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Over 1 Billion Muslims and Growing

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posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 12:38 PM
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Just to give my own answers to the posts here:


dlbrandt
I haven't read the koran only parts as quoted by other books. How can you say that the koran doesn't promote war and terrorism.

The Qur'an doesn't promote violence but gives very strict guidelines on when and how to fight a war if it is necessary.


dlbrandt
In it, it states to muslims that they are not to take Jews and Christians as friends. And that if killing is required to further the cause of Islam then do it.

The statement is advice to not live under Jewish or Christian states ("friends and protectors" the better translation) because there is no guarantee that those states will treat a Muslim fairly. A Islamic state must treat a non-Muslim with fairness however, allowing him to practice his faith. Of course Muslims can be personal friends with Christians and Jews since the Qur'an even says a Muslim man can marry a Jew or Christian woman.


asdasd12345
from what ive read, the moderate peaceful muslims are actually considered less devout because they selectively ignore the violent hate preaching parts that are in about half the koran

They don't ignore anything for to do so is like going against God, it is just that there is no hate preached in the way you imply.



popeye0314
How does the story of creation go according to Islam? You mentioned evolution.

There are verses that describe the Creation, most of it fits in with modern science's view (Big Bang etc). However the theory creation of life through evolution is seemingly in complete disagreement.


Wassabi
I as a Christian do not hate Muslims, but I do think they are misguided. ...Muslims as a whole are the locusts that are mentioned in Revelations.

This is the Muslim view of Christians, too. However, Muslims don't think of Christians as "locusts."


asdasd12345
ok firstly i find that its really hard to believe that anyone can take religion seriously. to me there is no doubt in my mind there is no god. i believe human beings have a hard time understanding certain concepts, one of them being infinity.

If you believe in evidence but without established theory and "proof," then you have a belief that is essentially a religion. The belief of creation by evolution is such an example.


dlbrandt
The korans agenda is to take over the world.

Muslims aren't required to do that by Islam though peacefully offering it to others is encouraged. The Prophet reportedly said that Muslims won't hold much power at the end despite being in great numbers.




posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 12:45 PM
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asdasd12345
what about these quotes

(Koran 8:12) "Remember Thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you: give firmness to the believers, I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers, Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips of them."

(Koran 2:216) "Warfare is ordained for you, though it is hateful unto you; but it may happen that you hate a thing which is good for you and it may happen that you love a thing which is bad for you. Allah knoweth, you knew not."

(Koran 69:30-37) "(It will be said) Take him and fetter him and expose him to hell fire. And then insert him in a chain whereof the length is seventy cubits. Lo! he used not to believe in God the tremendous, and urged not on the feeding of the wretched. Therefore hath he no lover hear this day nor any food save filth which none but sinners eat."

I know someone's already answered you but I thought you might need help again:

The first verse referring to what Allah said to the Angels. Man is quite different.

The second quoted verse said war is a necessary evil. Permission is given to fight against those who fight you, I don't know how this is a problem.

The last verse is a description of Hell. Even simple-minded people should see Muslims are not being told to do that which Allah will.



popeye0314
Why do suicide bombers believe they will be rewarded for thier actions?

Assuming you refer to Palestinians and a reward by Allah: If they know Islam they would know only Allah knows their fate in the Afterlife. Suicide and killing innocents are both crimes in Islam but so is what the Israelis are doing. I'd guess they just want to hurt because they are hurt themselves.


popeye0314
Why aren't muslims tried in a court of thier peers the same way catholics and christians are.

They do, you might hear of executions in "Islamic" countries. As for the suicide bombers it would be pointless trying them, yes?


popeye0314
What is Jihad? and why wouldn't there be an equal in christianity.

Simply the struggle to adhere to Islam's teachings. It's equated to war by many confused non-Muslims for some reason.



popeye0314
Why does islam teach to kill those that will not submit to allah?
Who is allah?
Why do muslims fight each other?

It does not, you misinterpret the Qur'an or get your information about Islam off some anti-Islamic website (read Christian).

Allah is simply Arabic for God. Even Arab-Christians use the word in their faith. The Islamic view of God is unimaginable by the human mind but the essential point is that there is only one God. This is different to the Trinity view of Christians.

For the same reasons anyone fights another.


TexasConspiracyNut
Where are the over one billion condeming muslims that hate what these terrorist are doing to the western world?

Probably asking why USA doesn't condemn Israel for its crimes against Palestine. However, plenty of Muslim leaders and web-sites (go check yourself) condemned terrorist attacks such as 9-11, just that the media didn't spoonfeed you that.



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 01:14 PM
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Neither Islam as a religion nor Muslims as a people are our enemy.
The US government is not attempting to turn us against the Islamic world as a means of diverting attention from other issues or to find an enemy to replace the Soviet bloc as eddie999 would have us believe.
Radical Islam has chosen the western world, and the USA in particular, to be its scapegoat. It is their need for a foriegn enemy that is the root of our troubles today.



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 01:29 PM
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What you all think about Islam and the end times??

I know alot of ppl at ats arent religious etc, but im asking as i have not read alot about islam and the end times with the christian perspective.

If you believe in Jesus then you know that Islam is a false religion, so what about Islamic involvement with False Prophet?? Beast?? 666??



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 02:46 PM
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Originally posted by TruthStrgnrThanFiction
What you all think about Islam and the end times??

I know alot of ppl at ats arent religious etc, but im asking as i have not read alot about islam and the end times with the christian perspective.

If you believe in Jesus then you know that Islam is a false religion, so what about Islamic involvement with False Prophet?? Beast?? 666??


Muslims believe in Jesus just as much as any Christian if not more, but not as a God. Also that Jesus wasn't crucified but sits in Heaven at this moment, waiting to return to Earth.

The Islamic view of the end times is mostly by way of reported sayings, not always the Qur'an. There are many (reported) signs of the approach to the end, for example the appearance of Magog and Gog tribes, various wars, a Beast from the Earth. Of Jesus' return it is said that it will be at a time when people are about to war against the anti-Christ. After a major war, he will finally bring peace to earth under the rule of Islam, dwell, marry and die on earth like any other man. On the last day a "trumpet" blown by an angel will kill all life on Earth, and another trumpet blown to resurrect everybody for Judgement.



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 03:09 PM
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Muslims that hate terrorism are everywhere and represent 99% of the Muslims. Chistians that hate Muslims are 20% and half in America!!!

Never forget that Muslims are Christians too, belive in Jesus and want peace, just not like us who need oil only.

America is the same as Nazis 80 years ago, the ones that hate and want to be right.

Never forget who was Prescott Bush, the Banker of Hitler and the grand father of W., 43 of the name and tradition!

Roman sionists are making their nazi war again, but with a fasl roman mask now.

Der Furher for ever????!!



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 06:18 PM
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It will be also time to "oil-bush lobby" to stop control Saudi and Irak politic, oil and culture as it permited to Saoudi to give the money to Pakistan in order they have the atomic bomb, and they have it now, thanks to Bush lobby.
Pakistan is said to be the most creasy muslim-like country and Bush lobby gave them with perfect knowledge!
Any one would have mad better. With a hope of peace, not of atomic bomb.
Over one billion are to die with nuclear bombs thanks to Bush lobby (Cheney-Wolkowitz-Pearl-Ben Ladden...) and the hate of each other he created in arabs countries...
The big chef of terror in Muslim countries is Bush, no problem, he will be back after to take the oil.



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by mithras

Originally posted by TruthStrgnrThanFiction
What you all think about Islam and the end times??

I know alot of ppl at ats arent religious etc, but im asking as i have not read alot about islam and the end times with the christian perspective.

If you believe in Jesus then you know that Islam is a false religion, so what about Islamic involvement with False Prophet?? Beast?? 666??


Muslims believe in Jesus just as much as any Christian if not more, but not as a God. Also that Jesus wasn't crucified but sits in Heaven at this moment, waiting to return to Earth.

The Islamic view of the end times is mostly by way of reported sayings, not always the Qur'an. There are many (reported) signs of the approach to the end, for example the appearance of Magog and Gog tribes, various wars, a Beast from the Earth. Of Jesus' return it is said that it will be at a time when people are about to war against the anti-Christ. After a major war, he will finally bring peace to earth under the rule of Islam, dwell, marry and die on earth like any other man. On the last day a "trumpet" blown by an angel will kill all life on Earth, and another trumpet blown to resurrect everybody for Judgement.






The antichrist, that is not the Antechrist (the Beforechrist, Lucifer, the lightmaker, the prefered angel of God that can put humans in a bad wrong way and so become "satan", because he knows to much for them but tryed to tought humans but humans were stupid and did bad things because they didn't understand the meanings and couldn't) will be Christian and will war against humans and god (jesus teach) for his luxe (money, power...) but in the name of God and Jesus...

[edit on 23/6/2004 by Alchy]



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by mithras

Originally posted by TruthStrgnrThanFiction



Muslims believe in Jesus just as much as any Christian if not more, but not as a God. Also that Jesus wasn't crucified but sits in Heaven at this moment, waiting to return to Earth.

The Islamic view of the end times is mostly by way of reported sayings, not always the Qur'an. There are many (reported) signs of the approach to the end, for example the appearance of Magog and Gog tribes, various wars, a Beast from the Earth. Of Jesus' return it is said that it will be at a time when people are about to war against the anti-Christ. After a major war, he will finally bring peace to earth under the rule of Islam, dwell, marry and die on earth like any other man. On the last day a "trumpet" blown by an angel will kill all life on Earth, and another trumpet blown to resurrect everybody for Judgement.







When you say that the difference between the muslim belief of Jesus and the christian belief is that muslims don't believe He's God, that is one major difference. As a christian Jesus is my God who saved me.

I am also curious about who Islam says Gog and Magog are?



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 06:52 PM
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Originally posted by Alchy
Chistians that hate Muslims are 20% and half in America!!!




Please remember a true christian values all life. We don't hate people, we don't like false religions that deny Jesus Christ as God and deny what Christ did to destroy sin and death and save mankind. I am also upset that billions(not just muslims) are believing in false ways of salvation.



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 07:00 PM
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The antichrist, that is not the Antechrist (the Beforechrist, Lucifer, the lightmaker, the prefered angel of God that can put humans in a bad wrong way and so become "satan", because he knows to much for them but tryed to tought humans but humans were stupid and did bad things because they didn't understand the meanings and couldn't) will be Christian and will war against humans and god (jesus teach) for his luxe (money, power...) but in the name of God and Jesus...

[edit on 23/6/2004 by Alchy]


Where did you get this from?



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 07:14 PM
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Originally posted by TruthStrgnrThanFiction

When you say that the difference between the muslim belief of Jesus and the christian belief is that muslims don't believe He's God, that is one major difference. As a christian Jesus is my God who saved me.

I am also curious about who Islam says Gog and Magog are?


Jesus never said he was God or a God, there is only one God, Jesus is a human, a son of god, our brother, we are all son of God.

He was only pure (the Pure, if you want) and son of God as anybody.

I'm Christian, Catholic and I've never heard Jesus was a God, there is one God.
He is a saint and a prophet and represent the third part of the world that is Humanity, the sons of God that are matterial and spirit, humans (like martians too if ever they exist).
The 2 other parts are God, the matterial, everything and holly spirit, the what-is-to-be, the reason, the action.
We can say Jesus is a God because he is said to be so pure like God, but he is human first and represent what a good human must be (with a willy also).

The father (God, all atoms), the son (Humans, martians and Jesus the king of the Nices, of humans), and holly spirit (action and reason of anything)

[edit on 23/6/2004 by Alchy]

[edit on 23/6/2004 by Alchy]



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by dlbrandt


The antichrist, that is not the Antechrist (the Beforechrist, Lucifer, the lightmaker, the prefered angel of God that can put humans in a bad wrong way and so become "satan", because he knows to much for them but tryed to tought humans but humans were stupid and did bad things because they didn't understand the meanings and couldn't) will be Christian and will war against humans and god (jesus teach) for his luxe (money, power...) but in the name of God and Jesus...
[edit on 23/6/2004 by Alchy]


Where did you get this from?




You're funny, the Bible, I'm cathechist.

[edit on 23/6/2004 by Alchy]



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 07:27 PM
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John 10:30 I and my Father are one

Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon His shoulder: and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, "The mighty God", "The everlasting Father", The Prince of Peace.


Jesus said He was and He is God. It's in the Bible.



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 07:34 PM
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There are currently 1.6 Billion Muslims in the World. The U.N believes that by the year 2050 ...45% of the world population will be Muslim.....Thus it is important to familiarize ourselves with the way of Islam:

Islam is not a new Religion. Prophet Muhammad( pbuh) was not the founder of Islam. He was in fact the Last Messenger of Islam. The word "Islam" is derived from the hebrew root " Shalom" (peace) and the aramaic "Shalem" (completion/perfection as in a Message). The full definition of Islam reflects all of these underlying meanings and can be translated " Submission to the Will of G-d in perfect harmony and accordance with the Laws of Nature". In short "Islam" is "Equilibrium". It is the balanced Din ( Way of Life). It is the Animus and the Equus. Islam is the very message that Jesus Christ (pbuh) taught . Jesus Christ taught and practiced the Religion of Ha'Shlama ( translation: Islam) and Prophet John the Baptist was an Islamic martyr.

According to the Qur'an , the Prophet Abraham(pbuh) was the first man to coin the term " Muslims" and he stated that his companions and descendents are Muslims. Similarly subseqent Prophets also used the term " Muslim" as a way of identifying themselves.

Jesus Christ referred to his disciples as "The Mushlam" and he urged others to emulate:

Jesus Christ (pbuh) using the word "Muslim" in Luke 6:40

Ein talmeed na'leh 'al rabbo; shekken kal adam she'MUSHLAM yihyeh k'rabbo


Translation in English: "No student can be above his teacher, but everyone that is a MUSLIM, can be as his teacher."



----River

P.S: The Dead Sea Scrolls of Qumran also confirm that the righteous are known as the community that SUBMITS [ to perform Islam]



posted on Jun, 23 2004 @ 07:44 PM
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Originally posted by dlbrandt
John 10:30 I and my Father are one

Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon His shoulder: and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, "The mighty God", "The everlasting Father", The Prince of Peace.


Jesus said He was and He is God. It's in the Bible.


Yes, they are the same, but one is human and our brother, the other is God and our father. They are the same as they live with the holly spirit, but not the same person, but the same light of spirit. The difference is that Jesus had a body, was born on earth and could only think like a human, with a body that is sometime heavy.
This is a symbol, but yes, Jesus and Rael (no, I'm not a Raelian) thought the same, but jesus is human and we can't say what will happen to him or us in the end. Will we all become God?
They say the very same, and also Jesus said that any bad made to someone is a bad made to God.
We are to become God in the end, just like him who came into god since the begining of times.
I'm one with my girlfriend too, but sometimes only, when we think the same.



posted on Jun, 24 2004 @ 03:32 AM
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Originally posted by dlbrandt

When you say that the difference between the muslim belief of Jesus and the christian belief is that muslims don't believe He's God, that is one major difference. As a christian Jesus is my God who saved me.

I am also curious about who Islam says Gog and Magog are?

It is a major difference, but really it's a difference in opinion about a being that was on Earth once. Saying Jesus is "my" this or that isn't really helpful, in my view.

There's only speculation beyond the belief that they will be an uncivilised unreligious people.


Originally posted by dlbrandt
Please remember a true christian values all life.

What does this mean, especially in terms of a Christian's attitude to violence? Doesn't everyone "value life"?


Originally posted by dlbrandt
John 10:30 I and my Father are one

This can also be taken to mean they are one in terms of goal or belief only.

The description son of God was given in the OT to various people.

One might think that if the idea of the Trinity was so important then it would even be mentioned in the Bible. It isn't mentioned but instead was a belief formed later as part of a way to understand the contradictions in the Bible. Considering the Bible's first commandment is to not hold partners with God and that the Trinity is a just an opinion of interpretation, perhaps you agree that one should really question which idea is correct? What if God really sees the Trinity as breaking the first commandment?

I know that the Islamic idea that Jesus is just a man offends you; but if you took time to understand Islam, the description of Jesus is one of highest regard and you might even prefer it. You'll be hard pressed to find a Muslim who even mentions Jesus' name within a joke.



posted on Jun, 24 2004 @ 10:25 AM
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Muslims do not believe in Jesus Christ at all.

They deny his crucifiction and resurection, and they deny he is the Son of God. Muslim claim God has NO SON. So any Jesus they claim to believe in is not Jesus of the Gospels who is the chosen Messiah, saviour of mankind.

If you deny Jesus as Lord and saviour then you deny Jesus completely because his death and resurection were his mission to save mankind.

What other prophet must God send AFTER he has sent his Son?? Mohammed is a FALSE PROPHET.



posted on Jun, 24 2004 @ 11:02 AM
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And he who denys the SON denys the FATHER!!!

Where is the SALVATION in Islam?? It is a faith based on WORKS..but none is righteous and all the righteousness of man is as a rag to the Lord.

So there is no salvation in Islam!! Then compare Islamic prophecies to Biblical prophecies...which came true...which has the 100% accuracy??

finally take a look at Jesus's life and then Mohameeds, and how their message was spread. Did Jesus kill anyone?? Did Mohammed?? Which faith is based on war and which on love?? If you read the Koran and the Gospels you will find that although many many evils have come from "churchs" claiming to be Christian, that does not change the message of Jesus Christ, love and forsake yourself to find true life and follow the Father in heaven. What is the message of Koran?? Where is its salvation?? Is it not the message of do good works and you will be saved??

I challenge any muslim to explain to me the SALVATION that is Islam? Where is the atonement for sin? How does the false god Allah save a man born in to sin?? Is man inherently evil or good? Was man even born with sin in the eyes of Allah???



posted on Jun, 24 2004 @ 11:38 AM
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Originally posted by TruthStrgnrThanFiction
Muslims do not believe in Jesus Christ at all.

They deny his crucifiction and resurection, and they deny he is the Son of God. Muslim claim God has NO SON. So any Jesus they claim to believe in is not Jesus of the Gospels who is the chosen Messiah, saviour of mankind.

If you deny Jesus as Lord and saviour then you deny Jesus completely because his death and resurection were his mission to save mankind.

And this profound statement is clear proof Muslims don't believe in Jesus? You have the right to believe in Christ Jesus how you want, clearly this isn't enough for you since you are now dictating what Muslims apparently believe. Perhaps someday, you can try to answer the simple question I put forward in the previous post but it's always fun to see the same old reply.



What other prophet must God send AFTER he has sent his Son?? Mohammed is a FALSE PROPHET.

Again your logic is awesome, as said before Muslims don't believe he was a son of God. The other prophet God sent after Jesus was Muhammad, why? For the same reason all the Prophets were sent after the previous. The Message gets corrupted mostly by people who change it to suit themselves and so the people need a refresher course. You'll even find Jesus talk of Muhammad in the Bible calling him the Comforter.



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