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Simon Bolivar exhumation, Chavez trick to start Mega-Continental conflict.

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posted on Aug, 31 2010 @ 08:07 PM
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reply to post by JohnJasper
FAIR (Fairness and Accuracy In Reporting) pointed out that it was the Romans who crucified Christ and that no-one has ever claimed that the Jews fought against Bolivar. Bolivar, in fact, fought against the government of King Ferdinand VII of Spain, who reinstituted the anti-Semitic Spanish Inquisition when he took power in 1813.

Again I have shown you that your references do not support your extremely biased and disturbed allegations. Please take time to reflect within your Christian soul as this is bordering on insanity.

I would like to know why you're so interested in this but hopefully no-one else will be taken in by your hateful slurs on an apparently well-loved and decent man.

 


The point John is that it is not necessary to be a seer or an Angel to notice that you are passionately linked with the Chavism, that you are a product of their brain washing, that you don't want to see the multiple evident contradictions in a movement that from one side claim to be truly democratic just in words but from other side is trying to destroy essential aspect of a liberty to construct a tyranny that supposedly will defend the People, but that In fact will support a totalitarian State that only Chavez and his friends will control for ever.

Chavez cannot be a trully democratic leader since, he showed along 12 long years his negative side specially on :

- attack to the Separation of Powers, Chavez wants to control not only the executive power but also to have absolute control of the Congress and the Supreme Court and in that way to be the legislator and the principal judge of the country.

- Prosecution of the free press, he several times has cancelled the license of operation of TV Channels, like it happened with Radio Caracas TV, one of the pillars of the free expression in Venezuela as well as many other media for the only reason that they criticize him openly.

- Abolition of the individual rights, that is possibly his major goal, he wants badly to implant a Marxist state in Venezuela, his obsession with Bolivar is just only a mask, his truly ideology drinks sometimes in the waters of Marxism Leninism and others in Nazism. During the Chavez era in Venezuela there have been even common citizens in hunger strick to protest against abuses of autority of the State with respect to them.

pls check

momento24.com...

www.cnn.com...

www.thaindian.com...

www.reuters.com...

If the Bolivarian Venezuela of Chavez is really the "Paradise" you are talking about , is really a very strange type of it, since the people prefer to die by their own hand to continue living in such regime.

I am really curious to see that every time you tried to defend Chavez you jump spectacularly so easy to the figure of Bolivar, that is something really shock not only me, but many other people that knows how different was the real Simon Bolivar of the Marxist caricature that Chavez has drawn to the Public, in the same way how different was the truly Christ of the pseudo Guerrilla leader that he pretend to show us he might be.

I know both Ernesto Che Guevara and Jesus Christ could look externally a little similar, especially in the iconography of the 1960's but in the interior they are apples of two very different baskets. .

There is a huge distinction among the truly Bolivar that always wanted that the individuals enjoy freedom in a democracy,




If the arms have given you Independence only the Laws will give you liberty


or



You have seen all my efforts to plant liberty where it was before just Tyranny


Than the Marxist - Castrist thesis Chavez loves so much that demonize all the free individual initiative and show the entrepreneurs as the most evil guys that are living all the time as parasites of the work class always exploited.

Without enterprise spirit there is no motor in the life of a nation, without a market there is quality in products, without people that is able to take all the risks that involve to create new businesses there is no jobs for the workers, without liberty to think there is no advance of science and technology, those are lessons the collapse of communism gave us 20 years ago, and that now this so arrogant Tyrant wants to erase of the collective memory.

How different is the revolution of :

Karl Marx or Vladimir Lenin or Fidel Castro based on the systematic destruction of the social tissue by the confrontation of social sectors that are naturally complementary in a healthy economy, or the eternal irrational hatred that blames the creators of enterprises of any kind of all the disgraces of the society, that create the artificial theory of the Plusvalue as expression of exploitation that denies the existence of the risk as the truly source of wealth,

with the one of :

Jesus Christ that gives credit to the merit of the ones risk their lives to reach noble goals, you must read the talents parable to understand this, that risk a seed to get a tree , that risk an egg to get a chicken or a sworn to get a fish.

Jesus Christ talks us of development of the society as expression of the improvement on the individuals, on the construction of human relationships among all the people based on the most high ethics, on the respect of each person, on love instead of hate, on admiration or respect instead of envy or discrimination, on mutual effort , collaboration and intelligent use of the personal talents and not in the mutual attack among members of the same society.

Jesus Christ tells us to see the difference among the human beings not as a source of evilness or a reason to support equalitarian obsessions, but a way in which life creates all the diverse necessary materials that are needed to build harmonic societies, in which the genuine Justice is based on the change of the persons from their interior, on the expression of a new way to think or live positively in charity, in faith and love.


Chavez wants to destroy what he says are corrupt social elites ( entrepreuners, intellectuals, civil rights activists, journalists) but in fact is creating a new Nomenclature of Burocrats that are going to predate the national budget not only of Venezuela but of other countries for the following 10 years if he is not stoped.


Jesus Christ changed the humanity from its interior, from its spirituality, but leaders like Jesus Barabbas in that same epoch, and Chavez now, pretend to change the world by taking it by force with his hands and strike it toward a wall of ethnical and social resentment, shock among nationalisms, and war of social classes, verbal violence that discredit any other point of view, as it happened for instance in his so famous arguing with Jose Manuel Rodriguez- Zapatero in the Iberoamerican conference of Santiago.

John, I am so sorry to break your personal idol, but to talk of Bolivar aside Chavez needs first to wash thoroughly our mouth, now to talk of Jesus Christ after Chavez is Blasphemy of the worst type, is to try to mix water with oil.


The most I can say of Chavez in connection with the Gospel is that he represents one of the best examples of the false Christ that will appear at the end of the times trying to deceive even the ones that were chosen by god to be saved, the same that the scripture clearly says will confront people against people and nation against nation.


Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness


[edit on 8/31/2010 by The angel of light]




posted on Sep, 1 2010 @ 02:04 AM
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reply to post by The angel of light
 


thedman - after several attempts to test the water with you, I can see you're way too blinded with your extremist-Christian brainwashing for any real communication to occur here.

I thank you for providing me with sources that I wouldn't have uncovered myself which have helped me fully understand the real enemies of the Venezualan people, the very people and institutions that Chavez has to work hard to defend himself from.

I wish Chavez every success in a difficult world, I hope that he successfully implants socialism into Venezuala and hopefully inspires the international socialist revolution that is overdue by 90 years. I believe that Chavez would forgive you for your distrust in him. That is what he does, not what he says.

God help you for I've given up trying!

JJ



posted on Sep, 1 2010 @ 02:16 AM
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Originally posted by JohnJasper
reply to post by The angel of light
 


thedman - after several attempts to test the water with you, I can see you're way too blinded with your extremist-Christian brainwashing for any real communication to occur here.

I thank you for providing me with sources that I wouldn't have uncovered myself which have helped me fully understand the real enemies of the Venezualan people, the very people and institutions that Chavez has to work hard to defend himself from.

I wish Chavez every success in a difficult world, I hope that he successfully implants socialism into Venezuala and hopefully inspires the international socialist revolution that is overdue by 90 years. I believe that Chavez would forgive you for your distrust in him. That is what he does, not what he says.

God help you for I've given up trying!

JJ


Lol, this is a very funny thread, tell me, how many times have you come to Venezuela? how many times have you live in a poor "barrio" here? where u cant go out when is dark or walk with a nice necklace or shoes on your feet because somebody will kill you for it?

The very enemies of the venezuelan people, my people because im venezuela is the people like you, is very easy to be a socialist in a First World Country, is totally easy to desire others live in socialism, but not me, you are not the one who have a presidents who say he is going to wipe you or anybody who thinks different, you are not the one who cant find a job because you dont agree with the gov, tell me, do the president of your country tells in TV that if his opponents wins more seats in the Parlament there is going to be war?, anyway, you are not the going who see the quality life of the country decay every day more and more, you are not the one who goes to a supermarket and find no food, you are not the one who must have the electricity cut out 10 times a week.

So before talk bull# about Venezuela and Hugo Chavez, come and live here some time.

Yes, you have a nice documental and i suppose you attack the MSM and "capitalist propaganda", but you are falling in the Chavez Propaganda.

[edit on 1-9-2010 by MonteroReal]



posted on Sep, 1 2010 @ 03:47 PM
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reply to post by MonteroReal
 



Originally posted by MonteroReal

Lol, this is a very funny thread, tell me, how many times have you come to Venezuela? how many times have you live in a poor "barrio" here? where u cant go out when is dark or walk with a nice necklace or shoes on your feet because somebody will kill you for it?


Fortunately, I don't live in a barrio, ghetto, slum or even a poor neighborhood. How about you? Do you live in a barrio? These places exist all over the world so I don't have to go to Venezuala to visit one. I live in a small town with neighborhoods that I wouldn't walk around after dark. I thank my lucky stars that I'm not forced to live in one of these.


Originally posted by MonteroReal
The very enemies of the venezuelan people, my people because im venezuela is the people like you, is very easy to be a socialist in a First World Country


Millions of people around the world including the UK where I live have been added to the ranks of the unemployed and dispossessed. Whole sections of cities and towns are becoming barrios.

Why? Not because of Socialism. It's capitalism that is causing this. The elite business people have engineered an economic crisis which they have been profitting from all along and continue to make huge profits. They engineer crises which cause other businesses to fail wiping out competition allowing them to buy up the failed businesses for pennies to the pound (cents to the dollar, etc.)

In 2006, a UN report stated that 1% of the richest adults owned 40% of the world's wealth. The poorest 50% of the world's adult owned only 1% of the wealth. It's the hoarding of that wealth that results in whole countries not being able to feed themselves or provide health and education to their people. World Socialism would put a stop to that but it has to start somewhere. It also cannot survive in isolation so must be part of a continuous revolutionary effort that removes capitalism from the planet.

Because of the continuing advancements in science and automation, human beings as a labor force are gradually becoming redundant. The old paradigm "working to live" is already an impossibility for some and is getting worse every day. There are only two options: poor people are just left to die or we change the structure of the world to where the wealth is shared equally between everyone.


Originally posted by MonteroReal
you are not the one who have a presidents who say he is going to wipe you or anybody who thinks different, you are not the one who cant find a job because you dont agree with the gov, tell me, do the president of your country tells in TV that if his opponents wins more seats in the Parlament there is going to be war?


Interesting comments and I've never heard about this before. Perhaps you can cite sources that back up these claims. The USA has a president that authorises assassinations by drone or death squads in at least 5 foreign countries, the kidnapping, imprisonment and torture of people of any nationality, anywhere in the world while preaching human rights and civil liberties, freedom and justice. He presides over a country where it's illegal to protest the innocence of someone who has been declared a "terrorist", with the largest prison population per capita, the impoverishment of its citizens and the dismantling of the few socialised services that American's enjoy.

It's a country where peaceful protestors are herded like cattle, beaten and arrested, where free speech has been muffled, where police can beat or kill citizens with little fear of prosecution. It's a country that spends millions every year undermining foreign leaders who refuse to play by the American economic rules and is currently building up forces in Colombia which threatens the sovereignty of Venezuela.


Originally posted by MonteroReal
anyway, you are not the going who see the quality life of the country decay every day more and more, you are not the one who goes to a supermarket and find no food, you are not the one who must have the electricity cut out 10 times a week.


You're right because the US and UK are living quite well on the wealth that they've stolen from countries like yours. Chavez is working to keep that wealth in Venezuela to benefit the people according to both pro- and anti-Chavez reports. Apparently all is not perfect in Venezuela and obviously I don't know why. I suspect that things weren't great under the previous regime.

Did you vote for your new constitution at gunpoint? Were threats made against you to force you to vote for the changes?

Regards,
JJ



posted on Sep, 1 2010 @ 04:47 PM
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Fortunately, I don't live in a barrio, ghetto, slum or even a poor neighborhood. How about you? Do you live in a barrio? These places exist all over the world so I don't have to go to Venezuala to visit one. I live in a small town with neighborhoods that I wouldn't walk around after dark. I thank my lucky stars that I'm not forced to live in one of these.


Ohhh yes, there are poor neighborhoods in all countries, and do u really believe that a one poor neighborhood in England is like one here? or one in Somalia? i would love to live in a poor neighborhood in UK.

I dont live in one, i lived 3 years in Caracas and there was one of the biggest and most dangerous near where i live, one that is called "23 de Enero", i was abled to see it through my windows, in fact, i heard the gunfights everynight, the screams, etc etc


Millions of people around the world including the UK where I live have been added to the ranks of the unemployed and dispossessed. Whole sections of cities and towns are becoming barrios.

Why? Not because of Socialism. It's capitalism that is causing this.


World Socialism would put an stop? lol, socialism is the one who says to me that i could not work in a industry owned by the gov because i was in a list of opponents to Hugo Chavez, and im not the only one, here the socialism with all the nationalizations is the one doing damage to the economy, more and more industry, bussiness closing every day, you can have a beautiful retoric and blame others, it doesnt matter, it didnt matter to comunist Russia or the eastern bloc, if socialism was so great, what happen to them? let me guess, "the big bad wolf Capitalism right?" like i say, come and live here and see your socialism in the work.


Interesting comments and I've never heard about this before.


Of course, Chavez is so great, he love us, our human rights.

www.youtube.com...

Here you have one.

Other

www.youtube.com...

But i suppose i understand you, USA is Bad, Chavez oppose USA, that means Chavez is good, is very simple.

Maybe you would love this one, www.youtube.com... of course, the gov says they solve the problem, that the guy is crazy, sick, etc etc, he died two days ago in the militar hospital where he was being held against his will.



You're right because the US and UK are living quite well on the wealth that they've stolen from countries like yours. Chavez is working to keep that wealth in Venezuela to benefit the people according to both pro- and anti-Chavez reports. Apparently all is not perfect in Venezuela and obviously I don't know why. I suspect that things weren't great under the previous regime.

Did you vote for your new constitution at gunpoint? Were threats made against you to force you to vote for the changes?


More retoric, benefit the people? where? i dont see it, i only know that when i go to a supermarket i cant find butter or milk, i only know that most of the industries in my region are stopped, that my friends are fired because there dont support the gov, etc etc.

You dont know Venezuela, what you know is your ideology and what you think must be in Venezuela, yes, things were not great, that was more that 10 years ago, of course, but what? because it was great before it mean is better now?

I didnt had the legal age to vote when the new constitution was made, i vote now but i dont have trust in the system, of course, you are going to say, ahhh "Chavez won", yes, you are right, but you know, people change their mind, the problem is that after 10 years we dont know if we really can beat the system.

And again, come and live here one year, if you survive maybe you would think different.

BTW, Chavez before the elections where he becomes president

www.youtube.com...

[edit on 1-9-2010 by MonteroReal]



posted on Sep, 1 2010 @ 05:13 PM
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I think it will be interesting to see if Bolivar died of TB, good call.



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 06:31 PM
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reply to post by MonteroReal
 


I cannot read/speak spanish (presumably the language of your posted video links) but google translate gives me an idea what's being discussed.


Originally posted by MonteroReal
World Socialism would put an stop? lol, socialism is the one who says to me that i could not work in a industry owned by the gov because i was in a list of opponents to Hugo Chavez, and im not the only one, here the socialism with all the nationalizations is the one doing damage to the economy, more and more industry, bussiness closing every day, you can have a beautiful retoric and blame others, it doesnt matter, it didnt matter to comunist Russia or the eastern bloc, if socialism was so great, what happen to them? let me guess, "the big bad wolf Capitalism right?" like i say, come and live here and see your socialism in the work.


First you say you didn't actually live in a barrio, then say you no longer live in Venezuala, then say "come and live here." Do you mean where you are living now or where you were in Ven. or in the Venezualan barrio?

If you really want to know why the Soviet Union failed, read the SEP Foundation document which provides a deep insight as to why socialism failed in that nation along with plenty of supporting references.


Originally posted by MonteroReal
Of course, Chavez is so great, he love us, our human rights.


You say this and then link to a video about Chavez threatening to cut off oil to the USA if they continue an economic war against Ven. Chavez is quoted as saying:


Chávez amenaza con cortar el envío de crudo a Estados Unidos (translation by Google translator)
Earlier, Chavez said that companies like ExxonMobil "earn a day billions of dollars worldwide, operating in Africa, they are stealing to Latin America, they are stealing the world and here we were robbed.

“But here never again rob us, it would take over our dead bodies. ExxonMobil bandits, they are imperialist bandits, white collar thieves, corrupt government, overthrown, supported the invasion of Iraq and the bombing, and continue to support the genocide. Why are these companies like ExxonMobil, bandits, bandits of the world, global mafias. "


My problem is that what he's saying would be true in any country in the world so why would he be lying about this in Venezuala?

Then you link to another video that (according to google translator) says "Chavez threatens to 'remove the tanks "if the oligarchy gains power at the ballot box." I don't know what that means or if it's a mis-translation. It seems to roughly translate to Chavez or Bush defending the revolutionary government against any advancement of the oligarchy. It also seems to indicate that they are "threatening to imprison some opposition leaders for corruption or failure to respect the outcome of the November 23"

But you go on to say:


Originally posted by MonteroReal
But i suppose i understand you, USA is Bad, Chavez oppose USA, that means Chavez is good, is very simple.


I'm not sure how this relates but I accept that it could be a language barrier problem.

The next one is easier because it specifically relates to the landowner/farmer who went on hunger strike and cut off his finger after losing so much of his land. I have yet to find out how he acquired his huge estate but he was certainly desperate to get it back.


Originally posted by MonteroReal
Maybe you would love this one, www.youtube.com... of course, the gov says they solve the problem, that the guy is crazy, sick, etc etc, he died two days ago in the militar hospital where he was being held against his will.


According to this Reuters article,



"Like vultures, they desired and hoped for his death," a government statement said of the Brito case, which has stirred up Venezuelan politics before the Sept. 26 vote.

Critics have seized on the emaciated farmer's death, in a protest over land he says was seized illegally in south Venezuela, as evidence of Chavez's abuse of property rights and cold indifference to opposition.

But the government says Brito's complaint had no basis in law and that his ownership of 717 acres (290 hectares) in Bolivar state had been repeatedly ratified by land authorities.

"We are obliged to reject the Phariseeism of the rotten media, the electoral opposition and the Catholic Church who encouraged Mr. Brito's extremism with the sole aim of having a death for their dirty banners,"


I'm not sure what happened here or why Brito felt that it was worth dying for the land that he lost. I fully believe that the ultra-rich in every country will fight tooth and nail to keep their vast fortunes even knowing that it means people are dying somewhere else in the world. The oil companies are completely unfazed by the damage that they do to the little peoples' environments around the world so long as they make their disgusting profits. I won't feel sad for them if and when the revolution comes to them. I will instead blame them and the system that they profitted from for the inevitable outcome.

I'd rather see millions around the world fed, clothed and provided shelter than worry about billionaires having to live like normal human beings.


Originally posted by MonteroReal
More retoric, benefit the people? where? i dont see it, i only know that when i go to a supermarket i cant find butter or milk, i only know that most of the industries in my region are stopped, that my friends are fired because there dont support the gov, etc etc.


You see food shortages and think it's your government's fault. Perhaps you're right but I suggest that you investigate and find out where the real fault lies. If it is with the government, then tell them and broadcast it to the world via the internet. If it's not, then ask your government to do something about it and broadcast it to the internet. Only then will you know the truth.

(CONTINUED)



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 07:04 PM
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reply to post by JohnJasper
 


(CONTINUED FROM ABOVE)

And finally you linked to a video about (according to google translator) Chavez arming the population so that they can defend themselves should the country be invaded by Colombia (supported by the USA.)


Originally posted by MonteroReal
BTW, Chavez before the elections where he becomes president

www.youtube.com...


In the USA, the constitution guarantees the right of citizens to bear arms in recognition of the fact that an armed population is not completely subject to its political masters. A government that wants to maintain firm control of its citizens, prevents its citizens from owning weapons. A government that arms its people ensures that the people can defend themselves from enemies both foreign and domestic.

I'm not particularly in favor of uncontrolled gun ownership because accidents happen but the alternative is complete subservience to whomever controls the police and the military.

Marx believed in arming the people post revolution because the elite will use their armed forces to re-establish power. Look what happened in Kyrgyzstan after their revolution. The ousted leader Kurmanbek Bakiyev is alleged to be instigating ethnic violence as a way of underming the interim government.



Otunbayeva [leader of the provisional government] has blamed Bakiyev, who has fled to Belarus, for instigating the unrest in southern Kyrgyzstan, where clashes between the two main Kyrgyz ethnic groups – the Uzbeks and the Kyrgyz people – in the second largest city of Osh have left about 120 people dead. Bakiyev said that claims that he ordered the disturbances were shameless lies.


Maybe Bakiyev is telling the truth but either way, if the population were armed they would have some chance of defending themselves against attackers for whatever reason. As it was, they were at the mercy of the marauders.

If Colombia attacks, armed Venezualans should be able to make their stay a miserably short one.

In closing, I don't actually know what is going on in Ven. but am keen to know. Please keep the information coming cause this region is vital to the anti-imperialism movement and in turn makes Venezuala a target for increased aggression. It serves as an example that you can fight American hegemony but it's hard work as Castro fully well knows.

Regards,
JJ



posted on Sep, 2 2010 @ 07:16 PM
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First you say you didn't actually live in a barrio, then say you no longer live in Venezuala, then say "come and live here." Do you mean where you are living now or where you were in Ven. or in the Venezualan barrio?

If you really want to know why the Soviet Union failed, read the SEP Foundation document which provides a deep insight as to why socialism failed in that nation along with plenty of supporting references.


I say that i dont live in a Barrio, that i lived in Caracas, where are most barrios in this country and one of the most dangerous was very near, but i dont live there anymore, i move to my homecity in the south.

I will read.




You say this and then link to a video about Chavez threatening to cut off oil to the USA if they continue an economic war against Ven. Chavez is quoted as saying:


The videos i posted are not about Chavez cutting off oil to the USA, and the article you are posting is a total different thing, in fact, i didnt talk about oil, and it doesnt matter if Exxon is not here, BP, Total, Chevron, Conoco, Statooil are here and that about cutting the oil is just retoric, we are too dependant, Chavez is too dependant of that, he wont do it, yes, USA invade countries, made war, and is our oil the one they use.


Then you link to another video that (according to google translator) says "Chavez threatens to 'remove the tanks "if the oligarchy gains power at the ballot box." I don't know what that means or if it's a mis-translation. It seems to roughly translate to Chavez or Bush defending the revolutionary government against any advancement of the oligarchy. It also seems to indicate that they are "threatening to imprison some opposition leaders for corruption or failure to respect the outcome of the November 23"


You see, one problem is trying to understand the situation in another country without knowing the language.

He is saying he will put the tanks in the street if an oposition candidate wins the election in that state, where is the democracy?, yes, he is right with the people who doesnt want to respect, but that is not the same as treat the others who win and respect, yes, the oligarchy, let me explain you something, in the Chavez language if you are poor, without home, without job, without education and you oppose him, them you are an oligarch.

And they always threat to imprison opposition people for corruption, you know, rich are bad, and for chavez, all who is in the opposition is an oligarch, rich and corrupt.


I'm not sure how this relates but I accept that it could be a language barrier problem.

The next one is easier because it specifically relates to the landowner/farmer who went on hunger strike and cut off his finger after losing so much of his land. I have yet to find out how he acquired his huge estate but he was certainly desperate to get it back.


Is not a barrier problem, is very clear, for example, you dont know how Brito acquire his lands, so is obvious it was by some illegal mean because "huge estate" is someting only bad (rich and oligarcs) people can get.


I'm not sure what happened here or why Brito felt that it was worth dying for the land that he lost. I fully believe that the ultra-rich in every country will fight tooth and nail to keep their vast fortunes even knowing that it means people are dying somewhere else in the world. The oil companies are completely unfazed by the damage that they do to the little peoples' environments around the world so long as they make their disgusting profits. I won't feel sad for them if and when the revolution comes to them. I will instead blame them and the system that they profitted from for the inevitable outcome.

I'd rather see millions around the world fed, clothed and provided shelter than worry about billionaires having to live like normal human beings.


Again, the rich and if you oppose chavez you are rich, so i suppose you are ones of those who thinks that it doesnt matter what a gov do if that means attacking the rich, it was his land, anyone has the right to defend their property, he was held against his will in an militar hospital controlled by the gov, they say it was to protect his life, that he was crazy, and you see? he is dead anyways, is not that you dont know what happen here, is that you really dont know anything that is happening here.


You see food shortages and think it's your government's fault. Perhaps you're right but I suggest that you investigate and find out where the real fault lies. If it is with the government, then tell them and broadcast it to the world via the internet. If it's not, then ask your government to do something about it and broadcast it to the internet. Only then will you know the truth.


Lets see, the gov take the farms, there were cows in the farm, the new "owners" kill the cows and eat them, ok, less meat, then they take the plants who process food, they spent the money in publicity, new uniforms, new salaries, but not in buying the food for the farmers and processing, of course, the farms with more food productivity where in hands of corporations or "rich people", we all know rich people is bad right? so lets take them, they cut the land in parts, give it to people to farm but what they farm? 4 potatos and 5 carrots each, wonderful.

The worst if that now we must import a lot of things that we use to EXPORT before, now we can, so rice, coffee, milk, sugar, etc etc, of course, there are other things we import, but the gov have a exchange control so we can't buy dollars freely, if a corporation who import food needs dollar well is #ing hard, is not only food, is electrical part, car parts, machines, etc etc.

So like i say, come and live here, see it with your eyes and learn some spanish so you cant really understand what Chavez says.



posted on Sep, 3 2010 @ 08:03 AM
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reply to post by MonteroReal
 



Originally posted by MonteroReal
So like i say, come and live here, see it with your eyes and learn some spanish so you cant really understand what Chavez says.


Perhaps moving to Venezuala would be a good idea if 1) I can learn the language and 2) I can be accepted into the country. I moved to the UK from the US and found it very easy to be accepted but of course I didn't have to learn a new language.

Having said that, my real interest in Venezuala and many other countries in the world is trying to stop the USA from forcing its "free trade" policies on them. Especially as this is usually accompanied by pillaging of natural resources and a purge of anyone who opposes imperialism. The range of countries threatened by US hegemony is too great for me to even consider learning the languages.

If Venezualans are unhappy with their government, then they must do something about it. They should not have regime change imposed on them by the USA directly or covertly as they've just done in Afghanistan and Iraq and are about to do in Iran.

I thank you for providing this feedback on the Venezualan situation. You might have noticed that The Angel of Light was casting out complete religious nonsense without any supporting sources which is out of place in ATS.

You yourself have used language that is strictly prohibited on this site which the mods will have to address. I'm not easily offended but rules are rules and you must admit, the profanity doesn't do your case justice.

I hope that you will continue to supply truthful information about Venezuala backed up by recognised sources where applicable. We're all in this together because if we keep going as one country against another, we all will fail.

Regards,
John



posted on Sep, 3 2010 @ 02:41 PM
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reply to post by JohnJasper

I thank you for providing this feedback on the Venezualan situation. You might have noticed that The Angel of Light was casting out complete religious nonsense without any supporting sources which is out of place in ATS.
 


No John, you are really wrong,

I think your place is not in ATS but perhaps in some Bolivarian website strictly created for Political Propaganda and centered on the cult to the Personality of Chavez, in the very communist rethoric tradition of course.

That would be the only place in which somebody could say that the very acute and completly logically supported arguments I have shown here to expose how false is the image of the Chavez regime you have and you are trying to portrait along many replies to misinform my readers, are not sense as you so happily claim.

You have remembered me today all the cynism of Fidel Castro years ago saying that he executed General Ochoa since he was consipiring in Narcotraffic when actually his fault was to be planning the way to cut his dictatorship on Cuba.

ATS is a site of fluid free expression one, after all it is very American, where what you say is not sense: mystics, predictions, prophecies, even religion are not forbidden at all, that would be the situation perhaps in a Bolivarian website not here.

You did well to move to England, since here your very curious concept of what is sense and not sense will be considered as violation of the bill or rights.

thanks,

The Angel of Lightness



posted on Sep, 3 2010 @ 02:58 PM
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i]reply to post by antar

I think it will be interesting to see if Bolivar died of TB, good call.
 


Well antar,

It is clear that the result of the testing of the remains of Simon Bolivar by the commission of "scientists" that Chavez has arranged to find the supposedly "hidden truth of his death" will arrive to the only possible conclusion, the one that is convenient for the Marxist Regime of Venezuela, and that can be so easy fabricated just only planting false evidence in the body:

A supposed plot of assassination by Columbians.

The Propaganda industry of the Chavism is now ready to boost that version in order to push the Venezuelans in a crazy conflict against Columbia and America.

So this is, like Garcia Marquez would say, the chronic of a fake death announced, there is no way that other truth can emerge of such a biased investigation, on this comedy everything is already decided weeks before the exhumation took place.


Why instead to try to lost time to wait for the false autopsy report of Bolivar we cannot better suggest to Russia to practice another one to the Body of Lenin?

Perhaps it will very instructive to the neocommunists of today to confirm that his very first hero, as Leo Trosky the founder of the red army clearly stated on 1923, was poisoned by Joseph Stalin in person.

www.revolutionarydemocracy.org...

And that was only the first of many political crimes Stalin commited to get the absolute control of the Soviet Union, there were millions the ones that were sent to gulags and violated in all his civil rights.

Nikita Krushev denounced the participation of Stalin in Lenin's death as well as thousands of other crimes he performed when as General Secretary of the Communist Party told the truth in his secret speech to the XX congress of the communist Party in february of 1956,

www.historyguide.org...

These are actual reliable links to what have been the methods implemented by communists during generations not only to take the power by force but also to fight each one to other for the only thing they really want : the absolute Power.


So Yesterday it was Stalin poisoning Lenin,and ordering the assassination of Trosky in Mexico to assure his political power.

www.marxists.org...

and

Today is Chavez poisoning the memory of Bolivar to justify an imperialist war along the Americas, what a progress the Neocommunism has done in the refinement of its rhetoric along almost a century, isn’t it?


A people that does not know History is condemned to repeat the same mistakes of the Past.



Thanks for yorur comment,

The Angel of Lightness



[edit on 9/3/2010 by The angel of light]



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