Why are animals stupid?? (interesting question)

What an insult to my boy Gravy (pictured in avatar). In no way are animal dumb norstupid...it comes down to the owner... respect, time and love. Just an hour with Gravy, and i assure you, you'd change your mind.

This seems to have become a discussion about animals being smarter than us. That is not what was said. We just underestimate the intelligence of animals. I read an article about pigs having the mental capacity of a 3 year old human child. I'm sure many people would never have expected that.

www.goveg.com...

It may be that we overestimate the value of intelligence per se.

Allegators = 65 million year history, very small brains.
Humans = less than 1 million year history (much less), big brains.

Allegators probably wouldn't invent the nuclear weapons, chemical warfare, and twisted ideologies that could quite easily take our speices out of the game in the next 100 years, to say nothing of making it to the one-million mark.

If we are still around in 65 million years, maybe then we can have bragging rights. Until then, our gigantic frontal lobes, tool-weilding abilities, complex speech, and so forth are very much fresh-out-of-the-oven experiments.

reply to post by Ozevee



Well, I knew, I have worked with pigs for years, and frankly, they are one of the coolest animals to interact with, they're smart and funny.

I'm not sure why this is news? We are smartest because thats the evolutionary route we went down. Given we're the top of the food chain it seems to have worked out rather well for us..

Other animals less so because they specialised in different ways. Your dog has much better smell, hearing and pain tolerance abilities than you. He needs it because he cant bait a trap or make a spear.

Its a function of brain size and architecture.

Belief has nothing to do with it. A dog can no more choose to be smarter than we can to be dumber. You have the intelligence your genetics equip you with. Unless you physically damage yourself you cant change it. You could if you wished choose to act in a stupid manner but thats not the same thing.

The fact we can frame this debate at all illustrates what makes us different.

check this out,

i saw this a while ago.


www.youtube.com...

Maybe our concept of intelligence requires some alterations. We tend to consider animal intelligence by reference to our own, and then claim we are the most intelligent lifeform on the planet.. which seems a bit over the top really but not unusual for human beings to claim such things.

Some people have given illustrations of animal intelligence that they have observed with their pets, etc. I agree that I can see my pets weighing up options and making decisions, etc.

I also note with interest that an animal is the greatest judge of human character, and will immeditaly inform us if we are observant, otherwise we are left to discover what they knew some time down the track.

I think it our Ego that wants us to believe we are the most intelligen thing on the planet. But what sort of intelligence poisons itself with everything it touches and uses? What intelligence fills its environment with toxins?

Only Humans do and that makes us one of the least intelligent forms of life in this world.

Animals are not stupid.

Human intelligence can not be compared with that of an animal.
The animal shows intelligence big time for its ability to adapt to human standards.

Don't forget. The animal does not have the same talents we do. the concept of speech and the ability to understand it is seen in countless animals. Yet... We still only guess when it comes to animal language.


reply to post by JohnPhoenix

I see training the dogs as a sign not so much that dogs are smarter, but that they are more foolish because they allow themselves to be taught.

This effects us even more. The only instinctive behavior we start with is to suck.
Everything else is taught. Which leaves us in a very vulnerable position. Does it not ?

Back on topic.

The look what we can do argument is just absurd. All it took was an opposable thumb.
The ability to manipulate what nature gives us, to benefit our needs. An increasing intelligence is IMO a logical consequence. Since every tool and use of it, opens up new possibilities to implement the use of it and discover the next challenge / possibility.

This way of development is IMO the seem way we grow up into adulthood. One step at the time.

reply to post by Tayesin


Hi

I agree with you. except for this part :

I think it our Ego that wants us to believe we are the most intelligen thing on the planet. But what sort of intelligence poisons itself with everything it touches and uses? What intelligence fills its environment with toxins?

Only Humans do and that makes us one of the least intelligent forms of life in this world.

Usually prey animals, like rabbits, sheep, deer and so on... They tend to overpopulate and destroy their habitats. When the balances changes into their favor that is.

Example. Deer / wolf balance / Yellowstone national park.
Exotic or introduced animals in a habitat they are alien to. Without their predators.

Like many kiwi ( Wingless Bird ) like species who got extinct when a predator appears where they never had one.

Edit to add link :

I've created a thread a while ago with a number of extraordinary animal behavior which have and are the reason that made us realize we had to reevaluate our understanding on the matter.

It was called : Humans. Not so special after all ! Intelligence in animals and evolution ?

[edit on 8/15/2010 by Sinter Klaas]

reply to post by Sinter Klaas


I'm not sure I follow you.

We are smarter because we evolved that way. And yes, tool use opens up more potential for natural selection upon intelligence as a trait, the more intelligent will use the tools better and be more successful. More so than just those with the best hearing or biggest frame.

I know of no other animal on this planet that has intelligence on a par with an adult homo sapiens (even a lower percentile example). We are a fluke.

There seems to be confusion here about intelligence being used as a measure of worth. Thats a different argument altogether. I agree that our behaviour towards less intelligent creatures is one that we need to modify less we find ourselves in a destroyed biosphere.

However, trying to make that argument by convincing people that animals are as smart as we are is flawed. Its wrong and it wont work. What we need to work on is having an increased respect for life of less intelligence.

Stopping eating other moderately intelligent mammals would be a good start.

reply to post by justwokeup


www.youtube.com...


we are flukes.

i don't know too many who can live without electricity, supermarkets, clothing stores or a/c.

reply to post by fooks


LMAO. Thats genius :-)

Thats todays reason to get out of bed taken care of....

This has literally got to be the dumbest post on ATS.

How is a post like this even getting on here?

Animals are not stupid. And as for their beliefs well we don't actually know if they have beliefs?

Bad post OP

Would you wanna go up to a gorilla and call him stupid..

Originally posted by union_jack
Would you wanna go up to a gorilla and call him stupid..

lmao! good idea!

once you got the tree out of your arse...lol, old boy and the rest will be rolling
around the forest and grunting about it for days!

I come from a lost era. Things were simplier then. However, they were no less important to daily life, they were crucial to existence and needed to be concentrated upon. Today, we have too many distractions that tempt us but have no connection to actual survial. We are mind weary. Things have gotten too complicated for us to understand them unless we are experts in that field. Pick any field or even trade you want to, astro-physics, quantum physics, medicine, social engineering, psychology, even automobile mechanics...anything, and it defies a ready understanding. We have no choice but to leave it to the experts or, increasingly, to the computers to think, do and know for us.

General TV lulls us, video games gives us something to manipulate, excel at and control. Then we have the things we sate ourselves with in a physical way, food, drink, drugs and sex, consumption of one kind or another. The younger people see the writing on the wall, and they don't like it. They don't want stuffed heads, they want to feel alive and in control even if they see the consequnces are dire.

I keep being reminded of that haunting English song of a couple of decades with the words, "Another brick in the wall...."

Yet as the standard first line of my signature says, the inevitable must happen. The result is: "Monkey see. Monkey do." Wisdom must happen later. In the meantime, as the monkey plays catchup with himself; the monkey is psychotic. So, leave the primate alone to do his thing in his own way. It will be a wholly different world, but no more crazier.

reply to post by justwokeup


I don't recall that I ever said that animals are as smart as humans... Did I ?

I know of no other animal on this planet that has intelligence on a par with an adult homo sapiens (even a lower percentile example). We are a fluke.

There is a list of numbers where they show the level of intelligence with.

We are given a 7. Chimps get a 2 and the dolphin gets a 5.

Now have dolphins an entirely different brain. Our frontal cortex which makes us different from animals and capable of our intelligence has developed totally different. We do not know how much effect this has regarding their intelligence.

What we do know is that their brains a bigger. They are capable of every emotion we are and they have an understanding of reality and their place in it.

They learn quickly and adapt to human behavior easily. The have an extra sense ( echo location ) which will mean they live in an extra dimension then we do. They can shut off halve of the brain to sleep and still be vigilant on its surroundings.

That's it. We have know way to know for sure how far there intelligence really goes.

Birds with tiny brains perform stuff we thought a big brain could only do.

However, trying to make that argument by convincing people that animals are as smart as we are is flawed. Its wrong and it wont work. What we need to work on is having an increased respect for life of less intelligence.

We fail to respect members of our own species. There is no difference in respect for life where respect itself isn't present.

My personal opinion :
It doesn't matter how intelligent animals are. We treat them all like crap, just like we do amongst ourselves. Except for the eating part of course.

We simply discovered, again that we were wrong. The boundary has become smaller and either animals are really smart or we are more animal then we like to be.

Arrogance thrives among man... It makes us look really, really stupid.

reply to post by Sinter Klaas

Hi Sinter,
Thanks mate.

I've bookmarked the link to read tomorrow.

Originally posted by ShadowAngel85
No videos, no proof, no nothing.

Did you even look? There are lots of videos on youtube.

They don't understand our language, they're not intelligent, just driven by instinct.

Well of course the definition of "intelligent" is subject to debate, but how can you say they don't understand language?

CHIMPANZEES CAN READ AND WRITE

Chimpanzees are highly intelligent and can do what a grade-shool child can do - sometimes more quickly. They understand language, understand the concept of symbols, and can read and write (by punching the right word on a computer).

They don't understand as many words as we do, and like people, some individuals are more intelligent than others. But they can use about 40 words in the case of the above video, or more in the case of the OP.

There are lots more videos on youtube on animals understanding our language, if you look.