2012 and the power of prayer........., page 2

reply to post by rubbertramp

---

I doubt that its going to happen but I don't really believe you can will anything by thinking it. If that were the case we would all be telepathic masters.

reply to post by DClairvoyant

---

Only from a pyschological point of view.

And it doesn't mean it actually works

Originally posted by rubbertramp
i'm wondering what your opinion is about this.
the idea being, that many believe in the power of prayer? right?
so, if enough people on this planet actually look forward to, and sincerely believe that something will happen, can it actually be created out of nothingness?
and, the opposite, if enough people 'pray' against something happening, can we stop it?

Dear OP,

The power of prayer had worked for many, since our civilisation began.

But it can only work, if what we prayed for hurt and harm no one, including ourselves and only for the general good.

Seek, and you shall find, BUT it may not be what you were expecting. Ask, and it will be answered, BUT it may not be the answer that you hungrily desire for.

As you are asking a question on prayer, I can only presume that you of religious faith. If so, then you would have know what the Messiah had said, that we mortals can move mountains, if only we have faith.

Our Creator does not live in some fanciful building, church, mosque, temple, etc, built with millions of hard earned monies of workers donated to religious organisations which was meant rather to help others in society.

He lives within you. It is an energy source far more powerful and vast than the cosmos that connects you - a human, regardless if you are of religious faith or atheist, for we are all His creations, - to Him, who loved us all and gave us many gifts - life, love, free will, intelligence, etc. .

With that Energy that lays in us, we can do many things in this world, alone or collectively, but it must be for the good of all, and most certainly never for ego trips. With power comes responsibility. We are still an immatured race, and it may be a blessing that we had not realize or learnt how to fully tap that energy, for we will end up only destroying each other the way nuke energy and holy scriptures had been misused.

As it is, that Energy right now is enough to heal our world, to ease suffering and pain for many, and that can come from sincere and honest prayer to our Creator. 95% of Americans are Christians, and have fellowship with others. Collectively, should americans be united and understand that power, and through responsible use of it, logically and rationally, wonders and miracles await. Similarly for muslims, jews and buddhists around the world, as long as such powers are use responsibly for the good of or necessity for all.

We are only one race - humans, with a common Creator, known by many names across cultures, geological space and time, and we do have common aspirations - love, peace, equality, justice, shared prosperity, progress and responsible freedom - despite our seemingly diversive differences. We are only human, and are all His children...

reply to post by rubbertramp

---

As far as we know we're alone on this planet, if we want to change this world for the better than let's do that OURSELVES instead of appealing to gods, angels or saviors.

There's an old phrase, God helps those that help themselves. Instead of praying we'd do well to start DOING. As far as 2012 is concerned I don't believe in doomsdays or prophecies either. How many doomsdays have come and gone without anything happening... and how many times has the world actually ended

reply to post by Titen-Sxull

---

I agree with you that we should always help ourselves first. That's why we had been given divine gifts, and are not mindless robots.

But there will be times when you alone or even collectively as a group cannot handle situation, let alone grasp them. So why bang our infantile heads against the wall instead of seeking for help? More so if our collective decisions may end up hurting and harming many many more others?


Footprints

One night I had a dream--
I dreamed I was walking along the beach with the Lord
and across the sky flashed scenes from my life.

For each scene I noticed two sets of footprints,
one belonged to me and the other to the Lord.
When the last scene of my life flashed before me,
I looked back at the footprints in the sand.
I noticed that many times along the path of my life,
there was only one set of footprints.
I also noticed that it happened at the very lowest
and saddest times in my life.

This really bothered me and I questioned the Lord about it.
"Lord, you said that once I decided to follow you,
you would walk with me all the way,
but I have noticed that during the most troublesome times in my life
there is only one set of footprints.
"I don't understand why in times when I needed you most,
you should leave me."

The Lord replied, "My precious, precious child,
I love you and I would never, never leave you
during your times of trial and suffering.
"When you saw only one set of footprints,
it was then that I carried you."

...Mary Stevenson

I opened up the idea from prayer to collective thinking in the following thread.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Some said yes and other stated no.

There were believers but nothing could be stated other than some vague notion that they believed it worked. The idea that prayer works is rather vague as well. There are plenty of anecdotes, but nothing beyond success stories that are hard to check. The problem is that there needs to also be a record of failures. People tend to not remember the failures, but the successes are well reported.

reply to post by stereologist

---

No studies?

Or just plain ignorance, in denial and an erraneous assumption on your part?

That we survive today is a divine miracle by itself, if not for the civilisational guidelines taught to our cavemen ancestors, as well as divine interventions along the way.

Belief in science is good, but dare you claim we are at the apex of scientific intelligence today, that we know all there is to know of science? There are many inexplicable occurences throughout the ages. Science has no answers for them.

Coincidences? If you consider yourself a rational man, would you believe in coincidences? Radomness in chaos?

Or would you prefer to at least refer to documented facts - history, crossed referenced by various disciplines, as a reliable source of information than to live in ignorances ?

But still, you have a right to free will. It's only your life and only you alone can live it, even if you subscribe to the hubris that you alone are god and need no one else' help or that will always be a mortal who can resolve your problems in a blink of an eye in your journey of life. We all have to learn and grow up sometime, some with easy paths, while some the more painful head bashing paths. It's our choices we make.

I wish you well. Cheers.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

---

You did not list any studies. Where are the studies that show prayer works?

It's the wish for the easy button isn't it?

reply to post by stereologist

---

I can qoute you thousands upon thousand of articles and books that prayer works. But what would have been achieved? You to believe it? Find lame excuses to belittle them and toss them aside?

No. I will not publish any link or work, for it would serve no purpose.

It is easy to be wary of others' trollish, belligerant behaviour and be suspicious of ulterior motives, but I see in you as a fellow seeker, to know, to comprehend more, with geniune intentions, otherwise you would not had asked those questions.

Search outside and within yourself, and you will find the answers that you seek. I am only a fellow mortal, with no powers to turn your mind around, nor even seek to do so. Religion is a private and personal issue, between a human and our common Creator.

That journey and quest for knowledge is one that you alone have to make. You will only accept truths, based upon your own efforts rather than be spoonfed, for you are a human and not some mindless robot fed daily with programmes and data to perform functions. You are a thinking rational human with intelligence, capable of logic and reasoning, as well as discerning between truths and lies.

You only need to cast a wider net in the search for truths. Go beyond the length of your nose, meet up with people, spend a few hours/mins a day to read up on articles on your subject interest that are not only on those that agree with you, but on those that you disagree with, so that you may gain better perspectives and make better informed judgements to progress and evolve.

It's only your life, and your free will to choose. No one else can live your life.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

---

I can qoute you thousands upon thousand of articles and books that prayer works. But what would have been achieved? You to believe it? Find lame excuses to belittle them and toss them aside?

Are you talking studies or are you talking wishful thinking write ups? It has to be the latter.

Sure there are plenty of people with the notion that prayer works. Then again there are lots of people that think Elvis is alive.

No. I will not publish any link or work, for it would serve no purpose.

That's because you can't. It would serve a purpose if there were anything to list.

Prayer has never been shown to work. It doesn't. It's like showing god exists. You can't show god exists and you can't show god does not exist. It is simply faith. Nothing wrong with faith. There are lots of things people do not know, but have faith in:
1. finding life on another world
2. faster than light travel
3. capturing a crypto

Despite an appeal to make an emotion attachment to an issue, prayer does not appear to work. No amount of feelings is going to show whether or not prayer works. Testing is the only way to tell.

reply to post by rubbertramp

---

I could really get into this kind of prayer.

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

(sorry, my embedding skills are sadly undeveloped)

reply to post by stereologist

---

'Emotional appeal'? 'Test'? Your Creator, the one who created you, gave you life and filled you with His spirit?

Child, how long will seek to deny Him with 'tests' and then frivolous dismissal of witness accounts over millenias of His actions when you are already a living proof of His creation and love?

Why not instead 'test' if mortals can create another you within a vacuum sealed laboratory using elements alone?

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

---

Your appeal to what appears to be a nonexistent god, or creator, or flying spaghetti monster does not demonstrate that prayer works. Prayer does not work.

reply to post by frazzle

---

Neither video appears to have anything to do with the thread.

Can you explain why you posted them?

reply to post by stereologist

---

Perhaps praying does not seem to work for you even though it works for many others. Could it be that you are praying instead to a ..er... spagetti monster? Had you tried to find out why?

Anyway, its your life and your choice.

reply to post by stereologist

---

I believe music is the highest form of prayer and that we have each other, all else is illusion. Pardon me for butting in on your conversation.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

---

I'm not talking from personal experience. When prayer is put to the test it has never been shown to work.

Sure you can find lots of people that provide anecdotal evidence. Then again you can find many gamblers that think they are winners. Both are based on delusions.

reply to post by frazzle

---

Cool. Just wondered why you added the music videos.

Now I know. Cheers.

reply to post by stereologist

---

No problem, I often come out of left field like that. The whole "my god is better than your god, my culture is better than your culture and my language is better than your language so I must attack you" attitude invalidates any spiritual concept. So its 2012 and I simply love that these people are PLAYING for change, rather than praying for change, it makes more sense to me.

May 20/21, 2012: the true meaning.
  Posted 8 days ago with 25 member flags

Cool Eclipse pictures (Earth, Moon, Sun, Pleiades)
  Posted 7 days ago with 24 member flags

Why the 2012 Phenomenon is Real!
  Posted 10 days ago with 21 member flags

World Message: Beginning May 26 thru Dec 21
  Posted 9 days ago with 14 member flags

newly discovered mayan calendars go beyond 2012
  Posted 18 days ago with 12 member flags

OMG: 2012 KP24 Incoming! Are we Doomed?
  Posted 3 days ago with 10 member flags

Secret rogue planet may be hiding behind Neptune
  Posted 13 days ago with 7 member flags

Is This How the REVOLUTION Begins?
  Posted 13 days ago with 7 member flags

Newest topics, updated in real-time:

Newest topics getting flags, in real-time:

Newest topics getting replies, in real-time: