form of meditation? I realize that religious folk would disagree with me, stating that God plays a part in this sort of thing. However, after feeling that way for years about prayer, and now being an ex-Christian and agnostic, that description is pretty much what I think of prayer.

As far as the recited/sung prayers in church or mass go, I think that the routine involved removes much of the intent. What I mean by that is that those prayers are usually done every week, and if you stand back and observe them, it's as though people are going through the motions rather than being passionate and energized by what they are doing. On the other hand, I've been in many more contemporary church services where prayers are completely spontaneous and done individually. Sometimes the entire sanctuary can get very emotional and the energy quite infectious. That's when the true power of a room full of meditating individuals seems to display some potential.

That being said, I have little doubt that the power of prayer, or meditation, has been diluted over the centuries. Whether or not it has been done on purpose, or if what we call prayer today is merely the product of unintentionally lost knowledge, we can only guess. But I do believe that it is much more powerful and purposeful than most people would admit to today.

That's my viewpoint on prayer.
Sorry for being a bit long-winded. I've thought about it quite a bit, and have always felt like prayer and meditation are essentially the same thing. Others may disagree, and that's completely understandable! In fact I am very interested in reading what others have to share on this topic.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 12:53 AM
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reply to post by kyred
 

Yes, I also remember being told that repetition is not Biblical and that prayers should be spontaneous. We were told to watch ourselves for New Age Movement chants and repeated slogans.

But then, I noticed that Jesus gave instructions on a prayer template in The Lord's Prayer. We repeated it every morning!
Next I noticed that "spontaneous prayers" in church always repeated certain terms and slogans - never mind the constant interjections of "Praise the Lord" or "Thank you Jesus". It's quite ironic actually.
And saying grace was always pretty uniform...



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 01:42 AM
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heres my 2 cents..well ...lol...times ten.
Yes, we are being dumbed down.
It is more of a get together than true prayer.
Prayer is a way to link brain/heart together to accentuate energy flow.
Everyone though has their way to achieve this..and thats the beauty of it all.
Everyone's hearts beats to a diffrent drum.
But deep down..
We all desire the same thing.
To live, love, be appreciated as different but as a same...in a sense.
May these wise words, make you feel as though you are not alone.
because You affect me...and I , You.

Love and light.
Silver



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 01:50 AM
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I felt compelled to add this.
Prayers....true prayers do not come from the chant.
They come straight from the heart,
The words, are but a way to get Our brains phyched to hopefully achieve
the true goal of being so pure and in a loving frame of mind as to
put aside our egos to get Our hearts synchronised to magnify this beautiful energy.

Love and light



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 02:00 AM
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I believe that prayer is between a person and that person's object of prayer - presumably the Creator.

I think prayer is a powerful force, and music is also a powerful force, so singing prayers is great.

And I think praying when you are alone is great.

What I don't like is people turning up to church on Sunday, just so they look good, and pretending to pray.

Churches are full of hypocrites.

We don't need churches, we need belief.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 02:48 AM
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reply to post by Privy_Princess
 

"Sung prayers" do not limit you.

Even the public worship of Christian churches, if you go beyond the Catholic tradition, doesn't confine itself to a "sung" version.

And public prayer is not intended to be a substitute for private prayer. Any priest or pastor, if asked, will encourage you to pray at home as well.

The only purpose of public prayer is to be a corporate expression of what the church is hopefully feeling as a group.



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 03:12 AM
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Originally posted by Privy_Princess

I don't know, but something tells me that the rhyming prayer conventions of today are a far cry from the prayers sent up by our ancestors in ancient times.

When I hear the priests sing the prayers at mass, and I think of how monks always have tonal resonance to their prayers, I always wonder....are prayers supposed to be sung? Does singing a prayer make it more powerful?

As much as we learn about the world today from a scientific standpoint, it seems as if we've lost just as much information from the spiritual standpoint.

I can't help but feel there is so much TPTB are hiding from us. They want to keep the secrets for themselves and leave us ignorant to information even our ancestors were privy to.

I guess they fail to realize that an ignoramus can't be blamed for their sins. After all, how can one sin if one doesn't even know what is wrong and what is right?

They are trying to corrupt us on a daily basis, but by withholding our God-given right to this knowledge, all they are doing is really reverting us back to our true selves.

[edit on 21-8-2010 by Privy_Princess]


Well what I do know is that very few religions actually want people to have direct experience of god. What they do want is peole to have the experiences through the priest.

look at it this way. Suppose you are a xtian and leed and exceedingly pious life and then one day you have an experience with an angel. You then take this to your local priest. What would his response be?

On a different note

Why do you think that the study of Angels and that of the visions of the Blessed Virgin Mary have been ignored by the established church and moved into the "New Age"?

Finally

If you go back to the early churches at the time of Constantine they were predominanantly ecstatic religions. Nowadays you need to go to the non-mainstream churches to get a sense of ecstatic Xtianity. Many of these churches draw a overwhelmingly large proportion of their clergy from the socially disfranchised.

[edit on 21-8-2010 by Tiger5]



posted on Aug, 21 2010 @ 03:28 AM
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reply to post by Privy_Princess
 




Does singing a prayer make it more powerful?


It would need to be demonstrated that prayer of any kind has any power at all. In order to find out if singing makes prayer more powerful you need a baseline for normal spoken prayer.



it seems as if we've lost just as much information from the spiritual standpoint.


This is because as we learn more about the world around us we have less need of conjuring up supernatural explanations for things. We don't need demons, goblins, ghouls, angels, prayers, incantations or deities anymore because we know that those answers are usually just argument's from ignorance. When we don't understand something we claim it is from a god or supernatural force... What science does is eliminate the need for those forces and replacing them with evidence and observation to create reliable models and theories. Science replaces superstition with knowledge and faith with evidence.



After all, how can one sin if one doesn't even know what is wrong and what is right?


Kinda makes you wonder why God condemns Adam and Eve AND all their descendants despite the fact he hadn't given them any means of knowing what they did was wrong.



posted on Aug, 26 2010 @ 07:59 PM
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reply to post by Privy_Princess
 


Yes it is! The influence of the demonic has reduced the importance and the intimacy of prayer! Religion is a means to control a group of people!
I never read Jesus saying lets go to the local baptist or Mormon,or catholic church to worship God and pray have you? He said where two or more gather in his name, he is with you! He also said when you pray go into a closet and be alone with God, and tell no one of your prayers.
Prayer is meant to be your personal and private time with God!



posted on Aug, 26 2010 @ 08:04 PM
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reply to post by kyred
 


You are correct. Jesus said to keep the prayer between you and the Father. If you pray don't shout from the mountains because than it would seem you are showing yourself off. Stay humble about everything.

It is the same when giving to charities. You see celebrities donating time on TV just to get exposure. Are they better than a person who does it for nothing?

You must pray, meditate, fast, and love.

That could revolve around anyone work life.



posted on Aug, 26 2010 @ 08:07 PM
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Originally posted by Privy_Princess
When we hear of how people used to pray in the olden days, it would be a much more solemn, intricate process than it is today.

I don't know, but something tells me that the rhyming prayer conventions of today are a far cry from the prayers sent up by our ancestors in ancient times.

When I hear the priests sing the prayers at mass, and I think of how monks always have tonal resonance to their prayers, I always wonder....are prayers supposed to be sung? Does singing a prayer make it more powerful?

As much as we learn about the world today from a scientific standpoint, it seems as if we've lost just as much information from the spiritual standpoint.

I can't help but feel there is so much TPTB are hiding from us. They want to keep the secrets for themselves and leave us ignorant to information even our ancestors were privy to.

I guess they fail to realize that an ignoramus can't be blamed for their sins. After all, how can one sin if one doesn't even know what is wrong and what is right?

They are trying to corrupt us on a daily basis, but by withholding our God-given right to this knowledge, all they are doing is really reverting us back to our true selves.

Ignorant.

Happy will come later.


But let he who can read,read the word for himself! If you don't learn and you take the word of others how can you ever know if right is right and wrong is wrong? You must also know that the bible is not the whole bible it its a condensed version the book of genesis is twice as thick as the modern king James or its takeoffs versions! If you don't know why we have the king James version then you won't understand that there is much much more to God than whats in that book alone!







[edit on 21-8-2010 by Privy_Princess]



posted on Aug, 26 2010 @ 08:15 PM
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Prayer is thought energy.

Really doesn't matter what method is used.

Only matters if it is positive or negative.



posted on Aug, 27 2010 @ 08:54 PM
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Originally posted by Annee
Prayer is thought energy.

Really doesn't matter what method is used.

Only matters if it is positive or negative.


And this is what this thread is about, the totally false interpretation about what prayer is, And what God has said about it!!!!!!
God hears your prayers he don't feel your energy! He said I have HEARD your prayers and I am listening!



posted on Aug, 27 2010 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by slinger

Originally posted by Annee
Prayer is thought energy.

Really doesn't matter what method is used.

Only matters if it is positive or negative.


And this is what this thread is about, the totally false interpretation about what prayer is, And what God has said about it!!!!!!
God hears your prayers he don't feel your energy! He said I have HEARD your prayers and I am listening!



Hmmmm - - you must be the god dictator.

Peace - Love - Energy to you.



posted on Aug, 27 2010 @ 09:33 PM
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reply to post by alonzo730
 


Actually, the "repetitive" prayer process you are referring to is the pagan praying ("as the heathens do") that Jesus was condemning, not the Rosary, which is a meditation, based on Mysteries prayers prayed with heartfelt meaning-- the Hail Mary, and the Our Father, Glory Be (Doxology) and Apostles Creed.

If repetitive, heartfelt prayer is condemned, then the Bible contradicts itself in Revelation-- the angels in heaven repeat unceasingly, “Holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty, who was and is and is to come” (Rev. 4:8)...

Jesus Himself contradicts this apparent idea when he repeats the "Our Father" after he teaches it to his disciples, and also when He repeates the same exact prayer three times in the Garden of Gethsemane during His Passion.

Thus Christ warned His faithful to avoid praying as the pagans do. However, He did not warn against repetition itself.

God Bless~



posted on Aug, 27 2010 @ 09:38 PM
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Originally posted by alonzo730
I pray all the time. I believe prayers can be sung. In our sacred sweat ceremonies we sing songs to the Creator. I know that according to the Bible, one is not supposed to say repetitive prayers, like say Hail Mary's. I know when I'm dying I'll sing a death song, that's a kind of prayer. I warn my relatives that I'm coming to the skyworld to meet them, and thank the Creator for the life I've had on earth. I think one could sing their prayers, just try not to repeat too much.


Yes, singing prayers feels so good. I have also recently learned that prayers should be spoken from a place of empowerment, not one of need. It is really about giving thanks and creatively affirming your life. Beautiful.




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