reply to post by whatukno
No Wuk, that is the problem with the "socialists, communists, leftists, and centrists" as Misoir described. They try to rationalize slavery as
freedom and rewrite definitions.
Freedom is freedom. You are either free or you aren't. There is no PARTIAL freedom, because if that were the case there would still be SOME SLAVERY
and CONTROL over the subject. Therefore, the only definition of freedom you need to worry about, is the actualy definition in it's entirety.
the state of being free or at liberty rather than in confinement or under physical restraint: He won his freedom after a retrial.
exemption from external control, interference, regulation, etc.
the power to determine action without restraint.
political or national independence.
personal liberty, as opposed to bondage or slavery: a slave who bought his freedom.
exemption from the presence of anything specified (usually fol. by from ): freedom from fear.
the absence of or release from ties, obligations, etc.
ease or facility of movement or action: to enjoy the freedom of living in the country.
frankness of manner or speech.
general exemption or immunity: freedom from taxation.
the absence of ceremony or reserve.
a liberty taken.
a particular immunity or privilege enjoyed, as by a city or corporation: freedom to levy taxes.
civil liberty, as opposed to subjection to an arbitrary or despotic government.
the right to enjoy all the privileges or special rights of citizenship, membership, etc., in a community or the like.
the right to frequent, enjoy, or use at will: to have the freedom of a friend's library.
Philosophy . the power to exercise choice and make decisions without constraint from within or without; autonomy; self-determination. Compare
necessity ( def. 7 ) .
The first three definitions alone are enough to satisfy what freedom is to me. Do the ideologies that Misoir feels are under attack bring about those
definitions or do they stand against them?
The answer is that they stand against them, just as this establishment does as well. Therefore, should anything stand against the definitions of the
word freedom, then they stand against freedom in its entirety, and they stand as an enemy of mine.
As helpful as health care might have been if done properly, that will never unhinge the fact that it forces people to do things instead of giving them
3. the power to determine action without restraint.
Therefore you, or anyone for that matter can support the health care bill, or any bill which mandates that people do something that they choose NOT to
do, and that is fine and dandy. However, you can not support them AND support freedom at the same time. Look at the definition and what I just laid
out to you. They are completely defiant to one another. One cancels out the other. You cannot have control and freedom in the same sentence.
Freedom may only be self-evident to the individual, but when the individual is prevented from ever attaining the freedom which they hold to be
self-evident, when the powers of tyranny and control stand against that happening... well... you know the rest. It ended in revolution last time.
You may feel that somehow, in this country you are free because of your ideals, but that shouldn't mean that others who might think differently
should be prevented that freedom. Sure, the health care bill might not have been bad in your eyes where you obviously define freedom in some other
way, but to those that go by definition it is preventing their freedom and they should have the right to that. Either way for you, whether the health
care bill passed or didn't pass, you would still be experiencing your self-proclaimed freedom. Those against it, not so lucky.
Thanks, but I really think that getting into a civil war is pretty high on my list of parts of my life that I think that I should rightfully be in
This quote, I enjoy the most. You fail to realize that the only reason war is coming is because so many people have been ignored and sold into the
slavery of this country. You don't realize that it is because of some of the tyrannical things that you support, the health care bill for instance,
the types of things that DO spit on people's freedoms yet you feel no affect of, these are the things that are leading towards war in this
And yes, for lack of a more graceful target, the people who stand to defend tyrannical governments and social control over yours, theirs, and
everyones lives - they will not be tolerated. This isn't my choice, this isn't a decision that I make - this is simply the divide that America has
come to in these troubling days, the divide that Misoir so states.
But like I stated in more words than necessary in my last post - it isn't a divide between left and right wing politics. It isn't a divide between
anarchy and socialism. It isn't a divide between Republican and Democrat. If it is that divide to you, then sadly you are still stuck in the illusion
system that they have manufactured for you.
No, the real battle is:
FREEDOM vs. CONTROL
The same battle that has been waging since the first man took up the crown and declared himself ruler over the others. The battle that has been the
direct result of EVERY SINGLE civil war and revolution in the history of this planet.
People are made to be free, and when they aren't given that freedom they will always... ALWAYS take it. There is nothing in this universe that is
ever going to change that.
[edit on 31-7-2010 by gwydionblack]