Calling all Debunkers, and anyone who thinks Holocaust Denial is offensive, debunk this!

I can hypothesize contrary to what I believe

LOL So now this thread is your "hypothesis"?

Are you backtracking?

A holocaust is a mass slaughter of people.

You called for people to debunk the claims of "holocaust deniers".

You got what you asked for and then passively insult those that disagree with you, or question their value of the "facts" or "truth".

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by AngryCymraeg

 

Okay, and that could have happened, but I can only believe that by denying certain facts which you suggest is wrong to deny facts. But if I denied the fact that there was no zyklon b residue in the gas chambers, and that the photographic evidence points to starvation and not gassing, and the logistics of gassing 6 million people, burying them, unburying them, in only a few years time is unrealistic, then sure I could believe that some were gassed, and sone were workers. But 6 million gassed? Let me ask you, how many out of the six million do you think were gassed?

Johann Kremer, an SS doctor who oversaw the gassings, testified that: "Shouting and screaming of the victims could be heard through the opening and it was clear that they fought for their lives."[30] When they were removed, if the chamber had been very congested, as they often were, the victims were found half-squatting, their skin colored pink with red and green spots, some foaming at the mouth or bleeding from the ears.[29]

LINK

Yes, let's not trust the guy standing in court for those atrocities.

In case you're wondering why no Jews have witnessed the gassing...they generally weren't alive enough to talk about it if they came near those chambers. You know, being alive is kind of a prerequisite for giving a testimony

Also, could you please stop with the "no Zykon B residue" nonsense when the FACTS undeniably state otherwise? It's dumbing down the people...

reply to post by MrXYZ

we even have the court statement of the commander of Auschwitz for crying out loud,

Sorry I have to take issue...

Testimony of Rudolph Hoess in the Nuremberg Trial

I commanded Auschwitz until 1 December 1943, and estimate that at least 2,500,000 victims were executed and exterminated there by gassing and burning, and at least another half million succumbed to starvation and disease making a total dead of about 3,000,000. This?figure represents about 70 or 80 percent of all persons sent to Auschwitz as prisoners, the remainder having been selected and used for slave labor in the concentration camp industries; included among the executed and burned were approximately 20,000 Russian prisoners of war (previously screened out of prisoner-of-war cages by the Gestapo) who were delivered at Auschwitz in Wehrmacht transports operated by regular Wehrmacht officers and men. The remainder of the total number of victims included about 100,000 German Jews, and great numbers of citizens, mostly Jewish, from Holland, France, Belgium, Poland, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Greece, or other countries. We executed about 400,000 Hungarian Jews alone at Auschwitz in the summer of 1944."

So if Hoess's testimony was so reliable WHY was the Plaque outside Auschwitz changed in 1989 to one stating about 1.5 million people perished there !!!

Hands up who knew where this thread would go !!!!

(raises hand)

reply to post by AngryCymraeg

We also have the photo-reconnaissance pictures of Auschwitz, which shows the lines of people entering the gas chambers

Gas Chambers: Arial Photo Surveillance of Auschwitz

reply to post by AngryCymraeg


The "no zyklon b residue in gas chambers" was referenced from david cole. Not once have I ever cited leutcher nor do I even know who he is.

reply to post by filosophia

Excerpts from David Cole's retraction:
I would like to state for the record that there is no question in my mind that during the Holocaust of Europe's Jews during World War II, the Nazis employed gas chambers in an attempt to commit genocide against the Jews.

At camps in both Eastern and Western Europe, Jews were murdered in gas chambers which employed such poison gases as Zyklon B and carbon monoxide (in the Auschwitz camp, for example, the gas chambers used Zyklon B). The evidence for this is overwhelming and unmistakable...

I now understand that I owe it to the people I wronged to make a forceful repudication [sic] of my earlier views. I also owe a very large apology, not only to the many people I enraged, and to the family and friends I hurt, but especially to the survivors of the Holocaust, who deserve only our respect and compassion, not re-victimization.

Therefore, to all of the above people, let me offer my most humble and very, very sincere apology. I am sorry for what (I) did, and I am sorry for the hurt I caused...

David Cole retracts January 15, 1998

And just as I must set the record straight concerning my views, it is also incumbent on me to set the record straight regarding the video "documentaries" and media appearances I did from 1991 to 1994. These "documentaries" are merely videotaped garbage filled with self-hatred and pseudo-intellectual nonsense.

My "media appearances" were nothing but an embarrassment. My glazed look, specious reasoning, and talking-in-circles during my talk show appearances would have hopefully alerted any astute viewers that this was a man not in touch with reality.

It has been brought to my attention that Bradley Smith is still using one of my videos in advertisements he is running on college campuses. Therefore, I would like to make these additional points: This video is being advertised without my consent, and I denounce this video as being without worth. Bradley Smith is no historian, and denial is no "historical field".

Students on college campuses should look elsewhere to find out about the Holocaust. To these students, I would say, look to books like Hilberg's "Destruction of the European Jews", Yahil's "The Holocaust", and Dawidowicz's "War against the Jews" for correct information. If your school library doesn't stock these books, have them order copies.
Do not pay any attention to any "David Cole" videos, except to rightly denounce them as frauds.

(signed)

David Cole

(notarized)

February 10, 1998

Your man David Cole debunked himself.

reply to post by Chamberf=6


From your second link...

To summarize briefly, in response to a highly effective CODOH campaign across American campuses utilizing a David Cole video, the Jewish Defense League had put out a brazen, thinly disguised death threat on this this young Jewish producer and had offered a reward for his whereabouts. This in America - with not a peep from anyone! CODOH immediately sent out letters notifying both the Simon Wiesenthal Center and the Anti-Defamation League of B'nai Brith - both high on ostensibly spotting and fighting defamation "based on race" which this threat against a member of the Jewish community clearly was and had been so identified. Neither organization chose to respond. So much for their "efforts" - for which they collect millions! Shortly after the death threat appeared on the Jewish Defense League website and was widely circulated in the newsgroups and in private e-mails, rumors started floating on the Internet that David Cole was about to cave in. He was described as very ill, as was his mother, and frightened of what might happen to him. I remembered David as a very slightly built young man who had been previously beaten up by thugs who did not like his Revisionist work, and whose apartment had been set on fire.

reply to post by ken10


That doesn't take away from the fact that he retracted his statements.

He was used to getting threats and beat up for what he said, so another threat shouldn't have all of a sudden "forced" him to retract.
He did it on his own.

Originally posted by Chamberf=6
reply to post by ken10

 

That doesn't take away from the fact that he retracted his statements.

He was used to getting threats and beat up for what he said, so another threat shouldn't have all of a sudden "forced" him to retract.
He did it on his own.

Similarly his retraction shouldn't take away from the FACTS he uncovered.

And being beat up and being killed are two very different consequences.

reply to post by ken10

the FACTS he uncovered

What would those be?

Originally posted by Chamberf=6
reply to post by ken10

 

the FACTS he uncovered

What would those be?

Well unless you are prepared to do unbiased research yourself, and learn from it, its a pointless exercise.

reply to post by ken10


lol sure.,,,ok

last line of Cole's recant:

I am thankful for being given the opportunity to make this statement. This statement is made freely and under no duress, and is quite willingly, even happily, given to Mr. Irv Rubin of the Jewish Defense League for the widest possible distribution. This statement is the most current and accurate compilation of my views, and it supersedes any previous writings, videos, or statements. It is my hope that there will be no more confusion as to where I stand. I thank you for letting me set the record straight.

Originally posted by Chamberf=6
reply to post by ken10

 

lol sure.,,,ok

last line of Cole's recant:

I am thankful for being given the opportunity to make this statement. This statement is made freely and under no duress, and is quite willingly, even happily, given to Mr. Irv Rubin of the Jewish Defense League for the widest possible distribution. This statement is the most current and accurate compilation of my views, and it supersedes any previous writings, videos, or statements. It is my hope that there will be no more confusion as to where I stand. I thank you for letting me set the record straight.

edit on 12/14/2011 by Chamberf=6 because: (no reason given)

If that's what you wish to believe that's fine.....Its a whole lot easier than watching his videos and debunking them for yourself.

reply to post by ken10

If that's what you wish to believe that's fine.....Its a whole lot easier than watching his videos and debunking them for yourself.

Why should I even bother with the vids if the maker of them says they are trash?

reply to post by Chamberf=6



David cole's "confession" was type written.
It contained ad hominem attacks against himself and his work
It was made through intimidation and threats of assassination
He was 16 when they forced him to retract. For shame.

" These "documentaries" are merely videotaped garbage filled with self-hatred and pseudo-intellectual nonsense. "

You seriously believe he wrote this about himself? David cole was intellectual not some character assassin. This is right out of the pages of disinfo and cointelpro, if he wrote it, it was because he was scared for his life. It sickens me that you tolerate this kind of intimidation against, yes, a jew!

reply to post by filosophia

This is right out of the pages of disinfo and cointelpro, if he wrote it, it was because he was scared for his life.

Opinion and assumption.

Originally posted by Chamberf=6
reply to post by filosophia

 

This is right out of the pages of disinfo and cointelpro, if he wrote it, it was because he was scared for his life.

Opinion and assumption.

I waited in case you were planning on adding more. A three word response is not that impressive, and since you skipped over all the pertinent parts your response was very lame.

reply to post by filosophia

David cole's "confession" was type written.

Who cares it was type written? How many letters do you write out by hand? He signed it and got it notarized signifying that the notary was a "witness".

It contained ad hominem attacks against himself and his work

Well that would be him recanting what he had previously said. So?

It was made through intimidation and threats of assassination

He said himself:

I am thankful for being given the opportunity to make this statement. This statement is made freely and under no duress, and is quite willingly, even happily, given to Mr. Irv Rubin of the Jewish Defense League for the widest possible distribution. This statement is the most current and accurate compilation of my views

He was 16 when they forced him to retract

What does that matter? His age and naiveté doesn't seem to bother you when he was denying the holocaust.
Why should his age matter, then, when he retracts?

You seriously believe he wrote this about himself?

Why not? Has he ever said he didn't? For such a vocal person, one would think he'd have spoken out if he was not the writer of the letter.

This is right out of the pages of disinfo and cointelpro

I'll say it again: opinion and assumption.

It seems you simply can't accept that your "holocaust denial" guy said his own films and words on the subject were "garbage filled with self-hatred and pseudo-intellectual nonsense. "

Better?

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by AngryCymraeg

 

The "no zyklon b residue in gas chambers" was referenced from david cole. Not once have I ever cited leutcher nor do I even know who he is.

My mistake, I thought that you were referencing the pseudo-scientific gibberish put out by Leucter. It turns out that you're actually referencing a different pseudo-scientific study by a guy who later recanted his views.