No birth certificate among passport documents

Originally posted by Adevoc Satanae

Originally posted by CheapShotArtist
reply to post by whatukno

 

Thank you. That was very constructive unlike Adevoc Satanae and his clueless drivel.

Personal attacks are wonderful. I guess you are angry because you made a baseless claim, I asked you to prove it, and you could not. Sorry that happened to you and has upset you so.

This = lol

You are the one who tossed the first stone by calling me ignorant.

Maybe you should check your glass house. I think it has a few cracks in it.

Originally posted by CheapShotArtist
reply to post by Adevoc Satanae

 

Actually, I have posted my source. Its a tiny source among many other sources out there that are on the interwebz. I also already stated why I believe in it.

I read your "source" and pointed out it has no facts or evidence. You are just going to ignore that then?

You are trying to prove me wrong.

There is nothing to PROVE wrong. Your source is not a source because it has no evidence, no proof, nothing verifiable. It is just something someone wrote.

Im trying to ask you to show me your sources (not someone helping you) but sources that you believe in that contradict that I am saying.

Sources for what? A source that points out your "article" has no evidence or facts? How does that even make sense?

(aka prove me wrong instead of coming off sounding like an internet Troll)

Prove what wrong?

What do you not get? Your source is worthless. There is nothing in it to prove wrong. THAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH IT TO BEGIN WITH.

Originally posted by CheapShotArtist
This = lol

You are the one who tossed the first stone by calling me ignorant.

Do you not know what the word ignorant means?

Maybe you should check your glass house. I think it has a few cracks in it.

Maybe you should check your dictionary.

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy
...
Edit: Furthermore, on a personal note, as someone in the media I am totally and wholly at a loss for how do deal with birthers. We can only show you things that actually exist, facts, documents, testimony, all of these things can only be produced when they in fact are real. At this point the birthers are pretty much asking for unicorns and that is not something that is at all possible. ...

We're simply asking for the same sort of documentation any of us could probably produce. Obama hasn't. You mean to say that if Obama was born in Hawaii, they never created a Birth Certificate at all for him? That would be very strange.

The only Birth Certificate we've seen is one from Kenya. Is it fake? I don't know for sure but I would be more prepared to doubt it if, say, there were a Hawaii birth certificate. There's only one out there and it's from Kenya.

You're from the media and you can't even understand that? I'm sure you really do understand it.

Finally, the President isn't supposed to be assumed to meet qualifications unless proved beyond a reasonable doubt that he doesn't. The burden should have been on him to show he meets qualifications. But that's so obvious it's even hard to think of saying it.

reply to post by oniongrass


You have been given proper documentation, documentation that in all reality you have no real right to ask for. Read the 4th Amendment.

Also, as a citizen of this country, you have in general never voted for a single POTUS in your entire life. The Electoral College actually elects the POTUS, but of course, this has been explained out to birthers over and over and over and over and over again. You guys just don't get it, you never WILL get it, because you DON'T WANT TO GET IT.

Now, in this thread, I have shown you plenty of evidence that the POTUS is in fact legal and actually is the POTUS. You can find it HERE. But you won't read it, because it might go against your birther ideas.

He has released his birth certificate online, you can find it. HERE

But if you don't want to believe that, well, it's your problem, not the POTUS.

Originally posted by oniongrass
We're simply asking for the same sort of documentation any of us could probably produce. Obama hasn't. You mean to say that if Obama was born in Hawaii, they never created a Birth Certificate at all for him? That would be very strange.

His birth certificate has all the same information the one they issue us in New York state have.

The only Birth Certificate we've seen is one from Kenya. Is it fake? I don't know for sure but I would be more prepared to doubt it if, say, there were a Hawaii birth certificate. There's only one out there and it's from Kenya.

Where have you been hiding? His Hawaiian birth certificate is all over the internet; all over ATS.

You're from the media and you can't even understand that? I'm sure you really do understand it.

Must be talking to Jimmy?

Finally, the President isn't supposed to be assumed to meet qualifications unless proved beyond a reasonable doubt that he doesn't.

Proved beyond a reasonable doubt? Says who?

The burden should have been on him to show he meets qualifications.

It was and he did. You apparently have no idea who is in charge of vetting those qualifications. Hint: NOT YOU.

But that's so obvious it's even hard to think of saying it.

I cannot wait until you all go back to school next month.

The Founding Fathers: The original birthers!

The Founding Fathers put the natural born citizen requirement in the Constitution because they knew one day a foreigner would try to destroy the U.S. from the inside. That foreigner is Barack Hussein Obama.

reply to post by Carseller4

The Founding Fathers put the natural born citizen requirement in the Constitution because they knew one day a foreigner would try to destroy the U.S. from the inside. That foreigner is Barack Hussein Obama.

So, you are saying your going to ignore all the evidence that shows that Obama was born in Hawaii and is in fact a natural born citizen, and is the legal POTUS of the United States?

Man, not only are you NOT denying ignorance, you have in fact embraced ignorance to the point of symbiosis.

They are not passport documents. Did anyone even look at them?

They are documents concerning the US visa for Lolo Soetoro. There is no reason for there to be a birth certificate for Barak Obama to be included.


[edit on 8/11/2010 by Phage]

reply to post by whatukno


Evidence is manipulated, distorted, and deleted all the time. Just look at Global Warming.

Obama's worse fear is that a couple of states actually do their jobs and verify that candidates on their ballots are qualified to be there. This is in the works in a few states. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Originally posted by Carseller4
The Founding Fathers: The original birthers!

The Founding Fathers put the natural born citizen requirement in the Constitution because they knew one day a foreigner would try to destroy the U.S. from the inside. That foreigner is Barack Hussein Obama.

Oh well that makes sense. Obviously they saw him coming and put that in there just for him. So it should be preventing him from becoming president any day now, right?

Originally posted by Carseller4
reply to post by whatukno

 

Evidence is manipulated, distorted, and deleted all the time. Just look at Global Warming.

Then what evidence are you using to base your idea that Obama was not born in Hawaii on?

Obama's worse fear is that a couple of states actually do their jobs and verify that candidates on their ballots are qualified to be there. This is in the works in a few states. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Are they working on time travel too?

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy
So World Net Daily had a birther article? How is this news?

You are talking about a website that is a pure and unashamed shill for the Republican Party's most Neo-Conservative members. They will support any conspiracy no matter how half-baked but only so long as it makes Democrats look bad.

This is the same website that still contends that President Clinton covered up a missile attack on TWA Flight 800 by Jihadis, and that has published a story questioning if leading Democrats were the incarnates of demons.

Half a dozen times they have published "internal sources" within the Israeli military saying an attack on Iran was assured within days.

Worst of all, WND is profiting off of the Tea Party Movement by having their "Tea Party At Sea" cruise and Taking America Back conference both of which are for-profit ventures.

This is not how a news organization should behave. They are hucksters at best and profit off of political division, hatred and fear. They are no different than the televangelist promising miracles for only a small donation and the Wild West snake oil salesman.

People believe such blatantly horrible journalism only because they want to. You, birthers hate President Obama and you are clinging to every single scrap of anything you can that backs up your feelings, no matter how dubious and morally filthy the source is.

We're really glad that you like our President. I'm sure that he'll be welcomed to ruin England next, being a self-described 'world citizen' and all....

[edit on 11-8-2010 by davidmann]

Originally posted by oniongrass

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy
...
Edit: Furthermore, on a personal note, as someone in the media I am totally and wholly at a loss for how do deal with birthers. We can only show you things that actually exist, facts, documents, testimony, all of these things can only be produced when they in fact are real. At this point the birthers are pretty much asking for unicorns and that is not something that is at all possible. ...

We're simply asking for the same sort of documentation any of us could probably produce. Obama hasn't. You mean to say that if Obama was born in Hawaii, they never created a Birth Certificate at all for him? That would be very strange.

The only Birth Certificate we've seen is one from Kenya. Is it fake? I don't know for sure but I would be more prepared to doubt it if, say, there were a Hawaii birth certificate. There's only one out there and it's from Kenya.

You're from the media and you can't even understand that? I'm sure you really do understand it.

Finally, the President isn't supposed to be assumed to meet qualifications unless proved beyond a reasonable doubt that he doesn't. The burden should have been on him to show he meets qualifications. But that's so obvious it's even hard to think of saying it.

Well as many other people on here have pointed out there is a released Certificate Of Live Birth that President Obama's people put out when this whole thing started up. Now what you choose to believe is your business, and you live in a nation where you are free to believe whatever you wish, but I'll just tell you how I personally understand the situation:

As a journalist, it is my job to uncover wrongdoing, and regardless of my political leanings (I am a Democratic Socialist for full disclosure) or my party affiliation (I am a member in good standing of the Labour Party but voted Lib-Dem in the last election) Now I do not, under any circumstances ever put my man in any political situation ahead of a corruption story, that would be bad journalism and bad morality on my part.

In my opinion and the opinion of almost every journalist I have spoken to, Barack Obama has proven beyond any doubt (which he did not have to do as the burden of proof rests upon the accuser in your justice system and your reading of it is just completely flawed) that he was born in the State of Hawai'i. I have seen his certificate, read the accounts of people who spoke on behalf of it, and have read our research files upon it which were contributed to by the Associated Press Syndicate. Your president is an American, born in your country and fits the criteria outlined in your constitution. He is legal, and legitimately elected by electors which were voted upon by your citizens, again as per your constitution.

To insinuate that I personally am a party to a conspiracy to undermine the legitimacy of the leadership of your nation is patiently and completely insulting. This is especially the case when in fact many of the people considered legends in journalism had their breakthrough moments uncovering exactly the kind of corruption you claim I am willfully ignoring. Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein will be remembered by history for ages for uncovering the Watergate Scandal, and to say that I, in my journalistic integrity would not do the same here is beyond comprehension.

Originally posted by davidmann

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy
So World Net Daily had a birther article? How is this news?

You are talking about a website that is a pure and unashamed shill for the Republican Party's most Neo-Conservative members. They will support any conspiracy no matter how half-baked but only so long as it makes Democrats look bad.

This is the same website that still contends that President Clinton covered up a missile attack on TWA Flight 800 by Jihadis, and that has published a story questioning if leading Democrats were the incarnates of demons.

Half a dozen times they have published "internal sources" within the Israeli military saying an attack on Iran was assured within days.

Worst of all, WND is profiting off of the Tea Party Movement by having their "Tea Party At Sea" cruise and Taking America Back conference both of which are for-profit ventures.

This is not how a news organization should behave. They are hucksters at best and profit off of political division, hatred and fear. They are no different than the televangelist promising miracles for only a small donation and the Wild West snake oil salesman.

People believe such blatantly horrible journalism only because they want to. You, birthers hate President Obama and you are clinging to every single scrap of anything you can that backs up your feelings, no matter how dubious and morally filthy the source is.

We're really glad that you like our President. I'm sure that he'll be welcomed to ruin England next, being a self-described 'world citizen' and all....

[edit on 11-8-2010 by davidmann]

Would you care to actually bring something to this conversation beyond pointing out that I stand behind President Obama on his status as a Natural-Born United States Citizen? Or would you rather just simply spew vacuous speech that someone else has brought to your mind?

Really your post could have just read "Well I don't care for President Obama much myself" and left it at that.

I'm going to start posting this in all these stupid useless birther threads.

Originally posted by whatukno
I'm going to start posting this in all these stupid useless birther threads.

well that was pretty funny, even if i think it is bad media and yet more media, pretty much any media about the birther topic is bad right now, on account of the division and critisizing that it causes between people, one example is this thread, every birther thread goes the same way,

the point i tried to make last post though, is that us debateing wether he is or isnt is pointless and futile, whats important is if you think the investigation itself should continue or not,

this means you dont have to believe he is or isnt, you only have to support the effort to be sure.

alot of people in this thread would be happy for the investigation to end. why? where talkin about ensureing the rules are followed by our president, and dont say that it doesnt matter cause it does,

finding proof that he is not american born is ground for reversal of everything hes done in office, wether youd support this doesnt matter, its a big deal either way, so this birther investigation is important but the topic discussion has become counterproductive,

so shut up and keep going is probly my point.

reply to post by pryingopen3rdeye


The birthers aren't interested in finding the truth, if they were, this debate would have been over two years ago.

Birthers have never been interested in the truth, they never have, they never will. That's why they make up fake birth certificates and make up lies continuously.

reply to post by pryingopen3rdeye


Ahh, the plot thickens so to speak! So you believe that if the birthers can prove that President Obama is not a natural-born citizen then everything he's done just disappears like nothing even happened! Wow that is a nice pipe dream for the right-wing! If you don't agree with a president, just try to void absolutely everything he's done.

I wonder if the same people hoping for this are the same ones pitching the fit about the "will of the voters not mattering" in the case of Prop 8 being overturned...

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by pryingopen3rdeye

 

The birthers aren't interested in finding the truth, if they were, this debate would have been over two years ago.

Birthers have never been interested in the truth, they never have, they never will. That's why they make up fake birth certificates and make up lies continuously.

birthers this and birthers that,

what is this birther group? is it people who believe he is not american?

or is it people who arent sure and want to find out?

you say 'they' dont care about truth, well do you? wont you support an investigation? or is your opinion that an investigation is pointless because someone MIGHT lie or be lieing.

dont be defeatist. support the investigation, have your opinions about who may be biased etc. but still you have no excuse to not support an unbiased investigation.

if your debating sources and whether they are or arent then fine, whatever.

there are so many investigating it i think itd be crazy to think all of them just want to lie and win anyway they can, investigators arnt all biased.