Is the holocaust serving as a coverup for the genocide[s] of native peoples?

Surely there were more than six million brown people killed in the time it took for the american empire to spread across the continent...

I've been thinking of hitler a lot lately after seeing these videos and realizing that (if the translation is right) I would have supported him in that time...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by charlie_the_loaferThe videos represent the speech of Adolf Hitler before declaring war on the USA , a speech in which he presents all his reasons .

I just love how it begins stating the pressures from the USA when it comes to loans , credits and financial powers...
PART 1

PART 2

PART 3

And then I just saw this thread...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by ypperst
*NOTE* This thread is NOT supporting Nazimen.

Was Hitler our last savior?

Woah, what did you just say??
Well, I do NOT like nazi's or racism or anything like that. I love every race on earth, so this is not an ad to be a nazi.

The reason I posted this, was because I have been thinking lately about Hitler, and why he did why he did. He really was a pig, killing all the jews. But his idea was perfect...
What is the problem today? Race hate, hunger, no communication, some people are better than other and so on. We got really many problems going on right now, and I myself believe we are going to screw this world up soon enough.

What Adolf Hitler wanted, was a pure race, a pure world.. What if he really did conquer the world, and was in lead today? I believe, it would be a much much better world. Not because he killed the jews, it doesn't really matter what race who made the control of the earth. Of course, the first many years would be totally chaos. But if hitler had control of the earth, and there went 50-60 years after the WW2, and all the bad things were forgotten, how do YOU think the world would have been today? Admit it, his idea of a World that is United, One and together, is the biggest thing the humans would ever have.

Now whether or not hitler and nazism were right or wrong in any ways, wouldn't it seem like the loss of most all native cultures everywhere in the world is a much more tragic loss than the relative handful that died during the holocaust?

Yes it's terrible that so many people died, but why do so many people seem to only get upset about the plight associated with people in europe and jews?

Were "indians" not treated like slaves and prisoners? Were they not rounded up, hunted down, and detained or killed? Plotted against as an unwanted ethnic group?

I think we'd have a lot more to learn from [a lot more to be upset about losing] the native cultures and traditions wiped out over centuries, than from what was lost in europe over the span of a decade...

Thoughts?

Is the holocaust serving as a coverup for the genocide[s] of native peoples?

I do not get you - is it "Jews were systematically killed during 20th century because they were Jews as a cover up for genocide of native people throughout the history" conspiracy?
Because it is pretty loose connection,to say the least.
Or is it - "there were lots of different genocides during the Human history by all kinds of nations and empires so why Jews are mentioned" one?
If it is the later - a) It happened in 20th century - supposed to be most enlightened and cultural - as an opposite to majority of Human history, and mass media available in 20th century was not available when ,say, Rome was doing their ethnic cleansing of Carthago, Spanish - of Inca and ctr.
And since you would have supported Hitler - why do you care about ethnic cleansing or native cultures? Leaving those problematic Jews aside, Nazi Germany did their ethnic cleansing in Eastern Europe too.
Surely at least 2 millions of ethnic Poles killed in the time it took for Nazi Reich,led by savior, to spread across continent.... And ethnic cleansing of Serbs and such - or you consider all of those also relative handful that died?
What about native culture of Roma?
You know what - i really understand people who say that Humanity did awful stuff throughout the history so evil X murdering Y is sad reality we need constantly to be aware of. Thus Holocaust is not something extraordinary.
But i do not understand someone crying about all those crimes (only of American empire though, which is a little weird) and then declaring that he probably would have supported one of bloodiest leaders of 20th century.
I am sure that Cortez did fine speeches in his time too.

There is no logical reason for supporting anything that Hitler did. Roosevelt and Churchill were not saints and Hitler would never be a saint, except to those with nothing but hatred in their hearts.

Please don't turn this into a thread about what people think of hitler or what anyone thinks of jewish people...

98% of any mainstream coverage of anything native [in america at least] is either about casinos, drinking/drugs, or it's some kind of 'funny' poke at pollution or land grabbing.

Kids everywhere have been playing cowboys and indians for a pretty long time. Name any industry that caters to children, and they've got something with a cowboys and indians theme. Movies, toys, food, anything. It's treated like a fond memory to reminisce about, a game - a fun thing for kids to reenact ..?

That's not how the holocaust is treated...

There are already videogames about the period, but at this point it's about killing the nazis because they're the evil ones.
Focus on big bad germany and the things they did for a few dozen years. Pay no mind -heck- Have fun and make jokes about the obscenely horrific things your own country has done to it's original inhabitants. It was all in the past, right?

Sure the holocaust was more recent so it's fresher in our collective mind, and in a period where "people knew better," but it's only a fraction of the humanity decimated through the process of getting to where we are today...

I think we'd have a lot more to learn from the native cultures and traditions wiped out over centuries, than from what was lost in europe over the span of a decade... so a lot more to be upset about losing

It's about time for me to go to sleep, I have no idea why I'm even talking about this now...

[edit on 14-8-2010 by alaskan]

reply to post by alaskan

Please don't turn this into a thread about what people think of hitler or what anyone thinks of jewish people...

Cool. Wonder what those movies ab out Nazi Germany and how good/just it was , or link to post describing Hitler as a last savior do in the OP though.

There are already videogames about the period, but at this point it's about killing the nazis because they're the evil ones. Focus on big bad germany and the things they did for a few dozen years. Pay no mind -heck- Have fun and make jokes about the obscenely horrific things your own country has done to it's original inhabitants. It was all in the past, right

Then this should be an attempt to show to all the unaware people on ATS what happened ,there are videos and links that describe what happened much better then videos and links in your OP.
Here,let me help:

But these estimates are only a fraction of the overall democide among Indians that inhabited all the Americas. Before the conquest of the New World the Indian population may have numbered from 8,000,000 to 110,000,000;77 perhaps even 145,000,000.78 A moderate population estimate consistent with the latest research is of 55,000,000 Indians79 Almost totally as a result of several waves of disease carried to the Americas by the conquering and colonizing Europeans, the Indian population dropped steeply by tens of millions, even possibly by as much as 95 percent.80 In Mexico alone the Indian population may have fallen by 23,000,000 to under 2,000,000.81 Including those Indians who were killed in warfare and democide, perhaps 60,000,000 to 80,000,000 Indians of Central and South American and the Caribbean died as "a result of the European invasion."82

www.hawaii.edu...
First fact about what happened and no mention of Nazis in it. I am proud.
Just want to remind you that there were relatively few Native Americans in what is now US , if you compare it to Southern/Central America. So i still do not get why you are only after US. As far as i know official US apologized for its part in this tragedy. Do not know about all the European powers that were involved in it,some much more then others.

Jesus man, I never said I was only talking about the US...

Well the simple fact is that the so called brown peopl ehad no wealthy backers and or PR machine to state their interests. No disrect to the Jews but they did. we do not even hear of the homosexual, Occultists, Trade unionists, politicos etc that were also killed.

reply to post by alaskan

Were "indians" not treated like slaves and prisoners? Were they not rounded up, hunted down, and detained or killed? Plotted against as an unwanted ethnic group?

This has happened to many people and races troughout history, and even recent history.

But it only counts for the Jewish, they're special and God's people and everything should be done to make up for the horrors their people went through, up to this very day.

Other people or races, not so much.

And no, I don't think the world would've been made better by Hitler, the empire would've been totalitarian, and that's never beneficial to the people.

reply to post by alaskan

First of all, you should know that those videos you posted here are neo-faschist propaganda and thus not trustworthy as far as learning something from them, in the sense of historical knowledge, and "denying ignorance". I have also the suspicion that this speech is not even authentic. Strangely enough, when I google "Hitler speech declaration of war on usa wwII" the best hits lead all to neo-faschist propaganda sites. And no, Hitler was not a messiah; he was an Antichrist.

Secondly, as far as your premise that the genocide of native Americans was far worse than everything Hitler ever did, IMHO it is fundamentally flawed: the problem I see is a problem of timescale and of organization. The genocide of native Americans was perpetuated over a vast time span of 300-400 years and it was not always an organized effort. For example, many natives died because of imported diseases unknown to them until then upon coming into contact with the "white" man. Only after that fact did the "white" man start spreading diseases intentionally to native tribes (small pox infested blankets, e.g.), but it was still not an effort that was systematical and organized on a large scale. Hitler and Nazi Germany on the other hand managed to kill that huge number of people deemed inferior to them -of which the Jews were only a large majority- in a very few years and in a very organized and systematic way. Just remember that the "final solution" was decided and planned in January 1942 and by mid to end 1944 many concentration camps were freed. So the bulk of the genocide and the extermination took place in merely two years. There is however a common theme to both genocides and that is the political ideology behind them -in the US it was the "Manifest Destiny" doctrine, i.e. that the "white" man was superior to the natives and was destined by divine decree to conquer and rule the continent. In Nazi Germany it was "Social Darwinism", the flawed idea that just as in nature and in accordance to the then new theory of evolution by Darwin -survival of the fittest- humans must be classed in to races of which some are more able and more worthy to survive than others. Case in point, the Nazi Aryan race which was deemed to have divine right to suppress other races and people and to exterminate them in order to be achieve the survival of Aryans. To make it clear I do not subscribe to such race theories: there is only one race - the human race and every human has the same right to exist and prosper as his neighbor.

Lastly, the idea that if the Axis powers had won the war we would live in a happy, united and peaceful world is pure day dreaming. Even if they had won the war, the resistance in France, in Serbia and in Greece amongst others would never end and in the end it would bring them down eventually. You know I'm all for mankind uniting and learning to coexist peacefully and taking care of mother earth, but this union can only be achieved by peaceful means; it cannot be imposed through war and military might. Such an imposed union would not have lasted long then and it won't last long in the future either.

[edit on 14-8-2010 by WalterRatlos]