Christianity. A Religion of Convenience, or Polytheism?

reply to post by IamBoon


I guess that the fact that I continue to try and set you correct is a testimony to a desire for truth, rather than the expectation that ignorance will be cast away. I love you, Boon, I really want you to understand.

If you were Jewish, in the time of Jesus, the way that you reconciled yourself to God was through the Law, through the Temple, and through sacrifice. That applied to all Jews, whether King David, some average guy, or Mary, the mother of Jesus. Until Jesus was crucified, the only way to be "right" with God was to strictly obey to the Law. Over time, what the Law actually meant to the Jewish people had changed, and had gotten to the point where it was difficult, if not impossible, for a person to uphold it all.

Nothing that Jesus did or said changed that. Jewish Law was the covenant between God and the chosen people, and it remained in effect, and, indeed, remains in effect, in 2010. If you are Jewish, and you are able to fulfill all aspects of the Law, you're good to go. Jesus did not change or remove the Law, it is still there.

In 70AD, the Romans destroyed Jerusalem and the Temple. This caused a major problem with the Law, as the Temple was a significant part of it. Many scholars maintain that it is no longer possible to uphold Jewish Law, because the Temple no longer exists.

Beyond the Jewish Law, however, is the Christian belief, upheld in the statements of Christ, that we are saved through his sacrifice. Our sinful nature is an affront (insult) to God himself, and the only way that it can be atoned for is by God himself dying for our benefit, as our sacrifice for the way that we insult him through our arrogance and sinful tendencies.

Therefore, the Christian belief is that God became man, diminishing himself, to atone for our guilt and to allow us the be right with the Law (which continues to exist, remember) by accepting Jesus' sacrifice for us.

That is Christian theology. It has been that way for about 2,000 years. Again, if you want to believe something else, that's fine, but you are not a Christian, by its very definition.

Originally posted by IamBoon

Originally posted by adjensen

Thus far, all the scripture that you've managed to quote has proven the opposite, rather than your case.

I am not stating that a Christian should worship or live as a Jew would. I am stating that the Ten Commandments and the punishments for breaking them are valid for Christian Belief.

If you behave according to Christ's two commandments, you will be unable to break any of the Ten Commandments, therefore they are complimentary, not contradictory.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by IamBoon

Originally posted by adjensen

Thus far, all the scripture that you've managed to quote has proven the opposite, rather than your case.

I am not stating that a Christian should worship or live as a Jew would. I am stating that the Ten Commandments and the punishments for breaking them are valid for Christian Belief.

If you behave according to Christ's two commandments, you will be unable to break any of the Ten Commandments, therefore they are complimentary, not contradictory.

BINGO. That's precisely why Jesus said said His yoke was "easy".

2 Commandments, which the entire Law and prophets hung upon:

1. Love God with all your strength, might, and heart.
2. Love people and treat them exactly as you'd want to be treated.

Or better yet like the famous Christian bumper sticker says:

I know Christian thought and there are many branches that believe WAY different things.

I am just wondering how to reconcile the many contradiction about this subject and your thoughts on them. I am not questioning your beliefs but mainly your take on it.

Jeremiah 3:34 Is a prphecy , but that prophecy is not to be fulfilled til Israel is forever destroyed as a nation. 3:38 I think. Things like that is what I am talking about.

I may come across as attacking but I am really just inquisitive. I really think new age Christianity is mostly helpful to society . I do not adhere to it myself but know a bit about it and think Aleister McGrath is a phenomenal spokesperson for it. Look him up.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Yes! And the easiest thing about it? If you lived the way that so many people claim that they already do, all you need to work out is the "love God" bit.

Sadly, though, far too many people who claim to love everyone else as themselves are pretty far from getting there, despite their beliefs. Heck, I work at it every day and I'm still quite a ways off. Without God's help, it seems a mountain insurmountable.

Realistically, it's really, really hard to actually live that way, despite what some might claim.

reply to post by IamBoon


No, the prophecy was fulfilled with the death of Jesus Christ. Paul said Jesus nailed the law to the cross with Him. It was all fulfilled with the death of God's only Son, Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior. Read Romans chapter 7 and Chapter 8.

And i forsee someone coming along to say Paul taught heresy. But that's EASILY refuted when you read 2 peter 3:15-16.

"And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction."

Peter is saying Paul's teachings in "ALL his epistles" are 100% true even if they are hard to believe. Peter, whom Christ said was the rock He would build His church upon, fully supports all Paul wrote in all his letters.

Originally posted by IamBoon
I know Christian thought and there are many branches that believe WAY different things.

Depending on what they believe, they may or may not be Christian. Mormons, for example, believe aspects of Christianity, but are generally not accepted to be Christians by anyone other than themselves. Similarly, the Gnostic Christians are not considered to be Christians, due to significant differences in theology.

I am just wondering how to reconcile the many contradiction about this subject and your thoughts on them. I am not questioning your beliefs but mainly your take on it.

If you wish to cite a specific example, I'm happy to give you my viewpoint as an Christian rooted in Orthodoxy. It is, though, solely my perspective.

Jeremiah 3:34 Is a prphecy , but that prophecy is not to be fulfilled til Israel is forever destroyed as a nation. 3:38 I think. Things like that is what I am talking about.

Jeremiah chapter three only has 25 verses, so you must be looking at something else.

I may come across as attacking but I am really just inquisitive. I really think new age Christianity is mostly helpful to society

I continue to await a definition of "New Age Christianity", though I am of the belief that Christianity, as it is outlined in the New Testament and accepted Christian theology, is sufficient as is, and needs no "new age" interpretation.

Originally posted by adjensen
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Yes! And the easiest thing about it? If you lived the way that so many people claim that they already do, all you need to work out is the "love God" bit.

Sadly, though, far too many people who claim to love everyone else as themselves are pretty far from getting there, despite their beliefs. Heck, I work at it every day and I'm still quite a ways off. Without God's help, it seems a mountain insurmountable.

Realistically, it's really, really hard to actually live that way, despite what some might claim.

I hear ya, I still mess up daily. Thankfully I have the Holy Spirit who is quick to convict me when I err so I can repent and ask for forgiveness. Salvation is SIMPLE as my sig plainly states, but sanctification takes serious WORK!!!

But by the grace of God and through His Holy Spirit it can be done. Praise the Lord.

reply to post by queenannie38


Now I can definitely ride with that idea. Considering I actually believed anything written in those books.

In regards to the O.P.
It might be helpful to read the works of Biblical criticism by the respected academics on the subject. They will say there has been a lot of interweaving of different traditions in what we think of as the books of Moses.
I think that at different times there existed a priesthood with a ritual or later a temple, and there needed to be some sort of explanation for what they were doing, so things were written and later people tried to make a consistent sort of document combining features from the different writings that they found. It was later codified as the "official" version that had to be accepted to be orthodox in those times, which would be the post-exile time that Jesus found himself in. He had his own interpretation, which would seem right to have, to us today, since the writings were formulated to support a political reality that had really become obsolete.
We are right to follow in Jesus' example and look past the ethnic problems a strict adherence would present. He allowed for a possible fulfilment of Israel returning to a pure religion and concentrated on the descendants of the promises, in their own land. That did not have the affect of a mass conversion, so things were free to progress into a global promise that through the priest/king Jesus we being before far off have now been drawn near to God.


[edit on 6-8-2010 by jmdewey60]

OP Christianity a religion of convenience or polytheism.

You reveal your prejudice by posing only two negative choices.

Christianity is the religion of conscience, confidence and compassion.

A triune God is not polytheism.

God has three divine natures of expression.

God the Father who is intellectual.

God the Son who is His spoken word, and since God does not lie then God is His word and His word is God. God = What he says=His Word.

God the Holy Spirit is the medium through which and in which His word is spoken. Since God is in perfect harmony to and with His Word then the vehicle which carries His Word the Holy Spirit must also be in perfect communion and harmony with both God and His Word.

There is perfect harmony in Gos and in His Word and in His Spirit which carries the Word. In that the three are inseparable and ONE.

So take me for example:

I say with my words with my breath or spirit that I will honor my obligations and commitments to you. If I am a man of truth, and a man of my word, then I will follow through with what I said. Pure in Spirit as is humanly possible. I mean what I say, and say what I mean. I am truthful and honest.

And I have the free will to contradict my words with my actions.

double post


[edit on 8-8-2010 by slugger9787]