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Reporters Harrass Black Conservatives at Tea Party Press Conference

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posted on Aug, 7 2010 @ 11:37 PM
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It's too bad that the Tea Party movement hasn't formed as a religion like the left's secular socialism. The leftist who has a problem with their various churches or individuals has no problem ignoring a conflict as long as the overall goal and vision is achieved. Greenpeace et al, Naacp,Gay Pride, Nambla, SEIU, ACLU , NOW are seperate churches under the overall religion of secular socialism. Remember how the National Organization of Women attacked Bill Clinton for using his male power to abuse defenseless interns. Of course not he was one of theirs. If we could accept anyone group regardless of the individuals agenda to acheive the overall goal of limited government and not let the MSM dictate who we can let in we would be a lot better off. The racist moniker has been created by the MSM, but may cause someone who has a different opinion on race that does not agree with the propaganzied version to leave the group.

For instance, I suggest we pay more attention to middle eastern men between 18 & 35 at the airport rather than 6 year olds and 80 year old grandmas. Now according to the MSM, I am a horrible racists because I am for profiling, while my personal opinion is I'm using common sense. Should I be kicked out of the Tea Party because of some agenda of the leftist media?

The whole racist diatribe is the left's effort to try to destroy the tide of opposition and create conflict within the tea party movement. Although I admire the speakers, their effort may only continue to promote the lefts agenda to divide from within.




posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 02:43 AM
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Originally posted by Oldnslo

If Obama runs in 2012, Americans could vote for his opponent for a thousand different reasons. 70% of Americans do not like the direction the country is headed. Do you think they will vote for BO again? It will be Bush in 2008 again, only worse. Ima gonna sit back anda watch!!

A California howdy for your blah blah blah! A little respect in return for yours.


[edit on 7-8-2010 by Oldnslo]


It's not that people don't like where this country is headed. People are upset because the current situation isn't rosy at the moment. The country is in a difficult spot and the person to blame is the one on top. Americans will not be happy until everything is alright again.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 04:09 AM
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Originally posted by Jenna
Nope. I insist that the entire picture be looked at.


You refuse to look at the entire picture. You have members and groups of the tea party movement assisting in instigating these racial charges and yet all you seem to do is complain that these racial charges back are totally uninfluenced by the tea parties themselves.



Again, nope. Though it seems to work this way for you.


What seems to work fine for me is in holding many non-tea party and counter-tea party groups accountable. You cannot seem to do the same for the tea parties as all Iv seen you do is to insist the tea parties are being unfairly labelled as racists. You fail to come to terms with the fact the tea parties are assisting in instigating these racial issues. You claim to understand there are racists in every group, but you continue to insist these racial charges towards the tea parties are out of thin air.

You cannot expect to accuse somebody or some group over something and expect not be accused back.



Of course you left out the part where they were called racist by the media the moment they dared to actually gather anywhere.


Which media outlet outright called the entire tea party movement racist? I have seen presenters on MSNBC make the charge that there are racists in the tea parties, but as for the movement as a whole? Iv seen the media say all kinds of things about all kinds of people. I have seen Fox news intentionally label and stereotype entire groups. Can you give me an example of what you are talking about?

If you are pointing to individuals labelling the entire tea party movement then no doubt, you will have individuals say all kinds of things about all kinds of people and movements. I have seen tea party individuals and groups label entire groups or movements as one thing or another. It goes both ways.


Apparently it's ok by you if they get called racist, they just shouldn't defend against it.


No. Im saying that if the tea party intends to spend its time attacking other groups and people day in and day out, they should expect the same right back. If you walk down the street and tell everybody that if your a non-christian your going to burn in hell, would you not expect similar responses thrown right back to you? I think its common sense really.



Wait... The tea parties caused the Black Panther members to stand outside a voting station?


No, the tea parties made a big issue about it and decided to pull out the race card a year and half later after the case was investigated, concluded and closed already.

You continue to complain about how unfair these racism charges towards the tea parties are, but this is a prime example of the tea parties instigating many of these racial attacks. The Tea parties among other conservative groups and media outlets accused the Obama administration of dismissing the case because of racial bias, they accused groups like the NAACP of racism, and likewise they received racial charges right back.


"When none of the defendants filed any response to the complaint or appeared in federal district court in Philadelphia to answer the suit, it appeared almost certain Justice would have prevailed by default. Instead, the department in May suddenly allowed the party and two of the three defendants to walk away.... "


Theres a nice article Politifact did explaining the case at hand:


The Civil Rights Division at the Department of Justice, which handles all racially motivated voter intimidation offenses, determined that "the facts did not constitute a prosecutable violation of the federal criminal civil rights statutes," according to testimony provided by Thomas E. Perez , Assistant Attorney General, on May 14, 2010. Justice spokeswoman Tracy Schmaler confirmed to PolitiFact that that determination not to file criminal charges was made prior to the filing of the civil case.

In other words, the decision not to pursue criminal charges was made by the Justice Department's Civil Rights Division prior to the Obama administration.


and,


In order to have violated the statute in question, the New Black Panther Party (which is not affiliated with the original Black Panther Party) would have had to "direct a campaign of intimidation," and Perez noted that while the organization had posted a notice that 300 members of the party would be deployed at polling places on election day, the Philadelphia location where King Samir Shabazz was stationed was the only one where an incident occurred. Perez further noted that the group posted a message on its website -- prior to the civil action being filed -- which stated, "Specifically, in the case of Philadelphia, the New Black Panther Party wishes to express that the actions of people purported to be members do not represent the official views of the New Black Panther Party and are not connected nor in keeping with our official position as a party."

www.politifact.com...

Tea parties and other conservative groups decided to make a racial issue out of it, accused different groups of influencing the courts decision for racial reasons and in turn they got racial charges thrown right back at them by these groups and supporters. Don't dish out what you can't take you know?



Nope. Sure do like to accuse me of things though,


Well I do think its rather accurate. You continue to whine to me about how the tea parties are unfairly attacked over racism, how the tea parties cannot defend themselves apparently, and yet we find that the tea parties assist in instigating many of these racial charges themselves.


That's all you've done so far in this thread. Complain because people are defending against the accusations of racism telling them if they're not racist then they shouldn't bring it up, yet saying it's ok if people call them racist.


Yes I made it rather clear. If you do not intend to argue about race and racism, don't bring it up. If you are going to accuse this administration of being racially bias, or if your going to charge groups like the NAACP as being completely motivated by racism, you will get those groups and other individuals accuse you right back of racism.

The OP thought that by showing a video of minority tea party protesters speaking on behalf and in defense of the tea parties, that this would somehow make the tea innocent of any of these racial charges when their actions in the past show other wise.


The difference being that the tea party supporters have to defend themselves. Obama has millions of people defending him and doesn't have to say a word.


Obama has millions of people attacking him on a daily basis, as do the Republicans, as do the democrats. This forum is a prime example, it has a flood of anti-Obama threads largely supported by the members on this forum. Iv seen that most anti-tea party threads are overrun by tea party defenders. There are more than enough tea party members defending the movement, especially on this forum.


If it was mishandled then it absolutely should be looked into.


It is of the opinion by many conservatives that it was mishandled, that does not equate to it actually having been so.


mishandling of legal cases isn't some minor issue


Iv seen plenty of mishandled cases involving murders, rapes and other civil rights issues. How many them had gained the amount attention case has within the tea parties? The attack on this case itself in my opinion was yet another snipe attempt to this administration and supporting groups, not really about how the mishandling of court cases.


Haven't been reading my posts I take it. Already did that several posts ago,


You have claimed you agree and yet you continue to argue otherwise.


Then do it. Hold both sides accountable instead of giving one a free pass just because you agree with them.


That is what I have been doing. Iv done it in other threads and posts accusing the entire tea party movement as racist, Iv done so in this thread insisting that the tea parties are innocent in instigating these racial charges.


I'd imagine so. Over 7000 characters on this post alone and I don't feel like I've solved anything. I could've written several books by now


We all could have written well over several books after the amount of posts we had contributed to this forum, but no we don't choose to write books do we? We choose to instead log onto forums and we choose our debates or people we wish to debate with. This is a forum where all kinds of irrelevent distracting issues are discussed, this is not outside the forums in the news room or at the dinner table. If you don't wish to write a book, nobody is stopping you.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 05:14 AM
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Originally posted by undo



We got the light skinned "black lady".


what the hell? just what the HELL?
who the flip cares if she's light skinned black, red black, yellow black, black black, purple black!




I'm quite impressed how you COMPLETELY missed the point. Unless you actually watched the video, you'd realize I didn't call her out, she called herself out. They actually tried to not point out the obvious, while pointing out the obvious. It wasn't about what type of black person that lady was. It was about how these people don't represent in any way, the opinion of the black community. Further, how the press conference was STAGED to give the APPEARANCE of black people from different walks of life, when in actuality, there's only one category of black Americans there. As I said before, this is a three ringed Circus act, aimed specifically at a certain audience.

And, I'll state once again: the reason it hasn't made MSM is because a REAL black person can spot the show. I mean let's be for real here. What black person will defend G.BUSH after the whole Katrina nonsense? Us black people, saw this Circus as not-so-entertaining. While others saw it as: "The Greatest Show On Earth." If Rupert Murdock isn't touching this, then obviously, it's a lost cause.

You should be happy that you were a witness to a brief moment in history, where a movement (14 people) were able to be "cast" in such a video clip of non stop comedy. I haven't seen this many funny black people all in one room since: The Fresh Prince Of Bel Air, Or the Cosby Show.

So, until "We're moving on up, to the east side..." your fallacies of where racism is going, still remains.

Please everyone who saw this, do not decide to go to the next million man march and state the things you saw here. For the consequences will be dire. Do not approach any black people with this kind of information, unless you have some kind of medical training. DO NOT go into work on Monday and mention this to any black people, Because the "Tea Party Movement" will soon become the "Tea party Mob". Just Imagine the Million Man March in your cubicle, on your face. You'll see the Reginald Denning beating in 3D. Try this on a non threatening black person first. Don't try this on a person who deals with your food, who can take away your freedom, who deals with your health.

Look, just take this as a warning. Don't get it confused that, this is "The End of Racism" because 14 people stood in a crowd, and somebody gave them a mic. And for the people who're loosely using the term "heroes", its the same same affect as using the word "heroes" in the show Heroes. I've seen that word on this thread more than I've seen that word on the thread for the Wikileaks guy. You might see stars and flags on ATS, but if you bring this up to a black person at work, your just going to see stars instead.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 05:49 AM
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reply to post by Illumin Not I
 


what? because they know how to put on suits and ties? this proves they are a staged circus act? because it's actually true -- people do manage to have an opinion that differs from yours and it doesn't have anything to do with circus animals. what a crock of racist bs.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 05:59 AM
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reply to post by Illumin Not I
 


i guess they are really scratching the bottom of the barrel looking for a way to run damage control on this. it's as if no one has seen a man in a suit and tie before or a guy holding a hotel water glass. (OOPS! CRYSTAL, DAGNABBIT, IT WAS CRYSTAL. HE'S OBVIOUSLY A BILLIONAIRE)

don't go down that road with me pal! DON'T FREAKIN' DO IT!

[edit on 8-8-2010 by undo]



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 06:38 AM
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reply to post by Illumin Not I
 


grr i'm so livid right now!

get this. this guy tells me that black people will rule the world soon, that white people will all be killed in a blood bath that sweeps the globe, as will jews. that the few white people that survive, will survive only to be their slaves and only if they don't have close set eyes or thin faces!!!!!!!

i was thinking... .why would that be anybody's idea of heaven or utopia? it's like INSANE! then he tells me that god does not care about women!!! women are just an after thought to keep the men happy. we're disposal body parts. WHY THE HECK DIDN'T GOD JUST MAKE BLOW UP DOLLS THEN? why the pretense?

then when he found out i thought his idea of utopia sucked, he was like "See! I knew you wouldn't understand." I guess i was supposed to be thrilled, as a white WOMAN, that god doesn't care about me, and that i'm giong to be killed in a blood bath that sweeps the globe, specifically for the purpose of eradicating the white satan from the planet!!!!!!!!

when i told him life had been hard for me too, he said, well too bad i'm sad, guess you're just a loser in esau's world and out of esau's world. he was your only chance to enjoy life and you botched that too. this guy was like doing everything in his power to make me feel like a piece of crap!

and mr. illum whatever, is doing the same dang thing. i'm supposed to be oh man, god, it's just horrible what a fake farce it is that people disagree with him. no one in their right mind would have another viewpoint! oh and don't mention it around a black person, they MIGHT BEAT THE HELL OUTTA YA! you got a problem mister and it ain't me and it ain't the people on that video.

tell ya what, until i hear rational, reasonable, sane discussion on this subject i will keep right on my own little protest!!!!!!!!!!!!


[edit on 8-8-2010 by undo]



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 07:18 AM
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Originally posted by undo
grr i'm so livid right now!

get this. this guy tells me that black people will rule the world soon, that white people will all be killed in a blood bath that sweeps the globe, as will jews. that the few white people that survive, will survive only to be their slaves and only if they don't have close set eyes or thin faces!!!!!!!

i was thinking... .why would that be anybody's idea of heaven or utopia? it's like INSANE! then he tells me that god does not care about women!!! women are just an after thought to keep the men happy. we're disposal body parts. WHY THE HECK DIDN'T GOD JUST MAKE BLOW UP DOLLS THEN? why the pretense?

then when he found out i thought his idea of utopia sucked, he was like "See! I knew you wouldn't understand." I guess i was supposed to be thrilled, as a white WOMAN, that god doesn't care about me, and that i'm giong to be killed in a blood bath that sweeps the globe, specifically for the purpose of eradicating the white satan from the planet!!!!!!!!

when i told him life had been hard for me too, he said, well too bad i'm sad, guess you're just a loser in esau's world and out of esau's world. he was your only chance to enjoy life and you botched that too. this guy was like doing everything in his power to make me feel like a piece of crap!

and mr. illum whatever, is doing the same dang thing.



First off, I don't care what you to feel bad about. I want you to understand this is choreographed, and not the opinion of black people. Never once did I call YOU a racist (nor did I mention Esau). Heck I even agree with your signature!

However, these people are are representing black people, using black stereotypes. So believe what you want to believe. But you're hearing, from a black guy, that black people are never gonna fall for this kinda of nonsense. So instead of arguing with me about black culture, why don't you stop and ask why hasn't this at least made Fox News at the very least?



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 07:38 AM
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reply to post by Illumin Not I
 


no you tipped your hand! i got news for ya, i'll say whatever i want, where i want, when i want (within the rules of etiquette, of course!). you got that? YOU GOT THAT? you done ticked me off. you shoulda read the signs. i'm a reasonable person BUT EVERYONE HAS THEIR LIMITS.

sonofaturkeyliver i can't believe i have to put up with this racist garbage! why'd i even read this thread! ARGH!

got a little story for ya. when i was a teenager, a female friend and i had a little walk to the hamburger restaturant. it was already dark but we thought safety in numbers. a white caddy pulled up across the street and 2 young black guys got out. one ran across the street in front of us and the other behind us. i told my friend, crap. i think we're in trouble.

so we planned to try to diffuse the situation by asking if they had matches. when we finally kinda grouped together on the sidewalk, we asked for matches. they asked for cigarettes. the exchange took place and one of them started to walk away. the other, however, pulled a gun and demanded our purses. we were just teenagers. we didn't have money, just enough change to buy a couple top hat hamburgers (15 cent a piece at the time). when it was clear we didn't have money, the one knocked my friend on the ground and began to drag her behind apartment buildings nearby. the other followed suit and tried to do the same to me. my friend got away, ran into the street and began jumping up and down flapping her arms, yelling for help.

suddenly, a car came to a stop and the biggest black man i have ever seen, got out of it and said in a deep voice: WHAT'S GOING ON HERE? you never saw 2 young guys disappear so fast. the guy took us safely home but not before scolding us on being more careful. he was awesome! and because of him, i am not even remotely prejudice today. i despise prejudice, as you can probably TELL!



[edit on 8-8-2010 by undo]



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 08:17 AM
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addendum to above post: OH, and i should mention that the location of the above story was DETROIT. and that guy is on my list of all time, real life, favorite heroes.

i also want to reference your comment that you're black and therefore know that black people will see that the black people in the video are just a staged circus act. if they all came out in shorts or dungarees, you'd have some racist comment to say about that too. it isn't them you're racist against either! it's that elusive white satan in the background, manipulating public opinion by forcing these fine people to get on the camera as a representative slice of black life. good grief, what if they just wore what they felt most comfortable in for the setting? what if there are all kinds of black people? what if EGADS they don't all look the same? i betcha i can find a video on any subject in which the majority present are black, and there will be different kinds of black people, wearing different kinds of clothes. sigh. you know what, nevermind. just go back to your fantasy that white people who don't agree with you are out to make you believe in circus acts.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 08:19 AM
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the truth again comes out thank you for this great vid awesome



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 08:42 AM
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oh just watched it again, that guy is not supporting george bush! ! ! how many times you do you have to be told that the tea party has all kinds of people in it. even democrats and the reason is not because they want tax breaks for big corps! and it's not because they don't want to pay taxes and help out their fellow americans. it's because their kids are born 100,000 dollars in debt. it's because our manufacturing base has been feed, fined, and taxed, right out of the country. it's because the exports and imports are unequally balanced. it's because our industry was slowly strangled to death. the ones that survived the onslaught, moved off the continent. did you expect everyone to just sit there and say "oh well," my kids and grandkids have no future but it's okay cause we wouldn't want to look racist! like that has anything to do with it. black people need jobs to ya know!



[edit on 8-8-2010 by undo]



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 08:52 AM
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Originally posted by Jenna
No, not all of them. I thought I said it already, but apparently not.


Yup, you did. Then you compared it to the civil rights movement again so...



They don't have to agree on the solution to agree on the problem and be considered a movement. And yeah government is a pretty broad issue. The one thing I've seen consistently from the tea parties (not the rally speakers, the actual people) is that they pretty much all agree that the government has gotten too large and that spending is out of control. They pretty much all agree that the current members of Congress are part of the problem. Narrows it down quite a bit don't you think?


No, not really. You seem to be really going out of your way to miss the point here. So lets say 100 people agree government spending is out of control. Lets say those 100 people get to decide the next president. Who do you think they would have picked last time around in order to quell their anger? McCain or Obama? See, either way someone wins. You cannot just vote people out. You especially could not do it last time and may not get to in 2012 if Obama were to not run again. You have to vote FOR someone.


Ah, so I did say it already. I thought so. I also thought I answered this question already. Will they all vote for the Republican? I doubt it. Will they all vote for the Democrat? I doubt it. Will they all get the solution they're hoping for? I doubt it.


Right so nothing then? There is no point to the Tea Party other than people needing to feel like they belong to some group then? If they are not going to vote in unison, you do realize how that will turn out, right? So what is the point of the Tea Party again?


Just as some people were disappointed that the women's rights or civil rights movements didn't go farther then they did, and some thought they went too far, the same will happen with this. That's the way of movements.


Yeah, keeping making those comparisons. If movements for civil rights and just voting every term are the same thing in your head, please keep it there. It is not working here.


Some will think more could have happened. Some will think less should have happened. And some will be perfectly content with the way it turns out. What that outcome will be is something we'll just have to wait for. No one knows at this point how it will turn out in November. Asking one person what millions of people across the country will do three months from now makes about as much sense as asking a sidewalk prophet when the world's going to end. Neither knows for sure, and if they claim they know the exact answer to your question they're lying.


You are just getting farther and farther from my original question.


Which would you prefer? The answer I can give you, or a lie? I hate lies, and I'm not very good at it. But just for you I'll try if you'd prefer I just make something up.


Still...


I've answered your question repeatedly, it's just not the answer you wanted. I can't tell you what's going to happen in November until it's over. Ask me again in December. In the mean time, don't pretend I haven't given you an answer when I have.


No, you have done a masterful job of answering anything but my question and I honestly think it is because you know the answer. You can claim you gave me an answer all you like but the fact remains that none of the answers you gave me apply to my question.

Unless your answer is to tell me the Tea Party is a complete waste of time and energy and just getting people excited about being complacent?



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 08:58 AM
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reply to post by Adevoc Satanae
 


maybe you aren't articulating what you mean clearly enough because you keep saying the same thing to me. "you did a fine job of completely missing the point of the question." i'd be scratching my head, re-reading your question, and thinking, well i didn't miss it, i just didn't answer it.
guess what? freeee country....i think.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 09:06 AM
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Originally posted by undo
reply to post by Adevoc Satanae
 


maybe you aren't articulating what you mean clearly enough because you keep saying the same thing to me. "you did a fine job of completely missing the point of the question." i'd be scratching my head, re-reading your question, and thinking, well i didn't miss it, i just didn't answer it.


Well that is nice. Jenna says she did answer it so I am not sure how the two compare. It was quite simple. I first asked if the Tea Party was all going to vote the same way. I was told no. I then asked what the point was then. I asked how such a diverse group of people that are all sooo very very different and all want such different things matter?

I was told they do not need to agree on a solution to agree on the problem. I agree. That does not tell me how they plan to do anything about it as a group when they are not really a group but just different folks.

I then asked a rather particular question that was never even addressed. So the Tea Party can accomplish something because they all agree on the problem. OK, so what change would the Tea Party have made in 2008? They could not vote out the incumbent. Would they have picked McCain? How about in the next election. Are they all going to vote differently but just against the incumbent? Follow that train all the way through. What happens when the votes get more and more divided? Think about it and tell me how that will elect the type of leader they want? What if the only option on the ballot is even worse? Then what?

See, I am trying to understand why people are insistent that the Tea Party members are not Republicans or all this or that or anything else and at the same time insist they are what they are? If there is no unified political ideology, I do not understand how they plan to be of any consequence in November. What are they going to do? Aside from voting how they would anyway but then going to a parking lot to shoot off blanks and yell to Toby Kieth records after?


guess what? freeee country....i think.


Think it all you want and then get back to me when you can point to me making any attempt to stop that for anyone.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 09:14 AM
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reply to post by Adevoc Satanae
 


i'm guessing the democrats would vote for democrats who are interested in the same thing the tea party democrats are and same for the repubs and the libertarians and so on. they may still vote their own party lines provided the candidate is actually on the same page. seems logical doesn't it? i think so. but what do i know, i'm just a dumb white lady who is going to die in a blood bath some day, because god doesn't care about me (because i'm a woman) and go to hell and burn forever, because i'm white. that mellanin crap, got me into trouble, while i was still in my mom's tummy.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 09:17 AM
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Originally posted by undo
reply to post by Adevoc Satanae
 


i'm guessing the democrats would vote for democrats who are interested in the same thing the tea party democrats are and same for the repubs and the libertarians and so on.


Right, that is my guess to. See where I am going with my questioning then yet?


they may still vote their own party lines provided the candidate is actually on the same page. seems logical doesn't it? i think so.


Seems perfectly logical, thus negating one of the following "truths"

The Tea Party wants change

or

The Tea Party is politically diverse.

According to your logic and my logic, it cannot be both. Thanks for agreeing.


but what do i know, i'm just a dumb white lady who is going to die in a blood bath some day, because god doesn't care about me (because i'm a woman) and go to hell and burn forever, because i'm white. that mellanin crap, got me into trouble, while i was still in my mom's tummy.



Um...well...uh...ok?



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 09:21 AM
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reply to post by Adevoc Satanae
 


to me , they seem more of a moderate cross section, which pretty much describes most of the country. most of us are moderate. we aren't fascists and we aren't socialists. we're sorta in the middle. but we tend to get fascists or socialists for our options to pick from. it's interesting but strangely so. is there such a thing as a fascist socialist?



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 09:39 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


Yeah, I get it. You completely agree that the Tea Party is just a bunch of people that will do nothing different, change nothing, and have no purpose. Thanks.



posted on Aug, 8 2010 @ 09:47 AM
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reply to post by Adevoc Satanae
 


it's possible that may be the outcome, but only if the candidates are willing to lie (this has been known to happen) or promise and not deliver (we've all done this at least once in our lives). not sure that would be such a good idea tho. i'm thinkin', right about the time the first big lie was revealed, i'd be looking for an extended vacation on a nice secluded island somewhere. cause the backlash would get ugly and that may be the plan.

sometimes i wonder when i hear the campaign speeches and then see what really happens, that maybe our politicians are abducted when it is clear they are going to win, and replaced with pre-programmed clones. some of the differences between campaign promise and actual events, are so big, that it kinda stuns you into disbelief.




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