Germany gave assassination list to secret US unit

Originally posted by stirling
MAC-SOG revisited.......
I begin to see how the older ones among us should have been better at teaching the next gen., about what was learned from Vietnam.

It's MACV-SOG.

Originally posted by stirling
It didnt work then, and it wont work now.Again i am amazed at the inability of the military to adapt or change.

Actually, the Phoenix Program (which was actually a CIA deal; SOG just played a part in it) was successful. The "failure" was that it was started too late and the Communists already had a major support system in place.

We are at war with the Taliban. We should be trying to kill or capture Taliban leaders. What's the problem?

They would do the same to our leaders if they had the opportunity.

The problem is , that there is no country or nation, which is called "The Taliban" and obviously nobody is sure, who he is shooting at.

We have no real war, we have no real enemy, we have just entruders, who think they are right and kill everybody they think is an enemy.

Who is bringing the war to whom?

[edit on 5-8-2010 by Siddharta]

reply to post by onthedownlow

Originally posted by onthedownlow
Perhaps you would like to enlighten us as to how we do not follow the geneva convention. Furthermore, maybe you could explain why you think the Brown Shirts were a legitimate military unit.

I'd be more than happy to. First off, we are breaking the Geneva Conventions with torture. Then, rendition as well as the way that we house and treat these "enemy combatants". GITMO and the secret CIA prisons scattered around the globe are basically the anti-thesis of the Geneva Conventions. Also, the way that we target some individuals. and that's just with these recent wars.

Just because we rename these enemy soldiers, doesn't mean that they aren't enemy soldiers and just because we claim certain individuals are "terrorists", doesn't mean that they are. For instance, if you molest a child, you can't really reclasify what a child is so that you aren't prosecuted for child molestation and even if you try, it doesn't mean that you aren't a child molestor.

If you travel anywhere outside of the US (to exclude some Eastern European countries), you would quickly find that we are looked upon as the Nazis of the 21st century. It's a shame too, especially seeing how we had the world's support right after 9/11, though it was quickly lost with the Hitler doctrine, errr I mean Bush doctrine.

As far as the 'brownshirts' or Sturmabteilung being a legitimate military unit, whether you agree with them or not, they were commissioned by the legitimate government ruling over a nation. If we use our emotions to conclude on their legitimacy, it may influence the accuracy of the data. I don't think too many people agree with either their actions or their charter, however that doesn't affect their legitimacy.

--airspoon

Originally posted by airspoon
Just because we rename these enemy soldiers, doesn't mean that they aren't enemy soldiers and just because we claim certain individuals are "terrorists", doesn't mean that they are. For instance, if you molest a child, you can't really reclasify what a child is so that you aren't prosecuted for child molestation and even if you try, it doesn't mean that you aren't a child molestor.

GC names these ass-hats as insurgents. They aren't members of a formal military and they aren't wearing uniforms or distinctive markings. According to GC, they can be treated like criminals if captured and not like soldiers.

Originally posted by airspoon
If you travel anywhere outside of the US (to exclude some Eastern European countries), you would quickly find that we are looked upon as the Nazis of the 21st century. It's a shame too, especially seeing how we had the world's support right after 9/11, though it was quickly lost with the Hitler doctrine, errr I mean Bush doctrine

Funny. I haven't seen it.

Originally posted by airspoon
As far as the 'brownshirts' or Sturmabteilung being a legitimate military unit, whether you agree with them or not, they were commissioned by the legitimate government ruling over a nation.

Doesn't make them a legit military force.

reply to post by kevinunknown

I think I am right in saying that they are currently being conducted by an American task force called TF 373. It’s also highly probable they have found some legal loop hole that allows these operations to take place without breaking the law.

Hitler and the Nazis didn't break German Law when they rounded up and forced into labor and murdered millions of Slavs, Gypsies, Gays, Political Dissidents and Jews either.

Yet many top ranking Nazi's swung from the gallows at Nuremburg for upholding the 'law'.

What is legal is not always moral, and is not always seen as legal in the long run.

Ulitmately entire generations of Germans many not even born yet have born some type of punishment or diminishment in status or freedoms as a result of those that did uphold the Nazi laws.

That's what many of the people who uphold might makes right amoral laws fail to understand.

In the aftermatch of World War II long after the leaders were rounded up and sent to trial, millions of Germans were deliberately starved, the women and girls were routinely raped some up to 20 times a day for years on end, what little some had to sustain themselves or what ever wealth they had left was taken by allied troops, and the most restrictive laws imaginable were implemented to rule over the people by the allies, all because a small percentage chose to uphold the laws while the majority stood silent or chimed in "but it's the law".

Sadly because of all the Jewish propaganda regarding World War II and the Holocaust for their own reasons of political tyranny and murder, most people have not learned the real lessons of the Holocuast and World War II and it sure does show in our governments and people who simply chime in "It's the Law" today.

Karma ain't nothing to play around with people.

There is always eventually a day of reckogning.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Hey don’t get me wrong, I am not trying to say this is legal or even moral. I am just assuming they will have found a legal justification for carrying out these “capture or kill” operations, this does not make it a moral right to just kill anybody on their list. I think this is morally gray at best. Saying that however, if we are to believe what we are being told, they are targeting people who pose a significant national security risk. This might not always be the case, I have read about TF 373 killing anybody who got in their way. But for the most part I de believe they are targeting the real terrorists. With that said I think your comparison to the Nazis actions towards the Jews is exaggerating things even though I agree with you and see where you are coming form, this is not moral. I don’t think it’s fair to compare SF capture or kill operations to the gassing of 6 million Jews.