Attention: There Is Already a Mosque Near the WTC Site

reply to post by misinformational


LoL thats easy, How do you know it was a CHRISTIAN that dropped the bomb?

And further more, it wasnt a RELIGIOUS war like the Extreme muslims are waging........do you remember the PREMISE of that war?

How do you know there werent agnostics and jews that help load that bomb?

Once again, it wasnt a religious war......pretty simple answer really

reply to post by Riposte


Nope, actually it saddens me to observe such a narrow-minded and ignorant display.

reply to post by DrJay1975

Originally posted by DrJay1975
Wow. If you could actually do a little math, ya know some 2+2 action then maybe you'd understand it isn't bigotry. That's why there is nobody asking to move the existing Mosque. It's not considered the WTC site. It's not the site initially promised to the Greek Orthodox church.

I don't know where you're getting your information, but a good deal of it is wrong.

This property has nothing to do with St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox. It was never promised them, they were never planning to build there, it is six blocks away from where St. Nick's stood until 9/11 and where it will hopefully stand once again once they work out the details of their deal with the Port Authority, with whom they are trying to do a land exchange.

The place where they want to build the Park51/Cordoba House community center and Islamic prayer space is not considered the WTC site either; it is private property blocks away from the WTC site.

The issue isn't with Muslims. The issue is respect for the dead. American Muslims are not idealogically compatible with middle eastern muslims. 1% support for terrorism here vs 50+% in the middle east. One block can also make a helluva difference. Religous freedom isn't the issue, poor taste and the hypocrisy of the Imam is. Everything he says he wants to do conflicts with what he's causing by putting it there.

And two blocks can make even more of a difference; that's how far this proposed building will be from the WTC site.

Have you considered the possibility that he wanted to put it there because he has served a congregation in the neighborhood for decades, because he has good relationships with the people in the neighborhood and with other (non-Muslim) religious groups in the neighborhood already? Because as someone who was down there handing out water to rescue workers in the days after 9/11 he has a better idea of what the neighborhood needs to heal than people who have never been there and are basing their arguments on misinformation dished out by blogs?

YOur problem is you label everyone who objects to the Mosque a bigot. They aren't. Some merely think it's a dishonor to the innocent victims of 9/11. The problem is epople on either side have tunnel vision. It isn't a freedom of religion issue. If it was the GOC would take presidence. The Imam wants to implement Sharia Law in the US. By definition that is a political movement which removes it from the freedom of religion debate. Almost 60% of Americans object to itIs our government a ruling class or a group who governs?

Does knowing that the Greek Orthodox Church is six blocks away and involved in a private negotiation over terms with the property owner of the land they want to build on change your perspective at all?


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[edit on 8/17/2010 by americandingbat]

It's a simple question: do you follow law or do you follow personal feelings and what's appropriate?

If they have a permit to build the mosque there, that's it. Feelings no longer matter anymore. And BTW, urging Muslims to build mosque somewhere else ie. not in the vicinity of WTC is pretty much putting a blame on all of them for 9/11.

So in a way, it's a good old racism. You can't have it both ways so you need to decide.

The Funding Concerns
Here is an 8-minute CNN Radio interview with the spokesman for Park51, Oz Sultan.

Interview with 'ground zero mosque' spokesman

It appears there will be transparency in the funding, and in addition, they will be applying for...

Sultan said they are committed to a transparent fundraising process and they will not take any money from any source that is on the TreasuryDepartment’s watch list. He claimed they will even apply for Homeland Security funding available for terrorist abatement programs.

Fundraising is not beginning for a few months yet. Domestic funding is the priority...state, local, and federal money. They will comply with theTreasury Department and will not take money from anyone on anywatch lists.

There will be transparency at all steps.

reply to post by ManBehindTheMask


Your attempts to justify your beliefs and not accept your hypocrisy is really quite sad.

Well, here goes it:

If they want to build the mosque as a slap in the face to 9/11 victims and America itself, well, let them (I'm not saying they are). You know why? Because it is more important to protect the rights of those we disagree with. I would much rather stand up for the rights of someone I disagree with than try to shut them up. You know why? Because I would expect the same thing from them.

So let's say that we all be quiet and let them build it? What EXACTLY would that mean? Does this mean all women are now required to wear Burkas in America. All books that are not the Quaran are burned? All men have to wear beards. People are now stoned instead of imprisoned?

What EXACTLY are you people so freaking AFRAID of?

reply to post by misinformational


first of all you dont know what my beliefs are, other then the fact that i think it is wrong to place a mosque there, and due to EVIDENCE,reason, financial backings, and history of the money men behind this is QUITE dubious.

Ive provided facts and figures behind this....

HOWEVER, I do believe its their right to do so none the less

Whether you agree with me or not is of no consequence........

I find your reasons FOR this mosque being built are quite blind and illogical....
You dont like my answers because you call people hypocrites for not wanting it there.

All the while citing Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the OKC bombing as grounds for hypocrisy, when its CLEARLY not even on the same level.....

I find that a flimsy argument........however, we agree to disagree and thats fine with me.

[edit on 17-8-2010 by ManBehindTheMask]

Old news to me.

but to bad others dont know about it.

reply to post by ManBehindTheMask


Does the rest of the world view us as an agnostic or jewish nation? Nope, they view us as a Christian nation... It was Christian politicians that made the call (commander-in-chief).

I saw a while back that you're also a Marine Veteran.. Did you deploy? I did, twice to Iraq. While we had to deal with a certain element.. The Muslims that I personally encountered and dealt with (I was with 3/5 for the March and Operation Phantom Fury) were by-and-large kind and good-hearted people.. They lived impoverished lives yet still attempted to better their communities for the common good.

The whole point of all of this is ensuring that our Constitution continues to protect our rights - If you say to a certain faith they aren't allowed to do something, then we are saying that it is ok to restrict freedom of religion... Once a freedom is restricted, it by definition, is no longer a freedom.

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[edit on 17-8-2010 by misinformational]

reply to post by mothershipzeta


Actually it is. Because a cultural center is not suppose to be a religious center. You only need look at the architecture and see what they are all about. It is a religious indoctrination zone. Provide for the community and have religious undertones for a certain way. Now certainly there is all the right to build these things. But as said, it's location is a matter of speech. I've volunteered at Christian versions of the same exact thing. If it's president was from the westbro baptist church, I would be just as much in questioning of it.

reply to post by Gorman91


How have you even looked at their architecture? All they have released as far as I know is a concept drawing of what it might look like.

And it looked to me pretty much like most glass-and-steel buildings, with a slight Islamic flavor in the patterning of the front.

As for community centers not being religiously affiliated, what about a YMCA or a JCC (Jewish Community Center), which were used as the model for this one?

Another thing to keep in mind regarding this issue.

If all concede that they have a right to build the mosque then what those people are doing to prevent them from building the mosque may be technically illegal.

The mosque builders are being deprived of their right to worship as they see fit.

All the legal authorities in New York have said they can go ahead and build the mosque there. Therefore those going out of there way to prevent that are committing a crime against the constitution and probably can be sued at a minimum.

reply to post by americandingbat


Like I said. If a YMCA was led by a member of the westbro baptist church I would be suspicious. The faith does not matter. The person does. The person involved has a checkered past. And I would like to know funding.

Originally posted by airspoon
You can't expect many people who argue against it to use logic. If their favorite pundit didn't say it, then it isn't reality for them.

--airspoon

After an exhausting seven pages of commentary... It appears that airspoon had it right from the get-go.

I've voiced my concerns to the people that are vehemently opposing the erection of religious building.

You have every right to your opinion.. However, I do deplore you all to take a long look at this situation in an unbiased light - if at all possible.

These are not Afghani/Taliban fanatics erecting a war monument... These are American citizens legally purchasing property and building a religious center 2 blocks from the site of the WTC.

As Americans, we all cherish our constitutionally protected rights - it is the foundation of what used to make this country great. We've let politicians and media sensationalize everything and instill fear of what's not us.

I am not Muslim. I have had close friends, nay brothers, struck down by insurgents in Iraq.. I won't let the actions of few dictate my view for any entire culture... People are the same everywhere, we have been lucky enough to be born into a country that provides a considerable amount of protection for certain inalienable rights.. The people that want to build this Islamic center were born into the same country - They have all the same rights as you and I. See past the politics, see past the fear-mongering. See that we are all people, we all bleed the same, cry the same, laugh the same, and love the same. And we all deserve the same rights and the same protection to our rights.

[edit - grammar]

[edit on 17-8-2010 by misinformational]

reply to post by Gorman91


The funding doesn't exist yet, but the project has promised to take no money from any person or group on the Treasury Department's watchlist.

The Imam has a shady background? Where did you get that idea? From one of the opinion pieces on the subject that backs it up with things like "his wife's uncle's former mosque now has a hyperlink on their website to a group that might be a terrorist front"?

reply to post by Soldier of God




Or maybe. It's not just a mosque, but a community center.

If you wanted to build a church. You know, have your own church. And one of the place to build it was perhaps half a mile down the road from the"old" church.

Would you not build it for that reason?

How do we know that the people building this community center (which includes a mosque) have the same set of beliefs as the people at the old mosque?

Not all muslims are the same. Regardless of people who are frothing at the mouth against this issue would have you believe..

This site is full of angry and short sighted people. I am tired of all of the harrasment and people being insulting for no reason.

NO ONE THINKS IT IS AGAINST THE LAW TO BUILD A NEW MOSQUE. !!!
NO ONE, NO ONE, NO ONE.............

people are saying that the Imam, is not taking peoples fealings into consideration, while saying he is concerned about building bridges. Well if you want to build a bridge, start by building bridges not walls.

That does not make me a biggot, because I would like people who suffered to have their feelings taken into concideration. It makes you all biggots for having biggoted views of people who would just like others to be conciderate of their beliefs and feelings.

reply to post by Gorman91

If it's president was from the westbro baptist church, I would be just as much in questioning of it.

Now there's a thought, lol

Who are the people who suffered? The 9/11 families? Even they are divided on this issue? Other people? Muslims died that day along with everyone else.